How To Detect Undercover Schills and Trolls

[Melvin- Admin]

Dear Community,

Lately, there have been a surprisingly high number of trolls, spammers and undercover schills on our forum. So much so, that I decided to create a thread to help you guys spot it easily. So here's a few signs of an undercover schill, troll or spammer. 

#1 No Photos or Personal Threads:

Many of our legit members have their own threads either asking questions regarding surgery, or have created a thread outlining their journey's. Now, there are legit members that do not have any pictures or anything like that but their posting pattern and behavior is different. 

#2 Posting Patterns:

Most undercover schills or trolls will be overtly aggressive. Most of the times they will vehemently defend hair mills, while attacking forum members ironically calling them fake or liars. Another easy way to spot these schills is their join date. Most of the time they are new members. Another way to spot them is by their poor grammar, using words like 'proofs.' 

#3 Quality Clinic Attacks:

Another telltale sign is the fact that these schills attack quality clinics for no apparent reason. You will see them on a thread questioning the quality, when they've just joined and have already asserted themselves as an authority figure. Even after many senior members correct them on their assertions, they continually respond with nonsense to try and smear the result and the clinic.

#4 Defending Clinics with No History:

Another sign is when a new user comes to the forum and joins to respond to a negative review. No back story, no history, just joined to comment on a negative thread. Most of the time they will be nasty and aggressive towards the person writing the negative review. Nothing genuine, just malicious and nasty. No one joins a new forum just to defend a clinic. Even if you went to the clinic, you wouldn't join to just defend them. 

#5 Questioning Things with a Negative Undertone

Some of these schills will be a bit more clever and harder to spot. But they will always resort to the same thing. You will see them passively attacking clinics by constantly questioning things with a negative undertone.

For example, 'why do you need two surgeries to get this result?' or 'good result, but you could achieve an equal result with half the grafts. Does that mean the clinic wasted a lot of grafts?' It's also easy to tell when they constantly attack one particular clinic with no apparent motive or reason. A quick look at their posting pattern will reveal the truth. They will never work hard to conceal their true identity. 

If you guys have things to add, please be sure to add more. I will pin this so anyone visiting can see.

[Britanium]

Something else which happens (like today) is a certain “hair mill” posted multiple “Amazing” reviews which came as a response to a very recent poor review.

This happens a lot here on the forum. All of a sudden we see “fantastic” results pop up from brand new members after a clinic has a not so good/poor result. 

[Melvin- Admin]

4 minutes ago, JohnAC71 said:

Something else which happens (like today) is a certain “hair mill” posted multiple “Amazing” reviews which came as a response to a very recent poor review.

This happens a lot here on the forum. All of a sudden we see “fantastic” results pop up from brand new members after a clinic has a not so good/poor result. 

Yes, that’s a great point. If you see a negative review, and then 5 new “amazing reviews” you know those are fake.

[Doron Harati]

1) Undercover paid agents that open hair mill Facebook groups that declare themselves as "casual" people that only open these groups to "help" people without getting or any other interest, same goes for undercover paid blogs\vlogs, many times they block or delete paitent with poor results or botched.

2) Hair mills or bad doctors that steal and post good results from pro level MDs clinics under their name, I myself caught clinics and consultant agencies that took photos of HDC clinic and other doctors.

3) Hair mills or undercover agents that present paitents that won the Russian Roulette as a reference that every paitent can have this kind of result.

4) Photos that were taken in cars

5) Fake Google reviews (for fake bad or fake good results), Google reviews are fake many times if not most.

6) Should I mention more?

Edited June 21, 2021 by Doron Harati

[pomloe]

So basically clinics paid his agents to create 3-4 threads from different users just in response of my negative hair transplant experience with them. So sad and pathetic. 

[sl]

Melvin, thank you posting this. I have been on forums for 12 years professionally and few years as a reader and agree with the above points and can spot them a mile off. 

Genuine hair loss sufferers would never attack patients from any clinic, regardless of who they went to and  who have posted their results and struggles and some of these that is their first post that is really obvious and as you say, no history, "just average guys" or some "random dude" excuse they give and then they go into second gear to attack and discredit  SYSTEMATICALLY  cases and comments from certain clinics.  You don't know who they work for but then they defend just as aggressively clinics they apparently have no links to and as night follows day a pattern forms as suspected and I do keep track of these posts for myself to sift the genuine from the shills and after a while it is very telling and obvious who has what motive to be here. It is good they are being seen by many here now and it will not be tolerated.

The result  of these shills is no-one wins and ironically they discredit the clinic they are shilling for, it always comes out,  and furthermore it damages the forum. The patients will post less if they will be subject to attack, the forum users suffer and especially those who are seeking honest guidance and also the recommended clinics will also be put off.

To clinics who wish to shill,  I suggest try to build your own reputation rather than shilling and trying to ruin others, learn the trade, get results, engage with the users here,  write articles, do videos, comment on cases to help, give interviews and generally start helping people as we and others do also and have done for years.

If you do want to continue to shill then at least download some software to avoid the same spelling and grammar errors that are inherent also in the posts as your limitations will be your undoing also.

I applaud any patient from any clinic who posts and indeed the clinics and colleagues on here who work for the common good to help others both in cases and education.

We are happy to be part and will continue to do our best to support and serve people regardless of where they go for surgery, and thankfully this is the sentiment of most on here.

Well done Melvin for addressing this and to all who see it. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited June 21, 2021 by sl

[Melvin- Admin]

6 minutes ago, sl said:

Melvin, thank you posting this. I have been on forums for 12 years professionally and few years as a reader and agree with the above points and can spot them a mile off. 

Genuine hair loss sufferers would never attack patients from any clinic, regardless of who they went to and  who have posted their results and struggles and some of these that is their first post that is really obvious and as you say, no history, "just average guys" or some "random dude" excuse they give and then they go into second gear to attack and discredit  SYSTEMATICALLY  cases and comments from certain clinics.  You don't know who they work for but then they defend just as aggressively clinics they apparently have no links to and as night follows day a pattern forms as suspected and I do keep track these posts for myself to sift the genuine from the shills and after a while it is very telling and obvious who has what motive to be here. It is good they are being seen by many here now and it will not be tolerated.

The result  of these shills is no-one wins and ironically they discredit the clinic they are shilling for, it always comes out,  and furthermore it damages the forum. The patients will post less if they will be subject to attack, the forum users suffer and especially those who are seeking honest guidance and also the recommended clinics will also be put off.

To clinics who wish to shill,  I suggest try to build your own reputation rather than shilling and trying to ruin others, learn the trade, get results, engage with the users here,  write articles, do videos, comment on cases to help, give interviews and generally start helping people as we and others do also and have done for years.

If you do want to continue to shill then at least download some software to avoid the same spelling and grammar errors that are inherent also in the posts as your limitations will be your undoing also.

I applaud any patient from any clinic who posts and indeed the clinics and colleagues on here who work for the common good to help others both in cases and education.

We are happy to be part and will continue to do our best to support and serve people regardless of where they go for surgery, and thankfully this is the sentiment of most on here.

Well done Melvin for addressing this and to all who see it. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Great post!

[Britanium]

@slvery wise words as always. Please don’t give tips to the shills though 😂🤣 well the first part yes... 👌

[Marko7t4]

Just curious what a hair mill is?

[Britanium]

45 minutes ago, Marko7t4 said:

Just curious what a hair mill is?

Multiple patients per day, usually tech only procedures. Very low cost/best or “nice price” 
Only Dr involvement will be when they draw the hairline on. 
More like a conveyer belt of patients, rather than the best model which is 1 person per day and full Dr involvement. 
They will take on anybody’s case. And make lots of promises they can possibly fulfil. 
Bottom line ? They are wanting money as opposed to the best possible outcome for each individual.

Will be able to fit you anytime you like ! This afternoon ? No problem ! 

Always offering a “Warranty/guarantee” for their results... which is another huge red flag 🚩 that’s synonymous with the mills. 
 

Edited June 21, 2021 by JohnAC71

[Melvin- Admin]

40 minutes ago, JohnAC71 said:

Multiple patients per day, usually tech only procedures. Very low cost/best or “nice price” 
Only Dr involvement will be when they draw the hairline on. 
More like a conveyer belt of patients, rather than the best model which is 1 person per day and full Dr involvement. 
They will take on anybody’s case. And make lots of promises they can possibly fulfil. 
Bottom line ? They are wanting money as opposed to the best possible outcome for each individual.

Always offering a “Warranty/guarantee” for their results... which is another huge red flag 🚩 that’s synonymous with the mills. 

^this

[deeznuts]

Biggest thing I like to see is just having a post history and being a genuine part of the community.

You can fake a ton of things, but it takes time and effort over a period of several months to fake the post history of someone who is an active participant in the community in a way that looks natural. And for all that work, they get 1 review out of it. Not that it isn't possible but it does take work 

[DrTBarghouthi]

On 6/21/2021 at 8:15 PM, Doron Harati said:

1) Undercover paid agents that open hair mill Facebook groups that declare themselves as "casual" people that only open these groups to "help" people without getting or any other interest, same goes for undercover paid blogs\vlogs, many times they block or delete paitent with poor results or botched.

2) Hair mills or bad doctors that steal and post good results from pro level MDs clinics under their name, I myself caught clinics and consultant agencies that took photos of HDC clinic and other doctors.

3) Hair mills or undercover agents that present paitents that won the Russian Roulette as a reference that every paitent can have this kind of result.

4) Photos that were taken in cars

5) Fake Google reviews (for fake bad or fake good results), Google reviews are fake many times if not most.

6) Should I mention more?

Those car photos are killing me 🤣 can’t agree more. 

[DrTBarghouthi]

On 6/21/2021 at 8:34 PM, sl said:

Melvin, thank you posting this. I have been on forums for 12 years professionally and few years as a reader and agree with the above points and can spot them a mile off. 

Genuine hair loss sufferers would never attack patients from any clinic, regardless of who they went to and  who have posted their results and struggles and some of these that is their first post that is really obvious and as you say, no history, "just average guys" or some "random dude" excuse they give and then they go into second gear to attack and discredit  SYSTEMATICALLY  cases and comments from certain clinics.  You don't know who they work for but then they defend just as aggressively clinics they apparently have no links to and as night follows day a pattern forms as suspected and I do keep track of these posts for myself to sift the genuine from the shills and after a while it is very telling and obvious who has what motive to be here. It is good they are being seen by many here now and it will not be tolerated.

The result  of these shills is no-one wins and ironically they discredit the clinic they are shilling for, it always comes out,  and furthermore it damages the forum. The patients will post less if they will be subject to attack, the forum users suffer and especially those who are seeking honest guidance and also the recommended clinics will also be put off.

To clinics who wish to shill,  I suggest try to build your own reputation rather than shilling and trying to ruin others, learn the trade, get results, engage with the users here,  write articles, do videos, comment on cases to help, give interviews and generally start helping people as we and others do also and have done for years.

If you do want to continue to shill then at least download some software to avoid the same spelling and grammar errors that are inherent also in the posts as your limitations will be your undoing also.

I applaud any patient from any clinic who posts and indeed the clinics and colleagues on here who work for the common good to help others both in cases and education.

We are happy to be part and will continue to do our best to support and serve people regardless of where they go for surgery, and thankfully this is the sentiment of most on here.

Well done Melvin for addressing this and to all who see it. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Well said. I agree that it is an interesting topic indeed. It’s quite annoying how far people go nowadays to ruin reputations or to even book a case. It is a more transparent and easier path to just learn and be good at what you offer. 

[gillenator]

Schills are also notorious for steering patients, especially the newbies because the schills know many newbies are not aware of their tactics.

And they always steer patients to the doctor they are getting free work from....surprise, surprise!

I sometimes wonder how often these scammers are steering by PM so they can work undercover.

[shami26]

Also, they claim to have a lot of friends who went to the same clinic.

[Melvin- Admin]

5 hours ago, gillenator said:

Schills are also notorious for steering patients, especially the newbies because the schills know many newbies are not aware of their tactics.

And they always steer patients to the doctor they are getting free work from....surprise, surprise!

I sometimes wonder how often these scammers are steering by PM so they can work undercover.

If anyone in the community gets a PM from someone recommending them to go to a certain clinic, and this poster doesn't have A) any pictures or B) recently joined, chances are they are schills. Not everyone, of course some highly respected members of our community may give some recommendations of surgeons they know do good work.

But if you get someone saying "Hey, go to Hair of __ they will get you in for $1,500 all inclusive package including, airport transfer and hotel. My best friend, brother, or co-worker went there." That is a huge red flag, please flag the PM so I can deal with that person.

[Britanium]

Something else which happens at least a few times a week is that a clinic will join and use it’s own name for the user name. So actually really easy to spot. They will then proceed to post a excerpt from there own website and post It on a new thread or bump a entirely unrelated post (usually a old one) 

They will contain a link or use hyperlinks within the text/message of the post. I will post a example below. The underlined hair transplanted will take you (as if by magic) to the clinics own webpage ! 

 

Edited June 23, 2021 by JohnAC71

[Britanium]

Another example, and quite sneaky way to promote your clinic your shilling for free ? Post it as your background on your user profile:

This clinic for example created 2 user profiles within a week of each other. 

 

Edited June 23, 2021 by JohnAC71

[gillenator]

A former long term member of this community was notorious for fishing and steering patients to the doctors he represented…and he PM’d lots of newbies…I was glad to see him finally leave… and yet he had multiple procedures, showcased his photos, and always offered his help but I always knew his real motives was to make money off patients, especially newbies.

 

[Melvin- Admin]

1 hour ago, gillenator said:

A former long term member of this community was notorious for fishing and steering patients to the doctors he represented…and he PM’d lots of newbies…I was glad to see him finally leave… and yet he had multiple procedures, showcased his photos, and always offered his help but I always knew his real motives was to make money off patients, especially newbies.

 

Does his name rhyme with slex 🤣 

[Britanium]

1 hour ago, Melvin- Moderator said:

Does his name rhyme with slex 🤣 

That’s one person, I can think of at least 2 other people that used to do the same as @gillenatormentioned. 

Edited June 24, 2021 by JohnAC71

[Melvin- Admin]

16 minutes ago, JohnAC71 said:

That’s one person, I can think of at least 2 other people that used to do the same as @gillenatormentioned. 

Rhyme the other two names. Only two left the forum. 

[Britanium]

2 minutes ago, Melvin- Moderator said:

Rhyme the other two names. Only two left the forum. 

Lol yes one would rhyme with killmen…. 

[Melvin- Admin]

1 minute ago, JohnAC71 said:

Lol yes one would rhyme with killmen…. 

I don’t believe he’d do that, he represented one of the best clinics at the time that don’t need that. The other one though, that is definitely something he would do.