Dr Diep FUE 1356 Grafts on Temples (NW2/3) [2-12-2020]

[Tentpole91]

Totally TB. My understanding is that you can wear your hair a little bit shorter with the FUE procedure, because while there are more scars, they are less noticeable than the lien. Definitely worth doing your research though.

[Tbcruz]

You are correct. 

[Tentpole91]

Hey all, Day 8 here. One thing I'm noticing is that some gaps are developing in the transplanted area:

Day 1:

Day 8:

The part i'm worried about:

I'm not super familiar with the shedding process or how the grafts develop. I've looked at a couple threads to this effect but would appreciate if anyone with first hand experience could weigh in on this and let me know if it is something to be worried about. 

[Melvin- Admin]

Video incoming, you got nothing to worry about mine was the same. 

[Tentpole91]

Thanks Melvin. I'm now at day 19 post surgery. The recipient area is shedding as expected, with nothing major to report there. My primary concern at this point is actually with the donor: it's growing in with a somewhat patchy appearance. 

This continues onto the right side, where there's a pretty clear line between donor and non-donor:

Question for you all on the forum: Is there a recovery time for the donor area? Or is this the level of density that I should expect in the donor going forward? Reading the forums there is a clear recovery time for recipient area. It's less clear to me whether there is one for the donor.

[Melvin- Admin]

The donor can take a few months to recover, there’s a great example on @FUEblonde1985 thread. He recently posted a donor pic and it looks way better. 

[Tentpole91]

Hey all, one month update here. Posing on mobile so not sure how the photos will render. Main thing I’m noticing is that the left side (first pic) has a lot more thinning towards the front than the right side (second pic). I have read that hair falling out is part of the process so nothing super concerning yet. 

If anyone has specific questions, happy to answer them. 
 

[Melvin- Admin]

Some sides shed quicker, don’t be surprised if the side that sheds quicker, grows quicker as well. That was my experience.

[MrAr]

@Tentpole91 that looks pretty good compared to others I seen . At 4-6 weeks some people’s grafts come completely off then come back at 10 weeks or so ..(based of testimonials) anyway s looking good man . And thanx for stopping in over at my thread . Cheers

[Noodles123]

I had a transplant by Diep years ago, and while the result was good for the amount of grafts placed I always had one gripe.   I REALLY did not like the placement of the grafts in straight lines like a cornfield.   For one, it causes wider gaps and a more see-through appearance that I've noted in my own transplants and others who have gone to him.   If he staggered the grafts it would cover more gaps and give the appearance of greater density.  

After all these years, he is apparently still using the same placement style.  I suspect that this is done to make the process quicker for himself in making the incisions and for his staff in placing the grafts.   

Again, I'm happy overall with my transplant, but this has always been an issue with him that I've noticed. 

Edited March 30, 2020 by Noodles123

[Tentpole91]

Thanks for the post Noodles. I guess we will have to see how that plays out for me. Are there any photos you would be willing to post, or that you could direct me to, with examples of what you are talking about?

Also, do we have any doctors here who would be able to chime in on this strategy of graft placement, and how it compares to others? 

[Melvin- Admin]

1 hour ago, Tentpole91 said:

Thanks for the post Noodles. I guess we will have to see how that plays out for me. Are there any photos you would be willing to post, or that you could direct me to, with examples of what you are talking about?

Also, do we have any doctors here who would be able to chime in on this strategy of graft placement, and how it compares to others? 

I'd be interested to see photos as well. I haven't seen any photographic evidence. 

@Noodles123 The community would appreciate some photos, so we can see what you're talking about.

[Noodles123]

Look at the placement of the grafts.... They are in straight lines, back to back.   You can clearly see how the grafts are not staggered and they are placed in straight lines.   From a distance it looks fine, but there are clearly gaps and less appearance of density from this kind of placement.   

 

Edited March 30, 2020 by Noodles123

[Melvin- Admin]

11 minutes ago, Noodles123 said:

Look at the placement of the grafts.... They are in straight lines, back to back.   You can clearly see how the grafts are not staggered and they are placed in straight lines.   From a distance it looks fine, but there are clearly gaps and less appearance of density from this kind of placement.   

 

I can't say I see anything wrong with these pictures. Maybe it looked different when the hairs grew out? 

[Tentpole91]

Yeah @Noodles123 if you could post a current-day photo illustrating the see-through nature, that would be awesome. 

@Melvin-Moderator I’m starting to see a couple trends pop up around the way Dr. Diep approaches his Hair Transplants. Mainly:

• Larger punch size than other surgeons in his $$$ price range ($10/graft)
• Uneven FUE extraction from the donor, increasing the risk of over-harvesting for smaller transplants (<1500 grafts)
• Unnaturally straight rows for the implanted grafts, which you can see from my photos earlier in the thread (though whether this is a bad thing is definitely up for discussion)

At the same time, he delivers some stellar results on the site and is generally seen as a “safe” bet due to the sheer number of unbiased write-ups available online. I understand that each doctor has their own techniques, and each technique has its own pros and cons. Larger punch size = higher rate of graft survival. Uneven FUE extraction = more untouched donor down the line. Unnaturally straight rows = something, but I’m not sure what. 

Ultimately we all consider a bunch of factors, make a decision, then hope for the best. And I am hopeful that in both my and Dadda’s cases, we have awesome results. But at some point, I think it’s worth figuring out whether there’s a pattern here. One possible set of explanations:

• Larger punch size is easier than smaller punch size, but a more dedicated surgeon could make lower punch size work, maximizing graft survival and minimizing impact on the donor
• Localized FUE extraction is easier to do than extraction in an even pattern across the donor area. You only have to shave one area, and you go line by line until you have enough grafts. 
• Unnaturally straight rows are easier to implant than more staggered edges

Again, this is just one possible explanation, and I’m not a doctor. But an easy story to tell here is that Dr. Diep just has a slightly lower quality bar than other top surgeons, while still managing to produce home-run results because of his expertise in other areas (hairline design, graft survival rate, etc). At the end of the day, he has a formula, it produces good results, and his waiting list is 6 months long. So from his perspective, why should he mess with the formula? 

Edited March 31, 2020 by Tentpole91

[Melvin- Admin]

8 minutes ago, Tentpole91 said:

Yeah @Noodles123 if you could post a current-day photo illustrating the see-through nature, that would be awesome. 

@Melvin-Moderator I’m starting to see a couple trends pop up around the way Dr. Diep approaches his Hair Transplants. Mainly:

• Larger punch size than other surgeons in his $$$ price range ($10/graft)
• Uneven FUE extraction from the donor, increasing the risk of over-harvesting for smaller transplants (<1500 grafts)
• Unnaturally straight rows for the implanted grafts, which you can see from my photos earlier in the thread (though whether this is a bad thing is definitely up for discussion)

At the same time, he delivers some stellar results on the site and is generally seen as a “safe” bet due to the sheer number of unbiased write-ups available online. I understand that each doctor has their own techniques, and each technique has its own pros and cons. Larger punch size = higher rate of graft survival. Uneven FUE extraction = more untouched donor down the line. Unnaturally straight rows = something, but I’m not sure what. 

Ultimately we all consider a bunch of factors, make a decision, then hope for the best. And I am hopeful that in both my and Dadda’s cases, we have awesome results. But at some point, I think it’s worth figuring out whether there’s a pattern here. One possible set of explanations:

• Larger punch size is easier than smaller punch size, but a more dedicated surgeon could make lower punch size work, maximizing graft survival and minimizing impact on the donor
• Localized FUE extraction is easier to do than extraction in an even pattern across the donor area. You only have to shave one area, and you go line by line until you have enough grafts. 
• Unnaturally straight rows are easier to implant than more staggered edges

Again, this is just one possible explanation, and I’m not a doctor. But an easy story to tell here is that Dr. Diep just has a slightly lower quality bar than other top surgeons, while still managing to produce home-run results because of his expertise in other areas (hairline design, graft survival rate, etc). At the end of the day, he has a formula, it produces good results, and his waiting list is 6 months long. So from his perspective, why should he mess with the formula? 

In the entire body of work, I don't think I would consider him lower quality. I don't see any proof of this straight patterns. Maybe he will share a photo of what he's talking about, but I haven't seen any issues with the overall outcome. Now, in terms of larger punches and extracting from one side of the donor, the information is out there, if you want a surgeon who uses a small punch, then definitely choose a different surgeon, however, I haven't seen many doctors who consistently put out high quality results every week, or the same number of patient reviews. In the end, it's all about results. I have seen dozens of surgeons work, and hundreds of real patient reviews, and I can safely say that Dr. Diep, is at the very top, so much that I have personally referred one of my best friends to him. He is now about 9 months and his results are stellar. 

[Abi28]

Melvin and Diep better love story than twilight 😍

[Tentpole91]

@Melvin-Moderator that’s good to know. I think it’s possible to simultaneously hold that he is a great surgeon but also that he takes some shortcuts compared to others who charge $10/graft.

And that’s my point — compared to the whole population of surgeons, he is likely top tier. But compared to the others who charge top dollar, he’s a bit of an outlier in terms of his approach.  

Regarding the straight lines: there have been two people on this thread who have commented on how the grafts are placed in straight lines. One of whom had surgery with Dr. Diep prior and called this out as an issue. So yeah: no proof yet that it gives sub-par results, but another thing to note I suppose. 

Edited March 31, 2020 by Tentpole91

[Noodles123]

1 hour ago, Tentpole91 said:

@Melvin-Moderator that’s good to know. I think it’s possible to simultaneously hold that he is a great surgeon but also that he takes some shortcuts compared to others who charge $10/graft.

And that’s my point — compared to the whole population of surgeons, he is likely top tier. But compared to the others who charge top dollar, he’s a bit of an outlier in terms of his approach.  

Regarding the straight lines: there have been two people on this thread who have commented on how the grafts are placed in straight lines. One of whom had surgery with Dr. Diep prior and called this out as an issue. So yeah: no proof yet that it gives sub-par results, but another thing to note I suppose. 

Completely agree with your assessment.   To be clear, my result was decent, but not spectacular.   Pretty much all the grafts grew in, so you can be assured that your transplant will be successful.  That  said, do I think Diep is in the same league as a Rahal or H&W?  No.   His level of artistry is just not quite at that level.  Do I think he is in the 90% percentile in terms of results?  Yes.  That said, he doesn't offer the same meticulous attention to detail as the Rahals, H&W, and Koniors of the world.   I think that's a fair statement.  

No shade to Diep at all.

So the main takeaway if you go to Diep?  You're gonna get a good result and you can be assured most of your grafts will survive.   But also be aware that the extraction pattern might leave patchy areas in the donor zone.   

My friend went to Rahal as a pretty advanced Norwood 4/5 and his hairline is absolutely STUNNING.   After seeing his hairline, I was just floored by how artistic and dense packed it was.  

While my transplant grew in fine, I still have some issues with it.  I experienced the same things Tentpole91 enumerated above.  He harvested all the grafts from a small area on the back of my head, so that area looks noticeably thinner and frankly obvious with a 3 guard and below.   And I've already mentioned the straight line graft placement, which is very obvious from my photos.  Not sure where the confusion is. 

I will say that at a social distance, the rows of hair grafts are not noticeable, but I have caught a few people doing double takes of my hairline when they are a bit closer.   

I've attached a pic of how my hairline looks today with no concealors.  My hairline was lowered about 3/4 inch because I had a large forehead.  The density from the beginning was always pretty thin.   And you can see that the gaps in the initial graft placement made the hairline look sparse.   I was about a Norword 3 and had about 1500 grafts placed to lower the hairline.   So that whole area never had any hair to begin with.    

Also attached a pic of my donor.  You can clearly see the thinned out area in the shape of a rectangle on the back of my head.  These pics are all recent. 

 

 

 

Edited March 31, 2020 by Noodles123

[LonelyGraft]

3 hours ago, Tentpole91 said:

Yeah @Noodles123 if you could post a current-day photo illustrating the see-through nature, that would be awesome. 

@Melvin-Moderator I’m starting to see a couple trends pop up around the way Dr. Diep approaches his Hair Transplants. Mainly:

• Larger punch size than other surgeons in his $$$ price range ($10/graft)
• Uneven FUE extraction from the donor, increasing the risk of over-harvesting for smaller transplants (<1500 grafts)
• Unnaturally straight rows for the implanted grafts, which you can see from my photos earlier in the thread (though whether this is a bad thing is definitely up for discussion)

At the same time, he delivers some stellar results on the site and is generally seen as a “safe” bet due to the sheer number of unbiased write-ups available online. I understand that each doctor has their own techniques, and each technique has its own pros and cons. Larger punch size = higher rate of graft survival. Uneven FUE extraction = more untouched donor down the line. Unnaturally straight rows = something, but I’m not sure what. 

Ultimately we all consider a bunch of factors, make a decision, then hope for the best. And I am hopeful that in both my and Dadda’s cases, we have awesome results. But at some point, I think it’s worth figuring out whether there’s a pattern here. One possible set of explanations:

• Larger punch size is easier than smaller punch size, but a more dedicated surgeon could make lower punch size work, maximizing graft survival and minimizing impact on the donor
• Localized FUE extraction is easier to do than extraction in an even pattern across the donor area. You only have to shave one area, and you go line by line until you have enough grafts. 
• Unnaturally straight rows are easier to implant than more staggered edges

Again, this is just one possible explanation, and I’m not a doctor. But an easy story to tell here is that Dr. Diep just has a slightly lower quality bar than other top surgeons, while still managing to produce home-run results because of his expertise in other areas (hairline design, graft survival rate, etc). At the end of the day, he has a formula, it produces good results, and his waiting list is 6 months long. So from his perspective, why should he mess with the formula? 

Diep charges $10 per graft? Whatttt

[Tentpole91]

@Noodles123 Thank you for the photos and for the detailed response. The patch on the donor is pretty obvious, which honestly isn't a great signal in terms of Diep's approach. 1500 grafts shouldn't leave you looking like that. 

 

I'm still not really seeing what's wrong with your hairline, though, other than a lack of density. That's not necessarily something I would attribute to the placement of the grafts, though. 

[MrAr]

@Tentpole91 have any progress pics?? Eager see how it’s looking .

[Tentpole91]

Honestly there is really nothing to report right now. I have some light hairs growing in but I’m only at 2 months 1 week out from surgery. I expect to provide an update around the 3 month mark. 
 

Right now, the main thing I am watching is the donor area and whether the shock loss grows back. Not sure what the timeline is for that piece. 

[HTHope]

On 4/20/2020 at 1:33 AM, Tentpole91 said:

Honestly there is really nothing to report right now. I have some light hairs growing in but I’m only at 2 months 1 week out from surgery. I expect to provide an update around the 3 month mark. 
 

Right now, the main thing I am watching is the donor area and whether the shock loss grows back. Not sure what the timeline is for that piece. 

I saw your post in another thread where you mentioned your donor area and not going below a 4. Do you have pictures showing the status of the donor?

[MrAr]

Update pics?