NW6 realistic goals?

[gillenator]

Brutus,

 

I know exactly what you are experiencing as I wore a full hair system for 11 years with HCM and hated it. Had my first procedure in 1996 in the frontal core and finally pitched my systems. To date I had roughly 6900 grafts in four separate procedures.

 

The one thing I was about to ask you that was not yet asked was, "Are there any Norwood class 7's in your family history?" But then I read your last post and you clarified that for us.

 

So here's the deal. IMHO, you have a lot of potential to restore your frontal third zone with a nice hairline and then transitioning the level of density as you reach the mid-scalp. I also agree that you leave the crown alone for now. You don't have to go above say 60cm2 in the frontal core to get a nice result. It won't be superb density but enough to attain nice coverage...

 

You will definitely need more than 3,000 grafts for a surface area of 100cm2. So I do not recommend that you do all of that area to start with. IMHO, the bottom line issue for you is donor reserve management. Just in case low dose finasteride does not work long term for you, and you continue to progress to class 7, you will need a well to draw from for further recessionary loss in the lateral humps and other areas.

 

We have no idea what your donor density is but my guess is that it is average. Your hair caliber appears medium at best. But you obviously have 3500-4000 grafts to start with hands down!

 

And I also see some retro-grade alopecia going on but your donor appears to have enough grafts to make a significant cosmetic improvement. Your occipital zone appears stable but remember, that's based on photos and not a microscopic exam. You definitely want that done beforehand.

 

You can start with a 3,000 to say 3500 graft session, wait a year and see how you like it. You never know, you may be a happy camper because you know your limitations and your goals are realistic IMHO. It's not like you are asking for a stormin full head of hair right?

 

So why not go for it?...

 

Wish you the best whichever way you decide to go. The toughest part of the decision will be whether you want to do FUE or FUHT on your first procedure because if you do progress to a Norwood 7, you can still buzz your scalp and not have a strip scar.

[Spanker]

Before I posted here I pretty much thought I wouldn?t loose that much more hair, but now I realize that I will most certain loose more, maybe alot more than I think.. Thank you really for your comments and of course you?re right with that I should plan this really carefully. What steps to take.

 

One thing I?ve wished for is to just accept the baldness, shave it all off and live my life. I?ve tried it but it become the start of 10 years with stress, anxiety and major depressions. I know it?s all in my mind, I wish that I could face it better but I can?t.

 

I also wondering how using hairpiece affects the hairs that are under and close to the system. I use glue, and the scalp is getting pretty dry.

 

I strongly advice not wearing a piece over transplanted until it's grown. If you absolutely must, I would wait several weeks and then use g2b glue, not really system glue. You should discuss that with your doc.

 

Good luck!

[Chewy]

Brutus, you look like you will be at least a 6A. You have more your going to lose IMO. It is good, if you are willing to have a bald crown, and if a very conservative approach was taken, then you might find yourself happy.

Brutus I personally believe you need to make very sure you want to go this route. IMO, it will be at least 2 procedures over the next 10 years. This means your initial result will degrade as you lose more hair which I think will occur. You would probably be consumed with this for quite some time.

We all are different, and so no way to tell you what will make you happy, but if you want to pursue the HT route, make sure you get multiple consults from ethical and well qualified surgeons. Good Luck.

[Mick50]

Obviously as a N6 Brutus will not gain a full head of hair again , but I was a NW5-6 and I am more than happy with my result after one session, people keep talking about him losing more hair but to my eyes the guy is completely bald on top and actually is at the point when he should pull the trigger ,OK he's still young but

I've always understood age 34 is in no way too young to consider hair transplant surgery,his sides and crown may expand but that can be dealt with in the second surgery which I imagine he will need ,as long as he goes to a good Doc I think he can can get a satisfactory result

He seems to have realistic expectations which actually is the best thing he has going for him

[JON86]

I think Dr Bhatti has given you the best advice. He sees this on a regular basis so I believe what he says. Without meds your future loss is a guarantee . I would think long and hard about going down this road of getting a procedure without meds. Don't let anyone online here or any online consult decide what you do. Meet with doctors in person and be evaluated. Educate yourself as much as you can then make the smart choice.

[Brutus]

Thank you, many good advice. If I would try finasteride, isnt just to stop right away if I would have any sides or can you loose libido permanent after a short while on the med? Have you heard of any regrowth after hairs have been lost for years? Why isnt minoxidil enough? I have thin fuzzy hairs on top for quite some time, can I expect they will be thicker and stronger.

 

When you talk about decent coverage, how many fu/cm2 do you mean? Do you have any pics with different density what to expect?

[Melvin- Admin]

Thank you, many good advice. If I would try finasteride, isnt just to stop right away if I would have any sides or can you loose libido permanent after a short while on the med? Have you heard of any regrowth after hairs have been lost for years? Why isnt minoxidil enough? I have thin fuzzy hairs on top for quite some time, can I expect they will be thicker and stronger.

 

When you talk about decent coverage, how many fu/cm2 do you mean? Do you have any pics with different density what to expect?

 

Post Finasteride Syndrome does exist, how much of it is actual physiology and how much is psychosomatic is unknown. But there have been reports of persistent sexual dysfunction after only a short period of usage. However, this is very RARE, I took Finasteride and I discontinued use after I experienced side effects and I returned to normal. I did however develop some performance anxiety as a result of my experience on Finasteride this in itself can cause sexual dysfunction if not controlled.

 

In my opinion, you should consult with a doctor before deciding whether or not to take Finasteride, remember this is a prescription medication, regrowth typically only happens to those individuals who are in the beginning phase of hair loss. The real only benefit in taking Finasteride for you would be to prevent from becoming a norwood 7, personally I don't think the risk is worth the reward but everyone weighs pros and cons differently so to each his own.

 

Lipogaine is a high quality Minoxidil, it also has some "supposed" DHT blocking ingredients like Saw Palmetto extract, beta-sitosterol,oleic acid, linolenic acid, and its delivered through a Liposome vehicle. I've been on it for about 10 months and ive noticed my hair has improved and my shedding has been greatly reduced compared to just generic Minoxidil. The DHT blocking ingredients may do nothing who knows it doesn't hurt, but I think the real benefit comes from the Liposome vehicle which definitely helps with the absorption of the minoxidil.

[Brutus]

Ok I see.. Ive experience libido-loss from different medications during the years. Antidepressants in general seems to have this sideeffect on me, but lowering the dose has always solved the problem.

 

When I meet a dr for consultation, will he be able to see in a minituarazion test for sure if I will progress to a NW7 or not?

[Melvin- Admin]

Ok I see.. Ive experience libido-loss from different medications during the years. Antidepressants in general seems to have this sideeffect on me, but lowering the dose has always solved the problem.

 

When I meet a dr for consultation, will he be able to see in a minituarazion test for sure if I will progress to a NW7 or not?

 

Oh ok, if you've taken anti depressants that have caused loss of libido and you've been able to continue with treatment, I don't think you'd have a problem with Finasteride. I think anti-depressants also have what's called post SSRI syndrome which is just like Post Finasteride Syndrome so if you haven't developed that then you may not have any issues. Now with the million dollar question for all of us Norwood 6 guys, can you tell if you will progress to a norwood 7, the short answer is not really. The doctor can check for miniaturization around the side fringes or lateral humps this is a usually a good indicator whether or not you will become a norwood 7, but of course the best a surgeon can do is give you an educated guess nothing is certain especially if you have Norwood 7's in your family. I think the older you get the lower the possibility of becoming a Norwood 7 becomes. Dr. Beehner said that there was a study that showed only 10% of Norwood 7 men reached that level at 60 years old.

[Rashid36]

Many people reach norwood 7 and are still able to restore hair at a suitable look.

Problem is if someone had a ht at norwood 6 then lost more hair and didn't have enough in the donor to cover for that.

 

I can only think of 3 options

 

1. beard hair

2. buzz it down

3. smp as a filler

 

Atleast the person would have tried and had some time to enjoy the look

Edited April 17, 2016 by Rashid35

[Brutus]

Okay I understand. Could a person use SMP as a filler if the hair is a couple of inches or would it look strange?

 

My previous question about different density. How many fu/cm2 is decent coverage? Could you post some pics with different density

[Rashid36]

You would have to go over to the SMP section and ask / research there.

Try to look at the pictures and see if that would be suitable for you.

 

Please take a look at the 2 pictures below and let me know if it's worth me taking or trying Finasteride to keep the hair i have,

Htsoon i agree with you but i think i'm norwood 5b heading for possible 6

[Melvin- Admin]

Okay I understand. Could a person use SMP as a filler if the hair is a couple of inches or would it look strange?

 

My previous question about different density. How many fu/cm2 is decent coverage? Could you post some pics with different density

 

SMP could be used as a thickener, I haven't seen this in person though, personally I think SMP is better used on scars like FUE scars. The issue with SMP is you have to continuously have the procedure done every 1-2 years, this could become a financial strain if you're spending 4-5K dollars just to upkeep the result. As for how many FU per cm2, that's difficult because we have all different sized heads, but just to keep it simple lets say the average norwood 6 has 200cm2 of bald scalp. You would need at least 50-45 fu per cm2 in the hairline to create a descent level of density, the amount would then taper off once you move back, leaving the crown with around 15-20fu per cm2. So to have consistent density through the entire scalp of 45 fu per cm2 you would need 9,000 grafts, most simply don't have that many grafts to give so what we could do then is keep more density in the frontal third and midscalp and decrease the density as we move back which would average around 30 fu per cm2 which would equal 6000 grafts. Obviously, this is just to give you an idea, depending on the size of your head you may need more you may need less, I know for myself, I would need about 7,000 grafts to give me 45 fu per cm2 including my crown due to my small headsize.

 

You would have to go over to the SMP section and ask / research there.

Try to look at the pictures and see if that would be suitable for you.

 

Please take a look at the 2 pictures below and let me know if it's worth me taking or trying Finasteride to keep the hair i have,

Htsoon i agree with you but i think i'm norwood 5b heading for possible 6

 

My personal opinion Rashid no, you've lost a lot of hair and the norwood 6 pattern is definitely apparent, you have some residual miniaturized hair that is on its way out, I don't think propecia will be able to return that hair to thick terminal hair, I believe that you will most likely stay the way you look and that's the real only benefit. For the serious consequences associated with this drug and the reward you would get it is just not worth it to me. If you were to gain all of your hair back to how you used to look then I would say Heck Yes take it, but to stay the same which is still bald and potentially risk getting really bad side effects, the pay out is just not big enough. If you were a Norwood II that was 22 years old thinking of getting an HT then I would most definitely advise you to take propecia, but at 35 years old Norwood 6 the damage has been done, the Forrest has been burned, there's no use in trying to buy fertilizer to bring back a decimated Forrest, the best thing to do is bring in new trees to replace the dead ones and hope no more fires occur. I would rather risk another fire then risk poisoning the land i hope that analogy makes sense.

[Spanker]

You would have to go over to the SMP section and ask / research there.

Try to look at the pictures and see if that would be suitable for you.

 

Please take a look at the 2 pictures below and let me know if it's worth me taking or trying Finasteride to keep the hair i have,

Htsoon i agree with you but i think i'm norwood 5b heading for possible 6

 

Absolutely without a doubt if you are interested in saving the hair you have, you should consider finasteride.

[Brutus]

SMP could be used as a thickener, I haven't seen this in person though, personally I think SMP is better used on scars like FUE scars. The issue with SMP is you have to continuously have the procedure done every 1-2 years, this could become a financial strain if you're spending 4-5K dollars just to upkeep the result. As for how many FU per cm2, that's difficult because we have all different sized heads, but just to keep it simple lets say the average norwood 6 has 200cm2 of bald scalp. You would need at least 50-45 fu per cm2 in the hairline to create a descent level of density, the amount would then taper off once you move back, leaving the crown with around 15-20fu per cm2. So to have consistent density through the entire scalp of 45 fu per cm2 you would need 9,000 grafts, most simply don't have that many grafts to give so what we could do then is keep more density in the frontal third and midscalp and decrease the density as we move back which would average around 30 fu per cm2 which would equal 6000 grafts. Obviously, this is just to give you an idea, depending on the size of your head you may need more you may need less, I know for myself, I would need about 7,000 grafts to give me 45 fu per cm2 including my crown due to my small headsize.

 

 

 

What do you think the density as in the crown in this link that was posted earlier in the thread?

http://www.hairrestorationnetwork.com/eve/183066-dr-carlos-k-wesley-replacing-toupee-beard-fue-scalp-fut.html

[Melvin- Admin]

What do you think the density as in the crown in this link that was posted earlier in the thread?

http://www.hairrestorationnetwork.com/eve/183066-dr-carlos-k-wesley-replacing-toupee-beard-fue-scalp-fut.html

 

I think it looks great, its very low in density but I think this is a reasonable result for any norwood 6. It looks like he has some grafts left just in case he experiences further recession of the lateral humps. Very well executed strategy and plan.

[Rashid36]

Yes i agree with you HTsoon, i think i might give Lipogaine a try and see how i get on with it

 

In the mean time take a look at what i've noticed after using monoxidil 5% and Nizarol 2% for around 1 and a half months

 

http://www.hairrestorationnetwork.com/eve/183189-treatment-update.html

[Brutus]

Rashid, it looks to me that your hair is thicker after you?ve used the products. Can it work that fast? I read that the hairs normally shed in the beginning and later on it grows more thicker, stronger hairs?

 

I?m tempted to try minox or lipogaine. But where do you think I should apply it, is it wasted to try in hairline or crown? Or should I focus on the edges where the minituarization is?

[Rashid36]

In the front and mid scalp it seems to have got thicker and healthy looking no growth but tiny little hairs that could have been there before.

 

In the crown there is regrowth, i cannot believe this and with just 1 and half months of use. I seem to have had a very good reaction. There has been no shedding just regrowth.

 

Alot of people have hair that can be stimulated back to grow.

 

Now I'm thinking what if i add propecia and prp therapy for any possible benefit would be even better.

 

I'm not sure if it is only down to any one particular thing I've been doing but as the picture shows the crown before and after clear regrowth.

[Phab]

@Melvin-ModeratorI read here that you stopped taking finasteride. In my other thread, I report that I also stopped fin but that it led to further loss of hair after I already had a successful HT. Now my hair looks worse than before HT. So I've decided today to give it another try, back to fin and take half pill or start with least 1/4. Since you posted here that you stopped fin in 2016, I'd like to know if you have any updates about your hair as well, and if you went back to fin as well

Edited March 15, 2021 by Phab