Has Hair Greed Got Me? Lighting is everything!

[Melvin- Admin]

2 minutes ago, aaron1234 said:

You could split the difference like I did with my last procedure - it all depends on the amount of grafts you get.  Just 700 grafts in my crown made a huge difference, the remaining 400 grafts went to my frontal third and temple points and I'm so glad I addressed those areas too. 

That's the conundrum with surgery.  You want to address everything but the limited donor supply forces you to prioritize.  

It’s like a math problem that can never be fully solved. I think even 100 grafts in the hairline would make a big difference, but I guess if I don’t have enough I’ll stick with the crown.

[aaron1234]

Just now, Melvin- Moderator said:

It’s like a math problem that can never be fully solved. I think even 100 grafts in the hairline would make a big difference, but I guess if I don’t have enough I’ll stick with the crown.

Totally.  I've been trying to solve this equation the last 7 HT's. 

[Doron Harati]

5 minutes ago, Melvin- Moderator said:

It’s like a math problem that can never be fully solved. I think even 100 grafts in the hairline would make a big difference, but I guess if I don’t have enough I’ll stick with the crown.

Yes even 100 grafts can make a difference for the hairline, so maybe 100-500 for the hairline won't be a big sacrifice, it various between every paitent 

[aaron1234]

7 minutes ago, Doron Harati said:

Yes even 100 grafts can make a difference for the hairline, so maybe 100-500 for the hairline won't be a big sacrifice, it various between every paitent 

It will definitely make a difference and might be worth it, but will it stand up to the harsh lights?  Most likely not.  

[EvoXOhio]

4 hours ago, Melvin- Moderator said:

I’ve considered it, but it faded after a few years. I wouldn’t want to keep retouching it, that would get pricey.

It’s about $2500 upfront then you’d need like a $700 touch up every 5-7 years. That’s an average of $100 or less per year. Most of us blow that or more on a nice night out.

 

I absolutely love my SMP because it dramatically adds to the illusion of density everywhere. I had areas that were see through like yours but now they look super dense. The only time I can see scalp is with super wet combed hair. 
 

if it was me, I’d get an HT in the crown and temple points, then wait a year and get full scalp SMP. 

[Melvin- Admin]

11 minutes ago, EvoXOhio said:

It’s about $2500 upfront then you’d need like a $700 touch up every 5-7 years. That’s an average of $100 or less per year. Most of us blow that or more on a nice night out.

 

I absolutely love my SMP because it dramatically adds to the illusion of density everywhere. I had areas that were see through like yours but now they look super dense. The only time I can see scalp is with super wet combed hair. 
 

if it was me, I’d get an HT in the crown and temple points, then wait a year and get full scalp SMP. 

Ok that’s good to know, I was thinking it would cost 2,500 every two years. 

[EvoXOhio]

Just now, Melvin- Moderator said:

Ok that’s good to know, I was thinking it would cost 2,500 every two years. 

No, because the touchups are just to fix the dots that have lightened (or add some new ones between them), it’s not like you’re getting the entire procedure done again. Plus the $2500 covers two full sessions whereas a touchup is one small session.
 

I mean every place will have different rates (may be $3000 up front for example, and the touchups could be $1000), but touchups shouldn’t cost anywhere near as much as the original, and as long as you take care of it (which basically means put sunscreen on) it won’t need a touchup for 5-7 years. 
 

The shaved look SMP for people who shave their head bald may need more frequent touchups since you’re staring directly at the dots, but even then I know it’s not every 2 years. 

 

Maybe @Gatsby can chime in on specifics since he has more real world longevity examples. 

[JDEE0]

I think you've come a long way, Melvin. Your hair most certainly looks good enough to the average person from the front in most conditions. I'm actually impressed by the coverage you've gotten when looking at your donor before in regards to the retrograde, you must have good characteristics!

In my opinion though, as others have said, even a handful hundred grafts will make a huge difference to your hairline/straight on profile in every day life. This in my view is amplified by the fact you wear your hair slicked back. I would try and focus on the crown for the most part, but if possible, would make the decision to sacrifice a little bit of my available grafts here in order to boost the hairline area instead. 

Temple peaks I wouldn't worry about too much, but I think overall I would go 80-85% of what I have available into the crown, and 15-20% into the hairline/frontal third. I think by doing this, the overall result would obviously be a somewhat weaker crown than you would otherwise have, but you'd get an actual noticeably improved hairline if you get what I'm saying. Basically, I think the difference in the crown would be minimal as a result of doing this, but the difference in the hairline would be fairly substantial - a few hundred extra grafts here will go a longer way than in the crown in my opinion.

 

Edited October 2, 2021 by JDEE0

[Z--]

First thing -- you've gone a looooong way from the starting point (I'm actually near where you were originally ), but hair transplants aren't perfect and I understand the concern with the density just behind the hairline. Honestly, I think if you have the grafts available, you could do something like 250-500 there and the rest in the crown.

How many grafts do you have available and are these exclusively beard grafts? If so, I'd possibly consider seeing if you could do any donor hair on your head (if remaining) for the the front and beard to get you some coverage in the back.

 

Edited October 2, 2021 by Z--

[Curious25]

I think it depends on what Eugenix see in front of them on the day of surgery, in terms of what they have to work with. 
 

I think 500 scalp grafts directly behind your hairline will reinforce that area really well, and open up new options for hairstyling. 
 

Your beard is going to supply you ample grafts IMO , but there also needs to be some scalp hair used in the crown remember - IDK for example, an ideal breakdown could look like this; 

 

2000 grafts BHT - crown and some mid scalp boosting 

 

2000 grafts Scalp 

1000 - used to create crown whirl and centre crown area

500 - used to bolster your hairline/frontal third

250 - left temple point

250 - right temple point.
 

I think that would be pretty cool. But over a 2 day session, or course ! 

Edited October 2, 2021 by Curious25

[Gasthoerer]

9 hours ago, asterix0 said:

It depends on what sort of hair style you want to sport.

Instead of a slick back, what about a side part type of style? Maybe some more in the front would help there:

 

First: I think it is against the law to post a pic of one of the hair GOATS in such a thread 😉

Second: The focus should be the crown using also BHT etc. No more Toppik and other stuff to disguise it. Not being afraid of wind and rain or someone standing behind me. Saving the time to style the hair every day. This was such a relief to myself. 

If you can spare 100 donor grafts for the hairline it is a plus, but not the focus.

Keep in mind were you coming from and that your crown can further expand...you need some bullets left considering your age. 

[Gatsby]

Melvin I love the way you style your hair (balding or non balding). It suits your face and its not only a great look but a slicked back look is easy to style. I would focus on the crown where luckily beard grafts can be used (as opposed to the hairline) for optimal effect. Also what you have going for you is an excellent scalp hair/beard hair match in terms of their similar characteristics. The beard hair will be a great match with your existing scalp hair!  You know Eugenix, if any a clinic can, will be able to find donor scalp hair for the frontal hair hairline (without compromising the cosmosis of your donor area) and behind that they can strengthen it with matching beard hair (which you have ample of) with scalp hair. It just won't be in the numbers of grafts that someone with a virgin 'perfect' donor has (which overtime no one really has anyways).

As to SMP once everything has healed for at least a year this also is an added option and you would be the ideal candidate as your hair is dark/black which is a perfect match in that your hair will 'shade' a cover over the SMP and so you won't be getting a contrast of say SMP (regardless of the ink color) with blond or light color hair. This can sometimes highlight a separation of hair to scalp illusion in harsh lighting. The touch up for SMP is only for some areas that may have faded. It is never a total re coverage of the entire SMP. It's just to 'sharpen up' some points of the follicles (mostly in the hairline area). I've had one touch up this year (after five years of wearing 'ink' and it was still only to touch up the coverage above and below the donor scars and to sharpen up the edge of the hairline (which also has a long linear scar). In your case however  I don't believe you will ever need an SMP touch up as you have hair there growing and the SMP is not aimed at being there to hide the scalp itself (if that makes sense). I can get you into contact with Caitlin James for a chat if you like (who did my SMP and has a massive volume of work for augmenting hair transplants with SMP for added density which you could do). That being said, I would stick to your game plan. But it's always good to know that you will always still have one trick up your sleeve. All the best mate!

Cheers,

Adrian.

[BLE123]

Melvin, I watched one of your recent vids and I was a bit worried when you showed thinning in the lateral humps. Maybe it was just the lighting or angle but you need to be careful as if they start to go then you're going to have a problem if you use up your remaining grafts. If it were me I would forget about the temple peaks(they look fine as they are) and I would probably leave the frontal third for now also(maybe a very small amount in areas of weakness). Concentrate mainly on the crown but not with the aim of filling it in completely.

That's just my view though, it's your head haha.

Edited October 2, 2021 by BLE123

[kirkland]

11 hours ago, Doron Harati said:

@Melvin- Moderator crown procedures need many double and triple grafts for high density result, you already had 3 procedures so it will best if you can calculate all the double and triple grafts you had from previous procedures to estimate if you still got enough for the density your desire, it's not easy to get average density over the crown if most of the grafts are singles, you should consult with the doctor which option will best if you got only majority of single grafts, if it's worth invest at the same procedure over your frontal, even with 3500 single grafts it may be hard to achieve average density over crown, so you need to make a plan with clinic if you won't be happy with the next crown density result can do another small touch up procedure around 1000-1500 grafts from back head, beard, whatever after 9 months.

I agree with Doron in this assessment. Since the crown is the 'black hole' of the scalp, and if you have a majority of single FU's in the bank, including beard hair, I would be cautious in using too many of them to fill the crown. I think it would be better to improve the density in the hairline and, since you are going to Eugenix, they can extract a lot from your beard for the crown. 

 

[Al - Moderator]

Melvin, put about 200 grafts in the center behind the hairline to create somewhat of a center tuft. You don't want to mess with the very frontal hairline as that looks so good right now. You don't want to risk ruining the naturalness of it. Using just 200 grafts behind the hairline won't really take away from what you are getting done in the crown and it will make you feel like you improved the front and I'm sure you will notice a difference when it grows out. A lot of this stuff is psychological. If you don't put any in the front then you will always be thinking to yourself that you should have done that.

If you don't actually touch the hairline and stay just behind it then you can use beard grafts. I wouldn't want to use any more scalp grafts as it looks like you are already getting a bit thin from all the grafts taken previously. I wouldn't want to thin out the sides and back any further. Besides, your beard hair seems to grow pretty straight and doesn't look too rough, so it should blend in very well.

 

[Curious25]

2 hours ago, BeHappy said:

Melvin, put about 200 grafts in the center behind the hairline to create somewhat of a center tuft. You don't want to mess with the very frontal hairline as that looks so good right now. You don't want to risk ruining the naturalness of it. Using just 200 grafts behind the hairline won't really take away from what you are getting done in the crown and it will make you feel like you improved the front and I'm sure you will notice a difference when it grows out. A lot of this stuff is psychological. If you don't put any in the front then you will always be thinking to yourself that you should have done that.

If you don't actually touch the hairline and stay just behind it then you can use beard grafts. I wouldn't want to use any more scalp grafts as it looks like you are already getting a bit thin from all the grafts taken previously. I wouldn't want to thin out the sides and back any further. Besides, your beard hair seems to grow pretty straight and doesn't look too rough, so it should blend in very well.

 

I agree with this area of focus, however think 200 wouldn’t make a huge difference . . 500 I imagine would be the rough ball park figure to start enhancing the visual density.
 

Melvin FWIW - no one knows I have hair loss, and after having a hairline procedure 6 years ago, this area is somewhat thin for me also . . and under these conditions your hair looks much better than mine does. I’m currently planning a restoration of this area myself - and will be favouring a DHI/stick and place technique. 

[Enhancer]

Just a different point of view here:

-You, being a high NW, will never get away from having to use concealers in the back.  The back will never be "fixed".  And as we all know when it comes to concealers, a little hair can go a long way.  Don't overkill the crown.

-Due to your hair style, long and slicked back, the hair in the hairline and midscalp also acts as coverage in the back. 2x bang for your buck.

-My philosophy is to isolate problems.  I would rather have one problem area to take care of than two separate less severe problems.

-There are more options for the crown.  Concealers and even a partial system can work in the crown.  There are no current suitable options for the hairline except transplants.

Having the same style and density as you I would cover the crown in the minimum density needed for concealers to work, and put everything else in the hairline.

[Curious25]

17 minutes ago, Enhancer said:

Just a different point of view here:

-You, being a high NW, will never get away from having to use concealers in the back.  The back will never be "fixed".  And as we all know when it comes to concealers, a little hair can go a long way.  Don't overkill the crown.

-Due to your hair style, long and slicked back, the hair in the hairline and midscalp also acts as coverage in the back. 2x bang for your buck.

-My philosophy is to isolate problems.  I would rather have one problem area to take care of than two separate less severe problems.

-There are more options for the crown.  Concealers and even a partial system can work in the crown.  There are no current suitable options for the hairline except transplants.

Having the same style and density as you I would cover the crown in the minimum density needed for concealers to work, and put everything else in the hairline.

His goal is to get away from concealers though - which contrary to your statement , is possible. 

[Melvin- Admin]

1 hour ago, Enhancer said:

Just a different point of view here:

-You, being a high NW, will never get away from having to use concealers in the back.  The back will never be "fixed".  And as we all know when it comes to concealers, a little hair can go a long way.  Don't overkill the crown.

-Due to your hair style, long and slicked back, the hair in the hairline and midscalp also acts as coverage in the back. 2x bang for your buck.

-My philosophy is to isolate problems.  I would rather have one problem area to take care of than two separate less severe problems.

-There are more options for the crown.  Concealers and even a partial system can work in the crown.  There are no current suitable options for the hairline except transplants.

Having the same style and density as you I would cover the crown in the minimum density needed for concealers to work, and put everything else in the hairline.

I already do that, and it’s okay. I would like to be confident enough to leave the house without concealer though, or at least not a lot. If I just needed a little sprinkle of toppik I’d consider that a success. 

[Melvin- Admin]

6 hours ago, BLE123 said:

Melvin, I watched one of your recent vids and I was a bit worried when you showed thinning in the lateral humps. Maybe it was just the lighting or angle but you need to be careful as if they start to go then you're going to have a problem if you use up your remaining grafts. If it were me I would forget about the temple peaks(they look fine as they are) and I would probably leave the frontal third for now also(maybe a very small amount in areas of weakness). Concentrate mainly on the crown but not with the aim of filling it in completely.

That's just my view though, it's your head haha.

It’s thin at the border of the crown. Right in this area, I’m not sure it’s considered the lateral hump since I believe the lateral hump attaches to the temporal peaks, but its definitely a concern of mine. 

[Melvin- Admin]

3 minutes ago, david2708 said:

The dark hair doesn't help. Lighten the colour to make less contrast with the scalp.

A cheap bottle of hair dye is somewhat less than another transplant.🙂

I think I’d look ridiculous with dyed hair lol

[Britanium]

4 minutes ago, david2708 said:

The dark hair doesn't help. Lighten the colour to make less contrast with the scalp.

A cheap bottle of hair dye is somewhat less than another transplant.🙂

For some reason all i thought of was this guy:

 

[asterix0]

@Gasthoerer Nobody here has Brad Pitt's hair that's a fact  .

However, that hair style can provide a good "combover effect" and add layering to sparser areas..

[BDK081522]

20 hours ago, EvoXOhio said:

No, because the touchups are just to fix the dots that have lightened (or add some new ones between them), it’s not like you’re getting the entire procedure done again. Plus the $2500 covers two full sessions whereas a touchup is one small session.
 

I mean every place will have different rates (may be $3000 up front for example, and the touchups could be $1000), but touchups shouldn’t cost anywhere near as much as the original, and as long as you take care of it (which basically means put sunscreen on) it won’t need a touchup for 5-7 years. 
 

The shaved look SMP for people who shave their head bald may need more frequent touchups since you’re staring directly at the dots, but even then I know it’s not every 2 years. 

 

Maybe @Gatsby can chime in on specifics since he has more real world longevity examples. 

You will  probably need touch ups much sooner than 5-7 years. Don't believe everything the clinic tells you. The ink fades and blurs relatively quickly. It's more like every 2-3 years that you'll need touched up. Still not bad though and worth it in my opinion. 

[EvoXOhio]

1 hour ago, BDK081522 said:

You will  probably need touch ups much sooner than 5-7 years. Don't believe everything the clinic tells you. The ink fades and blurs relatively quickly. It's more like every 2-3 years that you'll need touched up. Still not bad though and worth it in my opinion. 

I’m not going by what the clinic told me, I’m going by what real people on this site told me as well as hundreds or thousands of online testimonials. If you get quality work done you’re not going to need touchups every 2-3 years.  
 

You might be thinking of trichopigmentation which is a designed to fade or be gone completely in 2-3 years. Some people get that for SMP, but what we are talking about in this thread is the “permanent” kind, not tricho.