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Dr Rahal disappointed with FUT 5400+ grafts


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Dear All,

 

I seek your sincere advice after my bad hair transplant with Dr. Rahal. I did it in 2010 with more than 5400+ to resolve baldness degree 5. I am going to be 30 years old in March.

 

Since then, i am suffering a lot, started to avoid social gathering. Emotionally i feet anger and isolated. even the simplest things like posting pictures of me in facebook and instgram cannot do it because of my weird look.

 

Espcially now my options are limited, even shaving my head fully is not an option because of the scare!! not to mention that i already consumed 5400+ grafts!! What makes feel frustrated that the crown is so bald and my baldness will grow more with my age.

 

Moreover, with 5400+ grafts, you expect a better hairline than what i got. it is like i dont have a hairline. people tell me you are bald from front and back, do a transplant!!! it is like i didnt do it in first place or even worse!!

 

Now, my options are very limited with what happened.

 

do you feel the pain i am going through?

 

I seek your advise and support. what should i do?

 

I approached Rahal, he offered a free touch up only but i have to pay for tickets and i am coming from the middle east which is a lot. Also, i am the one who has to suffer through all this experience.

 

Also, i started to feel not comfortable going to Rahal after what happened. Because it may happen again since it happened to me. I feel the touch up is a temporary solution only.

 

please help me with your guidance,

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Rahal is a good surgeon and I don't think you should be scared to go to him. I do think you still look natural. If people are telling you to get a transplant, they can't tell you've had one, and that's good.

 

For you to get any good advice, imo, you'll need to post 3 more pics. A pre op, a one year post op, and a top down.

 

Are you on meds? A person can get a transplant at 25 and be, say a diffused nw4 and in 5 years be a nw6. What I'm saying is, we are talking about 5 years down the road. Without more info, like a one year post op photo, it's hard to judge your result.

 

The fact that he offered a free touch up half a decade later is saying something.

I am an online representative for Dr. Raymond Konior who is an elite member of the Coalition of Independent Hair Restoration Physicians.

View Dr. Konior's Website

View Spanker's Website

I am not a medical professional and my opinions should not be taken as medical advice.

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Sorry to read of your disappointment.

 

Do you have before/after pictures from 2010/2011? Were you happy with the result after 12 months? Are you on finasteride (I guess not), and did the surgery implant around existing hairs?

 

I'm guessing you probably lost more hair in the last 5 years which has caused the thin-look.

4,312 FUT grafts (7,676 hairs) with Ray Konior, MD - August 2013

1,145 FUE grafts (3,152 hairs) with Ray Konior, MD - August 2018

763 FUE grafts (2,094 hairs) with Ray Konior, MD - January 2020

Proscar 1.25mg every 3rd day

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Rahal is a good surgeon and I don't think you should be scared to go to him. I do think you still look natural. If people are telling you to get a transplant, they can't tell you've had one, and that's good.

 

For you to get any good advice, imo, you'll need to post 3 more pics. A pre op, a one year post op, and a top down.

 

Are you on meds? A person can get a transplant at 25 and be, say a diffused nw4 and in 5 years be a nw6. What I'm saying is, we are talking about 5 years down the road. Without more info, like a one year post op photo, it's hard to judge your result.

 

The fact that he offered a free touch up half a decade later is saying something.

 

Thanks Spanker for your feedback and i hope you don't experience what i have been through.

 

I got a feedback from different Doctors recommended by the network who said the transplant wasn't good at all with 5400+ grafts. I selected Dr. Rahal for his work and the talk about his work in the forum. but things didn't turn well. These things happen and i seek advise and guidance from experienced people.

 

I am not on meds, i wasn't advised to take meds after the one year mark.

 

you mentioned that my baldness has progressed. This is true, but can the transplanted 5400+ grafts be progressed as well? i am not concerned about my crown baldness. but can you look close to the hairline please? if it is you, will you feel happy with such a hairline with 5400+ grafts.

 

I attached more photos for the pre-op and others as requested. Now you have 5 pictures.

1.jpg.d0a2520c084d223fbe61f3147baccdf2.jpg

2.jpg.c5633306bcf325ceb4f5aa741e49fc4f.jpg

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So which photo it's the one year post op?

I agree that this doesn't look like a great outcome.

Some one year photos and a current top down will kind of show how unsuccessful it was. Judging from your pre ops 5 years ago and no meds, I think it's a good assumption that almost all of what you have on top is transplant.

 

Also, have you tried a side part? That could reduce the light hitting the scalp and improve your look.

 

I understand there are five photos, but 4 are basically the same one. I'm just telling you what photos you'll need for people to honestly declare the procedure a failure and to give you an idea of how many grafts it would take to to meaningfully improve your situation.

 

I would also consider getting on meds.

I am an online representative for Dr. Raymond Konior who is an elite member of the Coalition of Independent Hair Restoration Physicians.

View Dr. Konior's Website

View Spanker's Website

I am not a medical professional and my opinions should not be taken as medical advice.

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  • Senior Member

Sorry to hear of this, and I hope you can get it resolved. While meds are important, even without meds, we should see something with a substantial amount like 5.4k grafts.Which photo is pre, and which is post?

 

Could you post this set of photos: Front, Side View, Top, and Back? That way we can get an idea of the donor area as well.

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For 5400 grafts, this is not a good result at all. I have seen very few FUT results that come out like this. The reasons behind the poor results could be many (including any and all of: doc supervision/tech training and execution/patient post-op care), and I won't take guesses as to what they are.

 

If it bothers you that much, I would suggest you look at Europe (closer to you), select a great FUE doc who can assess your remaining donor, and get your frontal 1/3 fixed with 2000-2500 grafts. You went with FUT first, so hopefully you have at least 2000 grafts remaining for FUE.

 

IMHO - At this point, money cannot be the object. You will lose a lot more money by continuing to live in a cave than you will by getting this fixed properly and regaining your self-confidence. You have to really consider it more of an investment at this point than just a self-image improvement. If you are not comfortable returning to Rahal, then don't. There are great FUE docs in Europe who can probably help you with this (Bisanga, Erdogan, Lorenzo, etc).

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For 5400 grafts, this is not a good result at all. I have seen very few FUT results that come out like this. The reasons behind the poor results could be many (including any and all of: doc supervision/tech training and execution/patient post-op care), and I won't take guesses as to what they are.

 

If it bothers you that much, I would suggest you look at Europe (closer to you), select a great FUE doc who can assess your remaining donor, and get your frontal 1/3 fixed with 2000-2500 grafts. You went with FUT first, so hopefully you have at least 2000 grafts remaining for FUE.

 

IMHO - At this point, money cannot be the object. You will lose a lot more money by continuing to live in a cave than you will by getting this fixed properly and regaining your self-confidence. You have to really consider it more of an investment at this point than just a self-image improvement. If you are not comfortable returning to Rahal, then don't. There are great FUE docs in Europe who can probably help you with this (Bisanga, Erdogan, Lorenzo, etc).

 

This is a wise post.

I am an online representative for Dr. Raymond Konior who is an elite member of the Coalition of Independent Hair Restoration Physicians.

View Dr. Konior's Website

View Spanker's Website

I am not a medical professional and my opinions should not be taken as medical advice.

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  • Senior Member

Sorry you didn't get the result you were looking for, I would be disappointed as well considering other results with 5000 grafts that we have seen. It looks like you were a diffuse thinner to begin with and you probably lost your native hair after the procedure and netted a look similar to where you started. Were those grafts spread out over your whole scalp or just in the front? If you didn't have the transplant you may have been approaching a slick bald look by now. Propecia would have been advisable for sure.

 

I agree with the others about your hair style. With your hair standing straight up and taking photos that are lit from directly above will result in a most unflattering look for many people, not just you. I would part it on the side so it lays down a bit and provides coverage or comb it forward in a Cesar style. In any event it doesn't look like an obvious transplant, it does look naturally thin which is a good thing.

 

Rahal is a well known surgeon with a very good reputation. I would take him up on his offer for a free touch up and bite the bullet for the $1500 plane ticket over. Good luck.

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Sorry guys but we are talking for Dr Rahal.

His reputation is well known.

We are talking about the top of the world right now.

Touch up in this case is not acceptable.

This result for the grafts and money spend is below below average and we know it all.

Beside law papers we all sign before a transplant that in reality covers the doctor in case of a failure there is the ethical part which in not signed nowhere.

Dr Rahal have to make another transplant from the begining for free even the air tickets even he is covered by the law.he is a top world surgeon,not a lockal newbie butcher.

A transplant for dr rahal is an every day operation.for the patient might be 10 years money saving plus severe mentally issues in the meanwhile.

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i am suffering a lot, started to avoid social gathering. Emotionally i feet anger and isolated. even the simplest things like posting pictures of me in facebook and instgram cannot do it because of my weird look.

 

Espcially now my options are limited, even shaving my head fully is not an option because of the scare!! not to mention that i already consumed 5400+ grafts!! What makes feel frustrated that the crown is so bald and my baldness will grow more with my age.

 

Moreover, with 5400+ grafts, you expect a better hairline than what i got. it is like i dont have a hairline. people tell me you are bald from front and back, do a transplant!!! it is like i didnt do it in first place or even worse!!

 

Now, my options are very limited with what happened.

 

do you feel the pain i am going through?

 

 

I always felt the same way after mine. I didn't go out, didn't want to be in pictures, wore a hat everywhere. I also get people telling me things like I should just shave my head (it would look even worse with all the scars I have) or if it bothers me I should just get a hair transplant. Ughh!! They seem to think it's so simple to fix and can't understand the problem. The girl I was dating before having my HT knew I was going to have it done. We broke up a few months before I actually did it. Three years later after many HT surgeries and I hadn't seen her she asked me why I never went to have a HT.

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I approached Rahal, he offered a free touch up only but i have to pay for tickets and i am coming from the middle east which is a lot. Also, i am the one who has to suffer through all this experience.

 

Did he give an indication as to how many grafts he feels a touch up would be? 500? 1000? Is he willing to do some additional grafts on op of that at a discount?

 

For example, if he agrees to do maybe 500 for free plus an additional 1500 or so at half price then it might be worth it. Otherwise you're right. It isn't worth taking the trip for a few free grafts. You'd be paying more than what you would pay by having it done closer to you.

 

You should discuss these things with him if you haven't

 

But on the other hand I know it's hard to let someone do 2000+ grafts if you don't feel confident that he can do a good job on you especially after already using up 5400 grafts. You don't want to waste any more.

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There are a few questions that must be asked.

 

1.) You showed one before photo of the top of your head. Do you have any photos showing the result one year after surgery?

 

2.) You have shown your after photos five years after surgery but they are only of the front. Do you have any photos of the top of the scalp that are similar in angle to the one pre-surgery photo you showed?

 

3.) Was the distribution of hair from the hairline into the crown area or was the distribution just for the hairline and the front/top of the scalp? From the looks of the one overhead photo you were a NW6 with highly diffused loss.

 

4.) How much work is to be done if you go back to Dr. Rahal?

 

From what I've seen I don't think anyone has the right to say this is a failed hair transplant just yet. To be fair perhaps comparative photos should be presented and the distribution pattern shown before we can say what is going on.

 

As a side note, it is commendable that Dr. Rahal is offering free work five years after your surgery. Most clinics would tell you that it is too long to wait for them to take responsibility for any shortcomings in the result and in this case I can't see that there is a shortcoming due to the surgery itself as there is not enough supporting evidence. There are only a few photos of the front and nothing more. I'm not saying that this result is good or bad, just that I don't think we realistically can say one way or the other without more information.

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Sorry guys but we are talking for Dr Rahal.

His reputation is well known.

We are talking about the top of the world right now.

Touch up in this case is not acceptable.

This result for the grafts and money spend is below below average and we know it all.

Beside law papers we all sign before a transplant that in reality covers the doctor in case of a failure there is the ethical part which in not signed nowhere.

Dr Rahal have to make another transplant from the begining for free even the air tickets even he is covered by the law.he is a top world surgeon,not a lockal newbie butcher.

A transplant for dr rahal is an every day operation.for the patient might be 10 years money saving plus severe mentally issues in the meanwhile.

 

Couldn`t agree more. But chin up, nothing is lost in your case. What happened just happened, you can`t do anything about it, so take it as an experience. You can still fill the scar via FUE and add SMP optionally, plus you have some grafts left for sure in order to increase the density in your hairline. Try to evaluate the options you have with several surgeons, and just listen to the ideas they have at first, and unhurriedly. Probably you have to cut the hair shorter in general; with transplants, you in nearly all cases have to make compromises. Maybe your hairline could be reversed in a repair, and the harvested grafts used to increase the density of a then more conservative hairline? Just a wild guess..

But again, stay cool, you`re not alone, and nothing is lost :)

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... not enough supporting evidence. There are only a few photos of the front and nothing more. I'm not saying that this result is good or bad, just that I don't think we realistically can say one way or the other without more information.

 

@The hairtransplant "mentor"

 

Hello, aren`t you the representative of Rahal now? So you should have access to this patients information actually? :confused:

The transplant dates back to 2010, so it also could be the case that an actually good result looks sparse by now due to further loss. It could easily be checked by post op pictures dating back to 2010, 2011. Theflyer, can you post some pictures of your result when it was fresh and fully grown out?

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Sorry to read of your disappointment.

 

Do you have before/after pictures from 2010/2011? Were you happy with the result after 12 months? Are you on finasteride (I guess not), and did the surgery implant around existing hairs?

 

I'm guessing you probably lost more hair in the last 5 years which has caused the thin-look.

 

Thank you Matt for showing empathy. I appreciate it.

 

Regarding your point about lost more hair,

 

from front, I didn't have hair at all and all the hair that you see in front is a transplanted hair. Can you believe that I had 5400+ grafts and this is the outcome? My look was similar to your pre op and I am happy to see how successful yours was with less grafts than mine. Unfortunately, mine wasn't. My year post op, I was putting my hair to sides to hide the look of the hairline.

 

I put my pre op and post op which you are seeing the first photo in my second post.

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So which photo it's the one year post op?

I agree that this doesn't look like a great outcome.

Some one year photos and a current top down will kind of show how unsuccessful it was. Judging from your pre ops 5 years ago and no meds, I think it's a good assumption that almost all of what you have on top is transplant.

 

Also, have you tried a side part? That could reduce the light hitting the scalp and improve your look.

 

I understand there are five photos, but 4 are basically the same one. I'm just telling you what photos you'll need for people to honestly declare the procedure a failure and to give you an idea of how many grafts it would take to to meaningfully improve your situation.

 

I would also consider getting on meds.

 

Yes, it is not great unfortunately and if you feel my pain it is not even close to 0/10.

 

Thank you Spanker for your med advice, i am now considering it to reduce the progress of the sides. The crown Now is so bald.

 

THe first photo in my second post is pre-op. Yes, your assumption is right, all what I have is a transplanted hair.

 

Side part is good idea and it is yes helping to reduce the lighting affect. However, nowadays, the sides are balding and when I do a side part, it becomes like I have hair in the top, then nothing at the top of sides, then hair sides. Kind of patches.

 

This is why I put my hair style at the back to try hiding the sides as much as possible to have a reasonable look. Do you see how I am really left with limited option? If the transplant was good, I wouldn't be in this situation at all.

 

What makes things worse is my crown is so bald. If I want to do a transplant, I am in the delima that should I use the grafts to correct the old transplant or cover the crown and the sides? There is not enough grafts especially I used a lot in the first op.

 

I started to think to shave my head for bald look but the scar is taking this option out.

Edited by theflyer
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Sorry to hear of this, and I hope you can get it resolved. While meds are important, even without meds, we should see something with a substantial amount like 5.4k grafts.Which photo is pre, and which is post?

 

Could you post this set of photos: Front, Side View, Top, and Back? That way we can get an idea of the donor area as well.

 

Exactly, I am very frustrated that this number of grafts have been wasted. I will post it ,

 

The crown is so bald even when I discussed the touch up offer, I asked if I want to do a transplant to lower the hairline and to cover the crown since I am doing a surgery anyway. The answer that I cannot because my crown is so bald and huge area. Either crown and touch up or touch up and reducing hair Iine. Very limited options for me.

 

The middle of head is acceptable but the hairline and sides are the worst.

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I booked a procedure with doctor Rahal a couple of years ago,I had to cancel due to family reasons,I gave plenty of notice 4 weeks and Rahal kept my deposit of $1000.I was really upset and disappoined with him but he would not return my money.I lost all respect for him.I can empathise with you,he should pay your air ticket back over.

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For 5400 grafts, this is not a good result at all. I have seen very few FUT results that come out like this. The reasons behind the poor results could be many (including any and all of: doc supervision/tech training and execution/patient post-op care), and I won't take guesses as to what they are.

 

If it bothers you that much, I would suggest you look at Europe (closer to you), select a great FUE doc who can assess your remaining donor, and get your frontal 1/3 fixed with 2000-2500 grafts. You went with FUT first, so hopefully you have at least 2000 grafts remaining for FUE.

 

IMHO - At this point, money cannot be the object. You will lose a lot more money by continuing to live in a cave than you will by getting this fixed properly and regaining your self-confidence. You have to really consider it more of an investment at this point than just a self-image improvement. If you are not comfortable returning to Rahal, then don't. There are great FUE docs in Europe who can probably help you with this (Bisanga, Erdogan, Lorenzo, etc).

 

Very insightful thoughts, thanks a lot. Also, I agree with you that this is not a good transplant at all with thhis huge by,her of grafts!

 

I may go for FUE to correct what happened. The only thing is that my crown is so bald so if I go with correction nothing will be much left for the crown. We are talking about almost 8000 grafts will be gone.

 

Should I correct the front only and leave the crown? What are your thoughts? Also, I am still 30 so this means my baldness will grow more. What do you think?

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There are a few questions that must be asked.

 

From what I've seen I don't think anyone has the right to say this is a failed hair transplant just yet. To be fair perhaps comparative photos should be presented and the distribution pattern shown before we can say what is going on.

 

As a side note, it is commendable that Dr. Rahal is offering free work five years after your surgery. Most clinics would tell you that it is too long to wait for them to take responsibility for any shortcomings in the result and in this case I can't see that there is a shortcoming due to the surgery itself as there is not enough supporting evidence. There are only a few photos of the front and nothing more. I'm not saying that this result is good or bad, just that I don't think we realistically can say one way or the other without more information.

 

You're right; the evidence presented in support of the patient's complaint is seriously light. If I was the surgeon, I wouldn't feel obliged to offer anything free at this point because there's little in the way of conclusive proof - especially after 5 years - to lay blame at the surgeon's door.

 

I feel for the guy but there's not enough info here; maybe he didn't take his meds, maybe his aftercare was crap. Too many maybes. He needs to get over it and book FUE in Europe to sort his frontal third.

 

If he wants a proper assessment, he needs to provide half decent photos that show the current state of his head.

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Hi. Was there any talk from you first paid deposit to when you first met the doc mentioning any reasons you are not a good candidate or was the doctor hesitant to proceed? Do you know at what densities you were told the frafts were placed for the front? Did you give an idea based on other patients on how you wanted your goal/restoration to be?

 

The reference of five years being too long does not make sense. Is that telling other patients hey in 5 years you can have issues and end up without a proper transplant that has failed? If grafts were put into one specific region then that region should have adequate coverage 5 years or not.

 

This should make many prospective patients reconsider hair transplantation.

 

Lets be honest. Your front clearly has a see through effect. You can try to comb hair forward in ceasar style but your hairstyle shouldnt be restricted based on such a large procedure. Your hair should be similar to those that had 5000 graft surgeries in similar zones. Have you tried applying toppikk or nanogen in the meantime to add artificial density?

 

I think majority of forum users that answered thus far have accepted that this is a result in need of further repair going forward. People need to stop screwing with patients and results and say it how it is and this is exactly why FTC needs(is) to monitor the industry. If the doc offerred repair surgery it is evident he knows a repair was needed in the first place.

 

I hope you get the outcome you are looking for. As for any refund, i doubt you will get anything of such in this industry. Most refunds are pushed via followup repair procedures. Most doctors on forums do not believe in refunds it seems. Whether ot is surgery 1 year ago or 5 years ago.

 

Some patients were reimbursed for travel were some arent. I guess you are one that may have to pay your own ticket expenses. Another good reason to pay premium pricing and travel out of area for a procedure. A $1-2 per graft in europe and turkey and if something screws up you dont have to worry about 4 times the cost as much.

 

Good luck man. I wish you the best.

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