My journey at HLC (Ankara). 3100 grafts

[EvansLawrence]

20 minutes ago, massman said:

Have you sent your pictures to the clinic yet? Any response from them?

Yes! So we agreed on waiting till february (12th month mark). So far Im now on month 11 and no improvement so I know how this will be next month but I understand is a burocratic procedure. They have seen pics, offered a free touch up altough they know I dont feel condident enough going there again. So lets see how we can resolve this 😊. 

[massman]

45 minutes ago, EvansLawrence said:

Yes! So we agreed on waiting till february (12th month mark). So far Im now on month 11 and no improvement so I know how this will be next month but I understand is a burocratic procedure. They have seen pics, offered a free touch up altough they know I dont feel condident enough going there again. So lets see how we can resolve this 😊. 

Agree I don't think 1 month will make a difference but procedure is procedure! A free touch up is good service and the right thing to do. Appreciate your concerns though, have you brought up the topic of a refund instead?

[EvansLawrence]

Just now, massman said:

Agree I don't think 1 month will make a difference but procedure is procedure! A free touch up is good service and the right thing to do. Appreciate your concerns though, have you brought up the topic of a refund instead?

I did bring to them yeah. They didnt say no, didnt say yes. We agreed to wait. Personally I dont think they'll refund anything. Still i wont go even if they give free touch up. Cause my donnor is limited. 

[massman]

5 minutes ago, EvansLawrence said:

I did bring to them yeah. They didnt say no, didnt say yes. We agreed to wait. Personally I dont think they'll refund anything. Still i wont go even if they give free touch up. Cause my donnor is limited. 

Actually I think the fact they didn't say no is a good sign more than anything. It's obviously the least desired option from the clinic's perspective but the fact they haven't ruled it out suggests it's something they may be open to. The only difficult question with a refund is, how much should it be? What will you ask for, 50%?

[EvansLawrence]

Just now, massman said:

Actually I think the fact they didn't say no is a good sign more than anything. It's obviously the least desired option from the clinic's perspective but the fact they haven't ruled it out suggests it's something they may be open to. The only difficult question with a refund is, how much should it be? What will you ask for, 50%?

Yeah. 50% i think its fair. Asking more would be too much (Im better than before after all). But survival is not the best and the donnor is already touched and could have been treated better. 

[spacemanspiff]

Please keep us updated, I have my HT scheduled with HLC for next month.

Looking at your before and current photos, my only thought is that the hairline looks good but the temples are a bit thin still. You also have styled it in a way that makes it looks quite bad. Perhaps the density isnt what you expected? I dunno

Edited January 19, 2022 by spacemanspiff

[EvansLawrence]

On 1/19/2022 at 11:27 AM, spacemanspiff said:

 

 

Edited January 24, 2022 by EvansLawrence

[EvansLawrence]

Month 11 and a half

No improvement since last 5 months. I have accepted there wont be any improvement now. I want to show the poor density from all angles.

Next week/ 2 weeks I have my call with HLC. 

About my repair: I was about to do it on January with Dra. Cotellesa. We moved it to August cause in some areas there is still miniaturization (specially the middle part of my head, where HLC didnt touch yet, not much on implanted area) so in order to save some grafts I continue now with oral minoxidil, ketoconazol champoo and medebiotin forte so I can improve that (ofc I continue with finasteride as well). Acording to her about 1000 grafts would be needed to redensify the current implanted area. Lowering my hairline/temples is not recomended since donnor is already touched and would demand more grafts. Still I hope we can do something.

Sometimes at certain lighting where I dont see my lack of density (as in some previous pics, month 6 for example) I feel good cause looks like not big deal but then if hair is wet, light changes... I get back to reallity. I really wish I could have ended up as some of those cases they publish on their webside/ youtube. But I wont spend more time now regreting.

After my call next month with HLC I will post here what solution/ compensation they gave, if any, and forget about this procedure and focus myself on my current treatment, my life and next surgery.

 

Cheers

 

Edited January 25, 2022 by EvansLawrence

[JDEE0]

Any chance you could just post some pictures of your hair combed completely back both wet and dry? Don't get me wrong, if you're not happy with the outcome, then I understand why you're going for a second HT and I'm not trying to call you out or say you shouldn't feel the way you do. But, it does seem to me that most of the photos you have posted have some sort of downlight above your head, your hair doesn't seem to be particularly styled either (you seem to go more for the more natural messy textured look) or you're just spreading the hair to show the weaknesses.

My point is that I don't think many hair transplants are going to provide fullness in these conditions - the hair is somewhat going in different directions and angles due to the messier style you have as it allows it to flop around and not all be layered together, if that makes sense, and once you add some downlighting into the mix, light is going to bounce off and show scalp.

Your 8 month update on page 4 for example doesn't seem to have any downlight and your hair looks solid and I see no scalp or density issues in those pics as a result. I would imagine in this style and just being outdoors or anywhere not directly under a light, it looks completely normal? Really I'm just wondering how it looks in say normal light stood by your window or something just combed back.

[EvansLawrence]

On 1/25/2022 at 1:34 PM, JDEE0 said:

 

 

Edited January 26, 2022 by EvansLawrence

[EvansLawrence]

On 1/25/2022 at 1:34 PM, JDEE0 said:

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 26, 2022 by EvansLawrence

[bloodhound]

On 1/25/2022 at 4:09 AM, EvansLawrence said:

Month 11 and a half

No improvement since last 5 months. I have accepted there wont be any improvement now. I want to show the poor density from all angles.

Next week/ 2 weeks I have my call with HLC. 

About my repair: I was about to do it on January with Dra. Cotellesa. We moved it to August cause in some areas there is still miniaturization (specially the middle part of my head, where HLC didnt touch yet, not much on implanted area) so in order to save some grafts I continue now with oral minoxidil, ketoconazol champoo and medebiotin forte so I can improve that (ofc I continue with finasteride as well). Acording to her about 1000 grafts would be needed to redensify the current implanted area. Lowering my hairline/temples is not recomended since donnor is already touched and would demand more grafts. Still I hope we can do something.

Sometimes at certain lighting where I dont see my lack of density (as in some previous pics, month 6 for example) I feel good cause looks like not big deal but then if hair is wet, light changes... I get back to reallity. I really wish I could have ended up as some of those cases they publish on their webside/ youtube. But I wont spend more time now regreting.

After my call next month with HLC I will post here what solution/ compensation they gave, if any, and forget about this procedure and focus myself on my current treatment, my life and next surgery.

 

Cheers

 

Still in the same boat as you. 10 months in and no improvement from month 6. Saw a Dermatologist and recently contacted the Clinic with my concerns. We’ll see where we go from here, hope you’re doing good mentally 

[EvansLawrence]

2 hours ago, bloodhound said:

Still in the same boat as you. 10 months in and no improvement from month 6. Saw a Dermatologist and recently contacted the Clinic with my concerns. We’ll see where we go from here, hope you’re doing good mentally 

Thanks for the update and the good wishes. Well Im not doing terrible but Im not in my best either.

I saw my new hair surgeon in Spain, who is also a trychologist and she told me that at least there is not noticeable infection/bad condition on the scalp. Just a not very good procedure. She would need 1000 grafts to redensify all the area, acording to her words.

My only hope is they asume responsabilities and compensate for it. Im scared they just behave as any ordinary low cost clinic om Turkey. I believe they are more professional but lets see. I contacted them again and they said maybe next week we have a videocall. If they were just a regular clinic maybe they wouldnt even reply, right?. I dont know. Lets see what happens.

How are you doing mentally??

Edited February 5, 2022 by EvansLawrence

[bloodhound]

On 2/5/2022 at 3:49 AM, EvansLawrence said:

Thanks for the update and the good wishes. Well Im not doing terrible but Im not in my best either.

I saw my new hair surgeon in Spain, who is also a trychologist and she told me that at least there is not noticeable infection/bad condition on the scalp. Just a not very good procedure. She would need 1000 grafts to redensify all the area, acording to her words.

My only hope is they asume responsabilities and compensate for it. Im scared they just behave as any ordinary low cost clinic om Turkey. I believe they are more professional but lets see. I contacted them again and they said maybe next week we have a videocall. If they were just a regular clinic maybe they wouldnt even reply, right?. I dont know. Lets see what happens.

How are you doing mentally??

Dang 1000 grafts is a lot. I know that has to be mentally taxing but if it’s what needs to be done try to turn your brain off and not think about it. Just put as much effort into preventing further loss so you can minimize the need for future transplants.

If the trichologist says it wasn’t a good operation I wonder how others have came out of the same clinic we did with superb results. I don’t know what the correct answer is.. 

I do think if they didn’t want to help they wouldn’t respond or would find a way to make it your fault. I myself reached out a week ago with pictures but haven’t gotten a response yet. Can you tell me how long it took for you to get a response?

I’m mentally exhausted because I thought this would be the answer to my issues, the money spent, time waited etc.. I want to live my life again.

Good wishes man 

 

[spacemanspiff]

On 1/25/2022 at 3:34 PM, JDEE0 said:

Any chance you could just post some pictures of your hair combed completely back both wet and dry? Don't get me wrong, if you're not happy with the outcome, then I understand why you're going for a second HT and I'm not trying to call you out or say you shouldn't feel the way you do. But, it does seem to me that most of the photos you have posted have some sort of downlight above your head, your hair doesn't seem to be particularly styled either (you seem to go more for the more natural messy textured look) or you're just spreading the hair to show the weaknesses.

My point is that I don't think many hair transplants are going to provide fullness in these conditions - the hair is somewhat going in different directions and angles due to the messier style you have as it allows it to flop around and not all be layered together, if that makes sense, and once you add some downlighting into the mix, light is going to bounce off and show scalp.

Your 8 month update on page 4 for example doesn't seem to have any downlight and your hair looks solid and I see no scalp or density issues in those pics as a result. I would imagine in this style and just being outdoors or anywhere not directly under a light, it looks completely normal? Really I'm just wondering how it looks in say normal light stood by your window or something just combed back.

This is a great point, which I agree with. Your beginning photos of your temples show the clear bald spots. After that your photos are super hard to tell if you have a new hairline at the temples and how it actually looks. The only ones that give a decent idea are those recent photos of you on the airplane and i can see a clear hairline where there was none. Your hairstyle doesnt seem to lend a clear idea of your hairline. Trying combing it backwards so we can see it a bit.

Regardless you need to be happy and I am very curious what the response from HLC is. I am going to HLC very soon and would hope for a good response from them.

[Melvin- Admin]

It’s hard to judge the results based on these pictures. The picture angles are not good, the hair is combed apart in the better angles. I suggest taking proper photos straightforward eye level, both sides, and top down. Refunds are not a thing in this industry, as a refund would be a guarantee of results, which no ethical clinic does. Do you have better before pictures?

Based on what I see, it looks successful, but again, based on these poor before and afters. Better quality photos would build a stronger case. 

[MachoVato]

It's totally acceptable to be unhappy with your results. It looks like a spot didn't come in very dense, I see that. I'd be surprised if HLC didn't offer a top up for free, as many clinics would do.

I'm still stuck on the trichologist thing. In the US, they are not doctors and aren't even allowed to prescribe medicine, much less perform surgery. Dermatologists are doctors, but not trichologists.

[SD1984]

Any update? I think the donor looks fine and is normal. How close the extractions are all depend on how wide your donor range is amongst other factors. You also have the thing shaved down to nearly a zero there. Has there been any update on whether or not you will be getting a free touch up or are you going to push for a refund?

[Vann]

A few questions for some individuals.

@spacemanspiffHow was your procedure? Did you go through with HLC? Did you have a write up post?

@bloodhound Did you get a response back from HLC about any of the issues you had? 

@EvansLawrence Did you get a response back from HLC? Also, you stated that its not your fault if a clinic doesnt tell you to take finasteride before getting a hair transplant. I am not sure thats the case with most places. I cant speak for all but its your own due diligence to finding out what you need to get done prior to ANY surgery. I personally think the reason for this is permanent shock loss to your native hair. I read that a main purpose of taking finasteride is not only to help hair loss but to minimize the damage done to the pre-existing native hairs (when transplanting hair-- nearby). There are plenty of doctors who talk about this and the importance of taking finasteride for at least 1 year Iminimum) with an average of 3-7mgs weekly. Its hard to say your follicles died due to blood supply competition (necrosis) because the images you provided showed some pretty good indicators that it wasnt. But I am not a trained doctor (or doctor at all) so, i honestly cannot tell you why you have a loss of hair in one area. But what i can say is that I think your transplant looks great. Like Melvin and some others saying... it will never be about having 100 cm2 density. Its an illusion to take you from 0 to 50 at least or from 0 to something that isnt 0. The images you have taken show the worst it can possibly look like but not what it would look like if you went about your day normally. I am sure if you are that bothered by it you would have some type of style to avoid the way it looks? Could you provide one of those photos?

[bloodhound]

1 hour ago, Vann said:

A few questions for some individuals.

@spacemanspiffHow was your procedure? Did you go through with HLC? Did you have a write up post?

@bloodhound Did you get a response back from HLC about any of the issues you had? 

@EvansLawrence Did you get a response back from HLC? Also, you stated that its not your fault if a clinic doesnt tell you to take finasteride before getting a hair transplant. I am not sure thats the case with most places. I cant speak for all but its your own due diligence to finding out what you need to get done prior to ANY surgery. I personally think the reason for this is permanent shock loss to your native hair. I read that a main purpose of taking finasteride is not only to help hair loss but to minimize the damage done to the pre-existing native hairs (when transplanting hair-- nearby). There are plenty of doctors who talk about this and the importance of taking finasteride for at least 1 year Iminimum) with an average of 3-7mgs weekly. Its hard to say your follicles died due to blood supply competition (necrosis) because the images you provided showed some pretty good indicators that it wasnt. But I am not a trained doctor (or doctor at all) so, i honestly cannot tell you why you have a loss of hair in one area. But what i can say is that I think your transplant looks great. Like Melvin and some others saying... it will never be about having 100 cm2 density. Its an illusion to take you from 0 to 50 at least or from 0 to something that isnt 0. The images you have taken show the worst it can possibly look like but not what it would look like if you went about your day normally. I am sure if you are that bothered by it you would have some type of style to avoid the way it looks? Could you provide one of those photos?

Yes they offered me a free touch up 

[Gramatik]

On 1/25/2022 at 2:09 PM, EvansLawrence said:

Month 11 and a half

No improvement since last 5 months. I have accepted there wont be any improvement now. I want to show the poor density from all angles.

Next week/ 2 weeks I have my call with HLC. 

About my repair: I was about to do it on January with Dra. Cotellesa. We moved it to August cause in some areas there is still miniaturization (specially the middle part of my head, where HLC didnt touch yet, not much on implanted area) so in order to save some grafts I continue now with oral minoxidil, ketoconazol champoo and medebiotin forte so I can improve that (ofc I continue with finasteride as well). Acording to her about 1000 grafts would be needed to redensify the current implanted area. Lowering my hairline/temples is not recomended since donnor is already touched and would demand more grafts. Still I hope we can do something.

Sometimes at certain lighting where I dont see my lack of density (as in some previous pics, month 6 for example) I feel good cause looks like not big deal but then if hair is wet, light changes... I get back to reallity. I really wish I could have ended up as some of those cases they publish on their webside/ youtube. But I wont spend more time now regreting.

After my call next month with HLC I will post here what solution/ compensation they gave, if any, and forget about this procedure and focus myself on my current treatment, my life and next surgery.

 

Cheers

 

You should comb your hair in a normal way and take good photos in normal angles, sides, top, front. So we could judge your result better. HLC is a top clinic, it would offer a small touch up if needed.

[Joe2432]

On 12/16/2021 at 3:50 PM, EvansLawrence said:

Cotellessa will be for 2000 grafts 3800€. If more then 5000€ up to 3500 grafts. 

And I believe that HLC should refund maybe not the total, the 8000€, but at least about 5000€. More than half. Not only cause the survival was poor. But also cause they have wasted my limited grafts and the donnor could have been treated better.  I dont know if HLC does refunds but Im 100% sure they dont give me confidence for a reparation with them, even if free. Cause I dont care about other cases, I care about mine.

I was wondering how you came across Dr. Cotellessa and do you trust her work?  I came across her as well and she seems like a great doctor.  This industry is more new to me and it seems as if she isn't as popular as other doctors yet, so I just wanted to hear your input.

 

Thanks  

[EvansLawrence]

Update: i had on the 25th of February a phone call with Engin (HLC patient coordinator) and sent him the pics. We agreed on waiting for the managers to check the pics but I told him already that I want partial reinbursment. 

He mentiom about me "saying lies about the clinic on social media" which is not truth. I have a spanish friend who goes by mesiasss4 on youtube and we shared by our point of view my process on HLC. Sharing your opinion on youtube or here is just part of our rights and freedom. As long as I dont lie everything is ok, cause you can agree or disagree just as people agree with me here and others dont. And its just fine. 

3 weeks later I still wait for my answer. Havent received any message yet and honestly this looks just like they are forgetting about me.

I upload a pic of me at month 12th. End of recovery. Final result. You guys tell if this is acceptable at 2.5€/graft. And a total of 3157 grafts.

 

[bloodhound]

On 3/16/2022 at 6:33 AM, EvansLawrence said:

Update: i had on the 25th of February a phone call with Engin (HLC patient coordinator) and sent him the pics. We agreed on waiting for the managers to check the pics but I told him already that I want partial reinbursment. 

He mentiom about me "saying lies about the clinic on social media" which is not truth. I have a spanish friend who goes by mesiasss4 on youtube and we shared by our point of view my process on HLC. Sharing your opinion on youtube or here is just part of our rights and freedom. As long as I dont lie everything is ok, cause you can agree or disagree just as people agree with me here and others dont. And its just fine. 

3 weeks later I still wait for my answer. Havent received any message yet and honestly this looks just like they are forgetting about me.

I upload a pic of me at month 12th. End of recovery. Final result. You guys tell if this is acceptable at 2.5€/graft. And a total of 3157 grafts.

 

They offered me a free touch up and I am still thinking about what I will do. I agree this isn’t the ideal outcome despite some members here saying it’s due to how you comb your hair lol. At least 12 months is up and you can get another one hopefully. 

Edited March 21, 2022 by bloodhound

[JoeMan]

Honestly I'd consider a touch up with HLC. Although they might not be your favorite now, they have every reason to get this right now. Looks like you won't require much to fix the spots of low density. 

I think you really want to lower your hairline but I think it looks fine. Are your results perfect? No.

Can HLC make good on this? Probably. 

I highly doubt that they will refund anything, especially 50%. I'd be shocked if they offer any money considering it looks decent.

Either way, I wish you luck and please keep us posted on what happens. Thanks for sharing 👍