NW3 3200 grafts with Dr Erdogan

[Payam]

1 minute ago, HG1 said:

Well to be fair you are very honest about your own short comings. Personally had I been that concerned at the consultation I would have not gone through with the surgery.

Any large surgery involves a team of highly trained professionals, as long as the surgeon is over seeing the procedure and undertaking the important parts supported by trained and competent staff - you cannot really ask for anymore. It's impossible to undertake large FUE cases by the Dr himself. That's why the Dr's that do most of the work are limited to small cases. Personally I think you are upset with yourself more than anybody for your perceived poor choice of clinic. Please stay positive Payam.

Honestly there was a moment after they shaved my head where I considered just walking out. It was such a  bizarre experience, all the girls ushering you through the different stages, the 3 other patients, the rushed 10 minutes with Erdogan. Sure if he had one team of techs, but four? And completely without supervision? What is the education level of those very young girls?

[HG1]

5 minutes ago, Payam said:

Honestly there was a moment after they shaved my head where I considered just walking out. It was such a  bizarre experience, all the girls ushering you through the different stages, the 3 other patients, the rushed 10 minutes with Erdogan. Sure if he had one team of techs, but four? And completely without supervision? What is the education level of those very young girls?

They could all be graduates with first class honours degrees in medical sciences. At the end of the day, results are king and Dr Koray consistently delivers. As with all Ops there is always risks and no procedure can give100% guarantee of success. You will never get your original density back, the HT is just an illusion. The real fact is that, if 90% of the grafts survive and you lose a hundred via shockloss, you actually end up with  considerably less hair than you started with. 

[Payam]

11 hours ago, HG1 said:

They could all be graduates with first class honours degrees in medical sciences. At the end of the day, results are king and Dr Koray consistently delivers. As with all Ops there is always risks and no procedure can give100% guarantee of success. You will never get your original density back, the HT is just an illusion. The real fact is that, if 90% of the grafts survive and you lose a hundred via shockloss, you actually end up with  considerably less hair than you started with. 

I've seen a number of poor results recently from Asmed, if 90% of the graft survived, the graft placement was planned correctly and your hair diameter is at least average, you should have a great result. He used to consistently deliver, but on the front page we have two recent sub par result and likewise on a different forum, why are these being ignored? Erdogan has tried to streamline his operation for speed, I.e squeezing in as many transplants a day as possible with the least amount of involvement from himself, how is this in any way ethical?

[HG1]

On 8/10/2018 at 9:19 AM, Payam said:

I've seen a number of poor results recently from Asmed, if 90% of the graft survived, the graft placement was planned correctly and your hair diameter is at least average, you should have a great result. He used to consistently deliver, but on the front page we have two recent sub par result and likewise on a different forum, why are these being ignored? Erdogan has tried to streamline his operation for speed, I.e squeezing in as many transplants a day as possible with the least amount of involvement from himself, how is this in any way ethical?

Well if the two results are considered failures - still a matter of speculation, with the literally hundreds of excellent results online-  this still gives Asmed 99% + success rate. What proof do you have about his streamlining ? Can you give precise details or is this just your opinion? Not having a go - just looking for answers ?

[Payam]

4 hours ago, HG1 said:

Well if the two results are considered failures - still a matter of speculation, with the literally hundreds of excellent results online-  this still gives Asmed 99% + success rate. What proof do you have about his streamlining ? Can you give precise details or is this just your opinion? Not having a go - just looking for answers ?

But were those results recent? Was he using 4 teams of techs? You've had your surgery with asmed, are you telling me the whole process wasn't rushed? He meets you for maybe 10-15 minutes in total before the operation, he's jumping back and forth between 4 operating rooms to do incisions after your grafts have been removed, that means if you are last, your grafts are sitting there until he is finished with the other 3 patients. Does this seem like good practice?

[HG1]

You haven't answered my question about you having proof about your statement regarding his streamlining? I found the whole process - professional, well oiled and slick - rushed NO. For others might haven't been different, I can only tell you how it was for me.As I previously said, you cannot argue -  Asmed consistently produce fantastic results. You appear to have an issue with Asmed which is your prerogative, but any statements need to be backed up with hard facts or expressed as opinions which is a different matter. 

 

[Payam]

5 hours ago, HG1 said:

You haven't answered my question about you having proof about your statement regarding his streamlining? I found the whole process - professional, well oiled and slick - rushed NO. For others might haven't been different, I can only tell you how it was for me.As I previously said, you cannot argue -  Asmed consistently produce fantastic results. You appear to have an issue with Asmed which is your prerogative, but any statements need to be backed up with hard facts or expressed as opinions which is a different matter. 

 

Not sure what you mean about proof? I mean he rushes the surgeries to be able to squeeze in as many as possible, he did not use to do 4 surgeries a day, and there was even a time when he supervised the techs. Asmed has historically produced good results, but what about the thread we are in? What about my case? 

[HG1]

 This is the dictionary definition - Evidence or argument establishing a fact or the truth of a statement.

 Regarding your case, you are less than 50% in, so to get into A discussion regarding success or failure is just crazy. 

[Payam]

9 hours ago, HG1 said:

 This is the dictionary definition - Evidence or argument establishing a fact or the truth of a statement.

 Regarding your case, you are less than 50% in, so to get into A discussion regarding success or failure is just crazy. 

So what you are saying is you consider this surgery a success? He has to conceal the transplanted area with his own hair, is thar a success after 3200 grafts in a relatively small area?

[Rwethereyet]

57 minutes ago, Payam said:

So what you are saying is you consider this surgery a success? He has to conceal the transplanted area with his own hair, is thar a success after 3200 grafts in a relatively small area?

Payam, you had your surgery approx 5 months ago or so? I have looked through your posts and you have spent a great deal of time freaking out about your own transplant and unnecessarily so at this point. You are doing yourself no favours. You must be spending a great deal of time panicking and stressing and staring in the mirror! You are also putting a lot of your time in to posting on this forum specifically aiming at anything to do with ASMED.  You and I picked a clinic with an extremely high reputation and success rate, I did lots and lots of research before I made my choice, I knew exactly what was going to happen at ASMED and there were no surprises for me. 

You are trying to regard my transplant as a success or failure like there is a black and white line. A failure to me would be to be in the same position as I started or worse a 100% success would be all 3200 grafts having grown in healthy.  There is a lot of ground in between this. Also even if all 3200 grafts grew in I may have continued to loose hair or may not be satisfied with the density from that transplant. So even though the transplant yielded 100% graft success the result may still not be 100% of what I wanted.  I can tell you that I am so much happier with my hair now than I was before my transplant, however I am not yet satisfied. I am not ready to judge my result yet as it is still progressing and I can see this when I look closely in the mirror, so I will wait and reserve judgement until it has finished.  Then I will decide what the best course of action is. 

I would suggest as many have already said to you to relax (as hard as that may seem) forget about this forum and  stop looking in the mirror as much as possible for now and focus on something else in your life that you enjoy and love doing it will make your life a whole lot easier.

Your hair will improve, there is nothing you can do now except to wait it out and then address where you are when the HT has finished growing. 

[Payam]

26 minutes ago, Rwethereyet said:

Payam, you had your surgery approx 5 months ago or so? I have looked through your posts and you have spent a great deal of time freaking out about your own transplant and unnecessarily so at this point. You are doing yourself no favours. You must be spending a great deal of time panicking and stressing and staring in the mirror! You are also putting a lot of your time in to posting on this forum specifically aiming at anything to do with ASMED.  You and I picked a clinic with an extremely high reputation and success rate, I did lots and lots of research before I made my choice, I knew exactly what was going to happen at ASMED and there were no surprises for me. 

You are trying to regard my transplant as a success or failure like there is a black and white line. A failure to me would be to be in the same position as I started or worse a 100% success would be all 3200 grafts having grown in healthy.  There is a lot of ground in between this. Also even if all 3200 grafts grew in I may have continued to loose hair or may not be satisfied with the density from that transplant. So even though the transplant yielded 100% graft success the result may still not be 100% of what I wanted.  I can tell you that I am so much happier with my hair now than I was before my transplant, however I am not yet satisfied. I am not ready to judge my result yet as it is still progressing and I can see this when I look closely in the mirror, so I will wait and reserve judgement until it has finished.  Then I will decide what the best course of action is. 

I would suggest as many have already said to you to relax (as hard as that may seem) forget about this forum and  stop looking in the mirror as much as possible for now and focus on something else in your life that you enjoy and love doing it will make your life a whole lot easier.

Your hair will improve, there is nothing you can do now except to wait it out and then address where you are when the HT has finished growing. 

I respect that and I am glad you are happy, but I don't understand why people are giving this clinic a free pass. Look several of the asmed threads on this forum and you will see a recurring theme. An enormous number of grafts used, the patient is happy, yet not satisfied with the density and will opt for a touch up. I firmly believe that after these mega sessions we do, we shouldn't need any touch up to fill in density. In your case there are big gaps in the recipient where clearly the grafts did not survive which are resulting in this low density appearance. How many percentage of the grafts survived in your case? What does the clinic claim and have you gotten a second opinion? I am only 5 months in, that is true, but I am seeing the same thing in my hairline, big gaps completely bald with no sprouts in the same areas (frontal area, mostly on the sides same as you), is this a coincidence? I believe we need to get to the root of these issues, both for our sakes but also for future HT patients browsing this forum. Honesty and transparency is the most important thing there. Hoping the best for you.

Edited August 13, 2018 by Payam

[Bill - Seemiller]

On 8/9/2018 at 3:47 PM, Payam said:

Hey mate, simple answer is bad research. I barely even read the forums, I only looked at his results and the youtube videos where they post the perfect results only. Also I went in thinking he would be way more involved in the process, in reality you meet the guy for about ten minutes in total before the surgery. I also didn't know he doesn't do the extraction anymore, but most importantly, I had no idea from anything I had seen that he has several teams of techs that do extractions, and that they do 4 surgeries a day in parallel mostly unsupervised.

Payam,

I know that you have concerns but please keep discussion of your experience on your own topic and not on somebody else’s. It seems like you are unintentionally hijacking this topic.  This topic should be reserved to discuss the OP’s results not yours.  

 As for the research, I don’t believe that you did bad research, or perhaps you were not thorough but you did select a surgeon that has a history of producing outstanding results. 

Hang in there, you’re only at five months. 

Bill

[Bill - Seemiller]

On 5/30/2018 at 2:50 AM, Rwethereyet said:

Here are the harsh light pictures

Even under harsh lighting, when your hair is styled it seems to hold up very well. Obviously, when it’s not styled it’s going to appear a little thin and maybe even when it is styled, but overall I’d say you’ve had a nice result. That said, I think another touch up procedure in the frontal third would add to your density significantly and give you the ultimate results you want.

How are you feeling about your results?

Bill

[HG1]

7 hours ago, Payam said:

So what you are saying is you consider this surgery a success? He has to conceal the transplanted area with his own hair, is thar a success after 3200 grafts in a relatively small area?

Hi Payam, you said Asmed had streamlined their operation, please provide conclusive proof that this is the case, or confirm this is just an opinion. You make statements, then when challenged give no evidence and change the subject. 

As for your comments above, I think the OP hair has much improved from where he started and he will probably see further Improvements in the coming months with regard to hair characteristics and calibre. The OP has been remarkably open and honest and stated his hair is shown in the worst way and light possible. Lets be straight here, no one wants people to think they have made a mistake clinic wise and will usually showcase their hair in the best possible way. If the OP styled his hair, with some product - it would look much better. Is it a success? I'm not in a position to say, only the OP is. Would he like more density, sure he would like - just like everyone else.

 

 

[Payam]

8 minutes ago, HG1 said:

Hi Payam, you said Asmed had streamlined their operation, please provide conclusive proof that this is the case, or confirm this is just an opinion. You make statements, then when challenged give no evidence and change the subject. 

As for your comments above, I think the OP hair has much improved from where he started and he will probably see further Improvements in the coming months with regard to hair characteristics and calibre. The OP has been remarkably open and honest and stated his hair is shown in the worst way and light possible. Lets be straight here, no one wants people to think they have made a mistake clinic wise and will usually showcase their hair in the best possible way. If the OP styled his hair, with some product - it would look much better. Is it a success? I'm not in a position to say, only the OP is. Would he like more density, sure he would like - just like everyone else.

 

 

Hi mate, maybe i'm using the word wrong, I mean he streamlined it for higher profits with more risk/unknown variables by upping surgeries per day to 4 and himself no longer doing the extractions.

[Melvin- Admin]

Guys,

this thread is to discuss Rwethereyet’s results, if you guys want to have a conversation with eachother please send private messages thanks.

warm regards-Melvin 

[Rwethereyet]

5 hours ago, Bill - Managing Publisher said:

Even under harsh lighting, when your hair is styled it seems to hold up very well. Obviously, when it’s not styled it’s going to appear a little thin and maybe even when it is styled, but overall I’d say you’ve had a nice result. That said, I think another touch up procedure in the frontal third would add to your density significantly and give you the ultimate results you want.

How are you feeling about your results?

Bill

Hi Bill

Thanks for taking the time to look at my results so far. Generally I feel much better for having the transplant. I don't feel like the result I have so far is quite what I expected, I would have liked more density over the front third so that when my hair is styled you can't see my scalp through the hair so easily. Also my left temple is still lacking behind my right, this is odd as my right side is coming in slower than the left has on top.

I would like to give it till the 18th month before I decide what to do, I still see a few fairly new hairs coming in and quite a lot of the hairs seem like they need to thicken up.

ASMED want to see more photos nearer the 18th month so it will be interesting to see what there opinion is.

Hopefully it will thicken up more as I would rather not need to use too many more grafts from the bank for the front half. I believe I have approx 5000 ish left so should have enough for a touch up and the back section in the future. 

[Payam]

On 8/13/2018 at 8:43 PM, Rwethereyet said:

Hi Bill

Thanks for taking the time to look at my results so far. Generally I feel much better for having the transplant. I don't feel like the result I have so far is quite what I expected, I would have liked more density over the front third so that when my hair is styled you can't see my scalp through the hair so easily. Also my left temple is still lacking behind my right, this is odd as my right side is coming in slower than the left has on top.

I would like to give it till the 18th month before I decide what to do, I still see a few fairly new hairs coming in and quite a lot of the hairs seem like they need to thicken up.

ASMED want to see more photos nearer the 18th month so it will be interesting to see what there opinion is.

Hopefully it will thicken up more as I would rather not need to use too many more grafts from the bank for the front half. I believe I have approx 5000 ish left so should have enough for a touch up and the back section in the future. 

I find it infuriating that they won't disclosure the names of our techs. I am seeing huge similarities in our transplants, it would tell us a lot if we had the same tech team I think.

[Rwethereyet]

11 hours ago, Payam said:

I find it infuriating that they won't disclosure the names of our techs. I am seeing huge similarities in our transplants, it would tell us a lot if we had the same tech team I think.

Look, you need to chill out! You are judging your result at 5 months like your transplant has failed. You are not being respectful to ASMED and giving your transplant and body the time it needs to recover and flourish. You have a long journey ahead of you and you are making it a very stressful and unpleasant time for yourself.  I'm not interested in bitching about ASMED because my transplant has not finished growing in yet. I'm going to continue doing what I have been doing, enjoying my life and not stress about it. Life is too short and there is too much fun to be had out there. I suggest you do the same

[Payam]

4 hours ago, Rwethereyet said:

Look, you need to chill out! You are judging your result at 5 months like your transplant has failed. You are not being respectful to ASMED and giving your transplant and body the time it needs to recover and flourish. You have a long journey ahead of you and you are making it a very stressful and unpleasant time for yourself.  I'm not interested in bitching about ASMED because my transplant has not finished growing in yet. I'm going to continue doing what I have been doing, enjoying my life and not stress about it. Life is too short and there is too much fun to be had out there. I suggest you do the same

Sorry mate, didn't mean to agitate you, you have a great outlook on life and I hope the very best for you.

[Melvin- Admin]

5 hours ago, Rwethereyet said:

Look, you need to chill out! You are judging your result at 5 months like your transplant has failed. You are not being respectful to ASMED and giving your transplant and body the time it needs to recover and flourish. You have a long journey ahead of you and you are making it a very stressful and unpleasant time for yourself.  I'm not interested in bitching about ASMED because my transplant has not finished growing in yet. I'm going to continue doing what I have been doing, enjoying my life and not stress about it. Life is too short and there is too much fun to be had out there. I suggest you do the same

Very well said.

[jjsrader]

I say let him rant and obsess.  It makes for great reading and obviously he can't stop himself from posting.  The replies are great as well - informative too.

It's his process - great theatre!

Edited August 17, 2018 by jjsrader

[Legend007]

Haha js,, totally agree with ya. .. I come on here just for the ranting n arguing .. it’s what keeps this place interesting .. 

good thing we have our fellow anti-hero Jean to keep things spicy .. (‘.^)

[jjsrader]

It is ironic yet true that when provocative topics are raised - we tend to get answers.

Do you really think Dr. Erdogan would have EVER bothered to come here on the board and give his explanation of tech training at his facility if there wasn't a real reason to do so?

Frankly, he should have a section about that on his website - since he's such the promoter, eh?

Yet we only get a personal long explanation when enough doubt or noise was created. 

Let me tell you something; my entire extended family is in the healthcare industry (doctors/pharmacists/physician assistants/nurses) and I can tell you with absolute certainty they are just like anyone else.  Certainly nothing more but often much less than the rest of the masses.  Yea, they are usually very intelligent and take tests well - that's not everything.  Bedside manner is relevant too - and truly wanting to heal.  Plastic surgeons usually don't go into their field 'cause it's a 'calling' - it's detailed and demanding but very lucrative.

Now,  to the point.  There are so many doctor's that are challenged on this website and we never get a clear answer.  Oh, it will mess up my refund, I don't want to out my doctor, blah blah blah.

Most of them have a rep on this board or I can guarantee you someone on their staff looking for mention's of their name on this forum.  What do we normally get? 

An echo chamber and then mods begging for more info so they can open a dialogue with the doctor.  I'd like to hear more about that.  Website gets paid big bucks from doctor's and then I see alot of half-assed excuses about resolution.  I often wonder what the story is behind the scenes (outside of the website mission statement).

Case in point.  I bet at least the vast majority of doctor's aren't showing the required work on this website they are supposed to be accountable for.  Oh, but the moderator didn't keep up on that for the last 6 months - 'cause hey, I'm getting paid and I have to moderate all these posts and keep replies on topic.

Doctor's should be required to interact on at least a limited basis here in order to stay recommended.  In fact I saw a couple very nice/detailed and informative replies from Dr. Bhatti today - thank you doctor for your insight to a regular poster(s).

I realize doctor's are busy but surely they can step up and reply to at least the most interesting questions on this forum.  Many do, more need to do so.  It's called good standard of care.

Perhaps I'm most disappointed in newbies who don't use the search function and spend REAL time studying and reading months and months (years and years) of QUALITY and in-depth threads before they come on here and ask the same uninformed questions.

It would be better to charge an initial small registration fee to post in order keep out utterly clueless that don't bother to really approach major surgery investigation with the respect it deserves.

But what do I know?  The majority in here are into hair porn  and can't emotionally handle going bald as nature intended;  it's flaccid and weak & I have no bloody use for it.

Yet, here I am posting like an idiot!!  ; )

 

Edited August 18, 2018 by jjsrader

[Mick50]

5 hours ago, jjsrader said:

It is ironic yet true that when provocative topics are raised - we tend to get answers.

Do you really think Dr. Erdogan would have EVER bothered to come here on the board and give his explanation of tech training at his facility if there wasn't a real reason to do so?

Frankly, he should have a section about that on his website - since he's such the promoter, eh?

Yet we only get a personal long explanation when enough doubt or noise was created. 

Let me tell you something; my entire extended family is in the healthcare industry (doctors/pharmacists/physician assistants/nurses) and I can tell you with absolute certainty they are just like anyone else.  Certainly nothing more but often much less than the rest of the masses.  Yea, they are usually very intelligent and take tests well - that's not everything.  Bedside manner is relevant too - and truly wanting to heal.  Plastic surgeons usually don't go into their field 'cause it's a 'calling' - it's detailed and demanding but very lucrative.

Now,  to the point.  There are so many doctor's that are challenged on this website and we never get a clear answer.  Oh, it will mess up my refund, I don't want to out my doctor, blah blah blah.

Most of them have a rep on this board or I can guarantee you someone on their staff looking for mention's of their name on this forum.  What do we normally get? 

An echo chamber and then mods begging for more info so they can open a dialogue with the doctor.  I'd like to hear more about that.  Website gets paid big bucks from doctor's and then I see alot of half-assed excuses about resolution.  I often wonder what the story is behind the scenes (outside of the website mission statement).

Case in point.  I bet at least the vast majority of doctor's aren't showing the required work on this website they are supposed to be accountable for.  Oh, but the moderator didn't keep up on that for the last 6 months - 'cause hey, I'm getting paid and I have to moderate all these posts and keep replies on topic.

Doctor's should be required to interact on at least a limited basis here in order to stay recommended.  In fact I saw a couple very nice/detailed and informative replies from Dr. Bhatti today - thank you doctor for your insight to a regular poster(s).

I realize doctor's are busy but surely they can step up and reply to at least the most interesting questions on this forum.  Many do, more need to do so.  It's called good standard of care.

Perhaps I'm most disappointed in newbies who don't use the search function and spend REAL time studying and reading months and months (years and years) of QUALITY and in-depth threads before they come on here and ask the same uninformed questions.

It would be better to charge an initial small registration fee to post in order keep out utterly clueless that don't bother to really approach major surgery investigation with the respect it deserves.

But what do I know?  The majority in here are into hair porn  and can't emotionally handle going bald as nature intended;  it's flaccid and weak & I have no bloody use for it.

Yet, here I am posting like an idiot!!  ; )

 

I have already pointed out to Bill that Dr Yaman and Dr Bloxham have not shown any of their cases in at least 6 months, it begs the question is Dr Feller still recommended ? as he also doesn't present his work on here anymore . I was told by Bill that monthly updates by Docs have to be presented on a monthly basis .

 I asked Dr Erdogan 2 questions in response to the post he made recently ,  one regarding does he have enough time to properly supervise 4 different teams of techs when they are doing the extractions ? ,the second question was about the ambiguous advertising on his website regarding as to actually who does the extractions?, I haven't received a reply up to this point .

Edited August 18, 2018 by Mick50