Dr. Umar

[Ryan123]

Hi Guys,

 

Looks like after doing lots of research I will be going with Dr. Umar. He says he can do 10000 grafts in one session and another 10000 grafts after 6 or 7 months. I will be broke but worth it at the end hopefully. I would appreciate it if someone could give me some opinion?

 

Thanks

[aaron1234]

Ryan123,

 

Well holy crap that's a huge plan!!!!

 

I know Dr. Umar looks after his patients so I think you'll be fine. I do think you might want to space out the two procedures a bit more - even if you are just doing FUE and BHT. Give it closer to a year between procedures so you can really see what you need to address in the second op. Hair still continues to mature between 6 and 12 months post-op. Please please keep us posted with some pics. When are you going in for round #1?

[orlhair1]

Are you sure about your 10K grafts? I think your count is off. No one has 20,000 grafts available to be transplanted. Normally there are no more than 6,000 to 8,000 grafts total available to be transplanted. Some have less than that while a few may have a bit more.

[Sparky]

He is including bht, depending on how hairy he is, potentially he could have a lot more hair on the rest of his body, than on his head.

[scar5]

!! One body hair graft = 1/4 of a head hair graft if you are lucky!!!

!! One nape hair graft= 1/2 of a head graft of hair!!

!!One whisker graft = 2-3 head hair grafts!!

 

This is all my opinion and I have no experience or sense what so ever!! So take it with a grain of salt. And I say under my breath, God protect me and this forum from Umar's shills!!

 

I think Dr. Umar is great for what he does.

 

But with 20000 grafts, you are really paying for less than 10000 head grafts.

Why so?

 

Think hairs, not grafts. Body hairs in particular, are usually singles and spend a much longer time in resting phase. They grow, wirey and thin (when they grow) and the best you can get with them is a kind of thinnish 'mesh' that does not create the illusion very well, because they don't 'behave' as head hair. Whisker hair, on the other hand is the opposite. It is strong, straight and bold, standing out like little statues in the desert, but blending in well enough with a jungle, and very good for disguising strip scars, if the patient grows the hair out a little.

 

I dunno man. I would max out the head hair, then whiskers, then start body hair, in that order. And I would hope I wouldn't need to to the third option to be frank.

 

If you like a short cut, consider Umar as a great doc and ask him to spread the hair flat on your head?? Just an idea. If you have the money to burn, then by all means, BHT but I'm a bit iffy on its effectiveness to actually make your noggin better to the extent it makes your bank account worse.

Edited August 24, 2011 by scar5

[aaron1234]

I dunno man. I would max out the head hair, then whiskers, then start body hair, in that order. And I would hope I wouldn't need to to the third option to be frank.

 

I totally agree. That's my long term approach. And no doubt that body hairs are less cosmetically acceptable than scalp hairs. But I am positive that Dr. Umar will be throwing a lot of scalp hairs in the mix.

[Ryan123]

Hi Scar5,

 

thank you so much for your info, I really appreciate it. Also I am not rich, my hairloss has been bothering me for the past 6 years and now I have reached a stage where I will only be happy if I have hair in my head, even if i have to burrow. I have explained it to Dr. Umar. I will however ask him to do harvesting in the orders you mentioned and I will get his reponse. Will keep you posted.

 

Thanks for the heads up.

[Sean]

I definitely think it is possible. I have seen Dr. Umar's results with body hair, beard hair, and head hair combinations. He can make a Norwood 6 to Norwood 0 basically. I think he is capable. Just look at his results on major cases and or cases with disfigurement by other surgeons (repair case). Whatever the case may be, 20,000 grafts can do the job and probably "in some cases" surpass the quality and look of some patients who get 4000-5000 grafts (on similar norwood scale) using just head hair depending on their level of baldness. This method of beard, body, and head hair combo is deadly and it's shown to be effective in helping people get their hair back. Whether Ryan123 decides to go with Umar or not, I think with that 20,000 graft goal including body hair and beard hair would make a significant change on his scalp. Obviously putting body hairs and beard hairs in just one region ALONE may make the transplant look funky. However, if Umar is mixing the scalp hairs amongst body hairs and beard hairs and scalp hairs which he usually does, I think he pulls it off well. He uses these other hairs as filler hairs to add density and etc, while the scalp hairs are used as the foundation of the hairline and etc. Thus, it helps those who lack enough donor supply or those who are higher on the norwood scale. They are able to pull off dense looks.

[Guest mariewoltz25411697]

I have a question. Is the survival rate of the body hair same as the head hair? If so, the other problems with BHT are body hair being thin and resting for longer periods. I don't think this is big of a deal compared to the benefits of density. Given such scenario, I wonder why BHT is not a mainstream technique for high Norwood scales. Why only one surgeon (Umar) performs it?

Edited August 25, 2011 by mariewoltz25411697

[Sean]

I have a question. Is the survival rate of the body hair same as the head hair? If so, the other problems with BHT are body hair being thin and resting for longer periods. I don't think this is big of a deal compared to the benefits of density. Given such scenario, I wonder why BHT is not a mainstream technique for high Norwood scales. Why only one surgeon (Umar) performs it?

 

 

Well, my guess is that survival rate may be better than head hair. This is from my own observation. When I was younger, I did not have any hairs on my shoulder or my upper back, but as I got older, they just sprouted out of no where. Same goes for older men, they seem to have an increase in body hair as they age. People who's backs were not covered are covered and you can witness this on sunny days at the beaches. From shoulders to back to front, it seems as you age, more body hair sprout up. So, the survival is pretty good I think. Hell, you can even see ear hair on older folks sprout up and even wild eyebrow hair. There is an issue with resting phases I have read about, but not all body hair rests at the same time from what I have read. I don't think body hair alone is such a mainstream focus as it does appear different in texture. Some studies do suggest it grows longer on the scalp in length but the texture is still different. But in combination with beard hair and as filler hair it can be used successfully. I think Umar performs it since he is a licensed dermatologist as well. He knows all about skin issues as well as hair and is able to extract body hairs successfully from areas where some people might be hesitant due to scarring or may not be experienced to do so. But being an expert in dermatology, he might be able to reduce scarring through is own extraction process from the body and beard area. This could be a reason I just don't know. It's a time consuming process but Umar can extract tons of grafts in one sitting, He basically can implant like 3500+ grafts a day or something. I don't know what he is doing or how he is doing it but it is working and you can see it on his patients. He hasn't really spoken about his process and what he researched to do what he is able to do today, but it is working. I think if more and more people found out his technique they will be able to do the same, until then, he is pretty much the only one that I have seen successfully do it, and openly do it. There are guys on here that have done over 5000 grafts with him that achieved a thicker fuller look with his combo methods.

[hairthere]

ryan, Have you seen BHT results in person? If not I would highly recommend you do so to be sure it is the right path for you.

[TC17]

If your avatar is an actual picture of your hair loss, and you were born in 1984, then under no circumstances should you have a hair transplant.

[Ryan123]

Hairthere, I have not seen anyone with BHT but I have seen videos, which they looked cool, I might be able to meet someone who had done that but he is in different country.can you kindly explain your opinion about BHT?

 

TC17, that is my bald head and I am indeed born in 84 - please help me why you think i should nt have an HT?

[TC17]

Because quite simply, you are too bald and too young to be a suitable candidate for a surgery. Hair transplantation isn't for everyone, and it would be a damn shame if you invested money, emotion, and time in a procedure that ultimately will leave you dissatisfied. I have never seen a person with your degree of loss have anything close to a satisfactory result for a person in his 20's. The only time a person with your degree of hair loss should even consider a surgery is if that person is willing to rock an ultra conservative frontal forelock pattern. Sadly, that would look ridiculous on anyone under the age of 50, at the absolute youngest.

 

If you decide to proceed with Dr. Umar I wish you nothing but the best, but I would see if Dr. Umar is willing to guarantee survival and growth of the body hair.

[Jotronic]

Here's the problem, or at least some of the problems, with so much body hair for so much hair loss like yours. It will look like body hair on your head. It will not look like head hair. It will not behave like head hair. If for any unusual reason you are able to grow the body hair on your head to any length it will still look like body hair. You will essentially be stuck with two hair styles. Real short and damned short.

 

From your profile photo I can see that you wear a hair system and you still have hair on the top in the front, it's just shaved. You should shave the rest of your head to see if you like it and just move on. Work out, get ripped, shave your head.

 

Btw, being born in 1984 means you are about 27. Ever try Propecia? If not you should and if you aren't going to try it because you are afraid of the side effects, which are grossly overblown, then you are not serious about fighting your hair loss. No one should touch a 27 year old virgion scalp with so much body hair. BHT should be a last resort option for repair patients and those that are in desperate need of more hair but have exhausted more reliable and natural means of restoration with actual head hair.

[Sean]

I agree with what everyone has to say. They make their points valid as well and that's what makes the forum a great place to get help.

 

I think the bottom line is that this person wants hair. If someone has lost a substantial amount of hair at a young age, that should not be a disqualification for a transplant. It just depends on what surgeons would be willing to do or able to do to help patients and to find ways to help them. Granted hair quality can differ depending on the hair characteristics of the body/beard/scalp hair from each different person to another, for some the combination may work, for some it might not work as well. I would not advise strip though on those at young age with extensive hairloss because you just don't know how far you can bald, and later on some people may just end up keeping their hair short (i'm talking about vin diesal type hair, jamie fox type hair, etc). However, if you are young and face extensive hair loss & you do strip, then continue to lose hair and ran out of donor, then want to keep your hair short later because you can't deal with the continuation of hair loss, you really have to watch out for the linear scar. Granted some doctors can keep the scar at very minimal levels, some say hardly detectable, however, that scar will show one way or another with lower number of clips if you plant to give yourself a really short hair look later with close skin fades. It is true as well, that if you give yourself a michael jordan like waxed head look, tiny fue dots may be visible around your donor area if you get FUE. However, depending on the size of the punch used, you might be able to get away with it better then others that have had FUE with higher punch sizes. That is to say, if a 1mm punch or higher is used, or a .07mm punch etc. That can make a big difference. Technology has changed from what it once was, and most doctors now can successfully use tools using smaller sizes.

 

At the end of the day, it is up to you if you want the hair transplant or not. If you want to take the risk at getting hair back or not and what option you take.

 

To have hair or not to have hair, that is the question. To what extent you are willing to go and what you are willing to do is ultimately up to you. Granted your age is around the same age group as me, I just can't deal with waiting to get a transplant later. It has been bothering me for the past 10 years. I'd like to at least move on with my life with some peace, rather then thinking about it all the time. So, I decided to go with FUE with Dr. Rahal. I'm relying on technological advances in surgical methods and medications for the future, but trying to make the best out of what is available right now to get a control of the condition. I am not even too concerned about my crown area right now, as I would like to make the front of my scalp stand out. I'd like to establish that frontal area, and then worry about the crown later if I have to depending on medications.

 

Do you have any more photos of your current hair loss? Are you in a barber's chair in that photo you have up by any chance? It seems like you are since there is a yellow cover around you. Were they shaving your head by any chance?

[aaron1234]

Ryan,

 

It looks like you keep your hair on top real short - maybe to wear a system like Joe presumed. I wonder what it would look like grown out. I see a lot of short stubble on top. And if you do start Finasteride you might have more hair on top then we can see right now in your picture. Granted, it looks like you are heading to a NW7, but you might have some hair to save right now. More pictures could really help us get a better idea.

 

Look at HairToday72's pics. He has mostly beard and scalp hair with some body hair mixed in. He was a NW7 and you might look a bit like him after a first round. I really think his appearance improved with his procedure with Dr. Umar. I'm really curious to hear Dr. Umar's strategy for you.

 

You might also want to look at Dr. Rassman's SMP (scalp micro-pigmentation). It is new and controversial for good reason, but if you want to explore all options then that is one. It might turn out very well mixed in with some FUE.

[Sean]

I concur with most of what Aaron said. Now, you were estimating around 20,000 grafts, HairToday72 I think had 7500Grafts with the mix. At this point I do not think you are that level of Norwood. AND there does seem to be lots of stubble on top of your scalp, do you have pics of it grown out? so, if you were to get the number of grafts you were quoted, that might make a big difference. Depending on the texture of your hairs, who knows, but wish you all the best.

[Ryan123]

Hi all,

 

Thank you so much for all your comments. I have added more of my hairloss pictures, please note that is in the hair replacement saloon after1 week of shaving my head. Unfortuantely I cannot grow my hair long, bevause i am wearing a hair piece.

 

TC17 - you are right that HT is not for me, thats why when I started loosing my hair, i started using hair piece, to be honest I could not shave my head because it just doesnt suit me. since I am hairy guy, I need to have hair on my head. Now i want to get rid of the hair piece since it has really started to annoy me after 5 years. I feel I look fake as a person. TC17 my expectation from this surgery is to have hair, so when a stranger on the street or when I go to a meeting people dont say I am bald. I am planing to keep my hair short, however there will be hair on my scalp. I have been in touch with Dr. Umar and we have almost agreed to do 7500-10000(max) on the front and after 3 months 7500-10000 on the crown area. (however he requested some more pictures from me from when I was young and with a hair piece to confirm the numbers). Do you still think I will be devastated with the result. I just dont want to look bald anymore. after this two procedure, you think I will still look bald?

 

Jotronic - thank you for your comment. Shaved head does not suit me, my head will look like a Dxxx. I have tried the propecia and it did not work on me. I do work out and I am ripped but still need hair. Jotronic, I know you trying to tell me to grow some balls and shave my head, but to be frank if i shave my head and get brad bitts body, I will look 40, with the hair piece i look 24. Dr. Umar is going to use body hair and head hair and beard hair and hopefully and mix them up. I have seen some video where out of fairness it looked great. I yet have to meet someone in person to see if the videos are reliable or not.

 

Aaron and Sean - I uploaded my pictures, yes I am not completely bald and I have some hair, so thats why I am hoping that with Dr. Umar, I will be able to get some density. As i mentioned in above points the pictures are taking in hair replacement saloon.

 

Again thank you all in the forum for your opinion and comments and I have to be honest I am getting 50% negative vide and 30% postive Vibes and 20% neutral. I am really confused still, but the way I see it, there are two options I have.

 

1. to get this mega session BHT and keep my hair short so I can fool people that i have full head of hair

2. continue using my hair piece for another 5 years and hopefully new technolgy will come out in future.

 

I D be happy to hear for anyone to comment or maybe I ma just being too stupid and emotional.

 

Cheers

[orlhair1]

At the end of the day you have to decide what you are comfortable with. There are no guarantees in the HT world and once you go down the path of surgery it is a long term commitment. BHT adds another component to your chances for an outcome you will be happy with. You have to live with the results whether you are satisfied or not. I don't think anyone is trying to be negative.....just trying to give you all the information so you don't make an emotional decision and regret it. You will always get a wide range of opinions and you have received a lot of very good information from some very knowledgeable people. If after weighing all the pros and cons you and you decide to go forward, I wish you the best.

[Ryan123]

My apologies if I said "negative" vibe, what I was trying to say is that after getting lots of information from expereinced people on this forum, I am getting a vibe that it is not for me. Noone is been negative and everyone is been sharing their opinion and I am thankful to this forum.

 

You see this decision involves lot of money, comitment, energy and time, thats why I want to discuss it more with knowledagble people on this forum specially the ones who disagree that HT is not for me.

 

thanks

[RodG]

Hi Ryan,

 

How much is the transplant going to cost?

 

What sort of backup is Doctor Umar able to offer if you have a substandard result?

 

What type of coverage do you want? Are you after a full head of hair? Can you live with a result that may be a little see thru?

 

I had a HT a year ago and had 3743 grafts. I was basically a Norwood VI. I have had a major improvement but I do not have full coverage and my hair is a bit see thru but nontheless I'm happy. I'm 50 years old though.

 

I really feel for you being such a young age with significant hairloss. If you can afford it and believe that Doctor Umar is going to back his results then you could try one session and see how it goes.

 

Good luck buddy,

 

Regards Rod

[aaron1234]

Thanks for posting more pics Ryan. A couple more things now:

 

1) You have quite a bit of hair on top to save. If Propecia or 1/4th's Proscar didn't give you side effects before then get back on the drug. If you did get side effects, try doing a half dosage or every other day. Like Joe said before, if you really want to keep your hair then this is basically a must.

 

2) Your donor hair looks pretty healthy to me. You may even want to do an IN-PERSON consult with a clinic that specializes in mega-sessions (i.e. H&W). You should explore all options before diving into BHT even if you think strip is not for you.

 

3) If I'm correct to assume you have quality donor hair then I am sure your experience with Umar will include a majority of scalp hairs over body hairs. He would probably include nape hair into that which is not DHT resistant - but at least it's not pubic hair.

 

4) You do have a larger then average head - so that's more real estate to cover. You probably won't get too much coverage on the crown.

 

I'm not exactly sure how Dr. Umar would approach your case. I would see as many of his patients in person as possible before going into it. I hope the variety of opinions on this thread is giving a lot of food for thought. No one is trying to negative - just honest.

Edited August 28, 2011 by aaron1234

[Ryan123]

Hi RodG,

 

thanks for your questions. As for the cost, I will be able to tell you by next week. Back up, he told me that the best available donor would be used for my transplants. Whatever is left can be used in the future. Given my density and coverage needs, choice hair should not be spared in anticipation of surgery 5 years down the road. I have plenty body hair that may hopefully serve me in the future.

 

I am expecting not to look bald. You see I started wearing the hair system at age 21, I went to many hair replacement places and they said you have hair, its a shame and unethical for us to shave your head. However I was young and stupid and went and did with another place. Aaron, thank you for pushing with propecia, I will go buy it today. I just came back from my hair replacement place and realised how much thin hair i have left. I hope with trying the propecia I wll be able to keep them and with two surgeries of 15000 - 20000 grafts get my hair back. My expectation as I have said before is not to look bald and with the little hair that i have and with a mega session I think I will achieve the density than others in norwood 6 and in strangers eyes, I will have hair.. dont you agree? thats what i am hoping for at least?

 

I saw a video of 20000 grafts done by Dr Umar but they guy was completely bald and he got a great result - I have more hair than him so with 20000 grafts I will be happy if i get better result than him

 

Aaron all your points are valid and thank you again for bring up the propecia.

[aaron1234]

Aaron all your points are valid and thank you again for bring up the propecia.

 

No problem my friend. Just remember that to get full results from it you have to stay on it. Period! Your hair outlook is far more promising on finasteride. Don't buy into the side effect hype. It's a minority that experiences side effects - a very loud minority though.