Dr. Pekiner (Turkey) vs. Eugenix (India)

[Portugal25]

Just now, Cristero said:

I've had my transplant with Dr Pekiner 3 weeks ago and I can confirm the doctor ethics and skills.

I had 5% of miniaturized hairs on my donor but the others were thick caliber and he used those for the hairlines and crown. I've never seen better and more natural hairlines done by anyone else, apart from Dr. Couto and Dr. De Freitas in Spain. You can see it by yourself in an Italian forum through real patients reports:

https://bellicapelli.forumfree.it/m/?f=64816590

This forum is a it biased negatively towards him due to the bad behaviour of his rep in one case.

Then my HT could still be a failure, I'm in early stages, but I can tell you the doctor has been proven to be super professional and really human.

Cristero you are very right!
A Doctor can’t be judged by his representatives actions when there are 54 real patients posting amazing results with Dr. Pekiner on the Italian forum.

Hope to see your results thread soon. 

[Cristero]

Ah let me add that I met Dr. Sethi from Eugenix in NYC and he gave me a really good impression. If I was a high NW, I would have gone to Eugenix or Dr. Zarev in Bulgaria, but for a refined job on the hairline, I decided Dr. Pekiner was the man.

[Grafts]

1 hour ago, Abhinay Singh said:

@Grafts Hello Sir, First of all thank you for considering Eugenix for your hair transplantation.  Kindly let me clarify your doubts regarding Premium package.

Cost per Graft is INR 210 plus 18% GST ( €2.88 inclusive tax as on today.

 

Dr Arika will do designing and planning 

100% slits by Dr Arika 

100% Extraction by Dr Arika 

Hairline implantation ( Upto first two layers) by Dr Arika.

Remaining implantation will be done by senior technicians under the supervision of Dr.

Since we have been doing direct hair Transplant where Extraction and implantation is being done simultaneously it is not possible for one Dr to perform entire surgery.

Thank you Abhinay, for clarifying.

In that case, can Eugenix update the website because this isn't really clear.

As you can see, on the website, it doesn't mention 100% of the extraction being done by the Doctor; It mentions "Crucial parts of the extraction". 

Also, there is none of the extra detail you provided regarding the Doctor doing partial implantation, "Up to the first 2 layers"

I think this would really help with clarifying the Premium Package.

Edited October 8, 2020 by Grafts

[ITA]

@Portugal25about doctor Pekiner's skill, I have no doubts, but as I have already written once, the 54 threads you are talking about, are on a forum where the doctor's advisor is also one of the moderators, so there, you will never see patient threads  dissatisfied, even if in my opinion, there are few.  Also, on that forum it is forbidden to post links with other forums, as did the member @Cristeroon HRN.

[PizzaWolf]

I personally don't like Eugenix offering different packages with varying levels of doctor involvement.

I think it would be better for their patients and their brand in the long-run to just offer one price that gave the best surgical outcome possible.

That being said, if you can afford their premium package, I think it's pretty obvious who you should go with. Eugenix has many amazing firsthand outcomes, and the ability to handle a wide range of hairloss levels.

[Andy Sharma]

Hi John,

Well in my opinion you should first focus on kind of result you are looking for then plan for the budget accordingly. I personally found Eugenix India, Dr. Arika Bansal work superb. You should get in touch with them and discuss further. Hair transplant is something which changes our entire look and feel. So focus more on the results. 

All the Best

Andy

 

I'm not a medical professional, thus any information given by me is my own observation and should not be treated as professional advice.

[Britanium]

6 minutes ago, Andy Sharma said:

Hi John,

Well in my opinion you should first focus on kind of result you are looking for then plan for the budget accordingly. I personally found Eugenix India, Dr. Arika Bansal work superb. You should get in touch with them and discuss further. Hair transplant is something which changes our entire look and feel. So focus more on the results. 

All the Best

Andy

 

I'm not a medical professional, thus any information given by me is my own observation and should not be treated as professional advice.

The Original poster is @Grafts that is the person seeking advice. 

Edited October 9, 2020 by JohnAC71

[BLE123]

On 10/8/2020 at 4:16 PM, Melvin-Moderator said:

In my opinion, Eugenix all day. Pekiner seems to pick and choose his patients and has canceled the procedure on the day of the surgery more than once. 

Why is this seen as a bad thing? Would it be better if despite not feeling confident of a good result that the Dr takes the patient's money and risks leaving them disappointed?

Whilst I can very much understand a patient being upset at a surgery being cancelled after the time and mental anguish they've invested into making it happen, that's surely better than the alternative of having to live with a subpar(or even worse) result? The only point of contention I can see is why the Dr only aborted the surgery after extracting some grafts. Maybe inexperience on his part in wanting to at least try for the patient before concluding that surgery shouldn't go ahead but either way that's the behaviour of an ethical Dr, right?

I also don't see the problem in him offering a discount to a patient if they post their story on the forum(though I believe he no longer offers this), as long as it is 100% genuine and without any external pressure. It's no different to paid advertising and if anything the Dr is potentially leaving himself open to losing business if the result isn't good but clearly he has confidence in the procedures that he does choose to go ahead with. 

The only negative of Dr Pekiner was his rude and unprofessional rep. How much of that came from the Dr himself I don't know but either way it didn't reflect well on him, regardless of whether he was correct in his accusations or not.

I have to say @Melvin-Moderatoryou are generally very defensive of surgeons on here but as soon as Dr Pekiner is mentioned you quickly steer people away from him, is there something you know that others don't? Given this is my first post I'm sure this will come off as suspicious but I have no affiliation with this Dr or any other, I'm merely in the early stages of doing research into a potential surgery in the future and Dr Pekiner is one of those I'm considering - though would ideally like to see more results from him on this forum first.

[Melvin- Admin]

29 minutes ago, BLE123 said:

Why is this seen as a bad thing? Would it be better if despite not feeling confident of a good result that the Dr takes the patient's money and risks leaving them disappointed?

Whilst I can very much understand a patient being upset at a surgery being cancelled after the time and mental anguish they've invested into making it happen, that's surely better than the alternative of having to live with a subpar(or even worse) result? The only point of contention I can see is why the Dr only aborted the surgery after extracting some grafts. Maybe inexperience on his part in wanting to at least try for the patient before concluding that surgery shouldn't go ahead but either way that's the behaviour of an ethical Dr, right?

I also don't see the problem in him offering a discount to a patient if they post their story on the forum(though I believe he no longer offers this), as long as it is 100% genuine and without any external pressure. It's no different to paid advertising and if anything the Dr is potentially leaving himself open to losing business if the result isn't good but clearly he has confidence in the procedures that he does choose to go ahead with. 

The only negative of Dr Pekiner was his rude and unprofessional rep. How much of that came from the Dr himself I don't know but either way it didn't reflect well on him, regardless of whether he was correct in his accusations or not.

I have to say @Melvin-Moderatoryou are generally very defensive of surgeons on here but as soon as Dr Pekiner is mentioned you quickly steer people away from him, is there something you know that others don't? Given this is my first post I'm sure this will come off as suspicious but I have no affiliation with this Dr or any other, I'm merely in the early stages of doing research into a potential surgery in the future and Dr Pekiner is one of those I'm considering - though would ideally like to see more results from him on this forum first.

First post in defense of a surgeon, not suspicious at all. 

[Curious25]

44 minutes ago, BLE123 said:

Why is this seen as a bad thing? Would it be better if despite not feeling confident of a good result that the Dr takes the patient's money and risks leaving them disappointed?

Whilst I can very much understand a patient being upset at a surgery being cancelled after the time and mental anguish they've invested into making it happen, that's surely better than the alternative of having to live with a subpar(or even worse) result? The only point of contention I can see is why the Dr only aborted the surgery after extracting some grafts. Maybe inexperience on his part in wanting to at least try for the patient before concluding that surgery shouldn't go ahead but either way that's the behaviour of an ethical Dr, right?

I also don't see the problem in him offering a discount to a patient if they post their story on the forum(though I believe he no longer offers this), as long as it is 100% genuine and without any external pressure. It's no different to paid advertising and if anything the Dr is potentially leaving himself open to losing business if the result isn't good but clearly he has confidence in the procedures that he does choose to go ahead with. 

The only negative of Dr Pekiner was his rude and unprofessional rep. How much of that came from the Dr himself I don't know but either way it didn't reflect well on him, regardless of whether he was correct in his accusations or not.

 

I don’t think anyone could pick a fault in any of the above points made. 
 

Aborting surgery on the day because the doctor is unsure of the quality of results he is able to obtain is the most ethical approach one could take. If patients want to eliminate this as being a potential situation they may encounter - they should make sure to have an in person consultation with the Dr before booking a surgery, so he is able to analyse their donor hair then and there. 
 

RE. offering a discount to patients who post their results online - I see this as win/win for all parties involved - the clinic is benefiting from advertising and showcasing, the patient receives a slightly more cost effective option, and the hair loss community benefit from a new patient posted thread. The doctor is essentially encouraging his work to be put out onto the line before he or anyone in his clinic know what the outcome is going to be, so to go above and beyond and actually offer a discount for someone to do this, would personally instil more confidence in me as a prospective patient of his. 
 

I have no idea what the Pekiner saga was on here, but I don’t think you can use those above points as negatives or reasons as to why patients shouldn’t undergo surgery with him.
 

The gold standard advice always stands . . . consult with multiple doctors, review hundreds and thousands of both patient posted results and clinic posted results, look for doctors who are capable and experienced with cases similar to your specific case, and ideally meet with them in person before going under the knife. 

[ITA]

@Curious25the doctor's ability is not discussed, what the doctor has negative is to let his consultant do what he does.  He is the moderator of one of the most important Italian forums, well, already this is not ethical, he should do one or the other thing.  On that forum you will not see any negative doctor Pekiner threads, (if there are any) because the moderators are good and bad weather, they tried it here too, but with @Melvin-Moderator he found it hard.

[Andrea]

i had a FUE DHT At Eugenix and i' m really happy with the result. I haven' t taken the premium package, because it was too expansive to me .

I have had quick and good result, probably thanks to DHT procedure and i 'm  not the best case for a FUE because a famous clinic advice me not to operate and actually refused me . I didn't mind because i just wanted to have an other estimation and didn't want to operate in this "famous" and too expensise clinic ...

I also advice you to read my last post because i give a tip that you probably don't know...  and may be you will save some graft with my  tip ....

[Cristero]

23 hours ago, Egy said:

@Portugal25about doctor Pekiner's skill, I have no doubts, but as I have already written once, the 54 threads you are talking about, are on a forum where the doctor's advisor is also one of the moderators, so there, you will never see patient threads  dissatisfied, even if in my opinion, there are few.  Also, on that forum it is forbidden to post links with other forums, as did the member @Cristeroon HRN.

I don't know if you understand Italian, but if you went through the post you could have clearly understood the threads were real because some patients expressed their concerns during the journey.

Also they are updated month by month, it's not guys coming in and posting their before and after.

Several of them were users of the forum since many years, sometimes had a transplant with other surgeons and went to Pekiner for a repair or second pass. So I don't really know how the fact that Pekiner's rep is a moderator on the forum could be relevant. He was a moderator on the forum since many years ago and got his first transplant with another surgeon, then went to Pekiner for a repair.

[Cristero]

3 hours ago, Egy said:

@Curious25the doctor's ability is not discussed, what the doctor has negative is to let his consultant do what he does.  He is the moderator of one of the most important Italian forums, well, already this is not ethical, he should do one or the other thing.  On that forum you will not see any negative doctor Pekiner threads, (if there are any) because the moderators are good and bad weather, they tried it here too, but with @Melvin-Moderator he found it hard.

Same as above. I think you should go and translate the threads with Google translator to have a rough idea of what is written there. The moderator/rep never did anything to discredit the patients concerns or deleted any comments.

There are 2 cases in particular that I remember: one young guy who lowered his hairline by far and everyone was saying that the doc was unethical etc etc. Then after 6 months the hairline was looking pluggy and everyone saying that was a bad case etc etc. Eventually it grew up really well at 12 months and result was great. No comment was deleted.

The other one is a recent one with a guy that has been expressing his concerns for not growing well at the 6 months mark and everyone was telling him to wait until 12 months, but he was still saying his transplant wasn't successful. He changed his mind completely at 12 months. No comment has been deleted.

There are also several other Pekiner's cases on a German forum and they are all good. Do you want to elaborate a conspiracy theory for that one as well?

[Cristero]

On 10/8/2020 at 6:16 PM, Melvin-Moderator said:

In my opinion, Eugenix all day. Pekiner seems to pick and choose his patients and has canceled the procedure on the day of the surgery more than once. 

Melvin, 2 clinics I have consulted before choosing rejected my case, saying I still had too many hairs (being a diffuse thinner) and there was no way to avoid shock loss or that I should be on medication, not having an HT performed. One was a clinic you recommend here. 

Pekiner on the other hand  didn't have any issue with that and was confident implanting between native hairs and avoiding shock loss.

[Melvin- Admin]

15 minutes ago, Cristero said:

Melvin, 2 clinics I have consulted before choosing rejected my case, saying I still had too many hairs (being a diffuse thinner) and there was no way to avoid shock loss or that I should be on medication, not having an HT performed. One was a clinic you recommend here. 

Pekiner on the other hand  didn't have any issue with that and was confident implanting between native hairs and avoiding shock loss.

That is good, all I know is some patients came here complaining that he aborted their surgeries. Maybe he’s changed that, and if he did that’s good. @duchaine has a thread here mentioning he was rejected day of surgery. Btw @Egy is Italian, he uses this forum using google translate.

[Curious25]

5 hours ago, Egy said:

@Curious25the doctor's ability is not discussed, what the doctor has negative is to let his consultant do what he does.  He is the moderator of one of the most important Italian forums, well, already this is not ethical, he should do one or the other thing.  On that forum you will not see any negative doctor Pekiner threads, (if there are any) because the moderators are good and bad weather, they tried it here too, but with @Melvin-Moderator he found it hard.

Confused by your response to me here - I've not mentioned anything about the doctors skill level, I was agreeing with a previous poster, who made some valuable points. 

I don't think it is fair to discourage patients from a doctor based on;

- The potential of your surgery being ethically cancelled on the day of the procedure, 

- The fact that he did/does offer discounts for his patients to make a thread and post their results online. (this was an interesting one to object against, given the forums stance being that patient posted results are some of, if not the most important criteria to consider when researching clinics).  

With regards to one of his reps being a moderator on an Italian forum, I don't think this is necessarily unethical either provided that it is common knowledge amongst the community that he is a rep, which I am assuming it is given the fact that you seemingly know this to be the case. It is then up to users of that forum to take this into consideration - whether or not posts or negative reviews are deleted etc, this is a different matter. 

Essentially, the whole principle of this forum is for hair loss sufferers to share their experiences and gain knowledge. The recommended surgeon list has been designed with good intent, and what I would deem to be a pretty fair and honest system. However all recommended surgeons pay a contribution fee to this site.

Therefore one would expect that a moderator of this site would of course recommend a subscribed clinic over a non subscribed clinic;

-first and foremost based on the fact that he/she should and would have more experience of that particular clinics results and patient posted results,
-and second of all, whats the clinic going to make of the fact that they're paying contribution fees to a forum who is actively recommending a non paying clinic over their own clinic when it has specifically came up in question? 

Anyway, end of the matter is . . you can be the worst hair transplant surgeon in the world, however using the above two points to determine this surgeon being a poor choice are both invalid and irrelevant forms of measurement. 



 

[ITA]

@Cristeroread

[Cristero]

3 hours ago, Egy said:

@Cristeroread

That's the case of the Russian guy we all know. I've been told the guy was far from being honest, but I won't say anything else, as I just know what I've been told.

[Cristero]

11 hours ago, Curious25 said:

However all recommended surgeons pay a contribution fee to this site.

That's interesting. Is that true @Melvin-Moderator?

I keep hearing the story of people getting a discount for their report as an argument for Pekiner's bad ethic and I don't really get it. It actually shows the doctor is confident to deliver a high-end result and he's not afraid of people showing the outcome on forums. He's trying to build a name, like all the surgeons in the industry.

Edited October 10, 2020 by Cristero

[Portugal25]

 @Egy you are quite right to be angry at your homeland Italian forum for deleting posts but they currently have 54 real patient results threads so it’s far from being cherry picked. 

We all know about the Russian Guy with a subpar result because he attacked Pekiner in every international forum despite being offered a free touch up and it could be that he was influenced by the competition to damage Pekiner’s name. 

Like @CristeroI also see no problem for any Doctor to offer a discount as a incentive for patients to post their results for 12 months.
I had to nag my long time friend @PT#31 daily for him to post his results and again for him to update his thread. Without incentive why would anyone take time to post???? Are we to believe everyone that has a HT are people that have time available and like to write TripAdvisor and Yelp reviews?!??? Ofcourse not and without allowing the Doctor to offer them incentive for them to publish their work (good or bad) there will never be many real patients posting. 

Edited October 10, 2020 by Portugal25

[ITA]

@Portugal25 premised , as in all my posts relating to Doctor Pekiner and that for me he is one of the best Surgeons in the world, I am sure that those 54 threads present on that forum are real, I can doubt however ', that some may be missing that of the Russian patient, considering the way that forum operates? 
As for the discount that the doctor offers to his patients who consent to the publication of their reports, I find nothing wrong,

 

Edited October 10, 2020 by Egy

[Cristero]

6 hours ago, Egy said:

@Portugal25 premised , as in all my posts relating to Doctor Pekiner and that for me he is one of the best Surgeons in the world, I am sure that those 54 threads present on that forum are real, I can doubt however ', that some may be missing that of the Russian patient, considering the way that forum operates? 
As for the discount that the doctor offers to his patients who consent to the publication of their reports, I find nothing wrong,

 

The only one missing on the Pekiner's section on the Italian forum is the Russian guy, who did a mess there as well and he has been kicked out.

Other famous surgeons had cases removed (not only one) for patients misbehaviour or because they reached an agreement with the patients and they took it down.

[ITA]

38 minutes ago, Cristero said:

Other famous surgeons had cases removed (not only one) for patients misbehaviour or because they reached an agreement with the patients and they took it down.

Here it is not possible.

[Zoomster]

Pekiner or Eugenix ??
 

9 months In attached ..

you guys do the maths 

 

 

Z