Eugenix (Drs. Das/Somesh/Vinita) | 11,102 grafts | NW 6/7 | 28 yrs old | 2022/2023/2024

[futureresearch]

I also recommend learning to cut your own hair. I started cutting it myself and it made a huge difference. I used to hate going to a barber while my hair was thinning, plus cutting your own hairs means you can learn how to make adjustments to minimize thinning. I used to use a higher guard on my frontal third since it was thinner so it would look as thick as everything behind it. Haven't been to a barber since pre-covid, it's a game changer.

You'll definitely make mistakes along the way but it'll teach you a lot in the long run. If you have significant other they can really help out too.

Edited October 31, 2023 by futureresearch

[Melvin- Admin]

This is sort of my sweet spot. (Nape)#0.5 guard closed, mid, to open.  #1 closed, mid, open. #2 closed, mid, open. Repeat same with #3 guard. The top edge of the donor where is around a #4 open using same process. It’s actually pretty easy once you understand the process and it will save you so much money. 

 

I did a really bad old tutorial. But I’ve gotten a lot better at low taper fades. Maybe I’ll do one again. 

This lever is what I’m referring too when I say open and closed. Closed = shorter cut. Open = longer cut.

[asterix0]

@general-etwan Unfortunately for aggressive hair loss sufferers finasteride isn't enough. I am one too, I kept losing hair on finasteride and minoxidil from my early 20s, and now I am in my early 30s. 

I would be slick bald if I didnt take them however, and saving as much native hair as possible is always a good thing.

Your sides may very well drop because you are destined to reach Norwood 7 fully. I don't know if dutasteride is enough to even stop it, but it can always be tried. 

[Xanadu]

I just saw a video on youtube of a guy with a high fade. Why does it seem to work for him if it doesn't for Etwan - or could it work?

@4.40 min

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-nnZCWofXTg

Edited November 1, 2023 by Xanadu

[Bandit90]

Agree with Melvin, try and take dutasteride if you can. Your hairs are probably really sensitive to DHT, so if you use the Dut to nuke the dht your on to a winner.  I've just recently just started swapping my Sunday dose of finasteride for 0.5mg of Dut on the recommendation of @MazAB   and seems to paying off for me. Hopefully over the next year, I am going to make the full transition to Dut. 

Edited November 1, 2023 by Bandit90

[Stewie]

On 10/31/2023 at 5:07 AM, general-etwan said:

Additionally, and this may or may not end up being a major concern, I notice that it seems like my temple areas have continued to recede, despite me being on finasteride and using minoxidil every day. After the fade cut, you can see a gap between where the transplanted hair on the temples ends and the "thick" native hair begins. Or, maybe it was always in the works and it just wasn't as noticeable before.

 

It may be that I just won't be able to end up wearing my temple areas this short in the long run. I don't know. 

I think the unfortunate reality is I may be destined to perpetually move towards a boundary shown here in red:

 

Finasteride and minoxidil may not be strong enough to prevent that. I don't know what would be, or if there is any hope for that area at all.

I think looking at how they planned the surgery and the grafts etc, the area your looking at probably didn't really get any grafts and was already balding hence what your describing, as for meds, I was looking at your upfront pics on page one, kinda broke my heart as I dont have the pics but that was me but probably slightly more agressive in speed and by 21 I was NW6, but that said, have a think about meds, I have always thought reasons behind taking certain things, we get a lot of what we need from natural things we do and ingest anyway, and if like me you have not seen benefit from certain meds in a long time, then I would say cull them, try something else and keep a record of what its doing, if looking at your family balding pattern gives you a good idea of where your heading and you know you have more to go then maybe stay on it, if not then try something else I would say, I always think to much of one thing and another ie meds starts to block the effectiveness of the thing you want, so maybe have a think like you said on my page

[Stewie]

On 10/31/2023 at 8:41 PM, Melvin- Admin said:

This is sort of my sweet spot. (Nape)#0.5 guard closed, mid, to open.  #1 closed, mid, open. #2 closed, mid, open. Repeat same with #3 guard. The top edge of the donor where is around a #4 open using same process. It’s actually pretty easy once you understand the process and it will save you so much money. 

 

I did a really bad old tutorial. But I’ve gotten a lot better at low taper fades. Maybe I’ll do one again. 

This lever is what I’m referring too when I say open and closed. Closed = shorter cut. Open = longer cut.

my hair is super thin and I have been over harvested from my first two surgeries and still go a lot shorter than that and like it, suppose its personal preference

[general-etwan]

Thanks for comments everyone. Yeah, @Melvin- Admin, I usually buzz my back and sides every week or so rather than go to the barber every few days, but would definitely have to practice on proper fades and set up some kind of place with proper mirrors to make sure I can do it well.

@Xanadu The high fade on the guy in that video works because his hair density is very homogenous across the scalp. Mine still is not. That guy could do a high fade, or have the longer hair dip lower on the back...whatever he wants, it'll look fine because the density is homogenous.

This may go back to what I expressed very early on in this journey. My wish to be aggressive in homogenizing the hair density as much as possible across the entire scalp may have been naive but yet at the same time it seems to still be a goal. Especially when wearing my hair shorter. The longer hair is, the less noticeable differences in density across an area are, but at shorter lengths, it's very noticeable.

I feel like I now have a situation where I don't even know if I want to go for an SMP consultation because maybe I will want to have yet another HT to address some problems that seem to remain.

Here is today, 5 days after that fade that looked nice last Friday. Note that I put a "dramatic" filter on the images to enhance the contrast between the areas I want to show, and taken under harsh lighting:

 

 

^Circled in black are gaps that have no full-strength hair. The hair that remains there in that region (that they didn't implant into because they still "saw" hair there) is actually significantly miniaturized and will never be recovered. So now this area is not homogenous and it is visible at short length. I wonder if this area could be transplanted into in the future. I don't think I've ever seen a case like that. Circled in red are areas of retrograde alopecia which I've had there since my teens. Has remained about the same for many years now, but again, wonder if that area could ever receive any grafts to attempt to homogenize things.

 

 

^ Here you can see the still significant contrast in donor area vs recipient area, so visible just 5 days after the fade. On the right, the longest black line I believe is my "safe zone" based on my own opinion. Looking at old pictures, that boundary appears to have remained unchanged, as there is a pretty clear drastic sudden change between the miniaturizing hairs above and the dark thick hairs below that black line. The red line is what Eugenix harvested up to; not fully up to the edge that maybe for example a Dr. Zarev case shows. Circled in black is the area of retrograde alopecia again. Circled in red is the temple implantation, behind which I seem to have lost more hair since just the summer, because in pictures earlier in the year I had darker hair in that gap. Not good. 

Also, Zarev seems to harvest right to the very edges of the nape area, whereas almost all other clinics seems to stay about 1 cm inward from the edges.

Dr. Sethi to his much fairness did inform me during our lengthy consultation in June that as the thinning hair in the lower crown continued to miniaturize, I may need more attention over the years, but that he didn't want to implant too low in this 2nd HT because it could cause too much damage to native hair remaining. But I really didn't think I would need to be so concerned about that for a few years at least. It seems the implanted hair from June isn't quite coming in as quickly or strongly as that of my 1st HT.

Just trying to evaluate what my options will be going forward. Someone like @mtb who is a NW 6/7 like me and went to Zarev already had the gap seemingly completely closed. And of course, is up to 12,000 grafts, so the math there seems to make sense. 

Also, it is shown that Zarev uses a smaller punch size for scalp extractions than most clinics, which is how he keeps scarring so minimal. I believe Eugenix uses a 0.7mm punch for beard extractions (the beard scars on me are completely gone, invisible). So if they use 0.7mm punch on the beard, why can't they use it on the scalp too as Zarev seems to?

If I have to explore another HT to address these unusual and rare situations of non-homogenous looks, I sure will. Honestly, I understand that hair loss is a progressive condition, but at the same time it makes more sense to me to maximize homogenous density now, and then just accept more homogenous thinning over the decades, rather than keep having these visible gaps and contrast that prevent the head from looking properly balanced for more than 3 days at a time. 

 

Edited November 2, 2023 by general-etwan

[Gatsby]

How many months post HT2 are you? It’s really a waiting game and until you get to around the eight month mark I wouldn’t put too much attention on the donor, etc. It takes up to a year for the donor to heal and for hair to really fully bounce back. When I look at my donor (both surgeries) it looks patchy and terrible for at least the first 4-6 months. All the best! 👌 

[general-etwan]

29 minutes ago, Gatsby said:

How many months post HT2 are you? It’s really a waiting game and until you get to around the eight month mark I wouldn’t put too much attention on the donor, etc. It takes up to a year for the donor to heal and for hair to really fully bounce back. When I look at my donor (both surgeries) it looks patchy and terrible for at least the first 4-6 months. All the best! 👌 

5 months next week. I think I’m just a little spoiled because I found that my first procedure hair came in pretty fast and I thought that by month 5-6 I already had most of the result. I know that’s kind of outlier stuff but was hoping for similar again. Back of the head still looking rough. The fade cut was nice for a day but then it enters this length where things are all disconnected and I think it looks poor. I think I’ll probably just let it grow out now for a while. But by the end of this year I want to decide whether to schedule a 3rd procedure or do SMP on its own without another procedure. I’ve also determined that fibers are not for me; and especially not at this length. There’s not nearly enough hair that is long enough to put fibers on the crown; it just goes to the scalp and blots and looks obvious. Can’t use them when hair is this short, and even when it’s longer I am not going to want to be bothered by messing with fibers at all hours of the day according to my irregular schedules.

[hair_forever]

Zarev has an extraction system developed by himself, which has a 0.55 punch (a podcast I heard stated it at 0.70 with vacuum aspiration is a system that Eugenix also tried to develop but, they suspended the use.
The difference lies in the fact that Zarev carries out all the phases alone while Eugenix has various doctors (very valid) but, the difference in those cases is made by Zarev.
I am also an NW7 and recently seeing all these amazing cases of Zarev Pittella and Eugenix I felt like trying a journey with HTs but I am not willing to take Finasteride or Dudasteride because they cause me great side effects.

[hairman22]

i wouldnt do smp you dont have enough hair in the crown. 

your comparing yourself to mtb but he is a nw6 your a nw7 and much worse donor.

im not sure for example Zarev would have taken you as a patient tbh. 

your results so far are quite decent and it wouldnt be a surprise that you need a 3rd surgery

 

 

 

[Melvin- Admin]

Donor patchiness is something that’s somewhat inevitable, the higher you go up in graft count. The hair above your ear is fine, so it will look patchier compared to the rest. I wouldn’t pay it much attention. That said, the temple peaks may need to be filled in. That gap isn’t noticeable with long hair, but it is with shorter hair. Have you mentioned this to the clinic?

[GeneralNorwood]

16 hours ago, Gatsby said:

How many months post HT2 are you? It’s really a waiting game and until you get to around the eight month mark I wouldn’t put too much attention on the donor, etc. It takes up to a year for the donor to heal and for hair to really fully bounce back. When I look at my donor (both surgeries) it looks patchy and terrible for at least the first 4-6 months. All the best! 👌 

Gatsby, problems he is is talking about like retrogarde alopecia (above the ear) were already there before second HT, so let's be real it won't improve. He can expect improvement on the lower crown and other treated areas though. 

 

 

18 hours ago, general-etwan said:

 

 

 

The hair that remains there in that region (that they didn't implant into because they still "saw" hair there) is actually significantly miniaturized and will never be recovered. So now this area is not homogenous and it is visible at short length. I wonder if this area could be transplanted into in the future. I don't think I've ever seen a case like that.

 

Nah, they didn't implant hair there because of miniaturisation, but because of donor managment. They implanted 600 hair for the temple points, for black circles they would need ~500 more.

It is common topic on this forum, that transplanted hair on temples doesn't look natural when buzzed. I tried different options with my barber and you can see on my topic too that the longer it grows the better it looks. (however it cant be too long) 

 

How long did you grow temple points hair on this photo without cutting : ? 

 

 

About red circles aka retrograde alopecia above the ears. The fastest and simple solution is this advice by other members that you learn to fade this hair by yourself to achieve this best result that you presented after visit in the Barber. Because you can't visit a barber 2 times a week, it is unconvinient. 

In the long run, your beard resembles your hair, so maybe beard transplant in this area above the ear is something to consider instead of SMP. 

[general-etwan]

23 hours ago, Stewie said:

I think looking at how they planned the surgery and the grafts etc, the area your looking at probably didn't really get any grafts and was already balding hence what your describing, as for meds, I was looking at your upfront pics on page one, kinda broke my heart as I dont have the pics but that was me but probably slightly more agressive in speed and by 21 I was NW6, but that said, have a think about meds, I have always thought reasons behind taking certain things, we get a lot of what we need from natural things we do and ingest anyway, and if like me you have not seen benefit from certain meds in a long time, then I would say cull them, try something else and keep a record of what its doing, if looking at your family balding pattern gives you a good idea of where your heading and you know you have more to go then maybe stay on it, if not then try something else I would say, I always think to much of one thing and another ie meds starts to block the effectiveness of the thing you want, so maybe have a think like you said on my page

It's a tough choice between trying dutasteride vs just not worrying about medication. The hope with dutasteride would be to actually strengthen thin areas, and from what I know cases of actually regrowing anything are rare. No one else in my family has hair loss to the degree I do. No one. I got it the worst by far; there is no comparison to me. My grandfather on my Mom's side is maybe a NW4 at almost 80. Grandfather on Dad's side was maybe NW5-6 by age 40-50. Dad is NW 5-6 by age 50. I was NW6 at early 20s. So far beyond any comparisons I can even make to family. I know that if I were to talk to Pittella, as someone once mentioned here, he would tell me not to worry about taking fin or dut.

[general-etwan]

15 hours ago, hairman22 said:

i wouldnt do smp you dont have enough hair in the crown. 

your comparing yourself to mtb but he is a nw6 your a nw7 and much worse donor.

im not sure for example Zarev would have taken you as a patient tbh. 

your results so far are quite decent and it wouldnt be a surprise that you need a 3rd surgery

Yeah, not going to rush SMP that's for sure. But ultimately I expect I'll want to use it in combination. If I can get to a sufficient level of overall redistribution that I'm happy with, then I might be able to get SMP all over to work in tandem with the more homogenous look. But I don't think we're there yet.

I'm not sure mtb's starting point is that much better than mine, to be fair. I'm not sure whether you want to call each of us NW6 or NW7 but either way there doesn't look like too huge a difference from starting point.

 

I'm not sure either if Zarev would have ever taken me as a patient at starting point. But I think if he had, his strategy would have been consistent with his other cases in which he is meeting the boundaries together.

 

 

If just think at this point I will need to get to 10,000-12,000 total grafts moved too before I am fully satisfied with the redistribution. But I will want extractions to be taken right up to the sharpest boundary of hair loss and even down into the nape area, which Zarev goes pretty low into.

[general-etwan]

8 hours ago, Melvin- Admin said:

Donor patchiness is something that’s somewhat inevitable, the higher you go up in graft count. The hair above your ear is fine, so it will look patchier compared to the rest. I wouldn’t pay it much attention. That said, the temple peaks may need to be filled in. That gap isn’t noticeable with long hair, but it is with shorter hair. Have you mentioned this to the clinic?

Yeah, not too worried about overall patchiness or the retrograde above the ears; not a huge concern. I am focused on the gaps higher up on the head, that are more noticeable. Haven't talked to Eugenix about this yet, been super busy. But def will be topic of focus from here forward. 

[general-etwan]

1 hour ago, GeneralNorwood said:

Gatsby, problems he is is talking about like retrogarde alopecia (above the ear) were already there before second HT, so let's be real it won't improve. He can expect improvement on the lower crown and other treated areas though. 

Nah, they didn't implant hair there because of miniaturisation, but because of donor managment. They implanted 600 hair for the temple points, for black circles they would need ~500 more.

It is common topic on this forum, that transplanted hair on temples doesn't look natural when buzzed. I tried different options with my barber and you can see on my topic too that the longer it grows the better it looks. (however it cant be too long) 

How long did you grow temple points hair on this photo without cutting : ? 

About red circles aka retrograde alopecia above the ears. The fastest and simple solution is this advice by other members that you learn to fade this hair by yourself to achieve this best result that you presented after visit in the Barber. Because you can't visit a barber 2 times a week, it is unconvinient. 

In the long run, your beard resembles your hair, so maybe beard transplant in this area above the ear is something to consider instead of SMP. 

Makes sense that it's donor management, of course, but going forward, I say take the 500 more needed for the temple gaps that show when buzzed. 500 isn't a travesty. 1,000 would be. 

In that picture, I had gone a few weeks without buzzing the sides and temples. I want to say 2-3 weeks. 

I just think going forward, I really want to push for maximum homogenous distribution of hair and closing any gaps. Now that these remaining gaps are visible, and I am personally pretty confident that we can see the boundary of where hair loss will mostly stop at the back of the crown (yes we know it can dip slowly over a lifetime, but it's not going to dip suddenly anytime soon because all of my original hair that is significantly harmed by DHT has already suffered that effect by age 30 due to how extreme my loss is and the full pattern can be seen at this point; that's what I believe)...I will need any gaps closed in order to maximize the situation. If things are pretty homogenous then I can always buzz my hair or minimally fade it myself to keep it looking acceptable without having to need complex fades every week. And SMP could then be used all over very subtly to increase illusion of density. 

You just look at results like this, and say how is this possible...well it must be possible.

 

[Fox243]

3 minutes ago, general-etwan said:

Makes sense that it's donor management, of course, but going forward, I say take the 500 more needed for the temple gaps that show when buzzed. 500 isn't a travesty. 1,000 would be. 

In that picture, I had gone a few weeks without buzzing the sides and temples. I want to say 2-3 weeks. 

I just think going forward, I really want to push for maximum homogenous distribution of hair and closing any gaps. Now that these remaining gaps are visible, and I am personally pretty confident that we can see the boundary of where hair loss will mostly stop at the back of the crown (yes we know it can dip slowly over a lifetime, but it's not going to dip suddenly anytime soon because all of my original hair that is significantly harmed by DHT has already suffered that effect by age 30 due to how extreme my loss is and the full pattern can be seen at this point; that's what I believe)...I will need any gaps closed in order to maximize the situation. If things are pretty homogenous then I can always buzz my hair or minimally fade it myself to keep it looking acceptable without having to need complex fades every week. And SMP could then be used all over very subtly to increase illusion of density. 

You just look at results like this, and say how is this possible...well it must be possible.

 

There's also a huge difference between Zarev and Eugenix. Zarev has 3 hour long consultations with extremely detailed measurements where he does every part of the procedure while Eugenix is like most other top HT clinics. You will be sacrificing ~15% of quality when choosing Zarev vs the standard package at Eugenix or any other shop (H&W, etc)

[Berba11]

6 minutes ago, general-etwan said:

Makes sense that it's donor management, of course, but going forward, I say take the 500 more needed for the temple gaps that show when buzzed. 500 isn't a travesty. 1,000 would be. 

In that picture, I had gone a few weeks without buzzing the sides and temples. I want to say 2-3 weeks. 

I just think going forward, I really want to push for maximum homogenous distribution of hair and closing any gaps. Now that these remaining gaps are visible, and I am personally pretty confident that we can see the boundary of where hair loss will mostly stop at the back of the crown (yes we know it can dip slowly over a lifetime, but it's not going to dip suddenly anytime soon because all of my original hair that is significantly harmed by DHT has already suffered that effect by age 30 due to how extreme my loss is and the full pattern can be seen at this point; that's what I believe)...I will need any gaps closed in order to maximize the situation. If things are pretty homogenous then I can always buzz my hair or minimally fade it myself to keep it looking acceptable without having to need complex fades every week. And SMP could then be used all over very subtly to increase illusion of density. 

You just look at results like this, and say how is this possible...well it must be possible.

 

Worth mentioning here mate that this Zarev case utilised a much more conservative hairline height and shape then yours + zero temple point work. I don't think this case has beard grafts either so the result could probably be enhanced further.

 

Personally I think you're in a pretty decent place. Doing the temple points and altering the hairline probably could have been delayed until you were happy with everywhere else but otherwise your results are coming in nicely.

How many scalp donor grafts do Eugenix feel you have left?

[Melvin- Admin]

33 minutes ago, general-etwan said:

Yeah, not going to rush SMP that's for sure. But ultimately I expect I'll want to use it in combination. If I can get to a sufficient level of overall redistribution that I'm happy with, then I might be able to get SMP all over to work in tandem with the more homogenous look. But I don't think we're there yet.

I'm not sure mtb's starting point is that much better than mine, to be fair. I'm not sure whether you want to call each of us NW6 or NW7 but either way there doesn't look like too huge a difference from starting point.

 

I'm not sure either if Zarev would have ever taken me as a patient at starting point. But I think if he had, his strategy would have been consistent with his other cases in which he is meeting the boundaries together.

 

 

If just think at this point I will need to get to 10,000-12,000 total grafts moved too before I am fully satisfied with the redistribution. But I will want extractions to be taken right up to the sharpest boundary of hair loss and even down into the nape area, which Zarev goes pretty low into.

Great astute observation, you’re a Norwood 7 while @mtbis a Norwood 6 so the borders are different.

This patient however is spot on 

The big difference though is his hairline is way higher and his temple peaks are heavily receded. 

You have a much more youthful profile and hairline. But I would guesstimate around 13-14k grafts to get to that patients density, given your hairline and temple peaks.

Btw I discussed this patient with Dr. Zarev, he said he would never give that hairline on a young man, but he felt it was appropriate for him since he’s in his 50s. So I think your plan was better suited for you. But it will take more grafts. I’m thinking I need another 2,000-3,000 more grafts to have no thin spots. 

[general-etwan]

22 minutes ago, Melvin- Admin said:

Great astute observation, you’re a Norwood 7 while @mtbis a Norwood 6 so the borders are different.

This patient however is spot on 

The big difference though is his hairline is way higher and his temple peaks are heavily receded. 

You have a much more youthful profile and hairline. But I would guesstimate around 13-14k grafts to get to that patients density, given your hairline and temple peaks.

Btw I discussed this patient with Dr. Zarev, he said he would never give that hairline on a young man, but he felt it was appropriate for him since he’s in his 50s. So I think your plan was better suited for you. But it will take more grafts. I’m thinking I need another 2,000-3,000 more grafts to have no thin spots. 

I don't know if I agree that mtb and I are clearly distinct NW 6 vs 7. Can you explain what you mean by the borders are different? I think they're more the same than different.

If you look closely, we both have characteristics of both 6 and 7, so I think it kind of just ends up blurring together. 

https://naturaltransplants.com/solutions/norwood-scale/norwood-6/
https://naturaltransplants.com/solutions/norwood-scale/norwood-7/

 

 

We both have a had extremely similar very weak remaining lock on the top of the head (black), have a very similar area of final thinning (red), have similar thinning above and behind the ear (blue), and my border, if at all lower than his, is negligibly lower. The small difference seen here (yellow lines) has to account for mtb's image being taken from a slightly higher angle than mine. Call it NW 6 or 7, at the end of the day I say we were both NW6s at the time with very similar final border patterns. 

A traditional surgeon would look at mtb and say his loss could dip lower with age too, just as they would mine. But apparently Zarev was not concerned with that and/or does not think so as he harvested from that entire area of remaining hair, precisely up to the borders.

Yeah, the Zarev patient there got a very high hairline and no temple work. I agree the more youthful approach to me was very necessary at my age, and it still was relatively conservative. I think I have enough grafts for more work to try to homogenous this as much as possible. Some scalp for sure, and definitely beard if needed.

Edited November 3, 2023 by general-etwan

[Fox243]

4 minutes ago, general-etwan said:

I don't know if I agree that mtb and I are clearly distinct NW 6 vs 7. Can you explain what you mean by the borders are different? I think they're more the same than different.

If you look closely, we both have characteristics of both 6 and 7, so I think it kind of just ends up blurring together. 

https://naturaltransplants.com/solutions/norwood-scale/norwood-6/
https://naturaltransplants.com/solutions/norwood-scale/norwood-7/

 

 

We both have a had extremely similar very weak remaining lock on the top of the head (black), have a very similar area of final thinning (red), have similar thinning above and behind the ear (blue), and my border, if at all lower than his, is negligibly lower. The small difference seen here (yellow lines) has to account for mtb's image being taken from a slightly higher angle than mine. Call it NW 6 or 7, at the end of the day I say we were both NW6s at the time with very similar final border patterns. 

A traditional surgeon would look at mtb and say his loss could dip lower with age too, just as they would mine. But apparently Zarev was not concerned with that and/or does not think so.

Yeah, the Zarev patient there got a very high hairline and no temple work. I agree the more youthful approach to me was very necessary at my age, and it still was relatively conservative. I think I have enough grafts for more work to try to homogenous this as much as possible. Some scalp for sure, and definitely beard if needed.

If I were you, I'd try to wait for more trials with verteporfin or if you're impatient, I can try to ask Dr. Barghouthi to use verteporfin for you. We are not sure if verteporfin can be used on old scars, which is why it might be important to use it on the few grafts you have left.

I've been leading the verteporfin efforts for 1.5 years now, and I'm happy to help you over DM.

Edited November 3, 2023 by Fox243

[general-etwan]

32 minutes ago, Fox243 said:

There's also a huge difference between Zarev and Eugenix. Zarev has 3 hour long consultations with extremely detailed measurements where he does every part of the procedure while Eugenix is like most other top HT clinics. You will be sacrificing ~15% of quality when choosing Zarev vs the standard package at Eugenix or any other shop (H&W, etc)

Right, makes sense. Unfortunately it was just not doable for me to try to go to Zarev, with both the cost (at least $4/graft) and wait times for consultations not until 2026 with surgery 2 years after that (as Zarev has been saying on Instagram comments). Kudos to those who can make it happen.

27 minutes ago, Berba11 said:

Worth mentioning here mate that this Zarev case utilised a much more conservative hairline height and shape then yours + zero temple point work. I don't think this case has beard grafts either so the result could probably be enhanced further.

Personally I think you're in a pretty decent place. Doing the temple points and altering the hairline probably could have been delayed until you were happy with everywhere else but otherwise your results are coming in nicely.

How many scalp donor grafts do Eugenix feel you have left?

Yeah, that case makes more sense as many grafts were preserved not working on the front, as not necessary at age.

I'm actually very much fine that I chose to do the hairline lowering and temple work in the 2nd procedure, because now I can present myself from the front and like the way it looks, rather than continue to try to prevent people from seeing me face-on without hats. The thinness at the back (crown) is less noticed by people. But now it'll be the remaining focus.

They didn't say how many scalp donor I'd have left. Sethi simply said they absolutely were leaving more for future under the assumption I will need them. I think a lot of it is just up to subjective preference and how much redistribution someone wants to do.

[general-etwan]

29 minutes ago, Fox243 said:

If I were you, I'd try to wait for more trials with verteporfin or if you're impatient, I can try to ask Dr. Barghouthi to use verteporfin for you. We are not sure if verteporfin can be used on old scars, which is why it might be important to use it on the few grafts you have left.

I've been leading the verteporfin efforts for 1.5 years now, and I'm happy to help you over DM.

Had to read up on it; have been so busy with life I hadn't known about this. 

Sounds promising but also almost like magic. Preventing scarring and improving skin quality I can see, but regenerating hair follicles? Sounds like something David Blaine or Criss Angel would do. Through all the ideas over the years of regenerating or cloning hair follicles, I could never wrap my head around it logically. To me a hair follicle is a real, tangible object locked in place in matter (skin) and if moved, it remains a single object in its new place and nothing suddenly reappears in its old place. If we could actually produce regeneration in that manner, then I think we have to question our entire understanding of the universe itself. If you totally unearth a tree from the ground and move it, can another tree re-grow in its place? Well, maybe, if seeded. If the sun was completely disintegrated in a massive explosion, could a new one be generated in its place? How can something come of nothing? Well, that's the deepest question of all in terms of how this universe began in the first place, isn't it? 😂

Like others said in the verteporfin thread, even if it just prevents scarring, that's a big deal.

Definitely interested in learning more about it. Will be in touch.

Edited November 3, 2023 by general-etwan