Can I have a Transplant ?

[Dutchie]

Wouldn't going to deep risk transecting the whole graft?

Yeah, good point.

 

But I'm pretty sure the dermal papilla lies about 5mm deep, so I'm not sure you could go that far

[Rashid36]

I still don't know what I should do but I'm been more safe by not doing the transplant.

Even if I did risk it or gave it a go then there is the costs to think about as well as touch ups and further treatments and like others have said travel etc.

 

I'm thinking of having Smp treatment done to fill in the crown and thinning areas.

Don't know if i should go for the hairline re-create as that would require me to shave regularly and have that stubble look.

 

One clinic told me they could use the derma roller to put the Smp on and work with my current hair length ( i keep the sides and back at number 1 to 2 on a hair clipper and trim top hair).

 

What do you think about this for my hair loss ?

[JON86]

You are being smart by being safe Rashid. I am not saying all hope is lost for you as far as transplanting but smp might be a good option for you to consider. Just make sure to research the smp clinics . You could try temporary smp to see if you like how it looks. If it doesn't look good the ink will fade and could be discontinued. I have read quite a bit to never go for permanent smp as the ink tends to turn into a blueish color when it is permanent.

[delancey]

In my opinion, SMP is better used as a filler rather than a stand alone option. Some representatives and forum visitors have had successful outcomes, but just like body hair, it should be used as a filler, that little extra to give the illusion of more density. Should you go this route, make sure that you do your due diligence and find one of the best clinics in the world to do your procedure. And make sure that it's temporary SMP, as mentioned by Jon86 above.

 

With that said, my advise to you is to do nothing at all unless you can really ratchet down your expectations significantly. Are the odds in your favor that a transplant performed today will look good in 20 years from now? You've got a huge area of hair loss, a severely limited donor zone, with average characteristics. Clinics have already turned you down; these clinics are being very honest with you.

 

If I were you, this is what I would be considering right now:

 

a) Buzz cut. Wear a buzz cut for one month to see how you like it.

b) A hair system.

c) Do nothing at all.

 

I hope it all works out well for you.

[Rashid36]

Finding the right place for smp is one thing then knowing if i could have it done as a filler is another i mean i dont know any reliable place where i can go.

If it is temporary does that mean it will leave the scalp completely?

The last thing i would want is patches of ink even if faded.

 

What about harins case he had the same amount if not more hair loss ?

 

a) I've tried shave and buzz cut it did not suit me at all

 

b) Take a look at some recent pictures without a flash and at normal height with room light on. I don't think i could wear a hair system ontop (3 days growth on sides and back cut by trimmer clip no2) Also i just could not i mean my life style would not allow me too and i would get more bother from people around. I still have some hair on top of head looks less in pictures

 

c) Thats what i've been doing nothing but in all truth i have to let you all know it's really bothering me probably more then if the hair transplant fail. I respect what the top doctors have told me but it's affecting me i dont feel good and i feel i look much older.

I thank you all for your opinion and advice but i got some money to do 1 procedure to start.

I don't know how much grafts give good coverage but i want to get the whole lot done.

I don't want to take medicine too don't mind using monxidil.

It's on my mind these days alot I've spent hours and hours reading up about hair loss and treatments i nearly got con but was saved i emailed doctors around the world got different opinions and advice come on this site alot too.

 

Now I'm thinking its bothering me this much and there are some doctors who are willing to do the treatment, i should do something about it ?

[harin]

Rashid

 

1. Looking at your pictures - my hair loss was definitely more than yours!.

2. You definitely seem to have more donor hairs than I did.

 

If it makes u feel any better I felt the same way like u did before.

 

Good luck with our decision.

[Melvin- Admin]

Rashid, these pictures are much better at providing a better idea of your current loss, I agree with Harin, his hairloss was more extensive then yours, in fact, your lateral humps are quite high, and they look strong also, you do have the retro alopecia which is visible around the ears and nape, but aside from that the loss is not Norwood 7, I think people need to realize retro alopecia does not equal Norwood 7. It does limit the amount of grafts that can be extracted, but typically surgeons do not extract from the nape or ears because it's not a safe zone, so regardless it doesn't really matter. What does matter are the lateral humps which I have outlined the area in which I see definite strength for you. This highlighted area is basically what separates a Norwood 6 to a 7, if this area is miniaturized then almost certainly means Norwood 7, this area does not appear miniaturized visually in your case.

 

[Rashid36]

Wow!

 

I've been thinking of the worst that could happen

 

1. I get to the doctor then they decide i'm not suitable.

 

2. If the grafts don't hold

 

3. With more hair loss i dont have enough donor to cover.

 

4. Hair turns white/grey which probly will happen later

 

5. I spend some thousand pounds but not get a good result

 

6. The doctors and others who said no say we told you

 

7. I get more problems with having to sort things out

 

The best that could happen

 

1. I have the first transplant the doctor does a great job and all goes well

 

2. I would be very happy right now i'm not

 

3. I have more than enough donor hair including beard hair to do further treatment when and if needed later on

 

4. Stop thinking so much about having the treatment or not

 

5. Gave it a go

 

6. All hair grows like harin case and i start to feel my age if not younger!

 

 

If anyone can add to this please do

Edited March 1, 2016 by Rashid35

[Dutchie]

You said you had limited funds, so this is what I would do if I were in your shoes:

 

- Find out from dr. Umar how much its all gonna cost to do a total 10,000 graft FUT/FUE/BHT hair restoration

- Go to the bank and take out a loan for $50,000 (or whatever it costs)

- Make 3 trips to L.A and get the whole thing done by dr. Umar

- And presto, you're done for life. No more worries.

 

For me it would be worth it. You only live once, you gotta go for it!!

[Rashid36]

Hair and beard, possible treatment plan ?

[gillenator]

The available donor zone is being acutely impeded with retro-alopecia and the grafts may not last as the retro thinning is progressively moving upward.

 

1500 grafts won't adequately cover the crown and it will get larger potentially leaving you with an island of thin hair with a ring around it.

 

If you must have the work done, focusing whatever grafts that can be used in the frontal zone would make the best sense IMHO and just leave the crown alone.

[Rashid36]

I was wondering how much 1500 grafts would cover of the crown ?

 

When i asked the clinic if that would be enough for my crown they said

 

' According to your head size it will be sufficient. If needed we can go for more 200-300 grafts.'

 

(they will use more beard hair for the crown area)

[Dutchie]

I was wondering how much 1500 would actually cover of the crown ?

 

When i asked the clinic if that would be enough for my crown they said

 

' According to your head size it will be sufficient. If needed we can go for more 200-300 grafts.'

 

They will use more beard hair for the crown area

Did Dr. Umar ever get back to you??

[Rashid36]

Yes,

 

Dear Mr Rashid,

 

 

Thank you for sending beard and body donor photos. See response to your inquiries below in blue:

 

 

I want the best result so would want the best option.

 

The best result would come from using the maximum number of grafts recommended. So a 10,000 grafts procedure would be better than a 5000 grafts procedure from the list of option provided to you (below). So go for option #4 9500-11000 grafts if you want the best possible result

 

 

However many clinics and doctors have ruled me out as not been a suitable candidate. Also they say I dont have enough donor area to cover for now and future loss. One clinic said they can only take 600 grafts from beard?

 

I provided you with several examples of patients with similar or even worse degree of hair loss that I have restored successfully in my email to you. I am the world's expert and perhaps the only clinic in the world with the skill, the specialized equipment (which are my inventions all patented) to consistently restore baldness like yours in a global coverage basis. So your consultation dialogue with any other clinic such as the one you have recounted would be irrelevant when you consult me. They most likely do not have the kind of expertise or equipment that I have nor do they have results like the ones shown to you in my previous email. Also, you can see on my website ~ 30 cases listed in 3 pages of successful restoration work done on NW6-7 patients in our clinic using my advanced UGraft system starting from as far back as 10 years ago. See the 3 pages here:

 

https://www.dermhairclinic.com/before-and-after-gallery/nw-6-7-before-and-after/

 

Our work has been featured in major peer reviewed medical journals and news outlets such as the New York Times, MSNBC, Good Morning America, etc

 

Let me know if you would like my office to assist you with the booking process and if you have any questions.

 

Best regards

 

S. Umar, MD,

 

Scalp FUE and Body Hair Transplantation

Inventor of the UGraft

www.dermhairclinic.com

 

 

FineTouch Dermatology Inc

DermHair Clinic

819 North Harbor Drive, Suite 400

Redondo Beach, California 90277

Tel (310) 318-1500 or 1877-DERMHAIR

Fax (310) 318-1590

[Melvin- Admin]

Rashid, can I ask what do you hope to accomplish with a transplant? are you looking to be fully restored no baldness at all?

[delancey]

Rashid has four things going against him:

 

1. His young age

2. Advanced hair loss

3. Poor donor zone

4. Retrograde alopecia.

 

 

 

YOLO works better when the odds are in your favor.

[Rashid36]

Rashid, can I ask what do you hope to accomplish with a transplant? are you looking to be fully restored no baldness at all?

 

 

I want front hair line back then mid scalp to cover thinning and the as much of the crown they can cover as possible

[Rashid36]

Rashid has four things going against him:

 

1. His young age

2. Advanced hair loss

3. Poor donor zone

4. Retrograde alopecia.

 

 

 

YOLO works better when the odds are in your favor.

 

What you say is the same as what Dr Lorenzo has said but,

 

1. I'm 35 years old and many have told me my hair loss maybe / seems to be stable, i don't know

2. I think i'm on norwood 5 so don't see how that is advanced but how much and how long further hairloss would be, i don't know

3. Some say i have low donor while others say they can get between 2000 to 4000 grafts with addition to beard hair, i don't know

4. Does Retrograde alopecia rule out ht, i don't know

There is even a difference on if meds would be of benefit to me or not!

(i'm using monoxidil)

Edited March 4, 2016 by Rashid35

[Melvin- Admin]

I want front hair line back then mid scalp to cover thinning and the as much of the crown they can cover as possible

 

I think you can have a successful procedure if you're realistic, I highly doubt you'll be able to get a good hairline with good density and be able to do your crown, I think the crown is something you'll have to leave as is, putting 1,000-1,500 grafts would be a waste of grafts in my opinion, it's better to utilize those grafts in the front and mid and lateral humps, if you have high expectations I don't think you'll end up happy. I posted a video from Dr. Lorenzo earlier in the thread of what I believe is an achievable result for you. Managing expectations I think is an absolute crucial part of any surgical procedure. To be frank, you'll never look like you're not balding even with a fantastic surgery, even I still have to create an illusion with my hair and my crown hasn't been touched, it's a reality I have comes to live with and be happy with, considering my age and level of hairloss it's just not feasible to really think I could ever fully restore my situation and have enough grafts for any future hairloss.

 

Retrograde alopecia does not automatically disqualify you from having a procedure, it does however limit the amount of grafts that can be extracted, a miniaturization test should be done if your donor to rule out any further miniaturization. Additionally, any information provided to you by forum members or doctors online should be taken with a grain of salt, there's no way any of us really know or can judge your donor area based on pictures, proceeding with surgery or declining surgery without at least consulting with 4 or 5 qualified surgeons in person would be a big mistake. There was a case from a guy from London he was young and had a high level of hairloss and he had retro alopecia, forum members told him he'd be doomed if he had surgery, well he was able to get 14,000 grafts, just goes to show you online experts can not fully asses your situation simply by viewing pictures.

 

Here's the thread on page 2 and 3 he mentions people telling him he was going to be Norwood 7 8 years ago when he had his HT and 8 years later his hair is looking better than ever.

Thanks the the comments.

 

Win200 I was told by posting pictures on forums before my first ht that I wouldn't be suitable for any ht's as I had a poor donor density and to much area to cover, by others posters. Luckily I still wen't ahead and Dr Hasson said my density was very high indeed and my scalp laxity was freakish. After this last surgery Dr H said I still had the laxity of an average virgin scalp.

 

.

 

 

http://www.hairrestorationnetwork.com/eve/181718-total-14-462-grafts-dr-hasson-3.html

[Rashid36]

I want to keep a sort of french crop hair style, short and all comb forward.

 

If I had the front hairline done then smp in the crown i wonder how that would look.

 

It seems to me the places offering me treatment want to do all of it in one go as much as possible to get max results.

 

I hope that case happens to me but i could not see any before pictures in the link.

 

It's a matter of having to travel out and see the top doctors ( I'm in London, UK)

 

The second set of pictures (at normal height and no flash) i sent to H&W got the reply (the main point)below,

Dear Rashid,

 

Dr Wong has reviewed your photos and information and believes you are a suitable candidate for surgery and recommends that between 3500-4000 grafts by the FUT method should be possible in one session.

 

A few factors associated with your donor area such laxity and density will ultimately dictate how many grafts can be harvested. If all factors all favorable, he would like to take as many as possible to exceed 4,000 grafts. You have a large area to cover so in your case, within reason, there is likely no number that is too big. He feels that even if the total number of follicular units does not exceed 4,000, a significant cosmetic benefit can be achieved. Dr Wong would start with rebuilding the hairline and frontal zone working back into the mid scalp he will of course work back as far as possible.

 

The hairline placement would be age appropriate and start at around 7 to 8cm in height from your brow and show the correct level of temple recession of that of an adult male. Judging from the photos this might be just above your where the lowest point of your hairline currently is. Starting the hairline too low in cases of advanced loss means that the area of coverage becomes even greater so a mature hairline that is suitable for your age and hair loss pattern must be designed this would include appropriate temple reconstruction

 

The hairline would be dense packed to provide a frame for your face and styling options moving forward and the grafts would be densely packed throughout the hairline and frontal area into the mid scalp. The density will reduce through to the top of your scalp.

 

How much if any crown coverage and density if possible will depend on how many grafts he can harvest in this session. Dr Wong expect that a second procedure will be possible to address the crown around 1 year after the first session should you require this although this will depend on your laxity. The donor hair on the sides looks to be below average will will dictate how many grafts can be harvested and you should work at your scalp exercises

The first priority will be the front and mid scalp as the significant cosmetic impact will be felt with restoration of these areas.

 

Generally our recommendations are reasonably accurate but it must be clearly understood that we reserve the right to change these recommendations based on clinical examination of your particular scalp and hair characteristics.

[Melvin- Admin]

In my honest opinion, I feel H&W are best suited for your situation, there's a guy also from England who is their rep for English memebers he goes by garageland, maybe you can message him and ask him for some recommendations of local doctors to consult with to asses your donor, it's absolutely imperative you physically see a doctor before committing to surgery, as I said, no one can really fully asses you by looking at pictures, even im flying to Portland Oregon to consult with Dr. Gabel to asses my donor area, I've already consulted with umar in person also, I want to gather at least 4 medical professional opinions before proceeding with anymore surgeries you should do the same as this is the safest and best way to approach surgery. Sending online consults really does nothing, seeing a picture online is not the same as seeing it in person with magnification tools to check miniaturization. The hairstyle you want is it something like prince naseem Ahmed used to have back when he was a boxer? If so it may be possible but the crown would be bald.

[Dutchie]

Oh wow, if Dr. Wong has decided to accept you as a patient I would be on the next plane to Vancouver if I were you.

 

Remember, H&W do not accept just anyone. If they think you`re a lost cause they will decline

[Rashid36]

Yes, i need to go in person for consultation, thanks

See the picture of how my hair used to be. I want to keep it short so mabe beard hair would not be so bad looking just to fill the crown.

 

H&W can change there opinion if they saw me in person as anyone can.

They also said i would need to start and be on med. I have to think of there cost and I don't think they do beard hair which i think i will need.

 

Also the reliable doctors that said i can have a transplant all said i have limited donor and all said between 2000 to 3500 fue grafts and they all said start at the front.

 

This is my main worry of future hair loss and what i would do then i mean if they can only get that number now give or take, it's still low?

[Melvin- Admin]

Yes, i need to go in person for consultation, thanks

See the picture of how my hair used to be. I want to keep it short so mabe beard hair would not be so bad looking just to fill the crown.

 

H&W can change there opinion if they saw me in person as anyone can.

They also said i would need to start and be on med. I have to think of there cost and I don't think they do beard hair which i think i will need.

 

Also the reliable doctors that said i can have a transplant all said i have limited donor and all said between 2000 to 3500 fue grafts and they all said start at the front.

 

This is my main worry of future hair loss and what i would do then i mean if they can only get that number now give or take, it's still low?

 

I think getting surgery without any form of hair loss prevention is not a good idea If you don't get side effects from finasteride it is definitely a good hair loss prevention medication, if you do get side effects, then everything else would be at least useful in the delaying of hair loss. Nizoral 2% and a high quality minoxidil are better than nothing. Also, H&W have topical fin if you get sides from oral fin it may also be worth a try. There's some other things like laser therapy, a dermaroller, there's even things like Azelaic acid which has been shown to be an effective 5-alpha reductase inhibitor, which in turn decreases the levels of DHT in the scalp the efficacy is not going to be anything like finasteride but still better than nothing.

 

I think you're getting to ahead of yourself on achieving full coverage, as I said I don't think its really possible, of course we don't know until you've started on your journey, since you're worried about future loss, it would be wise to save some grafts in the bank should future loss occur. Beard hair could be useful in the future, but I think its best to do one step at a time. Once you've had your surgery you may be happy with the coverage and density you achieve, you may not even feel like going through the hassle of taking time off and the pain of surgery.

 

Also here are the guy from londons before pics, I believe he was probably around 30 years old here, you can see he does have retro alopecia, its not as noticeable because of his light hair and skin but its retro alopecia for sure

 

http://www.hairlosshelp.com/websites/galleryview.cfm?id=london_lad|gallery1.cfm

[JON86]

Rashid I think Htsoon has given you some great advice. It's all about being realistic. The most important thing if you go forward is to frame your face it will have the most drastic improvement for you. I also want to say that I believe online consults are pretty much a joke. Can you imagine sending a dentist a picture of your teeth and having him decide you need a root canal? Online consults really have been a horrible experience for me. I would not even consider a procedure without being checked in person. I would also be checked by several clinics not just one. There are clinics out there that will operate on anyone for money. There are ethical doctors out there too you just have to do the research to find them. I would meet with Dr Wong in person if possible. I do agree don't let anyone on a website give you false hope or take your hope away. They are just opinions and that's all they are.