The truth about Hasson and Wong.

[hairweare]

It appears that the right side is slightly higher in the pre-op photo which appears for the most part to be retained in the post op photo. Even so things rarely occur perfectly in nature and the minor difference does not particularly standout as artificial looking in my opinion. Once the hair is longer or combed to the side I doubt it would be perceptible. t is the custom of most physicians to draw out the proposed hairline prior to medicating the patient for approval and there is no reason to believe that an experienced physician like Dr. Wong would have done otherwise.

[Shampoo]

it is the custom of most physicians to draw out the proposed hairline prior to medicating the patient for approval and there is no reason to believe that an experienced physician like Dr. Wong would have done otherwise.

 

That is exactly what Dr. Wong did with me at the consult and the morning of the surgery,

 

I honestly believe Dr. Wong is a very caring doctor and will bend-over backwards to help rectify any perceived problems for reasonable patients.

 

I would like to see lots of additional pictures of this patient at different stages and with different hair lengths. Can someone provide a link I can click on to see these types of pictures of this patient?

[Spanker]

Am I the only one still trying to find the fu's that needed to be removed? Are they in the hairline or the mid scalp?

Edited October 30, 2014 by Spanker

[Noodles123]

Everything this guys claims has been repeatedly refuted. There clearly was communication at many points post op, and not radio silence from H&W as this guy claims.

Edited October 30, 2014 by blahblah1982

[Number47]

Everything this guys claims has been repeatedly refuted. There clearly was communication at many points post op, and not radio silence as this guy claims. When you make claims that are repeatedly disproved, it really calls into question the credibility of this person. I don't care what anyone says, it's pretty clear this guy knows exactly what he is doing and is leveraging the reach and anonymity of the internet to smear Dr. Wong with the intention of a getting a complete refund.

 

What anonymity Dr. Wong and H&W knows who he is :rolleyes:

 

If anyone is leveraging the anonymity of the internet to smear someone is you and you do it to him!

[bismarck]

Thanks for posting this, but I have to ask why was the assumption made that he wanted a significantly uneven hairline without discussing it first? And after he requested a straighter design, why was it still that uneven?

 

When he said undulating, Wong was referring to the irregularity along the hairline, not the height of the hairline itself.

 

As far as evenness, I believe the intent was to have both sides level.

[HybridHyper]

It was a good call to straighten the hair line a bit because the end result is a naturally looking hair line that is not completely straight and at the same time doesn't look like the one of Count Chocula. It wouldn't take much to lower the right side. I have kind of the same situation. My right side is a tad higher than my left side, and I don't mind it since my original hair line looked like that even when I was 17.

[Noodles123]

What anonymity Dr. Wong and H&W knows who he is :rolleyes:

 

If anyone is leveraging the anonymity of the internet to smear someone is you and you do it to him!

 

DUH.... The rest of the internet doesn't know who he is.

[hairfarmer79]

I first met HF in person during the pre op consultation the day before his surgery. We spend quite some time discussing the pending surgery and answer any questions he had. Examination of HF’s scalp showed a transplanted hairline that was high enough to allow addition of single hairs in front of the larger grafts. I explained that we can improve on his existing hairline but that it will never look quite as good as if we started from scratch. By placing single hairs in front and around the larger grafts it would soften them sufficiently and allow them to co exist without needing to be removed. However, if a few of the existing larger grafts along the hairline continue to be a problem they can then be individually removed at a later date. We need this infill session to grow out in order to identify the problem grafts. This approach has the advantage of conserving as much of the previously transplanted hair as possible and only removing those that are absolutely necessary. The three goals we wanted to achieve for this surgery were: 1) improve on the previous scar. 2) improve coverage in the crown and mid scalp. 3) Soften and infill the hairline.

 

On the morning of the surgery I designed an irregular undulating hairline just slightly lower than the existing hairline. HF requested a straighter hairline. I redesigned the hairline to accommodate creating something with a straighter design. WE then both had a good look to ensure the hairline was even. He signed off on the design and we proceeded.

 

His donor area had very good density and laxity. We removed a strip containing the old scar and sufficient donor hair estimated to generate 2700 to 3000 grafts (the eventual number was 2837). HF had an unusual high level of interest in all phases of his surgery and wanted to know all the details as the surgery proceeded.

 

During the surgery patient was kept informed and shown with a mirror exactly where the slits were made and hair was to be grafted. We had an ongoing dialog and patient kept informed as the surgery proceeded.

 

5 days post op we identified some double hair grafts from his previous surgery that were positioned well below his transplanted hairline. 7 double hair grafts were then removed and relocated to the recipient area.

 

Post op there were no problems and both donor and recipient areas healed well. Post op the hair growth was typical of what we'd expect and most of the transplanted hair started to come in at 6 months. The 7 month photos looked very good.

I spoke with him around 3 months post op and again at length between 5 and 6 months post op. I have given him my personal email and we have had numerous exchanges not including the countless emails from the staff.

I was very surprised to hear that this surgery had such a devastating effect on HF’s life and that I was responsible. In the photos I saw a very good improvement and can’t understand how this could be anything other than positive. Maybe with the hair cut very short and on close inspection the older grafts may not look as natural. We knew this from the beginning that further work might likely be desired. That is the nature of repair work.

 

There has been a lot of stress as a result of the negative attention, unfounded or not, created by this patient's surgery. To be fair we need to look at this surgery as a whole to judge it. Did we reach the following goals we set out to achieve ?: 1) Improve and reduce the scar 2) How much improvement were we able to achieve in the crown and mid scalp? 3) Did we improve the hairline ? In order to do that I would request that HF provide us with 1) picture of scar so that we can compare. 2) 6 views of the scalp taken with the same field and angle as the pre op pictures. Preferably with hair the same length as pre op. The frontal photos need to have the head centered and squared. It also needs to include the eyebrows to see if indeed the hairline is uneven.

 

 

Thank you for your response Dr Wong.

 

I want to fully canvas your response in it's entirety because it will need a great deal of correcting on your part.

 

"I first met HF in person during the pre op consultation the day before his surgery. We spend quite some time discussing the pending surgery and answer any questions he had"

 

Yes we spoke in your office as I had described previously. When you say "we spend quite some time discussing" I recall it being no more than 15-20 minutes of which time it became crystal clear there were many irregularities in what I had been previously told by Joe Tillman in relation to you supposedly being briefed of my previous older procedure.

 

 

"By placing single hairs in front and around the larger grafts it would soften them sufficiently and allow them to co exist without needing to be removed. However, if a few of the existing larger grafts along the hairline continue to be a problem they can then be individually removed at a later date"

 

Ok, as far as this statement this is central to my complaint because it has been the foundation from which the design of the hairline was created. As I had previously explained the issue with older procedures when it comes to mini/micro grafts is the inconsistent angulation.

 

As you can see with the 8 month photo you have attached to you response. My hair was colored and the hairline cannot be brushed forward or to the side due to the older procedure, it's essentially like going against the grain if I can adopt that terminology.

 

This was always central to my concerns and reluctance to go with the "concealing" option. I said to Joe very early on that I was concerned the older procedure would still vastly interfere and if anything dominate the way the new results could be groomed.

Since my new procedure has matured and grown in I have found my initial concerns have become reality.

 

As Dr Bernstein has written extensively on his site about how to successfully repair these types of older procedures, FUE extraction should be first considered. When you think about the most obvious reasons for this, you simply can't disguise what is by way of virtue angulation related issues.

 

I will never know who's approach is more successful but what I do know is the most obvious fact, no smoke and mirrors will divert people's attention away from the obvious flaws in the new hairline. It is with this in mind you have continued throughout the many months of discussions to evade that central question. Based on your response in here you are continuing to do so.

 

 

"The three goals we wanted to achieve for this surgery were: 1) improve on the previous scar. 2) improve coverage in the crown and mid scalp. 3) Soften and infill the hairline"

 

Improving the previous scar was merely the icing on the cake. It was last on my priority list, to the point I can prove if need be that I had never even mentioned it to you let alone requested it. As I had meticulously detailed in my communication with Joe Tillman leading up to the procedure not to mention even with the initial application form to Hasson and Wong. The specific goals and objectives were to fix the bane of the issue which was the hairline and mid scalp but specifically the hairline.

 

The hairline being the thing that shapes a persons face above and beyond anything else regarding a full head of hair it's the ultimate indicator of a successful or an unsuccessful hair restoration procedure.

 

The crown was 2nd or 3rd on my priority list and had been suggested as a possibility. It must not be forgotten that the initial recommendations that had come from Hasson and Wong was the desired outcome could and should be achieved with 3500 FUT but the end result being supposedly 2800 grafts.

 

 

"On the morning of the surgery I designed an irregular undulating hairline just slightly lower than the existing hairline. HF requested a straighter hairline. I redesigned the hairline to accommodate creating something with a straighter design. WE then both had a good look to ensure the hairline was even. He signed off on the design and we proceeded"

 

I recall you handing me a small mirror, I did my best to look at it from I guess a 1 or 2 dimensional view if you could call it that. It's ridiculously hard to determine a drawn line on your head looking at it from a small mirror and not being able to see from a range of angles. Lets be realistic there is no real way a patient can be sure what it's going to look like until the results start to grow.

It was about 6am in the morning, I was nervous had technicians waiting on us and everything was happening very fast. This is no exaggeration because you are yet to address the fact that you were working multiple procedures at the same time that day because Dr Hasson was on leave with a broken leg.

 

I don't remember signing off on anything but if by chance I did lets be realistic. I couldn't have possibly known what I was looking at, and would not have been able to properly assess in those few seconds the accuracy of your designs.

 

The only thing I do remember is you giving me some oral medication that doped me out big time, felt like I was floating on clouds for many hours afterwards.

 

With my age in mind I had stated to you which surely you remember, I said I actually prefer recession. To which you had responded "that's good then because most people want unrealistic hairlines" or something to that effect. It was a suggestion about age appropriate designs the point you were making.

 

 

"HF had an unusual high level of interest in all phases of his surgery and wanted to know all the details as the surgery proceeded"

 

That is very misleading. I did ask maybe about 4-6 questions during the procedure. I'm surprised you had used that to make some kind of statement considering you were not actually present during most of the procedure. You were working in-between multiple procedures.

 

Secondly, a person tends to get a little edgy at the realization a salesman has potentially sold snake-oil in the form of a misleading opportunistic sale.

 

 

"I spoke with him around 3 months post op and again at length between 5 and 6 months post op. I have given him my personal email and we have had numerous exchanges not including the countless emails from the staff"

 

Ok I cannot let this one pass. The suggestion you gave me your email is a bold faced lie.

I have spend nearly the entire 10 months when I eventually decided to contact your company not the other way around. Dealing with firstly Joe Tillman then Christina.

 

At no time did you voluntarily supply your email to me or even offer to do so.

It was clear from all of the subsequent dealings I've had with your company it was your intention to remain out of contact of me and rather let the girls on the front desk deal with it. Mainly Christina who you had tasked with dealing with my complaint.

 

The biggest insult was only in the last month was I to find out your direct email off your former staffer Joe Tillman vie the Hair Restoration Forums. Such is the evasiveness of your subsequent communications or lack of.

 

I have much more to write on this matter but am out of time for now.

I have some things I have to attend to but will write more on this matter this evening.

I'm very disappointed with your lack of honesty on a range of very obvious mistakes and design flaws.

 

I'll respond again soon.

Edited October 30, 2014 by hairfarmer79

[jason1980]

I'd like to see more photos from the patient showing exactly where his concerns are.

 

Without these additional photos continuing this thread is completely pointless.

 

No one really cares, and is completely irrelevant if Wong did or didn't give you his personal email, how many questions he asked in surgery etc. The only thing that matters is the final outcome, and without additional photos it's impossible to tell, unless I have missed something...

[hairfarmer79]

I'd like to see more photos from the patient showing exactly where his concerns are.

 

Without these additional photos continuing this thread is completely pointless.

 

No one really cares, and is completely irrelevant if Wong did or didn't give you his personal email, how many questions he asked in surgery etc. The only thing that matters is the final outcome, and without additional photos it's impossible to tell, unless I have missed something...

 

4 posts, joined in October no history of any respected contributions and here you are making demands of me?

 

You people really are trying arnt you?

 

Give up you are a waist of forum space and it is you trolls that are irrelevant.

 

I'm merely 1 person and you trolls will not influence any outcome so give it up.

[FUE2014]

No one really cares, and is completely irrelevant if Wong did or didn't give you his personal email, how many questions he asked in surgery etc. The only thing that matters is the final outcome, and without additional photos it's impossible to tell, unless I have missed something...

 

WRONG. The surgeon's integrity is one of the most important things. If, for sake of argument, a surgeon lied about communicating with a patient, then that is something I would be very concerned about. In the UK, doctors can get disciplined by the General Medical Council for dishonesty.

[densedream]

I, too, think you should post some quality pictures to show these devastatingly terrible results. All of these accusations and mud slinging but you haven't even posted photos of your results.. the main piece of the puzzle. I would definitely side with a medical doctor that has done 1000's of surgeries and had countless documented cases of satisfaction on this very site and others, over someone with possible Aspergers and extortionist tactics that won't even post clear and non disputable pictures. The burden of proof lies with hairframer at this point

[hairfarmer79]

I, too, think you should post some quality pictures to show these devastatingly terrible results. All of these accusations and mud slinging but you haven't even posted photos of your results.. the main piece of the puzzle. I would definitely side with a medical doctor that has done 1000's of surgeries and had countless documented cases of satisfaction on this very site and others, over someone with possible Aspergers and extortionist tactics that won't even post clear and non disputable pictures. The burden of proof lies with hairframer at this point

 

This is a figment of your own imagination simply because it is inconvenient for what ever views you have of this clinic. I have no need to take any of these demands from the likes of you and those like you. You people are irrelevant and are not constructively contributing to anything other than abuse of forum privileges and its members.

 

If the moderators of this forum had any decency left they would be addressing the kinds of tactics that are being employed by you shameless individuals to try and shout me down.

 

I am now convinced this forum is completely out of control.

Either the moderators are asleep at the wheel or the bias and the true mechanics of this site are being shown to exist.

 

I'm reporting and blocking every single person who accuses me of extortion starting with you.

 

If you think you're going to get away with publicly defaming me you are very mistaken.

Edited October 30, 2014 by hairfarmer79

[hairfarmer79]

Dr Wong I have given you and your staff all the time in the world prior to publishing this to listen to my genuine concerns and on every occasion it fell on deaf ears.

 

You continue to completely ignore every factual account and evidence of blindingly obvious poor outcomes that are presented to you.

 

Since I first decided to air my concerns and experiences on here I've had the mob on my case with a vengeance, one of which is a self confessed employee of Hasson and Wong, user name Lorenzo.

 

I have been repeatedly misrepresented, defamed, accused and attacked by the mob mentality of the trolls that lurk in here.

 

The public can and will see everything that has unfolded here and everything that has been thrown at me.

It is appalling behavior from people with very clear objectives to try and influence the outcome.

 

I find it incredibly disturbing that patients who have had bad experiences with physicians are given this kind of treatment and it seemingly goes completely un-moderated by those who run this website.

 

Something is very telling about this experience and until I've seen the same rules applied to those who have continually tried to misrepresent me in here, I remain uneasy about how this forum is moderated.

Edited October 30, 2014 by hairfarmer79

[Blake Bloxham]

Farmer,

 

I sent you a message. Didn't want you to think the moderators aren't watching closely. Thanks.

[wylie]

If the moderators of this forum had any decency left they would be addressing the kinds of tactics that are being employed by you shameless individuals to try and shout me down.

 

I am now convinced this forum is completely out of control.

Either the moderators are asleep at the wheel or the bias and the true mechanics of this site are being shown to exist.

 

I'm reporting and blocking every single person who accuses me of extortion starting with you.

 

If you think you're going to get away with publicly defaming me you are very mistaken.

 

I'd like to now refer back to my "persecution complex" statements for further evidence to buttress my previous claims.

 

And may this thread serve as Exhibit A of the issues HT doctors deal with when some patients say they receive a "horrible" result.

 

It's telling that the statement "It's a jungle out there" can cut both ways (no pun intended)

 

I now rest my case. Good day gentlemen.

[Bill - Seemiller]

Hairfarmer,

 

I had yet to post a reply on this thread because I believe in providing patients with every opportunity to share their genuine experience good or bad. However, I also believe in maintaining a fair and safe environment on this forum for both patients and physicians. Click here to read our fair forum policy.

 

I am concerned that you have now removed your own photos. Furthermore, the photos you did provide weren't easy to assess and didn't accurately show the areas of your concerns.

 

I ask that you re-post your original photos and take and post new high resolution photos showing the areas you are concerned about. Try taking some hairline shots from a straight away angle that also include your eyebrows (or the area directly above it showing only the tips of your eyebrows). I also suggest posting high resolution before/after pictures showing the top of your scalp, profile views and of the donor area (scarring).

 

I can assure you that I'm not requiring you to present photos to expose your identity and will be happy to help you crop any photos you send me (if you need help) to hide your face or any other identifying features.

 

Presenting accurate photos is the only way members of this community can really draw any conclusions about the result. As to your experience with Joe and Dr. Wong, it's up to the adult members of this community to draw their own conclusions based on what they read, which clearly is mixed.

 

Please post these photos ASAP as it's critical to the overall thread.

 

Best Regards,

 

Bill

[Loags79]

Hairfarmer, your thread initially started very well and it was easy to get a handle on your situation.. I was actually on your side. But as your started to say more and it seems like you're ranting on now, I'm kinda on the fence.

 

It would have be best served if you had documented accurately with high definition photos what you hair was like before, during and after (progressive photos) the HT.

 

Also please reframe from ranting on about trolls and people trying to shout you down and embellishing your version of events, it does unfortunately make you appear a little unstable, it makes it difficult for forum members to get a handle of your situation. Try to keep it neutral and factual. Generally people can see things for what it is in regards to trolls or whatever.

 

imo your hairline isn't great, but you did get decent growth. I too would be very unhappy with the results of the hairline if I paid 15-20k for those results. Your situation is fixable, both in regards to your hair and the relationship b/w H&W with regards to refund or whatever your seek in damages.

Edited October 30, 2014 by Loags79

[home1212]

very well said Loags79 ..

[SADbutTRUE]

The key is what is the main issue with your hair that needs to be fixed, so you can move past this and improve your quality of life, the mini and mico hairs need to be removed so you can style your hair the way you want to or is it fixing the hairline? a good FUE \strip surgen can fufill this request, stay positive and foscus on the task at hand , take a week or two off the forums to clear your head, good luck in your research in finding a solution to this situation.

[StaggerLee123]

I'd like to now refer back to my "persecution complex" statements for further evidence to buttress my previous claims.

 

And may this thread serve as Exhibit A of the issues HT doctors deal with when some patients say they receive a "horrible" result.

 

It's telling that the statement "It's a jungle out there" can cut both ways (no pun intended)

 

I now rest my case. Good day gentlemen.

 

I have been looking at his photos and other than a slightly crooked hairline, which seemed to be slightly crooked pre-op as well, I can't see what the horrible damage is. Perhaps hairfarmer should peruse your photos Wylie to see what a repair patient with damage looks like before he was fixed.

 

I'm sure I will be threatened with a law suit, as seems to be hairfarmer's wont, but I agree with the "persecution complex" theory. The paranoia is thick and if he is looking for Hasson & Wong to work with him, this strategy is not the way to go. I feel bad for the guy.

[Number47]

On the suggestion of a refund it was only weeks ago before I had put it in writing Dr Wong had volunteered a partial refund. That's the only thing he has done but such is the arrogance of these people he is now backing away from his own offer at a rate of knots.

I believe it's because it was an admission that it's an incredibly poor outcome.

 

 

 

I am not by any means a difficult person I'm sure any reasonable person can see that the result of this procedure is incredibly bad, maybe not the worst but certainly bad by today's standards set by other physicians around the world.

 

 

I think they should have given this guy a refund and be over with. These forums don't deserve this drama and clinics should not bring it on them. There are many physicians here recommended and we prefer to focus on other things than posters attacking the credibility of the guy trying to make him look like an extortionist or a psycho or whatever, you are putting him on the defence all the time and he is lashing against friends and enemies. I think he is a guy like us from what i read, i don't think he woke up one day and said ok i am going for a repair on H&W so i can start a smear campaign against them afterwards!I prefer the simple truth!

 

Hairfarmer i think you should relax, things are more complex than they look you cannot label friends and enemies so easily. Remember you have an open thread here where you have gone over the top yourself many times and still you are here speaking!

[HybridHyper]

The full refund sounds a bit too drastic. A complementary repair surgery is more like it. The density in the pictures looks excellent considering the hair type which is poor and I can relate since I have the same one. I suppose it can be thickened. HairFarmer just needs to talk to the doctor and negotiate the free ride.

[KO]

I agree, I don't think this deserves a full refund. Frankly, I don't think this is a bad result, but I can see how the OP would be unhappy with it. I think full refund is for cases with bad yield, major shock loss, or very unnatural looking growth.