Eugenix 3514 grafts (720 on the temples) May 2022 Dr Priyadarshini Das

[GeneralNorwood]

36 minutes ago, asterix0 said:

Yeah, I think that looks better personally than what you have now. Just trying to be honest and helpful. 

If you like your current style better then disregard my opinion 🙂

 People from real life often commented about this hairstyle "why front is so dense and the rest is so flat". In 3D it really looks weird. 

Now when i buzzed everything,i think it looks more neat. But neither of this hairstyles is perfect.

 

Since i'm back to dermapen and topical minoxidil 5%, i am going to monitor growth on this lateral humps. If something improves, maybe i will grow longer hairstyle. 

Edited February 5 by GeneralNorwood

[dba]

1 hour ago, GeneralNorwood said:

 People from real life often commented about this hairstyle "why front is so dense and the rest is so flat". In 3D it really looks weird. 

Now when i buzzed everything,i think it looks more neat. But neither of this hairstyles is perfect.

 

Since i'm back to dermapen and topical minoxidil 5%, i am going to monitor growth on this lateral humps. If something improves, maybe i will grow longer hairstyle. 

Sorry quick question could you show me the frontal hairline density from front view please?

 

Also how come they didn't do the mid? Coz yeah I see what your saying now but if the mid scalp gets filled a bit man , extra for fight club next movie for sure 

[GeneralNorwood]

Nearly 2 months passed since last update and i see some benefit of using minoxidil twice a day and weekly microneedling on the bald scalp. However nothing magical happened of course, miniaturised hair are miniaturised hair, they have their limits. 

I didn't shave top since 3 months, so you can get the idea how weak miniaturised hair are.

I was only shaving sides and back of the head and transplanted hair, so generally i was shaving stronger hair which are growing so much faster then miniaturised hair. However i didn't shave "stronger hair" since few weeks.

 

 

 

 

 

The disconnection is the worst, that's my priority to fix : 

 

Here disconnection maybe looks smaller, but it is still there : 

 

 

 

 

And super bend backwards: 

 

 

I didn't shave donor recently, because i am preapering for the next consultation. I hope it will be the last one!

 

Edited March 20 by GeneralNorwood

[bigmistake]

@GeneralNorwood if you will shave your head, then can you please share pictures of donor scars from your FUE surgery. Both in the sides above the ears and in the donor

[Bandit90]

Just looking at your recent update. It’s surreal because you have the same progression of hair loss as I did. Similar to yours mine just seemed to thin out, wish I kept some old photos to show. It’s the first time I’ve seen another user have this pattern on HRN. Also looks like we have a very similar final hair loss pattern and hair characteristics too. I know you’ve mentioned previously that you’re not the biggest advocate of beard hair on the scalp, but I feel they could do a lot of mileage in that mid-scalp area when intelligently blended (I struggle to distinguish between scalp and beard in my midscalp), freeing up those precious scalp grafts for those humps, crown and areas just behind the temples. Fortunately, with your head shape, I don’t think you have a huge crown area to cover so this should help make those scalp grafts go further. Appreciate, that it has been a stressful couple of years for you since your first surgery and has not been the outcome that you hoped for, but genuinely wish you the best outcome in your next procedure, it's clear that you are making all the right moves within your consults.

Edited March 26 by Bandit90

[GeneralNorwood]

On 3/26/2024 at 9:34 AM, bigmistake said:

@GeneralNorwood if you will shave your head, then can you please share pictures of donor scars from your FUE surgery. Both in the sides above the ears and in the donor

I think that scars are pretty visible at pictures from the recent update. I can post some more, but currently i don't have photos with short hair from the back. 

 

 

For me the scars are to big in terms of what can be achieved nowadays. 

[GeneralNorwood]

On 3/26/2024 at 10:14 AM, Bandit90 said:

Just looking at your recent update. It’s surreal because you have the same progression of hair loss as I did. Similar to yours mine just seemed to thin out, wish I kept some old photos to show. It’s the first time I’ve seen another user have this pattern on HRN. Also looks like we have a very similar final hair loss pattern and hair characteristics too. I know you’ve mentioned previously that you’re not the biggest advocate of beard hair on the scalp, but I feel they could do a lot of mileage in that mid-scalp area when intelligently blended (I struggle to distinguish between scalp and beard in my midscalp), freeing up those precious scalp grafts for those humps, crown and areas just behind the temples. Fortunately, with your head shape, I don’t think you have a huge crown area to cover so this should help make those scalp grafts go further. Appreciate, that it has been a stressful couple of years for you since your first surgery and has not been the outcome that you hoped for, but genuinely wish you the best outcome in your next procedure, it's clear that you are making all the right moves within your consults.

Yeah, that is true. Our final patterns are the same, we are both Norwood 7 with blonde hair. However 3 years ago i decided to start medical therapy and therefore i am keeping alive "leftovers" that survived DHT massacre. 

 

This is the photo that i took 3 years ago, when i decided to shave it off and start medical therapy. The norwood 7 pattern is obvious. 

 

Anyway for now the plan is to take ~5 k scalp grafts from the donor. Three surgeons told me that my beard characteristics are different compared to hair and it is not good idea to use them. 

 

I think that 5k hair transplant combined with vellus hair that i still have, will do the job. But when i lose my vellus hair, even with medication that i am taking, then it will be problematic. 

[jjalay]

34 minutes ago, GeneralNorwood said:

Yeah, that is true. Our final patterns are the same, we are both Norwood 7 with blonde hair. However 3 years ago i decided to start medical therapy and therefore i am keeping alive "leftovers" that survived DHT massacre. 

 

This is the photo that i took 3 years ago, when i decided to shave it off and start medical therapy. The norwood 7 pattern is obvious. 

 

Anyway for now the plan is to take ~5 k scalp grafts from the donor. Three surgeons told me that my beard characteristics are different compared to hair and it is not good idea to use them. 

 

I think that 5k hair transplant combined with vellus hair that i still have, will do the job. But when i lose my vellus hair, even with medication that i am taking, then it will be problematic. 

Your donor has already signs of depletion. Where are you going to find these 5k grafts?

[asterix0]

@GeneralNorwood Do you plan to just focus on the paretial areas to blend your sides and the top more naturally, and add more density in the midscalp? Medication will hopefully hold your crown area and back so it doesn't dip more, are you on finasteride or dutasteride?

 

[Berba11]

3 hours ago, jjalay said:

Your donor has already signs of depletion. Where are you going to find these 5k grafts?

The man has had multi in-person consultations with some of the very best in the business, which suggests the number 5K hasn't just been plucked out of thin air, don't ya think?

[Melvin- Admin]

Have you considered using beard hair? Looks abundant and the color matches the scalp, which isn’t always the case. 

[GeneralNorwood]

5 hours ago, jjalay said:

Your donor has already signs of depletion. Where are you going to find these 5k grafts?

I leave it to surgeon. But i can say that there are areas with native density that weren't use during my first surgery. 

 

2 hours ago, asterix0 said:

@GeneralNorwood Do you plan to just focus on the paretial areas to blend your sides and the top more naturally, and add more density in the midscalp? Medication will hopefully hold your crown area and back so it doesn't dip more, are you on finasteride or dutasteride?

 

For sure bringing back naturalness and repairing this "disconnection" is my top priority. There will be more focus on midscalp then on the crown i think. I use finasteride 6 times per week and dutasteride once a week. 

 

2 hours ago, Berba11 said:

The man has had multi in-person consultations with some of the very best in the business, which suggests the number 5K hasn't just been plucked out of thin air, don't ya think?

Yeah, this is number that actually was suggested by 2 surgeons and both said that this is under depletion level. So after i use 5k graft, i could still wear longer hair  in the donor.

[GeneralNorwood]

1 hour ago, Melvin- Admin said:

Have you considered using beard hair? Looks abundant and the color matches the scalp, which isn’t always the case. 

There is no surgeon who thinks that using beard grafts is good idea for me. The beard characteristics in my case is just too different compared do hair. 

Even Eugenix didn't suggest beard transplantation for me. Priyadarshini suggested ~3000 scalp grafts for the next HT. 

Edited March 27 by GeneralNorwood

[bigmistake]

22 hours ago, jjalay said:

Your donor has already signs of depletion. Where are you going to find these 5k grafts?

FUT.

[jjalay]

21 hours ago, Berba11 said:

The man has had multi in-person consultations with some of the very best in the business, which suggests the number 5K hasn't just been plucked out of thin air, don't ya think?

Well, some of the "best in the business" caused him this mess so i would be cautious about that. You dont have to be a genie to see that the donor area on the sides has already been depleted and there is no way you can extract additional 5k without causing further damage.

[jjalay]

2 hours ago, bigmistake said:

FUT.

This is also difficult. In this case you cant take a long strip, it will be only on the occipital area on the back of the head. With this if OP has good laxity he might be able to get something between 1500-2000 grafts. Imo this in combination with beard grafts might be a better plan that proceeding with another fue megasession.

[Bandit90]

56 minutes ago, jjalay said:

Well, some of the "best in the business" caused him this mess so i would be cautious about that. You dont have to be a genie to see that the donor area on the sides has already been depleted and there is no way you can extract additional 5k without causing further damage.

Short blonde hair can be very deceiving, my donor looked similar post-sitting one and I went on to get another 4k grafts from it. The OP has stronger donor than me, so on that logic alone,  the 5k estimation, appears completely plausible. Also with FUE I find there is length (similar to OPs latest update) when the FUE is more noticeable. When I buzz down, its much less noticeable and grown longer its hard to detect. But the one-two weeks after shaving down, there is more noticeable patchy appearance.  Another observation I had is the OP FUE scaring reminds me of Rolands' result - to a lesser extent. 

 

Edited March 28 by Bandit90

[Berba11]

2 hours ago, jjalay said:

Well, some of the "best in the business" caused him this mess so i would be cautious about that. You dont have to be a genie to see that the donor area on the sides has already been depleted and there is no way you can extract additional 5k without causing further damage.

What exactly are you trying to argue here? That you know more than the multi surgeons the OP has seen in person? That the OP should take your advice over those multi experts he's consulted with on this very issue? Maybe you'd like to consider that you're likely very wrong given that you haven't examined the OP in person, and are not qualified to do so with a high degree of certainty anyway.

[jjalay]

1 hour ago, Berba11 said:

What exactly are you trying to argue here? That you know more than the multi surgeons the OP has seen in person? That the OP should take your advice over those multi experts he's consulted with on this very issue? Maybe you'd like to consider that you're likely very wrong given that you haven't examined the OP in person, and are not qualified to do so with a high degree of certainty anyway.

Im saying what im seeing man. His donor on the sides has been depleted and he definitely doesnt have 5K left for another fue megasession, you dont need to be an expert to see this. If you like to trust doctors blindly and you believe in fairy tales this is your problem.

[GeneralNorwood]

32 minutes ago, jjalay said:

Im saying what im seeing man. His donor on the sides has been depleted and he definitely doesnt have 5K left for another fue megasession, you dont need to be an expert to see this. If you like to trust doctors blindly and you believe in fairy tales this is your problem.

My donor in some areas is close to depletion and has ~45 grafts/cm2. But in another areas it has 50-60 grafts/cm2. Well there are even areas with 70+ graft/cm2. It was checked by micro cameras, it's not fairy tale. 

 

5 hours ago, jjalay said:

Well, some of the "best in the business" caused him this mess so i would be cautious about that. 

I wouldn't call Priya best in the business. 

Edited March 28 by GeneralNorwood

[Berba11]

37 minutes ago, jjalay said:

Im saying what im seeing man.

But you're not seeing everything, so your opinion is limited and subject to a wide margin of error. You're just seeing pictures and therefore cannot make this statement with any reliability:

37 minutes ago, jjalay said:

he definitely doesnt have 5K left

You're not in a position to make this claim with this level of certainty. That's a fact. Try showing a little humility.

38 minutes ago, jjalay said:

If you like to trust doctors blindly

Who is trusting anyone "blindly"? @GeneralNorwoodhad in-person consultations with reputable surgeons, whose position on the matter is obviously superior to whoever jjalay is on a forum. Are you suggesting GN should have just saved himself the hassle of multiple in-person consultations and private messaged you instead?

40 minutes ago, jjalay said:

and you believe in fairy tales this is your problem.

Which fairy tales? You haven't established your claim as being true and cannot do so. Believing a lay person on a forum who is not in a position to make an accurate judgement is more in line with a fairy tale than the in-person assessment of multiple experts in their field. This is an odd hill you've chosen to die on.

[asterix0]

52 minutes ago, Berba11 said:

But you're not seeing everything, so your opinion is limited and subject to a wide margin of error. You're just seeing pictures and therefore cannot make this statement with any reliability:

You're not in a position to make this claim with this level of certainty. That's a fact. Try showing a little humility.

Who is trusting anyone "blindly"? @GeneralNorwoodhad in-person consultations with reputable surgeons, whose position on the matter is obviously superior to whoever jjalay is on a forum. Are you suggesting GN should have just saved himself the hassle of multiple in-person consultations and private messaged you instead?

Which fairy tales? You haven't established your claim as being true and cannot do so. Believing a lay person on a forum who is not in a position to make an accurate judgement is more in line with a fairy tale than the in-person assessment of multiple experts in their field. This is an odd hill you've chosen to die on.

Further, even if we assume jjalay to be speaking the truth, if OP's donor is more homogeneously extracted, even with those "high" graft numbers, it can still look very good at the appropriate hair length (a 2 or 3 buzz)

[GeneralNorwood]

Ok, guys, It's time to put cards on the table. 

A week ago I was in Bulgaria and did some sightseeing in beautiful Sofia. However, this was obviously not the main purpose of my visit.

I saw Dr. Zarev. 

Two weeks ago i received message from Zarev's clinic that somebody  cancelled consultation and they offered me this spot. I didn't think twice before buying a flight ticket. Yes, it was off-schedule consultation.

The consultation exceeded my expectations. It lasted for 2 hours and 30 minutes, longer then my consultations with other surgeons combined. Firstly,we talked about my hairloss history. I was showing to him pictures on my phone that i prepeared, he asked me about medications and about family history of balding. I showed him pictures of my dad and uncle, but anyway he said that in my case balding pattern (Norwood 7) is so obvious, that we really don't need to look at family pictures (but we did anyway). 

Then he asked me about my expectations. I said that i want to bring back the naturalness and i think repairing the disconnection is first step to do that. But the most important thing is that I want his opinion on what can be achieved.

He invited me to sit on photosession chair and he started to make pictures from all angles. 

The most interesting part for me was the measurments.

He divided my scalp into more than 80 areas. He said that usually he creates ~60 areas but for my case he must create more, because i had HT already. Yes, guys, 80 areas. It happened. 

Then he used micro camera on this areas, measured them with tape. We could see photos from micro camera on the big screen and he started to calculate grafts/cm2. Some areas had only ~45 grafts/cm2 but others like area above extraction zone had 70+ grafts/cm2. 

Dr. Zarev made some further calculations on the paper for a longer period of time and when he finished said to me that : 

1. Currently my recipient area needs 5200 grafts.

2. We can extract maximum 6500 from the donor without depletion. So with current needs we are below depletion level. 

3. 8500 grafts can be extracted maximally, but this would require shorter hairstyle on the sides and the back. 

4. I will lose more hair in the future, even with medications. And because of that i will need more HT's. 

 

I got surgery date in 3 years. However i am on the off-schedule cancellation list. 

 

 

Edited March 29 by GeneralNorwood

[BackFromTheBrink]

Well, that's quite the mic drop. Plenty of time to seek a consult with  Dr jjalay to validate Dr Zarev's cursory glance at your head. 😉

In all seriousness, you've seen the world's best and will put yourself in the best possible position for a great outcome. I'll follow with great interest - if I'm not mistaken you'll be the first Zarev repair case documented on here.

 

[Fox243]

38 minutes ago, GeneralNorwood said:

Ok, guys, It's time to put cards on the table. 

A week ago I was in Bulgaria and did some sightseeing in beautiful Sofia. However, this was obviously not the main purpose of my visit.

I saw Dr. Zarev. 

Two weeks ago i received message from Zarev's clinic that somebody  cancelled consultation and they offered me this spot. I didn't think twice before buying a flight ticket. Yes, it was off-schedule consultation.

The consultation exceeded my expectations. It lasted for 2 hours and 30 minutes, longer then my consultations with other surgeons combined. Firstly,we talked about my hairloss history. I was showing to him pictures on my phone that i prepeared, he asked me about medications and about family history of balding. I showed him pictures of my dad and uncle, but anyway he said that in my case balding pattern (Norwood 7) is so obvious, that we really don't need to look at family pictures (but we did anyway). 

Then he asked me about my expectations. I said that i want to bring back the naturalness and i think repairing the disconnection is first step to do that. But the most important thing is that I want his opinion on what can be achieved.

He invited me to sit on photosession chair and he started to make pictures from all angles. 

The most interesting part for me was measurments.

He divided my scalp into more than 80 areas. He said that usually he creates ~60 areas but for my case he must create more, because i had HT already. Yes, guys, 80 areas. It happened. 

Then he used micro camera on this areas, measured them with tape. We could see photos from micro camera on the big screen and he started to calculate grafts/cm2. Some areas had only ~45 grafts/cm2 but others like area above extraction zone had 70+ grafts/cm2. 

Dr. Zarev made some further calculations on the paper for a longer period of time and when he finished said to me that : 

1. Currently my recipient area needs 5200 grafts.

2. We can extract maximum 6500 from the donor without depletion. So with current needs we are below depletion level. 

3. 8500 grafts can be extracted maximally, but this would require shorter hairstyle on the sides and the back. 

4. I will lose more hair in the future, even with medications. And because of that i will need more HT's. 

 

I got surgery date in 3 years. However i am on the off-schedule cancellation list. 

 

 

Did you ask if you can use beard hair?