JayLDD

Almost certainly still ugly duck, your best bet until at least 5 months is growing the surrounding hair a bit to cover it if possible. I'm about a week after 6 months and only felt past the ugly duck a few days before 6 months. Prior to that its still not presentable, maybe even worse in the sense as the hair grows out a bit but lacks the density to blend with native hair in any sense and still has a lot of redness. Also the texture of transplanted hair can be ugly which further stops it from blending even up to 6-7 months. Such a long, shitty process.

My close friends already were aware of the procedure and have been impressed, same with my hair dresser. One thought I was joking when I told him I'd had transplants, I think he still does. I've only recently started wearing my hair with the hairline exposed because there's no remaining recession unlike after the first procedure which I wasn't comfortable with, so we'll see what happens. Because I'm young and my hairloss proceeded so quickly there are a lot of people who never noticed I had hairloss to begin with (long hair with a strategic combover helps too). A lot of people genuinely thought (and said) that I had a "bad haircut" when I was diffused NW3 and refused to accept I was balding, so presumably now just think my hairdresser upped their game.

I will do detailed 6 month photos in the next day or so with a proper camera. I realise that the lighting was poor but like I said in the post that wasn't the point, it was just to show the emerging overall shape of the hairline rather than the exact details. I'll post a few more recent phone photos here, I know that again the lighting image quality isn't perfect but again that's not the point. I think most people who take selfies or general photos when they're on the go want to see how the transplant will look in photos or how it appears at a reasonable distance and without a professional camera. Just as relevant as detailed, close-up sunlight pics imo.

I'm not going to post a single other response on this issue because I do see that its a waste of time and the responses are made by irrational people who just want to complain, but read Payam's thread, and look at HT0146s results and comments. If you don't think there are separate personal or anxiety related issues at play then there's nothing to say other than that how hilarious that is, and I feel bad for you. Keep supporting the childish, ignorant reckless and dishonest comments if it makes you feel better. I never suggested anyone should be censored or shouldn't speak their mind, but a stupid comment based on lies and misleading comments that are made with the intention of hurting someones business is wrong, and its childish, period. You're deliberately trying to make others feel uncomfortable about going to the clinic based on a small number of cases, despite the fact other major clinics have equal or more poor results and pretending to them that every result should be a home run. Payam who is the loudest one complaining isn't even at 9 months. You then have the audacity to complain about feeling uncomfortable when someone presents facts to the contrary. A forum isn't a free for all for one side to act braindead and irrational and censor anyone who suggests that, most people (the vast majority, well over 50 from the last 18 months) with positive results from the clinic aren't going to be comfortable entering the madhouse here and responding to Payam who is clearly irrational and doesn't want to change his mind which was set from day one if you read the thread. You say you aren't a professional reviewer and don't have time to review all their cases, no but the fact is that you can check over 150 in a few hours, which is reasonable if you're dropping 10 grand on a hair transplant. Pretending you can't do a Google search like any other adult is pathetic and dishonest. It is silly for me to go on about it because the comments of the those who I rightfully said were childish and had psychological issues just get more and more unhinged, thinking they are some type of martyr. Better to just ignore them, which I will.

Telling people to look at his history of results on as many resources as possible rather than listening to two who scream louder and more dishonestly than anyone else (and not even at 8 months) is not what a "bulldog" would do, its what any rational human being would. That's a pretty shitty and ignorant thing to call someone for basic common sense. Its not hard to find bad results from any alternative top surgeon you could suggest from the last 12 months. Not sure why the same two people slandering and trying to drive people away from the clinic should be accepted but presenting facts from people who have experience with the clinic is "a problem". You shouldn't ignore bad results from ASMED, but you also shouldn't ignore bad results from top surgeons like Feriduni, Cooley, Rahal etc etc which is what its obvious people are doing, because there are just as many poor results over the last few years from those clinics yet people say absolutely nothing about it. A rational person and someone who has done their research would be aware from this that not every result even from a top clinic is a home run, but at least ASMED offer touch-ups for below-par growth. None of the cases in question has the surgeon rejected to help the patient, even when they slander (and make things up, and post photos in the least flattering way possible) on a popular public forum. I agree with Melvin that for patients if they don't feel comfortable then move on, but for personal benefit apply the same standard and reference of poor results to every clinic, not just the ones with the people complaining the loudest.

I won't link it just in case its against this forums rules, but you can just google international hairloss forum then use translate tool on Chrome.

lol "some", over 40 strong patient posted results across here and the international forum during the last 18 months. None of the complaint results are anything close to disasters either. The only clinic that has as many good results posted online as ASMED on a regular basis aside from Diep's who churns them out on his Youtube channel. NONE have the same amount of strong patient posted results. With the 2 poor Cooley results I've seen and can show from the last 12 months, or poor Rahal or Feriduni results I mentioned, or the poor Reddy results I could find, is "something obviously going wrong over there" too? Be rational about your research, why is it that Payam's result at 7.5 month would make you reconsider about ASMED, but not about any of the bad results from these other clinics? Which as well as every other top clinic in the world have plenty because that's the nature of hair transplants. Its not a risk free surgery. The difference is that patients from those other clinics don't scream as hard as Payam and HT0416. HT0416 didn't even have a bad result, he refuses to take proper photos, won't post post-ops, and deliberately tries to make his transplant look as bad as possible in the pics he takes. Read Melvin's thread on this and you'll understand. If I had 3600 grafts and Payams result, I would be upset, but the clinic offer a free touchup for growth below 90% and the reality is that he'd be one of the rare cases that didn't get a great result. Blaming the clinic or spreading his hair apart to deliberately make it worse when complaining is childish and irrational. The clinic makes it clear that they work to rectify a situation with subpar growth so the idea that they're irresponsible or don't stand by their work is just wrong. I think you should do what ever you feel safest doing, but it would be flat out dumb to expect that by going to Reddy your result will automatically be good by default. Like any other surgeon he has poor/low density results and on top of that doesn't have even 10% of the patient posted results Erdogan does here or elsewhere. If you genuinely think that a great result is a guarantee with any surgeon you should call off a transplant entirely and do proper research.

Look on the international forum (a lot more results from the last 18 months than here, maybe 40 or so), There are clearly significantly more good results than bad on here also, should be noted that Payam isn't even 9 months and HT0416 who is also loud on this issue is over 2 years out. Should also say I've seen 2 well below average Cooley cases this year some with clearly worse growth than Payam's case, no one cares, they were even praised by forum-goers. A few poor growth Rahal FUE cases and again no one says anything. Even more poor Feriduni results across various forums. Quite frankly there isn't a surgeon who doesn't have bad results because its not a risk free surgery. You have a few poor Erdogan cases (or people complaining at the 6 month mark that refuse to post photos etc) and suddenly its the end of the world, the reality is that these other clinics aren't unlucky enough to get crusaders like Payam posting negative comments on every related thread. Erdogan is also the most patient posted surgeon on this and the international forum from what I see and does 3-4 surgeries per day, even with a higher success rate than 90% of surgeons the bad results will be more visible, especially with people like Payam and HT0416 who is complaining 2 years down the line despite having been offered a free touch-up. A lot of people with unrealistic expectations which Melvin addressed and did a great set of photos showing also. I'm still at 6 months and the length of the transplants is nowhere near the natives plus expecting more thickening and a small amount of growth, but I think I'm close to being able to say I will have had two successful and recent surgeries in a row at this point with ASMED. I don't think it makes any sense whatsoever for them to be considered a clinic where suddenly 3 poor results over 2 years means they shouldn't be considered, but in the case of other clinics (and there are absolutely none that avoid it aside from those like Koniors where you see less than 3 FUE cases in 12 months) its just something that happens. Should be mentioned too that ASMED do offer free touch-ups for below 90% growth and have a robot that can count the exact amount of growth. I do think Reddy does very good work as with all the other surgeons I mentioned (albeit more conservative), but I've seen various poor results and reviews from him too. Hair transplants are not a risk free surgery PERIOD.

Out of interest, if using these results as a comparison, how do you think your result looks compared to this result? By the way you keep saying 3000 to the frontal area, maybe you should post a clear post-op photo showing the grafts and a photo with your hairline pulled back pre-op.

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There are studies that suggest DHT increases for a short period from testosterone conversion after masturbating/sex which is likely why the hairloss myth gets perpetuated, but of course genetics are what is actually relevant.

Probably in between looking at this pic, but also can see the hairline was lowered quite a bit plus the temple peaks were also filled. Its definitely not packed with density at all above that of other well known surgeons. Imo the guy is looking at another 1000 grafts or so for a perfect result. Don't see a huge deal in having to go through two procedures to achieve that when his desired hairline design was quite aggressive to begin with.

You keep saying NW2, there are post-op and pre-op photos where its looks closer to a NW3 and the hairline height chosen to create is also more aggressive than a typical NW2 case. On top of that his temple points were completely rebuilt. You can't throw around very specific numbers like "70 grafts per cm/2" if you're not going to bother being accurate about the area covered and actually looking at the graft placement post-ops. I do agree the growth could be better, but if you're going to make precise claims about numbers then you should use accurate basis for them. I don't get what the problem being accurate about details here is, if there's a problem then why constantly hyperbolize it.

Your experience is anecdotal, I'm basing my analysis on statistics. Doganay is not a doctor with a 99% customer satisfaction rate if you judge patient posted cases online, he's a 50% satisfaction rate surgeon. Google or search on this website for yourself. Its not a small sample size either, and there are claims from old patient reps of making fake profiles to hype the clinic, posting fake reviews, unhygienic management of surgical equipment and not refunding or offering a touchup to patients with bad results. If a surgeon had clearly butchered someones head, had ONLY awful looking work and plenty of evidence to back this up, are you seriously saying you would need "personal experience" before you could criticise it? You just ignore it until you've been butchered yourself by them? Silly, and I'm sure you could see it if you thought about it. Its basic logic that you're missing here, same with your other point. Doganay is obviously a talented surgeon and has produced ample good work, but he is objectively hit or miss based on patient posted results and at various periods has lacked proper quality control to the point where there was more bad than good.

Personally I think ASMED should (and probably would) offer a touchup because from experience I know Koray and the clinic want to satisfy their patients as best they can even in cases where their expectations are a little too high, they specifically mentioned this issue to me the last during second procedure consultation. But for the life of me I have no idea why this has become such a big deal with patients of this specific clinic, looking at results overall on this website from all surgeons I would go as far as to say 99% have some sort of issue to fault such as uneven density, see through areas of coverage, thicker hair in the hairline than what would have been in their birth hairline etc, but others seem to deal with it rationally and on top of that accept that a touchup isn't the end of the world or something to let ruin their life because of these minor issues that the general public would be unlikely to ever catch out. I don't know Melvin's Youtube channel name but I've seen a wet hair comb through of his where its very clear that hes working to make the best of density that still isn't close to a pre-hairloss state. Some of these guys should look at that, its a phenomenal result but it also reflects what can reasonably be expected of hair transplants and that you can't judge results based on ridiculous circumstances like harsh bathroom lighting and unbrushed/washed hair that looks as it does out of bed. This case seems a good comparative situation with another surgeon, a few of the issues mentioned above and the density obviously isn't at the same level as the native hair, but in terms of what can be expected from hair transplants its a terrific result and with a touchup it could be perfect from the perspective of the average person. The patient was calm about it, the clinic was calm about offering a touch-up and no one expends energy on attacking people who ultimately all want the person to have a good experience and result. I cannot understand why anyone would make this situation so much harder for themselves or can't just be honest about expectations with themselves. Virtually every transplant on this website has some sort of issue if you go specifically looking for it, they're even easier to find if you shine harsh artificial light on it and spread the hair in a ridiculous manner that no one would ever do other than to make it look worse than it is. Payam imo is the only one with genuine below-par growth issues, but even he should look at top clinics for example like Cooley's, Lorenzo's, Feriduni's, Hasson/Wongs and search for their poor results because they regularly occur even with the best, on top of that wait till 12 months before reaching a firm conclusion. Either way he's not a victim, he's just unlucky and should have done proper research to prepare for the fact that a home-run isn't assured no matter where you go. You can't expect to slander a clinic with claims born out of genuine lies/ignorance + fear-mongering to make people avoid the clinic and expect them to be able to discuss or help resolve issues with you either. Just basic common sense.

I agree everyone has bad reviews, but I do not base my claims on heresay. Probably 50 negative reviews and claims of surgical misconduct from former clinic reps. Over the last 3 years or so more negative reviews than positive. Some of his results still look fantastic, but its all over the place. You can even search the recent Doganay cases on this site and you'll find its true, hit or miss. Hopefully yours is a hit.

"I thought grafts with refutable surgeons have a 98% growth rate?" This is exactly why people should do their research and specifically look for bad results and not just good ones from surgeons they're interested in. Absolutely NO surgeon can guarantee a 98% growth rate, or even a growth rate over 50%. There are bad results from every top surgeon and they're usually easy to find. External and unknown factors can ultimately override skill or consistent procedural conduct. It's why it should also be discussed and researched in advance with the clinic whether or not there is any sort of guarantee of a touch-up or refund.

I'm happy to not post on this topic again and won't, however I would note that the only reason I felt baited into doing so was due to disingenuous claims on behalf of Payam. Don't think its fair for someone to make false or misleading claims meant to fear monger and drive people away from the clinic while he and others justify it with being emotional. Hopefully the guy gets the issue sorted in future.

Sure, but again OP potentially looks the same or slightly worse than he did pre-op.Also agree OP doesn't have coarse hair and the other patients certainly are stronger, but OP's are absolutely not below average, and there are countless cases at this graft count on higher norwoods with confirmed average hair quality where good coverage was achieved. Not saying there shouldn't be a single spec of scalp visible or something silly, but for that graft count he shouldn't have come out still looking virtually bald, and certainly not worse than pre-op. Even just looking at the pre-op vs the direct post-op, its quite clear that a significant amount of grafts didn't grow. Ultimately beating a dead horse a bit at this point though, hopefully the clinic tried to aid in a solution.

First of all, nowhere does it say or even look like OP has "fine" hair, just looking at the donor it actually looks above average, but you seriously can't make a judgement like that without evidence. To compare just on the basis of photos which is still not a particularly good means: OP Patient I posted: Not an obvious drastic difference in donor hair quality. Even between medium fine and thick hair assuming this is the case is not going to be the difference between gaps you can drive a truck through vs close to perfect coverage for the same graft number. OP looks worse than pre-op, this absolutely can't be blamed on hair quality. You can also compare the post-op to the 2 year result and see many of the grafts didn't grow. I agree OP likely lost most of his native hairs, but there are hundreds of cases of this number on those even with fine hair that achieved good coverage with this graft number, and many from the same clinic.

If people are spending "every penny they have" (which is a horrible idea, period) then they owe it to themselves to do a basic Google search. The clinic doesn't hide or deceive anyone on the tech issue the consultation says the "surgical team" performs extractions and that Erdogan comes in during incisions, it is industry standard in Europe for the surgeon not to perform extractions and no clinic is vocally advertising this, nor should they be expected to. Its fair to expect ten minutes of research outside the clinics website which would make this clear, and if that's not happening when you're dropping ten grand, then its very obvious who is at fault, and it isn't the clinic. Saying he "doesn't perform the surgery" is blatant hyperbole from someone who doesn't understand how surgical procedure works. Do Rahal, Hasson, Wong, Feriduni, Lorenzo and Freitas not perform FUE surgery either? Because none of those are doing the extractions, Rahal and Hasson for example having exactly the same amount of engagement in the FUE that Erdogan does. No one I have seen EVER claims this about these clinics however. I would add to that Hasson/Wong in particular went to Erdogan for guidance when they were acquiring FUE skills prior to offering it at their clinic. I was a NW3 close to a diffused NW5 at 22, I know perfectly well the mental stresses of hair transplants, but being emotional about hair is no reason to be irrational, slander or be dishonest when it comes to research or analysing things objectively. Being emotional doesn't automatically make someone start lying, making things up or fear mongering to scare potential patients based on disingenuous information, like saying that the techs look too young to be experienced. The feelings are fine, statements like this ", but I'm also trying to take a critical look at the clinic, simply don't believe that "bad transplants just happen sometimes" make it pretty clear his outlook as run off the rails and are objectively in the realm of nonsense. There are hundreds of results on this forum from top surgeons who perform all surgical parts of FUE and have had plenty of poor results before. There is certainly a "reason" for these poor results, but you can't pinpoint it on the first thing you think of like Payam does with "But dah yung girl techs!!" He even said that a poor result wouldn't bother him if it was completely performed by a doctor, it only worries him because it was done by a tech. This is the definition of religious irrationality. And quite frankly, read Payam's concerns from the start of the thread, hes not crazy but clearly deals with issues that warrant professional psychological assistance, and is incredibly neurotic. He's not a child, for someone this inclined to anxiety not to spend ten minutes searching for information on a clinic hes about to drop 10 grand on for SURGERY, then its laughable to suggest he doesn't have some responsibility. He didn't even have to research, if the tech issue was such a concern he could have simply asked in consultation emails whether the surgeon performed all parts of the procedure, nor when he was at the clinic and was so surprised at the "young girls" that were techs and that there were multiple others having surgery did he have to go through with it. Its a surgical clinic, not a babysitters for manchildren.

I don't think Melvin's point is that this will necessarily be a great result or anything, but its not a disaster, he's still had a sizeable amount of growth that should be correctable unless it was physiological issues that caused the poor growth. Obviously no one can know the truth but his mention of experiencing a fever and flu like systems after the procedure seems like it plausibly could have effected the growth. Also as Melvin says its clear there is progressive growth and a rational and careful decision should be made at the end of the 10-12 month period where the average patient sees minor improvements until. He should look at options for correction and already start researching more intelligently than he did last time, but a black and white claim that its a "failure" at this point is just silly. Growth is growth, only idiots or those who haven't done their research expect going into surgery that its a guaranteed one and done. It's not exactly uncommon for a touchup to be required or below acceptable growth to occur, no matter who the surgeon we are talking about. The clinic guarantees a touchup but Payam isn't interested in this from what he's said and I suspect the clinic likely wouldn't want him anywhere near them at this point.

Just google international hairloss forum, then use the translate tool on Chrome.

You say this: "You call it mudslinging but I have not said anything false anywhere about their process" Then subsequently: "they clearly changed their model to maximize profits and Erdogan is not nearly as involved in the process any longer, he even leaves supervision to his lead tech. Most patients have no idea of these things because the clinic is not upfront about it" How in the world can you honestly say they did it to "maximise profit"? Did Hasson and Wong or Rahal decide to use technicians for extraction and implantation to "maximise profit"? Nor is it fair to say he isn't nearly involved any longer, the tech setup has been going on for at least 5 years, and being a surgeon with some of the most patient posted results on the internet, at least A HUNDRED of these say that Erdogan is not involved with extractions in detailed descriptions of the process. Nor does it say in the emails or booking confirmation or the website that he is directly involved. Nor is it industry standard ANYWHERE IN EUROPE for the surgeon to extract the grafts. It isn't misleading if its the industry standard and the clinic aren't proclaiming that he is involved in it, you are clearly the one being disingenuous. Nothing I said there was related to name calling, nor was it hyperbole, nor was it a conversation with you because the reality is that you're deluded to the point its like talking to a brick wall and have made your mind up. Wish you well with any surgery you have in future, although I feel for the surgeon that is going to have to deal with having you as a patient.

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