Am I being greedy 🤦‍♂️ appointment with Dr. Konior next year

[Al - Moderator]

The amount of hair you have for a 48 year old is probably in the top 1% of all 48 year olds, probably even the top .5%. You have more hair than I had when I was 17 and that's no exaggeration. Can you lower the hair line? Yes, technically it can be easily done on you. The question you need to ask yourself is will you be happy with it and what will you do and feel if you don't like it. A NW4 or NW5 having a hair transplant is usually much easier satisfied with all the added hair they get than someone who already has a full head of hair and is scrutinizing every strand of hair on their own head trying to figure out where to add hairs to make it perfect. This is what it seems like you are doing.

I will make a prediction that if you do go through with it you will end up thinking it's the worst thing you ever did. Why? Because right now you have a totally natural hair line that looks great for your age. A hair transplant is going to lower the hair line only very slightly, but it will never look as natural as it does now. For someone like yourself who constantly tries to examine it to see if it looks better or worse than yesterday, I can be almost 100% sure that you will not like the unnaturalness of a transplanted hair line. Yes many transplanted hair lines look great, but it's very rare to really get a totally natural effect.... and as I said, with someone who is so mindful about what it looks like, you will not be happy with something that is not your own totally natural hair line that you have now.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I think you should very seriously think about this.

 

[Jayson1361]

2 hours ago, StillAlive said:

Well, that was your choice. Still, they have apparently worked very well for you and you have maintained a NW1 full head of hair that some people pay tens of thousands of dollars to acquire surgically -and never do. I recommend going out there and enjoying life and that hair. It will honestly not get any better  

Well I certainly appreciate your upbeat message. However, I don’t think I’m NW1. Maybe with hair styled which is why I present these pictures. If you can style your hair and be happy….ish… let’s say 60-70% is it greedy to want to fix what has been broken? That’s why I chose styled pictures. I have others where my hair is over conditioned or has build up from crap products that honestly looks terrible I feel. 

[Jayson1361]

1 hour ago, BeHappy said:

The amount of hair you have for a 48 year old is probably in the top 1% of all 48 year olds, probably even the top .5%. You have more hair than I had when I was 17 and that's no exaggeration. Can you lower the hair line? Yes, technically it can be easily done on you. The question you need to ask yourself is will you be happy with it and what will you do and feel if you don't like it. A NW4 or NW5 having a hair transplant is usually much easier satisfied with all the added hair they get than someone who already has a full head of hair and is scrutinizing every strand of hair on their own head trying to figure out where to add hairs to make it perfect. This is what it seems like you are doing.

I will make a prediction that if you do go through with it you will end up thinking it's the worst thing you ever did. Why? Because right now you have a totally natural hair line that looks great for your age. A hair transplant is going to lower the hair line only very slightly, but it will never look as natural as it does now. For someone like yourself who constantly tries to examine it to see if it looks better or worse than yesterday, I can be almost 100% sure that you will not like the unnaturalness of a transplanted hair line. Yes many transplanted hair lines look great, but it's very rare to really get a totally natural effect.... and as I said, with someone who is so mindful about what it looks like, you will not be happy with something that is not your own totally natural hair line that you have now.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I think you should very seriously think about this.

 

You’re persuasive with this comment. I suppose there is a reason why some or most wait until thinning has progressed to get a HT. 

Dr. K is one of the best and known for his natural results which is why I chose to wait for him. But, even the best of the best can only do so much. I do have some things to consider. 
 

At the moment I think, logically, my approach is wait and see how meds and progression go this next 12 months. But I do have this feeling of progression, visibly as well over the past 24 months,  which makes me wonder what people mean when they say stabilization is needed for a HT. How is MPB ever truly stabilized? 

[Tiger2050]

5 hours ago, Jayson1361 said:

You’re persuasive with this comment. I suppose there is a reason why some or most wait until thinning has progressed to get a HT. 

Dr. K is one of the best and known for his natural results which is why I chose to wait for him. But, even the best of the best can only do so much. I do have some things to consider. 
 

At the moment I think, logically, my approach is wait and see how meds and progression go this next 12 months. But I do have this feeling of progression, visibly as well over the past 24 months,  which makes me wonder what people mean when they say stabilization is needed for a HT. How is MPB ever truly stabilized? 

Considering your age and the fact you are on medication, I see no problem with getting a small procedure to get a more youthful  hairline. You will have enough donor leftover to last you a lifetime. Keep in mind you will probably need a second procedure to get native density if you lower the hairline. Dr. K is one of the best but it’s not possible achieve native density with one pass. 

Edited November 30, 2022 by Tiger2050

[Jayson1361]

1 hour ago, Tiger2050 said:

Considering your age and the fact you are on medication, I see no problem with getting a small procedure to get a more perfect hairline. You will have enough donor leftover to last you a lifetime. Keep in mind you will probably need a second procedure to get native density if you lower the hairline. Dr. K is one of the best but it’s not possible achieve native density with one pass. 

I’ve been thinking about that. The whole density thing and transplants along the hairline. Dr. K has stated that he needs enough space between hairs to place his knife, which I’m assuming is sapphire sub 1mm, like maybe .8mm not sure. I seem to have some terminal hairs left along the hairline as others have miniaturized … with from what I can tell enough space to fit a donor so…maybe 1 pass 🤷‍♂️ but who knows if these other native terminal hairs will stick around. 

[BDK081522]

To achieve the density you will want (considering how detailed you scrutinize your hairline) you're more than likely going to need two procedures. Surgeons have to plan for graft survival as they compete for new blood supply. As such not all of them grow so you'll never get 100% from any surgeon. So, implanting at lower than natural density and not getting 100% regrowth will more than likely lead you to do two passes. Even with Konior, results are limited to your own physiology. I had to have two passes with him myself. So, keep that in mind that this will be years of your life with his waiting time and  growth waiting times etc. 

[Jayson1361]

5 hours ago, BDK081522 said:

To achieve the density you will want (considering how detailed you scrutinize your hairline) you're more than likely going to need two procedures. Surgeons have to plan for graft survival as they compete for new blood supply. As such not all of them grow so you'll never get 100% from any surgeon. So, implanting at lower than natural density and not getting 100% regrowth will more than likely lead you to do two passes. Even with Konior, results are limited to your own physiology. I had to have two passes with him myself. So, keep that in mind that this will be years of your life with his waiting time and  growth waiting times etc. 

Yeah the years thing could be an issue I just don’t know yet. Maybe I am hyper critical but I feel I can see progression of MPB or maturing I really don’t know. But hairloss is hairloss. I’ve included some pictures in harsh lighting today. Styled hair again a leave on conditioner, styler and later in the day some dry shampoo as the leave in can get kinda greasy and dry shampoo feels like it kinda thickens and/or breaks down the greasy feeling a bit  

[Mike10]

Actually I think you are an excellent candidate for HT. Much better than the vast majority here. Looks you will only need 1-2 procedures during iifetime and are not reliant on any medication. You just need to keep expectations in check and realize that of course there is no such thing as a guaranteed outcome.

It may seem unfair but the best HT candidates are those that do not really need surgery !

Edited December 1, 2022 by Mike10

[Jayson1361]

38 minutes ago, Mike10 said:

Actually I think you are an excellent candidate for HT. Much better than the vast majority here. Looks you will only need 1-2 procedures during iifetime and are not reliant on any medication. You just need to keep expectations in check and realize that of course there is no such thing as a guaranteed outcome. 

I’ve been on meds for 15 years. I don’t know if being on meds makes me a good candidate or not actually. 
 

So, what you’re saying is by being an excellent HT candidate is that you don’t think I need a HT? 

Edited December 1, 2022 by Jayson1361

[Mike10]

10 hours ago, Jayson1361 said:

I’ve been on meds for 15 years. I don’t know if being on meds makes me a good candidate or not actually. 
 

So, what you’re saying is by being an excellent HT candidate is that you don’t think I need a HT? 

I would say you are still a very good candidate. In your case, you would have been a perfect candidate if you were not on medication. However, it is very clear that you do not need a HT. 

 

 

[Curious25]

You’re a good example of the paradoxical nature of this industry -

You’re basically a perfect candidate for surgery - Mature age, good hair quality, minimal loss, on meds, etc.  

Yet peoples immediate reaction is to straight away harp on about the risk vs reward BS, and imply that no one would even notice the change cosmetically. 
 

You’re consulting with a very skilled surgeon, and you are taking the strongest 5AR inhibitor available - I think it’s pretty fair to acknowledge that the ‘risk’ in this instance is as low as it can possibly get. 
 

And when did we start doing hair transplants for other people ? It’s you who’s got the concerns that you have expressed, just as it will be most importantly you who will notice the new and improved hairline. 
 

Small hairline and temple point procedures can and do have dramatic impacts on people - people just get far too wrapped up in high Norwood transformations. 
 

Your hair is great as it is, I agree. Could it be even more great in the context of ironing out the concerns you have expressed? Absolutely. 

[AlBrown]

Do you have photos of the hairline in its prime?  It may help us seeing it through your "lens" to better understand the dissatisfaction. 

My thoughts…the “reward” component of hair surgery is subjective and unique to each individual when weighing the risks.  It is an elective surgery, not lifesaving nor serving a functional purpose outside of maybe a slightly warmer head in single digit wind chill. In the end we mostly do it because if we look good we feel good so I’d suggest if you feel the change would significantly improve your self-confidence then go for it.

This would be a different story if you were late twenties and on no medication, but you’ve done the correct progressions and are at a mature enough age to consider surgery.  Agree with others your hair looks great but that is just my opinion, not yours.  Your opinion is what matters most since you’re the one paying the money for it and living with the results (good or bad).

[Jayson1361]

4 hours ago, AlBrown said:

Do you have photos of the hairline in its prime?  It may help us seeing it through your "lens" to better understand the dissatisfaction. 

My thoughts…the “reward” component of hair surgery is subjective and unique to each individual when weighing the risks.  It is an elective surgery, not lifesaving nor serving a functional purpose outside of maybe a slightly warmer head in single digit wind chill. In the end we mostly do it because if we look good we feel good so I’d suggest if you feel the change would significantly improve your self-confidence then go for it.

This would be a different story if you were late twenties and on no medication, but you’ve done the correct progressions and are at a mature enough age to consider surgery.  Agree with others your hair looks great but that is just my opinion, not yours.  Your opinion is what matters most since you’re the one paying the money for it and living with the results (good or bad).

Well I’ve looked for photos when I was 15 but here is one in aug 2016. Funny enough it looks better now. Went back in time on the ol phone to find one but I think I can find some others. 
 

The second one is Aug 2016. The first one is year and a half later I believe as meds were kicking in as I became very consistent with Avodart and I grew my hair out. Dec 2017

 

I mean it’s no lie when people say on this forum that dutasteride works. Of course I did have my hair styled and had a leave in conditioner which kinda thickens hair so there’s that too, in the first picture  

Edited December 2, 2022 by Jayson1361

[Festa]

I think if you get a transplant you will not be happy with the results. Just my opinion from experience. I hope it helps you.

Edited December 3, 2022 by Festa

[Dillpickle123]

I think there’s no one better then Dr K for a hair transplant, I would say u have a mature hairline, it wouldn’t take many grafts to straighten it maybe 1500-2000 grafts if you want to do it then do it you’ll be supported in wtvr decision you make there’s risks like everything else but dr konior is a wizard 

[Jayson1361]

2 hours ago, Festa said:

I think if you get a transplant you will not be happy with the results. Just my opinion from experience. I hope it helps you.

Do you have a picture of your experience? 

[Festa]

2 minutes ago, Jayson1361 said:

Do you have a picture of your experience? 

I just think from everything you've posted so far and your expectations you would not be happy with a transplant. Like others have said even the very best transplants are not quite the same as natural hair. I think you'll be chasing a look and never be completely satisfied.

 

Keep in mind if you densly pack your front hairline and have more loss behind it then you are committed to multiple more surgeries the rest of your life just trying to maintain a natural looking pattern. Having a created frontal hairline with thinning hair behind it is not a good look at all. There is nothing wrong though with just a natural looking pattern aging gracefully.

 

I'd stay on the meds and reevaluate your situation in another 5 years or so and go from there. I think therapy like you mentioned may be a better help for you. 

[Spring15]

You have minor recession and going to a good surgeon you could get a nice NW1 hairline. The question is Why not? You've been on meds for years which has near maintained what you have, minimal loss, perfect donor and assuming you have up to 10 grand cash in the bank there is no reason why you shouldn't do it. 

People here are just comparing themselves wishing they had your head of hair and responding negatively to the idea of you getting a transplant. Go for it - with a credible surgeon of coarse. I've never heard someone say they've regretted a transplant when it's done properly, no matter how much or how little hair they had on their head to begin with

[Jayson1361]

27 minutes ago, Festa said:

I just think from everything you've posted so far and your expectations you would not be happy with a transplant. Like others have said even the very best transplants are not quite the same as natural hair. I think you'll be chasing a look and never be completely satisfied.

 

Keep in mind if you densly pack your front hairline and have more loss behind it then you are committed to multiple more surgeries the rest of your life just trying to maintain a natural looking pattern. Having a created frontal hairline with thinning hair behind it is not a good look at all. There is nothing wrong though with just a natural looking pattern aging gracefully.

 

I'd stay on the meds and reevaluate your situation in another 5 years or so and go from there. I think therapy like you mentioned may be a better help for you. 

I appreciate all feed back and your logic is sound. Further loss would be an issue that would need to be addressed. Obviously your stating the number one reason why people don’t follow through with appointments I’m assuming or if not the top reason at least in the top 3. Do you have a picture of your experience? I’m very curious… what didn’t you like about your experience? 

[Festa]

9 minutes ago, Jayson1361 said:

I appreciate all feed back and your logic is sound. Further loss would be an issue that would need to be addressed. Obviously your stating the number one reason why people don’t follow through with appointments I’m assuming or if not the top reason at least in the top 3. Do you have a picture of your experience? I’m very curious… what didn’t you like about your experience? 

I'm sorry I don't want to share pictures.

 

Dr. K said it best you're not a good candidate for this, if a very ethical doctor like him tells you that then you should listen. It's very clear in everything you say and how you feel about all this that you wouldn't become a good patient so you're most likely not going to have an optimal outcome in your mind. 

 

What some others that have posted on here haven't took into consideration is your mindset on this and expections. Yes of course you can get a transplant that's not the question, yes it's possible to have very good results as well. The question is are you the right candidate for one? In my opinion, no. Dr. K feels the same it seems, that should say it all. 

 

You mentioned other issues you're experiencing and therapy. I think that's a much better choice for you at this time. Good luck with everything.

 

[Jayson1361]

1 hour ago, Spring15 said:

You have minor recession and going to a good surgeon you could get a nice NW1 hairline. The question is Why not? You've been on meds for years which has near maintained what you have, minimal loss, perfect donor and assuming you have up to 10 grand cash in the bank there is no reason why you shouldn't do it. 

People here are just comparing themselves wishing they had your head of hair and responding negatively to the idea of you getting a transplant. Go for it - with a credible surgeon of coarse. I've never heard someone say they've regretted a transplant when it's done properly, no matter how much or how little hair they had on their head to begin with

Thank you for responding. First I’d say yes I’ve maintained to some degree you’re correct. I’m in question if it’s just genetics or if dutasteride really works that well?🤷‍♂️

Second Dr K is easily double 10k +.  Surprisingly but not surprisingly so. To be honest if I got back maybe 500 hairs each side of my hairline vs grafts which is always more hairs depending on the grafts it would do wonders for my hairline I think. But like fiesta said future loss could be a concern. I’ve posted some pictures of my hair density parted dry with a leave in conditioner in it. Pretty much it’s how I condition and style my hair now. It offers ease of conditioning and with a hair dryer adds control and some relative strength or pliability if you will to my hair. Otherwise my hair is rather curly, slightly coarse even. Genetics or Avodart? I just don’t know. Leading to the question, if there is thinning behind a transplant how long do I have? It looks dense… ish… I guess. One thing I’ve noticed is the longer the hair the easier it is to part, obviously, and the less dense it looks…so to speak. Which is why I suppose thinner hair looks better shorter🤷‍♂️🤦‍♂️ 

Id like to state to, a bit off topic for anyone that cares I’m about two months on oral minoxidil 2.5mg EOD moving into 5 times a week, slowly moving into every day. I’ve noticed some reddening/darkening of my hair in places and slightly longer eyelashes. I’ve noticed some increased shedding as well, hoping of course I have enough hair that it doesn’t become too noticeable if at all. I take this as a sign it’s starting to work to some degree in conjunction with Avodart .5mg. I’m curious if anyone makes it this far in my thread😔 what anyone’s experience may be. 

 

Edited December 3, 2022 by Jayson1361

[Jayson1361]

8 minutes ago, Festa said:

I'm sorry I don't want to share pictures.

 

Dr. K said it best you're not a good candidate for this, if a very ethical doctor like him tells you that then you should listen. It's very clear in everything you say and how you feel about all this that you wouldn't become a good patient so you're most likely not going to have an optimal outcome in your mind. 

 

What some others that have posted on here haven't took into consideration is your mindset on this and expections. Yes of course you can get a transplant that's not the question, yes it's possible to have very good results as well. The question is are you the right candidate for one? In my opinion, no. Dr. K feels the same it seems, that should say it all. 

 

You mentioned other issues you're experiencing and therapy. I think that's a much better choice for you at this time. Good luck with everything.

 

I do value your comments. Clearly they are insightful and relative to a previous experience you’ve had. Can I ask what your experience was? I understand the no pictures thing. What happened with you? Was it similar to my situation? 

Edited December 3, 2022 by Jayson1361

[Mike10]

Well I have said that you would have been an even better HT candidate if you were not on medication. Some other folks have now said that you are the perfect candidate because you are on medication.You yourself said that you do not know whether it is good or bad whether you have been on medication. 

I will now better clarify my position. If you have not been on medication, at age 50 with you hair, it is safe to assume that you would only need 1-2 HTs during your lifetime. Possibly you would be so old for the potential 2nd HT that you would not care. So 1 HT would be possible which would be very rare in this business.  

Judging from the pics you sent, it is safe to assume that medication is working very well for you as you have retained a great amount of hair throughout a large time period (looking better than before medication). It is possible that you will have to come off the  medication for 1 reason or anothet in the future. I have seen it many times occur in patients. In that case, would need to have  a 2nd HT.In other terms, your current situation does not translate into reality as you are on medication. 

Obviously, there is also the point of shockloss which some are going to argue Finansteride mitigates. However, I feel that , with your hair and age (age 50 and transplanting into isolated bald areas), the risk of permanent shockloss even without Fin is minimal. 

For now, I would advise not to have a HT for the simple reason that a NW0-NW1 pattern might look not age appropriate. In case you have to drop the medication, you could always have a HT then. But I would be happy with your kind of hair now at your age and that medication is working so well.You are right niw in a very good spot

 

 

[Jayson1361]

11 minutes ago, Mike10 said:

Well I have said that you would have been an even better HT candidate if you were not on medication. Some other folks have now said that you are the perfect candidate because you are on medication.You yourself said that you do not know whether it is good or bad whether you have been on medication. 

I will now better clarify my position. If you have not been on medication, at age 50 with you hair, it is safe to assume that you would only need 1-2 HTs during your lifetime. Possibly you would be so old for the potential 2nd HT that you would not care. So 1 HT would be possible which would be very rare in this business.  

Judging from the pics you sent, it is safe to assume that medication is working very well for you as you have retained a great amount of hair throughout a large time period (looking better than before medication). It is possible that you will have to come off the  medication for 1 reason or anothet in the future. I have seen it many times occur in patients. In that case, would need to have  a 2nd HT.In other terms, your current situation does not translate into reality as you are on medication. 

Obviously, there is also the point of shockloss which some are going to argue Finansteride mitigates. However, I feel that , with your hair and age (age 50 and transplanting into isolated bald areas), the risk of permanent shockloss even without Fin is minimal. 

For now, I would advise not to have a HT for the simple reason that a NW0-NW1 pattern might look not age appropriate. In case you have to drop the medication, you could always have a HT then. But I would be happy with your kind of hair now at your age and that medication is working so well.You are right niw in a very good spot

 

 

I’ve got to say the time and caring people in this network put into replying and reading and replying, it’s amazing. Not common. Is it the topic, probably somewhat, but more so a testament to the people here that care. Mike thank you for your comments and perspective. 
 

You highlighted one of my more important thoughts. Noticing some thinning around the corners above my temples in my mid 20s as I lost my teenage hair line, I dabbled in hairloss drugs. Was never really consistent. Even in my mid 30s I seemingly wasn’t consistent. I became more consistent in my later 30s moving into my 40s. Sometimes, I wonder did I jump the gun here. Was being on drugs really needed? Was I destined to look like my father which none of my brothers do? Was I destined to look like my mothers side where with slight recession most men retained their hair? The ultimate question being, is dutasteride that effective? Or it is possible that genetically in combination with dutasteride I’m where I’m at. I’ve long looked for dutasteride results where someone has managed to maintain on some sort of aesthetically pleasing level their hair,  and haven’t really found really any. Long term I suppose. Mostly I’ve found guys that have been on it and maintained to some degree but what I’ve seen is really just ok results. I certainly don’t think I’m some sort of medical anomaly either. Therefore, it has lead me to think that maybe it’s just a combination of meds and genetics. So, my question is how good are these hairloss drugs with so many guys yielding mediocre results or maintaining some semblance of what they’ve had. Don’t get me wrong I do have a thinning hairline I feel, I just don’t know if it’s genetics or drugs. Sadly. That being said your statements are well thought out and I thank you for your feedback. 

[AlBrown]

11 hours ago, Jayson1361 said:

Id like to state to, a bit off topic for anyone that cares I’m about two months on oral minoxidil 2.5mg EOD moving into 5 times a week, slowly moving into every day. I’ve noticed some reddening/darkening of my hair in places and slightly longer eyelashes. I’ve noticed some increased shedding as well, hoping of course I have enough hair that it doesn’t become too noticeable if at all. I take this as a sign it’s starting to work to some degree in conjunction with Avodart .5mg. I’m curious if anyone makes it this far in my thread😔 what anyone’s experience may be. 

This thread has been informative for me.  Have a look...