11.06.20 Koray Erdogan 5000 Greft Results

[110620]

24 minutes ago, Curious25 said:

How do you feel with your results ? 

When we consider 5000 greft and my previous situation(before HT), it is disappointment for me.

No one did not find my result successful from my friends and i wanted to ask from forums to take decision that should i fix it from any other clinic or not. Unfortunitly i did not receive any positive comment until now

[mrmane85]

You have a really good beard so there are plenty of options for you. I think you will need another 5000 grafts for a good result but you can definitely get there. 

Maybe reach out to Eugenix or Dr Pittella and find out what options are available. 

[110620]

20 hours ago, mrmane85 said:

You have a really good beard so there are plenty of options for you. I think you will need another 5000 grafts for a good result but you can definitely get there. 

Maybe reach out to Eugenix or Dr Pittella and find out what options are available. 

Unfortunitly as i know, i have only 2500-3000 greft for next(and final) HT for repairing or fix the situation. It looks next 5000 greft is not possible for me anymore.

 

I will check Eugenix and Dr Pittella. Thank you so much for suggestions and comment.

[mrmane85]

4 hours ago, 110620 said:

Unfortunitly as i know, i have only 2500-3000 greft for next(and final) HT for repairing or fix the situation. It looks next 5000 greft is not possible for me anymore.

 

I will check Eugenix and Dr Pittella. Thank you so much for suggestions and comment.

@Dr. Felipe Pittella &@eugenixhairsciencesboth specialise in cases like yours. You already have a good starting point too so I think you'll be surprised at what is possible. 

What's done is done, so I would suggest to focus all of your energy and focus on the next steps needed to reach the goal you initially set out. 

I am positive you will end up with a nice result.

[110620]

On 4/28/2022 at 2:56 PM, mrmane85 said:

@Dr. Felipe Pittella &@eugenixhairsciencesboth specialise in cases like yours. You already have a good starting point too so I think you'll be surprised at what is possible. 

What's done is done, so I would suggest to focus all of your energy and focus on the next steps needed to reach the goal you initially set out. 

I am positive you will end up with a nice result.

Thank you very much for advise. I will check them.

 

I plan to find a clinic which can use my beards too

[LatinBald]

Koray has completely disappeared from the Spanish forums, and practically nobody considers operating with him.
On the other hand, he continues to graft 5,000 grafts to almost all patients, when the rest of the doctors have reached the consensus that surgeries of more than 3,000-3,500 grafts should not be performed.
In my opinion it doesn't make sense and results like this one are proof that the quality has dropped and why it has disappeared in Spanish forums for years.

[Euphoria]

I am not defending Erdogan. But you want objective opinions and here is mine.

This looks to be a successful transplant. You stopped finasteride which was keeping the heavily minitiarized few hours at the top of your head, those native hairs are gone and now the transplanted hairs are there alone covering your head, of course the density isn’t there. 5000 grafts are covering your whole head which without the HT would be completely bald and appears to be.

In your case, I think all the follicles grew because you would’ve a bald spot somewhere which you don’t. You don’t have density because you don’t have native hairs anymore. 

You haven’t shown your donor which probably means it isn’t butchered and completely fine. And you say you have more hair in the bank after 5k grafts!!. What more could you want from a HT? A little toppik and you wouldn’t even need another HT especially since you’re not even on meds. 

I am sorry but yes, you will get blamed if you don’t take finasteride or minoxidil especially when the miniaturisation is so obvious and barely any native hairs left to cover bald spot. I am a nw6ish and still take fin holding on to few hairs that have not made my hair completely shiny and allow toppik use. If I stop I will probably get worse where a HT will not just look as good but with the few native hairs, I can even appear to have density. Yes, even a few hairs can make a huge difference.

All that said, seems like asmed isn’t getting good reviews lately but this? this is a good job and to say otherwise just won’t be honest. Indeed some of the posters are just weird who are recommending not even going to Turkey which is absurd. 
 

Check out Melvin stickied thread. There are people who get 9k/10k grafts and still see through. Are they failed transplants? Absolutely not. 
 

If you were on fin or minox and still had this result then yes it would be bad. Just look at your preop, fin and min are struggling to keep them alive 😂 

I guess this is why some top HT docs are so selective with patients they take and dismiss high norwoods because the expectations are unrealistic. 
 

 

[Nccan]

10 hours ago, Euphoria said:

I am not defending Erdogan. But you want objective opinions and here is mine.

This looks to be a successful transplant. You stopped finasteride which was keeping the heavily minitiarized few hours at the top of your head, those native hairs are gone and now the transplanted hairs are there alone covering your head, of course the density isn’t there. 5000 grafts are covering your whole head which without the HT would be completely bald and appears to be.

In your case, I think all the follicles grew because you would’ve a bald spot somewhere which you don’t. You don’t have density because you don’t have native hairs anymore. 

You haven’t shown your donor which probably means it isn’t butchered and completely fine. And you say you have more hair in the bank after 5k grafts!!. What more could you want from a HT? A little toppik and you wouldn’t even need another HT especially since you’re not even on meds. 

I am sorry but yes, you will get blamed if you don’t take finasteride or minoxidil especially when the miniaturisation is so obvious and barely any native hairs left to cover bald spot. I am a nw6ish and still take fin holding on to few hairs that have not made my hair completely shiny and allow toppik use. If I stop I will probably get worse where a HT will not just look as good but with the few native hairs, I can even appear to have density. Yes, even a few hairs can make a huge difference.

All that said, seems like asmed isn’t getting good reviews lately but this? this is a good job and to say otherwise just won’t be honest. Indeed some of the posters are just weird who are recommending not even going to Turkey which is absurd. 
 

Check out Melvin stickied thread. There are people who get 9k/10k grafts and still see through. Are they failed transplants? Absolutely not. 
 

If you were on fin or minox and still had this result then yes it would be bad. Just look at your preop, fin and min are struggling to keep them alive 😂 

I guess this is why some top HT docs are so selective with patients they take and dismiss high norwoods because the expectations are unrealistic. 
 

 

If you have knowledge of hair transplants at respectable clinics like Pinto, Ferreira, Konoir, DeFreitas, Eugenix, Bisanga, Couto, and even Turkish clinics like Bicer, HLC etc, then you would know what 5000 grafts looks like, this is not it. Even their donor management is bad now, mine is patchy after only 3k grafts, I did a consultation with another doctor who said they extracted grafts too close in clusters...

ASMED will threaten to sue if patients post bad images and videos, especially videos on youtube. 

Their main marketing platform is youtube, so try to post your bad result there and see how fast you get threats from lawyers sent to your home mail box for your wife and kids to find 

As another poster said they abandoned the other forums, this is because they can't buy the admins to remove bad result

This guy acts like the mafia to protect his money, I hope you are never on the receiving end, Koray and Asmed is not in the top 20 you should even be considering if you want a transplant, do not play with your life you might ruin it 

I leave you with this video, this guy is resisting the lawsuits and threats, a hero

 

Edited May 1, 2022 by Nccan

[110620]

11 hours ago, Euphoria said:

I am not defending Erdogan. But you want objective opinions and here is mine.

This looks to be a successful transplant. You stopped finasteride which was keeping the heavily minitiarized few hours at the top of your head, those native hairs are gone and now the transplanted hairs are there alone covering your head, of course the density isn’t there. 5000 grafts are covering your whole head which without the HT would be completely bald and appears to be.

In your case, I think all the follicles grew because you would’ve a bald spot somewhere which you don’t. You don’t have density because you don’t have native hairs anymore. 

You haven’t shown your donor which probably means it isn’t butchered and completely fine. And you say you have more hair in the bank after 5k grafts!!. What more could you want from a HT? A little toppik and you wouldn’t even need another HT especially since you’re not even on meds. 

I am sorry but yes, you will get blamed if you don’t take finasteride or minoxidil especially when the miniaturisation is so obvious and barely any native hairs left to cover bald spot. I am a nw6ish and still take fin holding on to few hairs that have not made my hair completely shiny and allow toppik use. If I stop I will probably get worse where a HT will not just look as good but with the few native hairs, I can even appear to have density. Yes, even a few hairs can make a huge difference.

All that said, seems like asmed isn’t getting good reviews lately but this? this is a good job and to say otherwise just won’t be honest. Indeed some of the posters are just weird who are recommending not even going to Turkey which is absurd. 
 

Check out Melvin stickied thread. There are people who get 9k/10k grafts and still see through. Are they failed transplants? Absolutely not. 
 

If you were on fin or minox and still had this result then yes it would be bad. Just look at your preop, fin and min are struggling to keep them alive 😂 

I guess this is why some top HT docs are so selective with patients they take and dismiss high norwoods because the expectations are unrealistic. 
 

 

Thank you for your objective comments.

 

"This looks to be a successful transplant. You stopped finasteride which was keeping the heavily minitiarized few hours at the top of your head, those native hairs are gone and now the transplanted hairs are there alone covering your head, of course the density isn’t there."

+I think you need to persuade Dr. Erdogan first about successful transplant because actually Dr. Erdogan did not satisfied on my 1 year post-op control. I consider he did not satisfied because he gave me a box of dutasterid and offer a new HT with paying money again. If he found my HT succesfull, i belive he would not offer a new HT and dutasterid! And you know what, i was using finastraid without giving any break when he checked me. So, my situation is not related with quiting finastraid

 

"You haven’t shown your donor which probably means it isn’t butchered and completely fine. And you say you have more hair in the bank after 5k grafts!!. What more could you want from a HT?"

+ Actually clinic told me that i have 7.500 greft for usable and 5.000 greft used. Remaning is 2.500-3.000. Any of clinic did not tell me yet i have enough greft. This was ASMED's calculation.

My donor area, especially my sides(left&right) are not in good condition. When my barber trims with shaver with low number, removed grafts can see easly but i dont care it. My priority is my front line, secondly vertex area. My donor area is ok when i leave it long hair. Generally i dont have too much complain about my donor area if my barber cuts it with scissors.

 

"I am sorry but yes, you will get blamed if you don’t take finasteride or minoxidil especially when the miniaturisation is so obvious and barely any native hairs left to cover bald spot."

+ As i wrote above, i was using finastraid when Dr. Erdogan checked me and he did not like 1 year post op results on me. This is not directly related with finas. 

 

"If you were on fin or minox and still had this result then yes it would be bad. Just look at your preop, fin and min are struggling to keep them alive"

+ Come on man! Finasteride, minoxidil, toppik. What else? Dutas, microneedle? If i use fin, min, toppik why did i had HT? I would used a cap forever or trim to my hair number one.

I just wanted a good front line when i see my face on mirror, it was all. 

[Euphoria]

8 hours ago, 110620 said:

Thank you for your objective comments.

 

"This looks to be a successful transplant. You stopped finasteride which was keeping the heavily minitiarized few hours at the top of your head, those native hairs are gone and now the transplanted hairs are there alone covering your head, of course the density isn’t there."

+I think you need to persuade Dr. Erdogan first about successful transplant because actually Dr. Erdogan did not satisfied on my 1 year post-op control. I consider he did not satisfied because he gave me a box of dutasterid and offer a new HT with paying money again. If he found my HT succesfull, i belive he would not offer a new HT and dutasterid! And you know what, i was using finastraid without giving any break when he checked me. So, my situation is not related with quiting finastraid

 

"You haven’t shown your donor which probably means it isn’t butchered and completely fine. And you say you have more hair in the bank after 5k grafts!!. What more could you want from a HT?"

+ Actually clinic told me that i have 7.500 greft for usable and 5.000 greft used. Remaning is 2.500-3.000. Any of clinic did not tell me yet i have enough greft. This was ASMED's calculation.

My donor area, especially my sides(left&right) are not in good condition. When my barber trims with shaver with low number, removed grafts can see easly but i dont care it. My priority is my front line, secondly vertex area. My donor area is ok when i leave it long hair. Generally i dont have too much complain about my donor area if my barber cuts it with scissors.

 

"I am sorry but yes, you will get blamed if you don’t take finasteride or minoxidil especially when the miniaturisation is so obvious and barely any native hairs left to cover bald spot."

+ As i wrote above, i was using finastraid when Dr. Erdogan checked me and he did not like 1 year post op results on me. This is not directly related with finas. 

 

"If you were on fin or minox and still had this result then yes it would be bad. Just look at your preop, fin and min are struggling to keep them alive"

+ Come on man! Finasteride, minoxidil, toppik. What else? Dutas, microneedle? If i use fin, min, toppik why did i had HT? I would used a cap forever or trim to my hair number one.

I just wanted a good front line when i see my face on mirror, it was all. 

You gave the impression you quit finasteride after HT, which you say you didn’t then yes this is a bad result.

Seems like asmed has become just a hairmill with bad results and should be avoided.

[110620]

13 hours ago, Euphoria said:

You gave the impression you quit finasteride after HT, which you say you didn’t then yes this is a bad result.

Seems like asmed has become just a hairmill with bad results and should be avoided.

"You gave the impression you quit finasteride after HT"

+ Actually i was mentioned on my previous posts that i quited finas after 18 months later then my HT but it is normal you did not noticed it. Clinic requests minimum 12 monts after HT according to their instruction list and i used 18 months an quited.

 

"Seems like asmed has become just a hairmill with bad results and should be avoided."

+I can not say this. I shared just my situation and requested your opinions for am i need any other HT or not. But it looks it will be better that i have another HT if i have sufficient graft, according to comments

[A Fue Good Men]

Me and another guy had a convo with Lorenzo about erdogan and his techniques. (They are best buds after all).

 

he claimed erdogan always does higher graft numbers because he splits grafts.  Whether this is to charge the patient more or to preserve the donor…you be the judge. But IMO any doctor operating on more than two  patients a day is a mill- they rely heavily on tech involvement. This is very risky. 

[A Fue Good Men]

On 5/2/2022 at 10:25 AM, 110620 said:

"You gave the impression you quit finasteride after HT"

+ Actually i was mentioned on my previous posts that i quited finas after 18 months later then my HT but it is normal you did not noticed it. Clinic requests minimum 12 monts after HT according to their instruction list and i used 18 months an quited.

 

"Seems like asmed has become just a hairmill with bad results and should be avoided."

+I can not say this. I shared just my situation and requested your opinions for am i need any other HT or not. But it looks it will be better that i have another HT if i have sufficient graft, according to comments

If you choose to go down the surgery route again, tread carefully. IMO stick to doctor led operations. Do lots of research there’s great resources on this site.

[drawdownfx]

17 hours ago, 5BetaReductase said:

Me and another guy had a convo with Lorenzo about erdogan and his techniques. (They are best buds after all).

 

he claimed erdogan always does higher graft numbers because he splits grafts.  Whether this is to charge the patient more or to preserve the donor…you be the judge. But IMO any doctor operating on more than two  patients a day is a mill- they rely heavily on tech involvement. This is very risky. 

Very well said. I dont believe in “scaling” a hair transplant clinic. You cannot avoid the inevitable loss in quality if you scale your operation. OP I hope you find the results you are looking for with your next surgery

[splitting hairs]

The reality is that most of the top clinics use technicians to do extractions.  Hasson and Wong have 4 technicians doing their extractions, as per their website.  Freitas uses technicians, Lorenzo, Ximena Vila uses Tech's too.  FUE is very labour intensive and a surgeon doing all of the extractions, implantations etc can lead to fatigue which may also affect the outcome. 

However, if technicians are going to do the extractions then they must be suitably trained.  After all, we are paying for a top service and we should get it.  

Asmed has gone downhill a lot over the years.  I think this is because they cared more about quantity of patients than the quality of their results.  

At the moment, I'm only aware of Dr Ferreira and Dr Couto doing all of the extractions.  

[Kaya]

13 hours ago, splitting hairs said:

The reality is that most of the top clinics use technicians to do extractions.  Hasson and Wong have 4 technicians doing their extractions, as per their website.  Freitas uses technicians, Lorenzo, Ximena Vila uses Tech's too.  FUE is very labour intensive and a surgeon doing all of the extractions, implantations etc can lead to fatigue which may also affect the outcome. 

However, if technicians are going to do the extractions then they must be suitably trained.  After all, we are paying for a top service and we should get it.  

Asmed has gone downhill a lot over the years.  I think this is because they cared more about quantity of patients than the quality of their results.  

At the moment, I'm only aware of Dr Ferreira and Dr Couto doing all of the extractions.  

Dr Keser, Dr Pekiner and Dr. Zarev do the extractions and implantations themselves.

Edited May 7, 2022 by Kaya

[A Fue Good Men]

14 hours ago, splitting hairs said:

The reality is that most of the top clinics use technicians to do extractions.  Hasson and Wong have 4 technicians doing their extractions, as per their website.  Freitas uses technicians, Lorenzo, Ximena Vila uses Tech's too.  FUE is very labour intensive and a surgeon doing all of the extractions, implantations etc can lead to fatigue which may also affect the outcome. 

However, if technicians are going to do the extractions then they must be suitably trained.  After all, we are paying for a top service and we should get it.  

Asmed has gone downhill a lot over the years.  I think this is because they cared more about quantity of patients than the quality of their results.  

At the moment, I'm only aware of Dr Ferreira and Dr Couto doing all of the extractions.  

I suspect you may be biased as you are a Lorenzo patient. His clinic is a mill by definition (4 surgeries per day, techs do all extractions, now even one of his techs named Anna does implantations as well).
 

But I can assure you, myself and several other of his former patients have bad complications such as donor over harvesting, poor growth, and by his own admission- mistakes made during surgery such as wrong punch type and size. All issues that would not be present if the doctor was more involved or spent more time in the planning phase. In his case, managing 4 surgeries per day, while simultaneously doing in office follow ups and answering patient emails results in less successful outcomes for his patients.

 

there is a reason he, and his buddy erdogan, have fallen out of favor on the Spanish and international forums.

 

All the clinics you named have maximum of two patients per day. Lorenzo has 4 and I’m pretty sure it’s limited to that as he only has 4 operating rooms. Erdogan has TEN (!) ORs.

 

Lorenzo charges nearly double compared to any of the other doctors you mentioned in your list, and you get less time with him, and a tech doing at minimum half your surgery. I don’t think his results or his ultra conservative hairline designs demand that kind of pricing. His Chinese punches, mated to CIT handles, are the equivalent of a 1997 Toyota Corolla in today’s day and age. Many of us were astonished with the horror in our donor areas when cut short due to poor quality, outdated tools, and improper extraction spacing.

 

IMO, any doctor doing more than 2 patients per day is driven by one thing and nothing more- money.

 

I advise anyone considering a mill to please check out the recommended doctors from this site. Do not let price or distance be a deciding factor for your surgery. This forum is unique as it isn’t bought out like most others.

[A Fue Good Men]

2 hours ago, Kaya said:

Dr Keser, Dr Pekiner and Dr. Zarev do the extractions and implantations themselves.

Don’t forget hlc, pinto, and the up and coming superstar @Dr. Felipe Pittella. All great options

Edited May 7, 2022 by 5BetaReductase

[THE TRUTH]

2 hours ago, 5BetaReductase said:

I suspect you may be biased as you are a Lorenzo patient. His clinic is a mill by definition (4 surgeries per day, techs do all extractions, now even one of his techs named Anna does implantations as well).
 

But I can assure you, myself and several other of his former patients have bad complications such as donor over harvesting, poor growth, and by his own admission- mistakes made during surgery such as wrong punch type and size. All issues that would not be present if the doctor was more involved or spent more time in the planning phase. In his case, managing 4 surgeries per day, while simultaneously doing in office follow ups and answering patient emails results in less successful outcomes for his patients.

 

there is a reason he, and his buddy erdogan, have fallen out of favor on the Spanish and international forums.

 

All the clinics you named have maximum of two patients per day. Lorenzo has 4 and I’m pretty sure it’s limited to that as he only has 4 operating rooms. Erdogan has TEN (!) ORs.

 

Lorenzo charges nearly double compared to any of the other doctors you mentioned in your list, and you get less time with him, and a tech doing at minimum half your surgery. I don’t think his results or his ultra conservative hairline designs demand that kind of pricing. His Chinese punches, mated to CIT handles, are the equivalent of a 1997 Toyota Corolla in today’s day and age. Many of us were astonished with the horror in our donor areas when cut short due to poor quality, outdated tools, and improper extraction spacing.

 

IMO, any doctor doing more than 2 patients per day is driven by one thing and nothing more- money.

 

I advise anyone considering a mill to please check out the recommended doctors from this site. Do not let price or distance be a deciding factor for your surgery. This forum is unique as it isn’t bought out like most others.

Did you get a bad result from Lorenzo ? 

So far, I have never seen a bad result from Lorenzo after all these years of researching forums. 

That being said, I agree with you and I must say I don't like the fact that he uses techs and pushes out 4 surgeries a day...Hasson and Wong do the same thing and I am not a big fan of that...

But I have yet to see a bad result from Lorenzo. He's got by far the largest number of documented cases on his youtube channel. More than any other hair transplant doctor in the world.

Also he shows results under harsh lighting and combs through wet hair on the crown which nobody else (except Couto) even dares to do. 

Again, one could argue you they are cherry picked...Sure.  But still he has way more than Couto, Bisanga or even De Freitas/Pinto etc...

Lorenzo and Erdogan are not even comparable. 

Lorenzo is legit even though money-minded and I agree that some aspects of his practice are questionable (punch size, lack of involvement during surgery...). 

Erdogan is basically an expensive hairmill. He is the exact same as Cosmedica, Elithair, Hair of Istanbul or Cinik. All he does is draw your hairline...Erdogan is certainly a talented surgeon but his clinic is a hairmill  where he doesn't take part in surgeries and 10-12 different teams of nurses perform the surgeries... As a consequence,  there are dozens of really bad results from ASMED...Take a look at the hairloss international forum. I've seen  many poor results. At 2.5 euros per graft the donor gamble is not worth it. You can get the same with Cinik  with 3 times less money. Or go with Ximena and Pinto for the same price who are both much safer  options and have a history of far better and more consistent results. 

I'd still rank Lorenzo far above Erdogan no matter what. It's day and night. 

[Melvin- Admin]

5 hours ago, 5BetaReductase said:

I suspect you may be biased as you are a Lorenzo patient. His clinic is a mill by definition (4 surgeries per day, techs do all extractions, now even one of his techs named Anna does implantations as well).
 

But I can assure you, myself and several other of his former patients have bad complications such as donor over harvesting, poor growth, and by his own admission- mistakes made during surgery such as wrong punch type and size. All issues that would not be present if the doctor was more involved or spent more time in the planning phase. In his case, managing 4 surgeries per day, while simultaneously doing in office follow ups and answering patient emails results in less successful outcomes for his patients.

 

there is a reason he, and his buddy erdogan, have fallen out of favor on the Spanish and international forums.

 

All the clinics you named have maximum of two patients per day. Lorenzo has 4 and I’m pretty sure it’s limited to that as he only has 4 operating rooms. Erdogan has TEN (!) ORs.

 

Lorenzo charges nearly double compared to any of the other doctors you mentioned in your list, and you get less time with him, and a tech doing at minimum half your surgery. I don’t think his results or his ultra conservative hairline designs demand that kind of pricing. His Chinese punches, mated to CIT handles, are the equivalent of a 1997 Toyota Corolla in today’s day and age. Many of us were astonished with the horror in our donor areas when cut short due to poor quality, outdated tools, and improper extraction spacing.

 

IMO, any doctor doing more than 2 patients per day is driven by one thing and nothing more- money.

 

I advise anyone considering a mill to please check out the recommended doctors from this site. Do not let price or distance be a deciding factor for your surgery. This forum is unique as it isn’t bought out like most others.

I disagree, just because you do two patients a day doesn’t mean you’re bad. Several great surgeons do two patients a day. I understand you’re unhappy, but I don’t believe it’s fair to start making generalizations just because Lorenzo does something. 

For example, Lorenzo uses techs. Therefore, techs are bad. Dr. Hasson himself said he would pit his best tech against any surgeon in the world. Not all surgeons are created equal, not all techs are created equal. The body of work of the clinic is what really matters. I have seen very good work from Lorenzo. 

[A Fue Good Men]

3 hours ago, Melvin- Moderator said:

I disagree, just because you do two patients a day doesn’t mean you’re bad. Several great surgeons do two patients a day. I understand you’re unhappy, but I don’t believe it’s fair to start making generalizations just because Lorenzo does something. 

For example, Lorenzo uses techs. Therefore, techs are bad. Dr. Hasson himself said he would pit his best tech against any surgeon in the world. Not all surgeons are created equal, not all techs are created equal. The body of work of the clinic is what really matters. I have seen very good work from Lorenzo. 

I think you misread my post Melvin. I said anyone who does more than 2 patients a day is risky. There are many top docs in North America and Europe (even from this board) that do not exceed two patients a day. Once one doctor tries to manage more than this, things can get ugly. Techs are crucial to every surgery, but when a doctor has a football teams worth of techs doing crucial steps of the surgery and there is a high turnaround within his team…it’s a recipe for disaster.

 

And of course you’ve seen good work from Lorenzo, just like we see good work from asmed, cinik, and hair of Istanbul at times too. When you’re literally pumping out 4-10 patients per day, even at a 50% success rate, you’re going to end up seeing at least some good results posted by the clinics.

 

Again, a lot of it is my opinion but I’ve been to Spain twice and I saw roughly half the guys with me that were unhappy for various reasons. A top clinic like H&w has not fallen out of flavor on forums here and internationally. I can’t say the same for erdogan and Lorenzo.

[A Fue Good Men]

7 hours ago, What is your agenda here said:

Did you get a bad result from Lorenzo ? 

So far, I have never seen a bad result from Lorenzo after all these years of researching forums. 

That being said, I agree with you and I must say I don't like the fact that he uses techs and pushes out 4 surgeries a day...Hasson and Wong do the same thing and I am not a big fan of that...

But I have yet to see a bad result from Lorenzo. He's got by far the largest number of documented cases on his youtube channel. More than any other hair transplant doctor in the world.

Also he shows results under harsh lighting and combs through wet hair on the crown which nobody else (except Couto) even dares to do. 

Again, one could argue you they are cherry picked...Sure.  But still he has way more than Couto, Bisanga or even De Freitas/Pinto etc...

Lorenzo and Erdogan are not even comparable. 

Lorenzo is legit even though money-minded and I agree that some aspects of his practice are questionable (punch size, lack of involvement during surgery...). 

Erdogan is basically an expensive hairmill. He is the exact same as Cosmedica, Elithair, Hair of Istanbul or Cinik. All he does is draw your hairline...Erdogan is certainly a talented surgeon but his clinic is a hairmill  where he doesn't take part in surgeries and 10-12 different teams of nurses perform the surgeries... As a consequence,  there are dozens of really bad results from ASMED...Take a look at the hairloss international forum. I've seen  many poor results. At 2.5 euros per graft the donor gamble is not worth it. You can get the same with Cinik  with 3 times less money. Or go with Ximena and Pinto for the same price who are both much safer  options and have a history of far better and more consistent results. 

I'd still rank Lorenzo far above Erdogan no matter what. It's day and night. 

See my reply to Melvin. Not everyone is willing to post publicly but I know of several guys that I had surgery with who have some glaring issues. And to your point, at nearly double the cost as top surgeons in Spain. Keep in mind roughly 75% of his patients are from Europe so you’re not going to see much on American forums.

 

I don’t want to derail this thread so send me a PM if you wish.

[PizzaWolf]

@5BetaReductase I agree with you that a surgeon who performs as many surgeries as possible in a day isn't doing his patients any favors, but you don't seem to be aware of just how many current top clinics are operating on over 2 patients per day.

HLC is 4 patients per day, H&W are 4, DeFreitas 3, Eugenix has reports of 6. I'm sure there are other highly regarded clinics over 2 patients that I'm not aware of.

I think consistency of results over time is likely more important than number of surgeries, but I can definitely see the concern over what number becomes too much to maintain quality. I think a doctor who continues to increase his surgeries per day as time goes on is likely a bad sign.

@splitting hairs Dr. Couto has a single tech who performs all of his extractions.

[A Fue Good Men]

32 minutes ago, PizzaWolf said:

@5BetaReductase I agree with you that a surgeon who performs as many surgeries as possible in a day isn't doing his patients any favors, but you don't seem to be aware of just how many current top clinics are operating on over 2 patients per day.

HLC is 4 patients per day, H&W are 4, DeFreitas 3, Eugenix has reports of 6. I'm sure there are other highly regarded clinics over 2 patients that I'm not aware of.

I think consistency of results over time is likely more important than number of surgeries, but I can definitely see the concern over what number becomes too much to maintain quality. I think a doctor who continues to increase his surgeries per day as time goes on is likely a bad sign.

@splitting hairs Dr. Couto has a single tech who performs all of his extractions.

HLC is 4 but only doctors do the work so there is some accountability. H&w is 4 but that’s two for each doctor…which is manageable. 
 

keep a lookout on this forum and others to see the outcome of clinics that scale their surgeries, I guarantee you’ll see a trend.

 

keep in mind, each graft is literally an organ. Extracting is not as simple as some make it out to be. Yes, I’m sure there are very skilled techs out there but they don’t know all of the intricacies and biology of skin/hair/vascular systems. When a doctor is heavily involved, they can adjust the surgery as needed to help provide the most successful patient outcomes.

 

I really don’t want to derail OPs thread so let’s please continue this discussion elsewhere.

[Melvin- Admin]

Guys,

This has completely de-railed the thread. If you wanna discuss another surgeon start your own thread.