Dutasteride / Avodart - Considering

[ciaus]

On 1/19/2021 at 3:37 PM, Kraistoff said:

@Leftwithrope no sides really. I’m sure that sometimes I’m not as horny as I used to be sometimes but will take a lot to tame this beast. 

In my early 40s just on finasteride, and still waiting for the beast to slow down. Not like the unfortunate guys that still have the urge and just can't perform when the event starts, I'm just talking about the urge. About a 30% reduction would be nice to help keep life more simple and trouble-free.

 

[Harry Bosch]

On 1/19/2021 at 9:53 AM, UnbaldEagle said:

Good luck with your dut journey, @Kraistoff.

One thing about dut, I think this is the reason it works great for certain people, but not at all (or worse than fin - quite a statement, I know) for others: this drug significantly increases your T levels. I know DHT is the main culprit, but testosterone plays a role too, especially if you have a lot of it. For individuals with low to moderate T levels, dut will do wonders, if you have high T levels, I'm not too sure. DHT is 5x more potent than testosterone, however we have 10x more T than DHT, so it's quite easy to do the math --> T will also wreak havoc. 

Just my own 5 cents, nothing proven. 

 

I’ll have to check my T levels and test this hypothesis. Despite being a good long-term responder to Fin, two months on Dut (2x/wk) + Fin (5x/week) has coincided with some temporal thinning.  

Nothing tragic, but enough to over-analyze and nitpick (moreso). I can still execute a convincing combover rivaled only by a former US president.

curious to hear input from some Dut veterans.  stick it out?  try topical?  quit complaining ?

PICS

oct/nov vs. today 

 

 

[giegnosiganoe]

Interesting discussion. I originally took finasteride 1mg/day for 6 months, then switched to dutasteride 0.5mg/day for the past 18 months. I only switched over because I thought it would be good to play it safe knowing that the studies show dutasteride works better. I believe I've maintained over these 2 years (on either drug), but I can't say for sure.

Very interesting that you've had noticeable loss @Harry Bosch. Is checking your T levels a good proxy for understanding the effect on scalp T? I know that the effects of fin/dut on serum DHT vs scalp DHT can differ greatly.

Edited February 6, 2021 by giegnosiganoe

[TorontoMan]

2 hours ago, Harry Bosch said:

I’ll have to check my T levels and test this hypothesis. Despite being a good long-term responder to Fin, two months on Dut (2x/wk) + Fin (5x/week) has coincided with some temporal thinning.  

Nothing tragic, but enough to over-analyze and nitpick (moreso). I can still execute a convincing combover rivaled only by a former US president.

curious to hear input from some Dut veterans.  stick it out?  try topical?  quit complaining ?

PICS

oct/nov vs. today 

 

 

Damn we are pretty similar. You are prob in a stronger position than I was pre surgery. I do see the recession you’re referring to, do you have a photo of your crown? 

[TorontoMan]

To chime in on this convo.. you have to mitigate any potential upregulation of AR, with a topical AA, if you continue to progress even on duta 

Edited February 6, 2021 by TorontoMan

[Kraistoff]

It’s 4 months that I’m on Dut / Avodart now ,   And after second transplant which is also 4 months post op I am getting happier each day 

 

[Britanium]

Would you be able to post another pic please ? I can’t really see too much In that one. However I can see a LOT of hair 👏👏

[Kraistoff]

Sure 

I’ve tried to mark up so you can see what’s transplanted and what’s not. The island at front is native hair. I’ve had around 1500 grafts in back at crown and 4500 grafts to rebuild frontal hairline and the frontal third. I was slick bald at hairline and pretty much entire frontal third apart from the island is transplanted

im using propecia everyday and I have been using dutasteride twice a week (Monday and Thursday) for past 4 months but planning to reduce this to Monday only incase I build up a tolerance and exhaust my medical options - I figure I can increase dutasteride again in future if needed . 
 

when I shaved down for HT number 2 it was clear I had a lot of miniaturisation in the crown despite being on fin for 2.5 years . 
 

 

[Britanium]

Thanks man 🙏 much clearer pics ! 

[Harry Bosch]

8 hours ago, TorontoMan said:

Damn we are pretty similar. You are prob in a stronger position than I was pre surgery. I do see the recession you’re referring to, do you have a photo of your crown? 

i detected thinning on the crown around October/November. that’s what really sent me into an overall panic. I surmised that Fin was losing effectiveness after 10 years (I’m in my mid30s now) and motivated me to get Dut into the program.

I’ve been applying minoxidil to the crown for the 2-3 months. And now incorporating oral minox.

Although my hairline is taking hit (including my long stable “good side”), I think (hope) I’ve had improvement on the crown.

attached pics:

1. October 

2. November 

3. December 

4. December 

5. January 

6. today 

7. today

 

 

[Harry Bosch]

9 hours ago, giegnosiganoe said:

Interesting discussion. I originally took finasteride 1mg/day for 6 months, then switched to dutasteride 0.5mg/day for the past 18 months. I only switched over because I thought it would be good to play it safe knowing that the studies show dutasteride works better. I believe I've maintained over these 2 years (on either drug), but I can't say for sure.

Very interesting that you've had noticeable loss @Harry Bosch. Is checking your T levels a good proxy for understanding the effect on scalp T? I know that the effects of fin/dut on serum DHT vs scalp DHT can differ greatly.

if it’s working for you, keep doing it and don’t second guess.

some guys don’t respond well to Dut.  unclear why exactly. @UnbaldEagle speculates that DHT will crash on Dut, but regular T will increase.  too much T can accelerate hair loss on the scalp.

it’s all kinda bro science.  but finding a simple, sustainable program is the best play.  unfortunately it requires patience to measure outcomes, which is tough to navigate if/when backsliding occurs

[UnbaldEagle]

1 hour ago, Harry Bosch said:

Although my hairline is taking hit (including my long stable “good side”), I think (hope) I’ve had improvement on the crown

It's not unusual at all what you're experiencing. I remember the days when dut was a relatively novel drug and there was this first line of guinea pigs on Hairsite and Hairlosshelp who reported the exact same thing: improvement on the crown whilst the hairline was getting destroyed. Most people were incredulous so they speculated it's the initial shed but some of these guys never recovered although they stayed on the drug. 

Also from what I've seen from people who did their blood work dut nukes out almost ALL serum DHT. It's whole different class than fin. 

If dut alone is not working that great, adding RU or CB that competes with both T and DHT locally you're basically fully halting MPB. 

[Harry Bosch]

3 hours ago, UnbaldEagle said:

It's not unusual at all what you're experiencing. I remember the days when dut was a relatively novel drug and there was this first line of guinea pigs on Hairsite and Hairlosshelp who reported the exact same thing: improvement on the crown whilst the hairline was getting destroyed. Most people were incredulous so they speculated it's the initial shed but some of these guys never recovered although they stayed on the drug. 

Also from what I've seen from people who did their blood work dut nukes out almost ALL serum DHT. It's whole different class than fin. 

If dut alone is not working that great, adding RU or CB that competes with both T and DHT locally you're basically fully halting MPB. 

I had about a 2-3 week period taking Dut without applying RU — unfortunately the liquid bottles expire fast and the shipping isn’t exactly overnight. Poor planning by me.

hopefully that explains my recent experience. And continued RU use coupled with Dut 1x per week / Fin 6x per week will get me back to where I was in December.  Maybe wishful thinking.

differentiating between a short-term shed and real, progressive loss — not ideal !!

[Kraistoff]

I’m not familiar with RU - what is it 

[Melvin- Admin]

Wow @Harry Bosch that’s pretty impressive. @Kraistoff you’re looking great, looks like your crown looks fuller.

[Harry Bosch]

3 hours ago, Melvin-Moderator said:

Wow @Harry Bosch that’s pretty impressive. @Kraistoff you’re looking great, looks like your crown looks fuller.

Thanks man. Unfortunately every hair I rescue on the crown seems to get subtracted from the temples.

I introduced Dut and RU/stemoxydine around the same time - hard to tell what’s working and what’s not. Downside to the panicky kitchen sink approach 

[cpfm]

Would love to get updates from @Kraistoff and @Harry Bosch.

Are you still using DUT twice a week with FIN? any changes?

Thanks.

[Kraistoff]

On 4/19/2021 at 7:51 AM, cpfm said:

Would love to get updates from @Kraistoff and @Harry Bosch.

Are you still using DUT twice a week with FIN? any changes?

Thanks.

 

[JP28]

@Harry Bosch any update?