1869 Grafts with Dr. Diep 2/12/19 (33 y/o Caucasian NW3)

[FUEblonde1985]

I've been in back to back trials these last couple months and I haven't had a chance to even breathe. I'll update when I have a chance. Haven't even gotten a haircut during this time.

[Melvin- Admin]

3 hours ago, FUEblonde1985 said:

I've been in back to back trials these last couple months and I haven't had a chance to even breathe. I'll update when I have a chance. Haven't even gotten a haircut during this time.

I'm glad you didn't forget about us, eager to see your updates.

[FUEblonde1985]

Here is my almost 8 month update. The hair more or less seems to be at its final form. I can't really notice much of a difference between 6 month and 8 month in terms of growth or thickness. I think the hair is becoming less "wirey" and a little more natural over time. However, the angle of the hair still seems a bit different than the native hair around it - the native hair wants to naturally drape forward and down, whereas the implanted hair tends to want to be pushed upwards a bit. I think for most guys this would be a non-issue since combing the hair back is a good style for implanted hair - but not mine. My hair generally works better when styled forward and to the side (big forehead) and the implanted angle is making that a bit of an issue. Not sure if this will resolve over time.

The area behind the hairline at my right temple is also weak. There is a patch there, about a dime size, where almost no hair took. I can cover it up effectively, but you can tell that the spot is missing volume. I don't know if I will try to fix it in the future, but there is a not insignificant number of grafts there that failed. I won't post any close-up photos yet until I get to the 12 month mark, but its one aspect that hasn't worked out.

Other than those comments, I am mostly happy about the results. Nothing to say about the donor area as there are no issues with it and it looks the same as it has since the last photo I took of it. The three photos from the bathroom are harsh lighting, one dry hair and two wet/damp. The other two are in more generous lighting.

[SWdan]

Looks great.

[Melvin- Admin]

Thanks for keeping us updated, I'm glad to hear the donor is a non-issue for you. I'm actually really impressed with how good it looks wet. My hairline doesn't look that good when it's wet. Looking forward to those close-up shots. I think you will see some improvements in the next 4 months. 

[Fahri]

Really impressive, thank you for sharing. Once education is complete I may go for this myself, its the downtime in recovery that makes me apprehensive, too many people on campus.

[Melvin- Admin]

@FUEblonde1985 hey man, I know you’re probably busy, sounds like maybe you’re a lawyer and a newlywed.

Hope everything is going well, I’d be interested to see your 12 month results. It’s coming up next week. Look forward to your update 😊 don’t forget about us 👨🏼‍🦲 baldies lol

[OliverAtom]

On 10/8/2019 at 1:31 AM, FUEblonde1985 said:

Here is my almost 8 month update. The hair more or less seems to be at its final form. I can't really notice much of a difference between 6 month and 8 month in terms of growth or thickness. I think the hair is becoming less "wirey" and a little more natural over time. However, the angle of the hair still seems a bit different than the native hair around it - the native hair wants to naturally drape forward and down, whereas the implanted hair tends to want to be pushed upwards a bit. I think for most guys this would be a non-issue since combing the hair back is a good style for implanted hair - but not mine. My hair generally works better when styled forward and to the side (big forehead) and the implanted angle is making that a bit of an issue. Not sure if this will resolve over time.

The area behind the hairline at my right temple is also weak. There is a patch there, about a dime size, where almost no hair took. I can cover it up effectively, but you can tell that the spot is missing volume. I don't know if I will try to fix it in the future, but there is a not insignificant number of grafts there that failed. I won't post any close-up photos yet until I get to the 12 month mark, but its one aspect that hasn't worked out.

Other than those comments, I am mostly happy about the results. Nothing to say about the donor area as there are no issues with it and it looks the same as it has since the last photo I took of it. The three photos from the bathroom are harsh lighting, one dry hair and two wet/damp. The other two are in more generous lighting.

FUEblonde1985,
All is looking great. Cant wait to see the final result at 12 months. It´s true that the light coming in on those last photos doesnt help but I´m sure it will look much better in person.
Also, nice to hear that your donor is looking good, it´s important for possible future touch-ups.
Any outdoor photos? Those would be nice to see.

Many thanks for sharing 😉
 

[FUEblonde1986]

Here is my last update and final thoughts (I'm on a different username because I forgot my password and I am too inpatient to wait for account unlock)

I overall have mixed feelings about my final result. I think the hair is in general an improvement, but I think that there are some issues, some of which have nothing to do with Diep, others I believe are a result of the procedure execution.

1. The implanted hair texture/density doesn't flow with the natural hair. This is probably out of hands of the doctor, but something that everyone should realize will likely happen unless you are just fortunate to have your existing hair match well with the donor. The hair behind my implanted hair doesn't flow or style very well with the implanted hair. The implanted hair is clearly thicker, because the hair behind it is thinning. My styling routine mostly fixes this, but it is an issue that I have to deal with each day - the hairstyle just doesn't flow naturally like you would expect.

2. Building on point 1 above, which I believe is directly as a result of Diep's work - the angle of the implanted hair does not flow well with the natural hair. Its obviously not implanted standing straight up, but the natural hair flows forward and down, where the implanted hair constantly wants to angle upwards and out. This is especially apparent in the area where the implanted hairline at the temples meets the natural temple points - looking closely at mine the flow is absolutely not natural at all, and its a very obvious indicator where the transplanted hair begins.  Again this makes it difficult to style in a natural way. It seems like the angle of the hair is best suited for combing the hair back, which I see a lot of guys do after implants. Unfortunately that style doesn't work for my head or hair, making every style a difficult cross between hair that wants to flow up and back, and hair that I am trying to style down and across. I don't know if this is a limitation of current techniques, or the Dr. didn't utilize fine single grafts to place in this area when they were available.

3. This also adds to 1 and 2, although this isn't the Dr. fault (although I think he could have advised me better on this) - part of the fault for the hair styling issues is that I didn't have much hair implanted in the areas where I already had hair. If I could do it again, it probably would have achieved a better result to just shave the crown and then have some of the grafts implanted further back in the hairline, so that there was a better mix of native and implanted hair. Instead, there are my triangle tufts of implanted hair, and then the natural,thinner,weaker hair right behind it. I expect this will continue to become more of an issue when the hair continues to recede (which it has a small amount since the procedure).

4. There is a small area in my right temple where very few grafts took. I don't know why this happened, but it is annoying thing to look at and work around every day. You can see this in the pictures below. I will add that the picture looks probably worse since you are also seeing continued advancement of the hair thinning, but the implanted area is missing many grafts that should have been placed.

5. There is a lot of stuff said on this forum about Diep's donor areas. I can say that I haven't had any concerns about mine, but I also think that I can't actually know if my donor is in bad shape until I get a second procedure down the road. I think I will probably seek a different doctor just as a precaution since I anticipate needing 2-3 more procedures later in life, and the donor area just looked "really" bad right after surgery compared to other reputable doctors. I'm not sure why it has to be this way when other docs are getting just as good results without leaving a huge mess.

Again please keep in mind these photos are putting the hair/transplant in the worst light. My hair looks pretty good when dry/styled (see other progress pics above, not much has changed since my last update) - it's really just the finer details that are bothering me. Going into the procedure, I was hoping that after this, styling my hair in the way I want would be easy/no effort because it would just be in all the right places. Unfortunately that part hasn't really changed much - instead of dealing with a receding hairline, I am dealing with hair that doesn't naturally flow together. 

 

 

 

Edited February 29, 2020 by FUEblonde1986

[Melvin- Admin]

Have you addressed any of your concerns with Dr. Diep, do you mind sharing pictures of your hair dry, and of the donor area. 

I don’t really see any issues in the flow of the hair. Thanks for keeping us updated. 

[BDK081522]

I have the same exact problem as you after a Dr Diep hairline restoration. Overall the transplant looks pretty good. But it’s the little nuances that bother me. The hair that was implanted was definitely two perpendicular to the scalp. Where my natural hair meets the transplanted hair it is very obvious that the transplanted hair sticks straight up and the natural hair wants to lay forward. I believe this is to Dr. Diep not using a very acute angle with his implantation. If you look at some other surgeon's work they implant at a flatter more acute (closer to the skin) angle. This is how natural hair grows and actually helps with camoflouging. It's a win win for the surgeon to implant the follicles flatter to the scalp. I believe this takes more technical skill and is more tedious and that's why it is not done all the time. Temple point restoration has to be implanted extremely close to the skin which is why very few surgeons are actually successful or willing to do them. I too have temple transition grafts that didn't grow. One side is much thinner then the other. It seems like all the rest of the transplanted hair had good yield except where he transitioned to the temple area. 

[OtherSyde]

I dunno man, I wouldn't worry; looks fantastic overall and I'm sure anyone without an eye specifically trained to look for the subtleties of hair transplants would never even notice. Besides, you can always go back for a way smaller and less expensive procedure to touch up the unforeseen things like some of the grafts not taking so well in that one little area near the right temple, and blending more grafts back into the native hair to make the transition flow better. Still looks like a home run to me, man! Congrats!

[FUEblonde1986]

On 2/29/2020 at 3:59 PM, Melvin-Moderator said:

Have you addressed any of your concerns with Dr. Diep, do you mind sharing pictures of your hair dry, and of the donor area. 

I don’t really see any issues in the flow of the hair. Thanks for keeping us updated. 

I have not spoken with Diep about it - my follow up is not until April. Either way, I'm not sure that this would fall under the category of "money refunded" or "free touch up" - although I think an argument can be made that the lack of grafts in the right temple falls below what should be generally acceptable. I'm not sure what would account for this area of sparseness - all the photos I took in the first few weeks shows that the hair was transplanted there. The only thing I can think of is this is an area where there seemed to be a large scab, but the scabbing essentially stayed put until well after day 10ish.

I took some follow up photos. I just got the hair cut, so it looks a bit different than the photos posted over the weekend. Here are ones where the hair is dry, just washed, no product (and the hair is generally frizzy here due to the keto treatment):

This is after using some wax to style it (I know, doesn't look that different):

I didn't used to style my hair this way, with it up and to the side, but this is sort of my only option because the transplanted hair won't drape over in any kind of fringe.

Here is the donor area (the best quality I can do on my own with mirror), this is a 3 guard on the back:

[Melvin- Admin]

In my opinion, the hair transplant was a success, now is it perfect? No, but I don't think any hair transplant will ever be perfect. Check out my thread on hair transplants being an illusion of density, I show my own results under harsher environments like your previous pictures. It comes down to perspective. I think those with less hair loss will have higher expectations than those with significant hair loss.https://www.hairrestorationnetwork.com/topic/52489-are-hair-transplants-an-%E2%80%9Cillusion%E2%80%9D-of-density/

Are you on finasteride? It does look like you may be losing some additional hair in the midscalp where grafts weren't placed, but maybe it's just the lighting. My advice is to forget about hair transplants for the time being, at least until you start to lose ground in other areas on your scalp. Wish you the best man and thanks for coming back and sharing your update.

[PlzRespond]

1 hour ago, Melvin-Moderator said:

In my opinion, the hair transplant was a success, now is it perfect? No, but I don't think any hair transplant will ever be perfect. Check out my thread on hair transplants being an illusion of density, I show my own results under harsher environments like your previous pictures. It comes down to perspective. I think those with less hair loss will have higher expectations than those with significant hair loss.https://www.hairrestorationnetwork.com/topic/52489-are-hair-transplants-an-%E2%80%9Cillusion%E2%80%9D-of-density/

Are you on finasteride? It does look like you may be losing some additional hair in the midscalp where grafts weren't placed, but maybe it's just the lighting. My advice is to forget about hair transplants for the time being, at least until you start to lose ground in other areas on your scalp. Wish you the best man and thanks for coming back and sharing your update.

Melvin did you ever get a number of ur density in the transplanted area (grafts/cm2)?

[Melvin- Admin]

9 hours ago, PlzRespond said:

Melvin did you ever get a number of ur density in the transplanted area (grafts/cm2)?

About 40 grafts per cm2

[Mycroft]

I doubt any doctor would offer a refund for a case like this as your hair largely looks okay. I do see what you mean about the temple though, and I do think that a number of doctors would be willing to do a small touch-up job in that area for no additional charge. Whether Dr. Diep is willing to do so would be a question only he can answer.

[Tentpole91]

This is a fascinating thread for me as someone who recently got surgery with Dr. Diep. The points being made about the angle of the hair are definitely valid, especially when the density isn’t really there behind the grafts to push the hair down naturally. @Mycroft I’m curious how the angle of the hairs could be corrected through surgery. That doesn’t seem possible to me, but then again I’m not a doctor. 

[OliverAtom]

On 3/3/2020 at 3:22 AM, FUEblonde1986 said:

I have not spoken with Diep about it - my follow up is not until April. Either way, I'm not sure that this would fall under the category of "money refunded" or "free touch up" - although I think an argument can be made that the lack of grafts in the right temple falls below what should be generally acceptable. I'm not sure what would account for this area of sparseness - all the photos I took in the first few weeks shows that the hair was transplanted there. The only thing I can think of is this is an area where there seemed to be a large scab, but the scabbing essentially stayed put until well after day 10ish.

I took some follow up photos. I just got the hair cut, so it looks a bit different than the photos posted over the weekend. Here are ones where the hair is dry, just washed, no product (and the hair is generally frizzy here due to the keto treatment):

This is after using some wax to style it (I know, doesn't look that different):

I didn't used to style my hair this way, with it up and to the side, but this is sort of my only option because the transplanted hair won't drape over in any kind of fringe.

Here is the donor area (the best quality I can do on my own with mirror), this is a 3 guard on the back:

Man, this photos look amazing!
Wet hair is complicated to see the "perfect" result that we all want but I could say checking your photos that your final result is a great one.
 

[Mycroft]

7 hours ago, Tentpole91 said:

This is a fascinating thread for me as someone who recently got surgery with Dr. Diep. The points being made about the angle of the hair are definitely valid, especially when the density isn’t really there behind the grafts to push the hair down naturally. @Mycroft I’m curious how the angle of the hairs could be corrected through surgery. That doesn’t seem possible to me, but then again I’m not a doctor. 

I was referring to the dime-sized patch of thinness he mentioned. Mis-angled grafts could only be fixed by having them removed or attempting to conceal them with more grafts 

 

[Tentpole91]

@FUEblonde1986 did you happen to have your April follow up with Dr. Diep yet?

Also, can you comment more deeply on the state of your donor? If you cut the hair short, can you still see the rough outline of where the doctor did the extractions in terms of it being less dense than the surrounding areas? 
 

cc @FUEblonde1985 since I’m not sure which one you are getting emails on. 

Edited April 23, 2020 by Tentpole91

[FUEblonde1985]

On 4/23/2020 at 1:30 AM, Tentpole91 said:

@FUEblonde1986 did you happen to have your April follow up with Dr. Diep yet?

Also, can you comment more deeply on the state of your donor? If you cut the hair short, can you still see the rough outline of where the doctor did the extractions in terms of it being less dense than the surrounding areas? 
 

cc @FUEblonde1985 since I’m not sure which one you are getting emails on. 

I had my follow up today (the delay was my fault) - we didn't discuss a whole lot because my feelings overall about the procedure have gotten somewhat more positive since my last posting here. We mainly discussed the thin patch on my right temple and his explanation was that the success of grafts in that area is commonly lower because they try to use the smaller single grafts in order to have a smoother transition into the temple point area. I'm not sure if I buy that since the other temple area clearly grew much better - and as I said previously my gripe with that area was that the hairs on the left temple were quite thick and it was a harsh transition to the temple points. So, if they are indeed trying to use thinner single grafts in the temple area, they didn't seem to apply that strategy to my left temple. I suspect the difference between the left and right side was the differences in technicians - I was fairly awake towards the end of the procedure and I can recall hearing the technicians talking to each other and it sounded like the technician on my left was having some difficulties placing the grafts.

Either way, there is no point in stressing or speculating and the point is that there is just some variation to expect for any procedure and that's just the nature of hair transplants as they are now.

Going to my previous point about my overall feelings about the procedure, which seems generally true for most transplants - the transplanted hair continued to evolve over the last 5 months (I'm at month 17 now) - its slightly thicker and more natural feeling and looking. Its hard to tell if this is a result of having significantly longer hair (haven't cut it in 4 months because everything is shut down in Cali) but in general it just looks/feels more natural than when I last posted. I would have to say my opinion about my own procedure seemed to mirror that of hairvanity's transplant with the same doctor https://www.hairrestorationnetwork.com/topic/49399-2022-grafts-with-dr-diep-fut-revision-surgery/ - he seemed to have doubts early on during the "end stage" but felt satisfied once he got to the 1.5 year mark. This is probably a mix of the hair getting better and also relaxing our expectations of "perfection." I would venture to guess that many of the "perfect" looking transplants you see on this forum and elsewhere are generally of the same quality as mine with less picky patients and taking good photos. My hair looks fantastic if I style it and take some good angles, but I can make the transplant look pretty mediocre if I choose to (see above). People happy about their transplants are going to post their best photos - people unhappy will try to take the worst photos. With a few exceptions, your transplant is probably going to look as good as the good ones you see if you go to a well reputed doctor.

This still leaves what I think is the big elephant in the room regarding Diep and that is the donor area @Tentpole91. Again, my donor area looks great (nothing has changed from the photos above), you cannot tell at all that hair was taken from that area. I haven't seen the hair at a 1 guard, but at a 2 guard you can't really tell either - the only way you can see the thinness is if you look at the hair from a very specific angle (so that the follicles are directly pointing at your field of view). I doubt that any doctor could remove a significant percentage of hair but leave it looking undetectable from all angles. I have many things to nitpick about my transplant, but the donor area as it appears now is not one of them.

This still leaves the question as to what impact, if any, Diep's punch technique has for any future harvesting from these areas. That I cannot know, and that might also be the reason that I choose a different doctor. Honestly I think the only way to draw any conclusions about this is to hear feedback for people that have had multiple rounds with Diep - I haven't seen any (although I haven't looked specifically).

For what its worth, Diep said any future procedures with him will be offered at discount. I'm not sure if thats because of my dissatisfaction with the right temple, or if he does that for all his patients. I may or may not take him up on that, but that won't be for quite a few years down the road.

 

 

 

 

 

[Melvin- Admin]

2 hours ago, FUEblonde1985 said:

I had my follow up today (the delay was my fault) - we didn't discuss a whole lot because my feelings overall about the procedure have gotten somewhat more positive since my last posting here. We mainly discussed the thin patch on my right temple and his explanation was that the success of grafts in that area is commonly lower because they try to use the smaller single grafts in order to have a smoother transition into the temple point area. I'm not sure if I buy that since the other temple area clearly grew much better - and as I said previously my gripe with that area was that the hairs on the left temple were quite thick and it was a harsh transition to the temple points. So, if they are indeed trying to use thinner single grafts in the temple area, they didn't seem to apply that strategy to my left temple. I suspect the difference between the left and right side was the differences in technicians - I was fairly awake towards the end of the procedure and I can recall hearing the technicians talking to each other and it sounded like the technician on my left was having some difficulties placing the grafts.

Either way, there is no point in stressing or speculating and the point is that there is just some variation to expect for any procedure and that's just the nature of hair transplants as they are now.

Going to my previous point about my overall feelings about the procedure, which seems generally true for most transplants - the transplanted hair continued to evolve over the last 5 months (I'm at month 17 now) - its slightly thicker and more natural feeling and looking. Its hard to tell if this is a result of having significantly longer hair (haven't cut it in 4 months because everything is shut down in Cali) but in general it just looks/feels more natural than when I last posted. I would have to say my opinion about my own procedure seemed to mirror that of hairvanity's transplant with the same doctor https://www.hairrestorationnetwork.com/topic/49399-2022-grafts-with-dr-diep-fut-revision-surgery/ - he seemed to have doubts early on during the "end stage" but felt satisfied once he got to the 1.5 year mark. This is probably a mix of the hair getting better and also relaxing our expectations of "perfection." I would venture to guess that many of the "perfect" looking transplants you see on this forum and elsewhere are generally of the same quality as mine with less picky patients and taking good photos. My hair looks fantastic if I style it and take some good angles, but I can make the transplant look pretty mediocre if I choose to (see above). People happy about their transplants are going to post their best photos - people unhappy will try to take the worst photos. With a few exceptions, your transplant is probably going to look as good as the good ones you see if you go to a well reputed doctor.

This still leaves what I think is the big elephant in the room regarding Diep and that is the donor area @Tentpole91. Again, my donor area looks great (nothing has changed from the photos above), you cannot tell at all that hair was taken from that area. I haven't seen the hair at a 1 guard, but at a 2 guard you can't really tell either - the only way you can see the thinness is if you look at the hair from a very specific angle (so that the follicles are directly pointing at your field of view). I doubt that any doctor could remove a significant percentage of hair but leave it looking undetectable from all angles. I have many things to nitpick about my transplant, but the donor area as it appears now is not one of them.

This still leaves the question as to what impact, if any, Diep's punch technique has for any future harvesting from these areas. That I cannot know, and that might also be the reason that I choose a different doctor. Honestly I think the only way to draw any conclusions about this is to hear feedback for people that have had multiple rounds with Diep - I haven't seen any (although I haven't looked specifically).

For what its worth, Diep said any future procedures with him will be offered at discount. I'm not sure if thats because of my dissatisfaction with the right temple, or if he does that for all his patients. I may or may not take him up on that, but that won't be for quite a few years down the road.

 

 

 

 

 

It would be great if you can post some updated pictures. That said I 100% agree with your assessment. Those happy post flattering pictures, and those unhappy post unflattering pictures, truth is, no hair transplant is perfect, nor are they supposed to be. Also, I’m one patient that has two rounds with Diep, and to date my donor looks fine. 

[HTHope]

7 hours ago, Melvin-Moderator said:

It would be great if you can post some updated pictures. That said I 100% agree with your assessment. Those happy post flattering pictures, and those unhappy post unflattering pictures, truth is, no hair transplant is perfect, nor are they supposed to be. Also, I’m one patient that has two rounds with Diep, and to date my donor looks fine. 

Hi Melvin, I came across an old post of yours where you mentioned the possibility of dr konior adding in hairs into your fue scars (from beard I believe?). Was this recommended by him? Are you going to go thru with it?

[Melvin- Admin]

2 hours ago, HTHope said:

Hi Melvin, I came across an old post of yours where you mentioned the possibility of dr konior adding in hairs into your fue scars (from beard I believe?). Was this recommended by him? Are you going to go thru with it?

No, I haven’t done it, but it’s a possibility in the future.