Curious25

Wow, 24 years of DHT Inhibition, 19 of which blocking both 5AR I+II ! How have you been throughout the years? Any reason as to why you are considering the change to topical? In response to your question, excuse my ignorance if this isn't possible - but could you not just apply the topical all over your scalp, covering your donor?

Amazing for 1500 grafts

Looks a great design, and Dr Hasson has fantastic results time after time so I’m sure you’l be very happy come 12 months. Question for @H & W Doug- the extraction pattern seems to reach pretty high, and outside of the traditional safe donor zone - what are the reasons for this? I’ve seen it from a few North American FUE surgeons recently, Thanks

Exactly - so now do you see the contraindication in the advice? Where is the logical sense, if this type of hair follicle is the one that is currently providing the coverage on his mid scalp and crown?

Probably the best idea to start a new topic Melvin as the other thread was taking away from an amazing BHT transition. I think regardless of anyone’s stance on the medication, we all have to agree that at present it is the single best preventative measures any hair loss sufferer can take, in terms of efficacy. Without divulging too far into the science, the pros, the cons, the myths, the realities - I also think it’s fair to say that if any otherwise healthy male had a choice in the matter, they’d choose not to take a medication that tampered with the natural functioning of their body’s endocrine system. There are risk associated, and for that reason it essentially boils down to an individuals perception of risk vs reward. Reward in its largest extreme would be to re stimulate miniaturising follicles, and maintain without further loss for many years, let’s be generous and say 30 because that’s roughly how long it’s been in use. Risk in its largest extreme would be to permanently damage your androgen receptor sensitivity, and become an extremely difficult, if not untreatable urological medical case. I say that with the reluctance of being labelled a ‘fear mongerer’ but I was told this on solid authority during a recent urological consultation I was fortunate enough to pay for. So for me personally, the way I look at judging any form of risk vs. reward decision, is ascertaining which pro’s and con’s mean the most to me, as opposed to x having 10 pro’s whereas y only has 3 . . . (The weighting you allocate to the pro’s and con’s supersedes the volume of each) Now this question, I think, is different . . and directed towards whether analysing how much actual reward is attainable here. Simply put, referring back to our reward’s largest extreme . . If you are a bald NW 6/NW 7 patient - you have no ‘recipient zone’ scalp miniaturised hairs to restore, and you have no ‘recipient zone’ native hairs to restore. Therefore, personally for me, it would be risk vs no reward. Now there’s a new phenomenon that has appeared, subscribing to safe zone donor hair also being susceptible to miniaturisation induced by DHT - which would, logically, change the way we have to view this question - however as far as I have always been aware, the very reason hair transplants exist is because 99.9% of hair loss sufferers have a safe region of scalp donor hair, that is resistant to the DHT induced miniaturisation process - which is somewhat categorically different to generalised thinning associated with aging. Eager as ever, to here more input.

@Portugal25 I just want to start by saying your 8 months progress pic is fantastic. Secondly, what has Dr BF picked up to suggest your safe zone is at risk to the miniaturisation? Have you been diagnosed with DUPA?

But given that it is already recognised, and has been for decades, that beard hair growth occurs as a result of the follicles sensitivity to DHT, I’m failing to see the logic in suppressing their ‘fertiliser’ as Melvin earlier put it. What benefits can result from trying to inhibit the hormone they are dependant upon?

I don’t think passive observations that finasteride users still have beard growth to be a sufficient answer to this. For me the question for the doctor would, Doctor a substantial amount of beard hair grafts have been transplanted to my scalp, that have now provided a dramatic transition in my appearance on top. Why do you recommend to suppress a hormone that is scientifically proven to stimulate the growth of these said grafts, in favour of potentially minimising miniaturisation of my (already strong looking, despite two ht’s) donor hair region?

Oh mate come on, I'm even more convinced that it's you now than I was yesterday - why else would a 'former Spex patient' who just popped in to 'find out where he'd gone', be bothered to go off topic and ask a member to back up something he said which is completely irrelevant to why he originally posted? It's also very suspicious how you're claiming you had surgery with a Dr he recommended you to go to, who also happens to be (by chance I'm sure), the Dr involved in the bust up on here. Someone earlier couldn't have put it better on here, it's depressing how from your own unfortunate experiences as a young patient, you've essentially become an industry predator yourself.

Agree with the above - for 9 months this a good result from where you started. Judging by your 5 month pictures you were on the slower side of growth rate experienced by HT patients, therefore I think in your case in particular you will experience improvement for another 9 months. There was quite an obvious difference between 5 and 9 months, which also bodes well for the next 3 months. 12-18 months should be final phase maturation.

The problem with micro dosing is that if it's still reducing the DHT levels in your body similar to what the recommended doses do, *and you are prone to having negative side effects* you will eventually have the same side effects, albeit potentially slightly delayed and further down the line, once the build up of continuous 5AR inhibition has reached a level great enough to affect you adversely. Think about it logically - the reason side effects occur in the first place, is because of 5AR inhibition, and the subsequent lowering of DHT. Therefore, no matter what the dosage you take, if you are achieving reduction in DHT by a similar amount to what the recommended doses achieve (as you stated) - there is no reason why this would make you immune from adverse side effects because exactly the same thing is essentially going on inside your body. Now if you stated micro dosing was proven to not reduce DHT by a similar amount (which I think is what some studies suggest) the argument for side effect mitigation holds more credibility - however Its similar to fat loss, in the sense that you can't spot reduce fat in the gym, as you equally can't spot reduce DHT, and specifically target just the hair follicles (unfortunately). Dependent on the individual - even the slightest reduction in DHT levels and fiddling with the endocrine system may incur adverse and unwanted effects, however IMO, in the majority of users, it probably wouldn't cause an issue. The same goes for larger doses - theres seemingly people who take 1.25mg proscar daily without any issues, as there is for dutasteride users.

Required: -Dr Konior -1500 of your lovely, thick grafts Result: -The best NW6 transition online

Very satisfied, and I owe it down to communities such as this one in educating myself and selecting a top surgeon and clinic.

Unfortunately 99.9% of patients will always require more than 1 HT - given that they want to maintain their hair looking full.

Living up to my name, I'm curious as to how any form of anti androgen would come side effect free? Even if it stays localised to the scalp, for it to have any effect on the follicle receptors, it has to be induced systemically some how, no? Also, what is it?

One of the biggest conmen in the game - which is hilarious seeing as though his tagline as to why he does what he does is to protect patients from these very people. He's no better than a tabloid journalist here in the UK - in fact thats exactly what most of his work is, writing bald shaming articles about David Beckham or the two Prince's in newspapers not worthy enough of wiping your ars3 with. Don't be fooled by his whole nice guy act, he's profited and profiting handsomely from all his affiliations with clinics (some of which are useless) and deer in headlight patients that succumb to his marketing - he smashes dutasteride yet will have you believe the £50+ a bottle shampoo, or the wellman vitamins he promotes is maintaing his hair 😆. Oh and his favourite word to use is plethora, probably in his own deluded way to try and make himself sound doctor level intelligent, and attract patients for his little 1-1 skype consultations (where you'd be advised Dr Bhatti over Dr Hasson) lol! Shame because he could genuinely use his experiences and knowledge selflessly, and really give back to the community without capitalising at all. Anyway, considering you have 4 posts, all used up to start and write this thread, I wouldn't be surprised if you were Spex himself trying to drum up a bit of traffic your way again 😂 Congrats on your ITV debut

No doubt you really will be the finished product under the hands of any of those three doctors. It'd be nice if they could help put together a vlog of some kind with you in return for all you do for the community 👍

I picked this up on another thread - but it has been bought to my attention once again, is there any explanation to dieps extraction pattern? Pretty much every Diep patient I've seen on here recently have had grafts taken from outside of the traditional 'safe donor zone'. This guys almost had grafts taken from his crown!

Looks really good! Personally don't see the benefit in minoxidil - It's like crack for your follicles, their existence becomes dependent on it, so once you stop, so do they - and you lose them all. Its messy, inconvenient, has cosmetic side effects in the form of collagen reduction (so you're robbing pete to give to paul looks wise), can have cardiac side effects (more common from oral usage), and doesn't address the actual pathway that causes MPB. It's merely a growth stimulant, which once you start, you need to commit to for the rest of your life - so not ideal if you decide to start, then get negative side effects/cant be bothered using it anymore. Finasteride - directly addresses the root cause of MPB, and has a huge success rate in slowing the progression of hair loss down. Negative side effects are possible (yet statistically in the minority of users) as you are disrupting your bodies natural endocrine system, and can range from mild - severe across sexual dysfunction, breast tissue growth, and a phenomena known as 'brain fog', which can refer to reduced concentration span, irritation, being less alert, and generally put 'not feeling yourself'. Advice suggests if side effects do occur, they will disappear on discontinuation of the medication - however there is an acknowledged condition known as post finasteride syndrome, in which some users have had prolonged issues with side effects after stopping using the drug, and fail to return to baseline. This was recently confirmed to me by a leading urological consultant, who explained that the hypothesis as to why this occurs is down to androgen receptor sensitivity being nullified as a result of the bodies natural endocrine system being 'tampered' with, and is in essence an untreatable condition. This is because it is irrelevant how much testosterone you synthetically try and treat a patient with - if their receptors are shot at, it counts for nothing, because regardless of the testosterone levels, the receptors are unable to pick it up and 'put it to use'. This however again, is statistically rare, and very low amongst the population of users. The impact of certain side effects will differ from man to man, and what may concern one, may not concern another. We are unique and individual - and decisions should be made on a personal level, once all information is gathered, processed and understood. My consultant told me some of the PFS patients he has encountered denounce they would never have gone near the medication in the first place had they been informed of the worst case scenario possibility - equally there are people who have taken the drug for years on end, swear by it, advocate it, and have maintained their hair looking great. This is why I am a big advocate that all patients are well informed about the medication, and have enough, if not all of the information to weigh up the pro's and con's for themselves, to personally make an accurately informed decision.

Beautiful hairline design. Subtle A-Symmetry and the angular closings are nothing short of perfect. Look after yourself and your new grafts during the next 8-12 months and you will both look and feel like a new man. Congratulations.

There is always a lot of justified pessimism on these types of threads, because a brief scan at the track record for 'cures' and their time frames doesn't particularly equate to a huge amount of success. However, What do we mean by cure? By definition - 'to relieve a person of the symptoms of a disease or condition' So ultimately when we speak of a cure, we are looking for something that can reverse hair loss? Some would argue finasteride is capable of doing exactly this when the follicles are in a miniaturised state- albeit at the expense of potential side effects, and differing responses from individuals in terms of results. However for some - this could technically be 'a cure'. We have excellent hair restoration surgeons, capable of performing work that would have been unimaginable 10 years ago, let alone 30-40 years ago - so based on illusion of density - this for the average NW5 patient, could equally be argued to be 'a/the cure'. I think we'd be naive to remain as pessimistic as is usually shown on discussions such as these, because there is no doubt about it - hair restoration techniques are getting better and better, and with an industry price tag of over a billion dollars, investments into development and research are only on the upward trajectory, and have been for many years. There is a huge focus on regenerative medicine in the medical world at the moment, and hair loss is a sub section within the medical field where there is a particular interest with regards to regenerative therapies, with some patients already demonstrating great results. It's never a one size fits all when it comes to treatments in this industry, so the more options that become available, the higher the percentage of sufferers who will be able to benefit. Cautiously optimistic, I think, is the most helpful mind frame one should hold in respect to this - in particular the younger members who are perhaps in their late teens or 20's. IMO - for patients at NW5 and below, there are options already out there enabling them to be 'cured'.

Of course - you are being sensible in acknowledging there is no benefit in deciding to proceed for a second pass before the 18 month mark, in which I am confident you will continue to see improvements up until. It is just great news for you, and a strong position to be in, to have the option of probably futher depleting your donor by another 1.5-2k grafts, which strategically placed, would obviously make a huge difference to an already knock out result. I hope life is better this week for you 👍

Hair looking in great shape still Melvin, good to see! And your donor equally strong! Who would be your first choices for FUE crown work, when you decide to eventually bite the bullet? Your beard also looks good, would you consider extracting from under your chin to enhance up top even further ?

There’s plenty of people who HT without finasteride, some can unquestionably get away with it, without it even having to be a consideration - depending on their hair loss rate, donor quality, aspirations, hair loss pattern, and surgical plans .... and of course there are others who maybe can’t avoid continued loss at a faster rate, yet still remain realistic with their options and accept what they are likely to achieve - because the sacrifice for mental and physical well being and peace of mind outweighs that for them. I don’t know where I personally fall . . I think probably somewhere in between the two, however I’m confident I’l never look bald. I was actually willing to start on a Microdose recently after years and hours of research, however ran bloods to get my baseline and booked a consultation with a specialist - in which, without wanting to be labelled as a ‘scare mongerer’ by the propecia fan boys, I decided not to go ahead, after meeting with him for over an hour. There are options - if you hover over the boards, you’l come across tons of successful cases, who also have realistic plans for the future in place. Don’t forget , users will still eventually end up bald, it can’t hold off loss forever.

Looking great @Zoomster - definitely some thickening since previous months, more noticeably on the hairline. Donor looks very strong Aswell - hope you decide to go for a second pass at some point and Really Knock it out the Park 😉 Regardless, it looks great as it is, and in comparison to where you started, hard to believe! Equally hard to believe how you were turned away only a few years ago for not being suitable, and now 7000 grafts later you have decent coverage on top, and a donor that looks as though it has hardly been touched!