8 Month Update: Dr. Dorin 1,696 FUT

[corvettester]

8 Month Update: Dr. Dorin 1,696 FUT

Here’s a brief breakdown of the major elements of my HT followed by my analysis and plan of action.

 

Right Temple: Looking great. Excellent result for 1,700 grafts.

 

Left Temple: Still lagging behind the right in both maturity and growth by approximately 20%. By now, it’s probably safe to say that it won’t get as good of a yield as the right side. Dr. Dorin concurs.

 

Immediate Center Hairline: Still the sour apple of the bunch. Poor growth yield. Dr. Dorin agrees that it is not up to his usual standards. He is committed to making it right though.

 

Left Temple Point: Looking great. Excellent Result.

 

Right Temple Point: Almost no yield. Looks the same as before my HT. Dr. Dorin agrees.

 

Scar: Pretty refined for the most part. There is one section about 3” in length in the back, right side that has stretched a little, perhaps 2-2.5mm. Dr. Dorin wants to revise this section. The rest of it looks very refined and I’m quite pleased. To me, it’s not that big of a deal. Some people stretch, some don’t. Those that do, have to go back for scar revision—tough luck!

 

 

Analysis & Plan of Action:

Today Dr. Dorin gave me the go ahead for a second procedure, which I will undergo next week. I have known from the beginning that I would need two procedures for my hairline and temples, as I wanted to play it safe and take the conservative route.

 

I’m very pleased that I get to have it done so soon. I really didn’t want to have to wait a full year before getting my second pass. My reasoning is that since I already know I will need a second HT, why wait? Let’s get it done as soon as safely possible so that I can have my final result by next summer… I’m not getting any younger after all! So I feel fortunate that Dr. Dorin happened to have an opening in his schedule next week, otherwise I would have had to wait until mid to late July.

 

That being so, next week I will undergo a second FUT procedure of approximately 1,800 – 2,000 grafts. The aim of which is two-fold: first, to shore up where the first HT fell short; second, to add density to the hairline and temples, thereby bringing it closer to the native density.

 

Dr. Dorin was very generous in unconditionally offering me a complimentary procedure of however many grafts I felt necessary to get the result I wanted for my first HT, including any extra I desired for density for a second HT. He said that he treats all his patients like family and that if I wasn’t 100% satisfied with the result, then he would see to it that I was.

 

For this reason, even though I was already planning on getting a second HT for density regardless of the outcome of my first HT, Dr. Dorin offered to do it free of charge. I certainly don’t need 1,800-2,000 to shore up my first HT.

 

Just to be clear, I do not believe that my first HT is a failure by any means. My result is simply less than optimal in certain areas such as the immediate center of the hairline, the left temple, and the right temple point.

 

Dr. Dorin was very gracious in his explanation of the possible causes of my poor yield. He explored all possible variables including technician/physician error and at no point did he shy from taking responsibility. This to me shows a physicians commitment to his patients and I believe is the gold standard of care when things don’t end up just right.

 

In all fairness, there really are a lot of unknowns. He said my results are rare and kind of quirky. Therefore, I don’t think it fair to assume technician/physician error any more than it is to assume physiological limitations. I’m willing to meet him half way on this one.

 

For example, one of the oddities of my HT is that my right temple came out so well, but the left fell short. Yet the left temple point came out perfect, while the right temple point had almost no growth whatsoever! I really don’t know what to make of it; there are simply too many variables involved. Either way, Dr. Dorin made it very clear from the beginning that if things didn’t turn out as I wanted them, that he would make it right.

 

So to be perfectly honest, I’m not really worried or even disappointed at this point. The way my mind works is that there is simply no point in wasting time on regrets, “what ifs” and pointing fingers because there is no way to change the past. I need to move forward, period. Of course, all of this is predicated upon the knowledge that my doctor stands behind his work unconditionally.

 

Thus, with the second procedure we will shore up whatever didn’t turn out well enough in the first HT and we’ll add to the density to make it look more like my native hair as originally planned.

 

I have felt very supported by Dr. Dorin and his staff since day one. At no point have I felt left out in the cold on any issue or concern, no matter how minor. I have had full access to the doctor and his team since then and have taken full advantage of his post-op hospitality by going in for bi-monthly check-up and photos since my HT.

 

As for my second procedure, we’re going to weigh the left temple area down with even more grafts. I part my hair on the left so it’s essential that it is well covered as it is the most exposed area of my entire hairline. Also, we’re going to really focus on my hairline in the immediate center due to its low yield.

 

Further, I requested that we smooth out the jagged hairline that Dr. Dorin originally designed because I personally prefer hairlines that are more contoured. I’ve debated this matter with several people and I’ve concluded that it’s really just a matter of taste. Some docs prefer jagged hairlines, others prefer contoured hairline. I want mine to be somewhere in between the two—simply a personal preference for which Dr. Dorin is glad to accommodate me.

 

I’m very happy with the way Dr. Dorin has handled my case so far and I look forward to my second procedure with him next week. He said that I could be certain that a second pass would give me the density that I wanted and shore up where the first HT fell short.

 

Long story short, I have complete faith in Dr. Dorin. He made it abundantly clear to me that he wants me to be happy with my result. He meant it too. It’s not about the money for him, otherwise, he would not have offered me a complimentary touch-up procedure and second pass. To me, his generosity epitomizes his integrity and his confidence in his ability to perform URFUT.

 

 

Corvettester

Edited June 16, 2011 by corvettester

[corvettester]

To see photos please view my HTN User Profile, 8 Month Update Folder.

 

My Hair Loss Website is giving me issues with uploading photos. Once I resolve it, I'll post pics with commentary.

 

Corvettester

[Blake Bloxham]

Corvettester,

 

Thank you for keeping us updated. While I definitely always recommend that hair transplant patients want a full year before assessing their final yield (at 12 months, growth is approximately at 100% whereas at 8 months, for example, it's estimated closer to 60%), I definitely trust Dr. Dorin's expert opinion and I'm pleased that he's taking care of the situation. Good luck! I look forward to future updates.

[Dutch]

Glad to hear that Dorin is standing by his work& is looking after you free of charge

[Spanker]

I am happy for you that Dr. Dorin is standing by his work.I would not consider it a terrible result but it is good to know that his standards are that high. Are you confident enough that you will experience little further loss to use that many grafts on such a small area? That is almost 1/2 your grafts. I know you know what you are doing but I just wnated to know your thoughts on this.

Edited June 15, 2011 by Spanker

[corvettester]

I am happy for you that Dr. Dorin is standing by his work.I would not consider it a terrible result but it is good to know that his standards are that high. Are you confident enough that you will experience little further loss to use that many grafts on such a small area? That is almost 1/2 your grafts. I know you know what you are doing but I just wnated to know your thoughts on this.

 

Yes, Dr. Dorin's standards are high. He was the first to admit that it wasn't up to his standards.

 

Your points are well taken on my donor availability. Including FUE, I had a total of approximately 8,000 grafts available. After this second procedure, I should have another 4,500 or so to tide me over if things get worse down the line. I don't have much MPB in my family though. Of course, there are no guarantees as we all know.

 

Either way, in my opinion it's pointless to go for the illusion of density in the hairline. I want a dense hairline. If my hair loss continues, then I will go much less aggressive in the back. At that point, I will aim for the illusion of density.

 

 

Corvettester

[Levrais]

Corvettester,

Good luck next week. I've been following your progress since you're about a month ahaed of me. Coincidently I'm going in for #2 next month. Like you I have a small area that may need a little touch up but I'm wondering if I should wait until the12 month mark. Do you think it's possible that you have late bloomers that might pop through but could be damaged by implanting new grafts at month 8? Just wondering as I would really like to be done my next summer as well. I look forward to you next updates.

[corvettester]

Like you I have a small area that may need a little touch up but I'm wondering if I should wait until the12 month mark. Do you think it's possible that you have late bloomers that might pop through but could be damaged by implanting new grafts at month 8? Just wondering as I would really like to be done my next summer as well.

 

I’ve been following your case as well, Levrais. Your result is really something! No doubt, Dr. Bisanga is a top doc. I like to follow doctors not affiliated with the HTN such as Bisanga, Epstein, Unger, etc…

 

As for my case, I consulted with four separate doctors and all agreed that I could go back for my second HT at 8 months post-op at the earliest.

 

If you already know for sure that you're going to need a touch up, then I don't see the point in waiting the full year. What difference would it make? You’re not getting any younger.

 

As for damaging the late bloomers, I really haven't seen or heard of anyone who had significant growth after 8 months... Maturity, yes! New growth, nope! Every doctor I’ve ever spoken to, except one, has said not to expect any new growth after 8 months (the one exception said no new growth after 9 months). However, maturing will last up to 18 months.

 

You do have to remember your recently transplanted hairs will get cut and/or damaged (not the follicle unit, but the actual hair above the skin) during the next procedure. This is because the doctor has to go back and squeeze more grafts in between the old ones—it will all grow back though. This is not the same as transection. It’s nothing to worry about. I’m sure your doctor will explain it to you.

 

Good luck with your second procedure to Levrais.

 

 

Corvettester

[multiplier]

Looks good to me, man. Both in the sense that it looks natural, but also that it does not look noticeably "thinning" except in the eyes of you and maybe others who have thinning hair. Otherwise, pretty subtle, and the rest of your hair looks (enviably) great. That's a great sign that Dr Dorin is communicative and wants to help get you to where you want to be.

[corvettester]

Thanks Multiplier.

 

Yes, the transplanted hair that has matured the most looks very natural. So I'm sure I just have to wait a little longer for the left side to catch up in maturity and all will be well.

 

Yes, Dr. Dorin has been nothing but supportive, helpful and honest.

 

 

Corvettester

[salami]

Nice update Corvettester.

 

I have a procedure with Dr. Dorin next week as well. I had 2 consults with him, and I concur with everything you said about him.

 

Good luck with your second procedure.

[Levrais]

Thanks corvettester,

Best of luck with the upcoming procedure. I'm sure it's going to look great. With your hair characteristics it looks good now even with the deficient areas so you can't grow wrong.

[aaron1234]

Corv,

 

Your results so far look pretty good. The spots where you say is lagging behind in growth is apparent but not by much. I think another procedure will def do the trick. Though I personally would wait a full 12 months to see how the hair matures before another procedure I think you'll do just fine. Good luck! Thanks for the great pic documentation!

[aaron1234]

btw, your scar looks pretty darn good. Quick question: Maybe you stated this already, but will your next procedure use a donor strip excising the old scar... or will you get a second scar?

[corvettester]

btw, your scar looks pretty darn good. Quick question: Maybe you stated this already, but will your next procedure use a donor strip excising the old scar... or will you get a second scar?

 

 

Donor strip excising, of course!

 

Just 5 days away!!!

 

 

Corvettester

[orlhair1]

Good luck on your second surgery Corvettster!

[bonkerstonker]

Corv I'm pleased you've got a stand up surgeon it's quite rare. How long did you leave your staples in? Are you having surgery 5 days from now?

[corvettester]

Corv I'm pleased you've got a stand up surgeon it's quite rare. How long did you leave your staples in? Are you having surgery 5 days from now?

 

Yes, Dr. Dorin is a stand up guy.

 

T&D use sutures. I left them in for ten days last time. This time around, I might go for two weeks depending on what the doc says.

 

My procedure is this Thursday, June 23rd. I'm psyched!

 

 

Corvettester

[bonkerstonker]

That's awesome, all though maybe I'm being a bit paranoid but if you have grafts under your scalp that haven't sprouted yet isn't it likely they'll be hit in surgery.

[corvettester]

That's awesome, all though maybe I'm being a bit paranoid but if you have grafts under your scalp that haven't sprouted yet isn't it likely they'll be hit in surgery.

 

Fair enough. I'll start a thread on the subject and see what the rest of the community thinks.

 

However, I will say this: I have seen virtually no new growth between month 6 and 8. Most of my growth took place between month 3 and 4.

 

 

Corvettester

[hairthere]

Corvettester, I know we have had our share of differences, but at the same time I have to speak up if I see someone about to undergo a questionable surgery.

 

"I really didn’t want to have to wait a full year before getting my second pass. My reasoning is that since I already know I will need a second HT, why wait?"

 

The reason to wait at least a full year is that you're implanting into an area that has been traumatized and needs time to heal properly. I understand the desire and upsides to getting this done asap, but have you really considered the possible negative impact of doing another procedure so soon? Keep in mind your recipient area now has scar tissue that was not there previously.

 

Also, I know Dr. Dorin explored all the possibilities of why you had poor yield, but he did not offer you a concrete explanation. That would personally worry me a bit.

 

I know how badly you want to be done with this--hairloss can consume our lives and the HT process can wipe away years. But your donor is precious and finite and should be treated as the valuable commodity it is, no matter what your level of hairloss and family history. If you do decide to go through with it I hope you get the results you're looking for.

[corvettester]

Corvettester, I know we have had our share of differences, but at the same time I have to speak up if I see someone about to undergo a questionable surgery.

 

"I really didn’t want to have to wait a full year before getting my second pass. My reasoning is that since I already know I will need a second HT, why wait?"

 

The reason to wait at least a full year is that you're implanting into an area that has been traumatized and needs time to heal properly. I understand the desire and upsides to getting this done asap, but have you really considered the possible negative impact of doing another procedure so soon? Keep in mind your recipient area now has scar tissue that was not there previously.

 

Hairthere,

 

Your points are well taken. I considered the same thing.

 

For this reason, I recently consulted with four HT doctors prior to making my decision (two coalition, one recommended and another not affiliated with HTN). All four said that I would be fine to safely go ahead with a second procedure any time after 8 months. However, one of the four said that he liked to wait 9 months because it's possible to have a little growth between 8 and 9 months.

 

As far as the traumatized recipient and donor area. All the doctors told me that it would be fine by this time.

 

Nothing against you or the community, but I based my decision upon the professional opinion of qualified physicians. Keep in mind, I didn't ask the HT docs if I could get a second pass at 8 months post-op, but rather when was the earliest I could safely do so. Had they told me to wait 10 months, I would have waited until then without stressing it.

 

However, if there are any docs out there who disagree, I'd be glad to hear their thoughts on the matter. I understand that each doctor has his own philosophy, so please feel free to chime in.

 

 

Corvettester

[bonkerstonker]

It seems you've done your home work but I wanted to bring it up as I know when i want something I get tunnel vision and dive in head first without stepping back and thinking.

[corvettester]

Also, I know Dr. Dorin explored all the possibilities of why you had poor yield, but he did not offer you a concrete explanation. That would personally worry me a bit.

 

Hairthere,

 

This statement doesn't sit right with me. Time and time again, I hear doctors and their respective reps emphasizing the fact that FUT is not an exact science and that there are still many unknown variables. Of course, there are certain things that they can know, and when certain things go wrong, sometimes they can pinpoint the cause, sometimes not.

 

Usually when docs cannot figure it out, I see them chalk it up to physiological limitations. I'm not alone in my suspicion that all these "physiological limitation" cases are not quite so simple.

 

It's funny that you stated that not having a concrete explanation would personally worry you. For me, it's almost the exact opposite. I would be very worried if the doc said it was conclusively a physiological limitation.

 

I'd say, if you know for sure, then what evidence do you have to substantiate your claim? I mean, just a year ago you (as well as all the other docs I consulted with) were saying what a great candidate I was for an HT, and now you're saying that I have some sort of physiological limitation that negates that?

 

The same goes for a patient who attributes physician/technician error to a less than optimal result: what evidence do you have to substantiate your claim? Otherwise, let's give each other the benefit of the doubt and try to come to a mutually agreeable solution and plan of action.

 

It's just too easy (and convenient) for a doctor to pass off a less than optimal result to physiological limitations. An outright failure, perhaps, but a lesser yield in certain isolated areas? I don't know about that one... Same goes for patients who want to blame technicians because one side had a little more growth than the other.

 

Lastly, I did not have a poor yield all around. My right side and right temple came out perfect! It looks just great. However, the right temple point had almost no growth whatsoever!

 

Inversely, the left side and left temple has less growth than the right (I estimate by 20%), yet the left temple point came out perfect! WTF?

 

The immediate center of the hairline, an area about 2-3 inches in length, has the poor yield. I'm definitely not satisfied with it.

 

How does one explain all this?

 

Dr. Dorin explored in-depth all the possibilities for this result with me. In the end, he said that my result was rare and kind of quirky, but it's not a bad result. It's certainly not a failure. It's less than optimal in certain areas, but a success in certain other areas. Most people keep telling me what a great result I have and how happy I should be! To date, I haven't heard anyone criticize my result. Thus, I appreciate Dr. Dorin's candid and honest explanation... no pretensions or prevarications with him.

 

 

 

Corvettester

Edited June 21, 2011 by corvettester

[hairthere]

The physiological limitation you have now is the scarring in the recipient area. That's what would concern me most and make me hold off on another surgery, at least a year. Again, hope it turns out as you hope.