Say it ain't so.

[Oxiborick]

Hello everyone,

About three weeks ago I got a hair transplant (FUE) for 3800 grafts. A day or so after the procedure, I made a post showing it off to Reddit and got some extremely negative feedback. "Worst work I've ever seen" etc. The consensus was that I only actually received 2000 grafts, or at most 2500. I figured everyone was just being dramatic and I kind of dismissed it, as I was really impressed with the clinic's professionalism and general approach. I've also dealt with some real bozos on there so it was easy enough to dismiss these guys. I returned to my home city after staying in the clinic's city for a couple weeks. When I got home, I showed my "after" pictures to a friend who has undergone three procedures and he also said it only looks like about 2000 grafts, or 2500 at most. So I had a consultation with another hair transplant surgeon (a very highly respected one with a great reputation) and he said the same thing, though instead of giving an estimate he just said that 3800 were clearly not transplanted successfully. Now I'm really starting to worry.

I hope to god this isn't true as I liked this clinic a lot. (It's in the USA.) They were extremely helpful in getting me set up and were very friendly and professional to deal with. They also paid for two days at a very nice hotel and for my transportation from the airport. Didn't seem sleazy or incompetent at all. Very clean and tidy clinic with a nice setup, not some crappy "back alley" type deal. Total procedure took like 16 hours, so it's not like they rushed through it. Surgeon was extremely attentive to my well-being and needs, and was very kind and considerate. Great "bedside manner". What's going on here? Are all these people wrong?

Just eyeballing everything it does look to me like there are more donor extractions than grafts onto the bald areas.

The grafts that I do have (regardless of whether they number 2500 or 3800) do seem to be growing (shock loss hasn't happened yet) so I guess they survived the procedure. Also everything is healing just fine, just tiny bits of residual soreness here and there occasionally but nothing that would even require Tylenol.

Here are my before, after (grafts) and after (donor) pics. What do you think? Please refrain from making angry, hysterical comments; I want to be as rational about this as possible and hate drama. I really, really, really don't want this to be true as like I said I had a great working relationship with the clinic leading up to the procedure... and I especially hope it's not true because I won't be able to get another procedure until the beginning of 2024 (too much else going on until then).

Would be especially interested in hearing from any actual surgeons who might be reading this.

Thanks!

 

[Pbaird98]

I’m so sorry to see and read this. Unfortunately I have to say I can’t see 2k worth of grafts. And yes it’s not good work, it’s not refined and the implanted grafts are not likely going to make any real visual impact, I have absolutely no pleasure in having to write this. There is positives though, the next procedure you get (whenever that may be) you will much, much better informed and it’s better they didn’t actually take 3.8k of you’re finite donor area. 
The plan should have been to provide adequate cover at the frontal third, and then another procedure for the crown, not both with such few grafts, which I would only guesstimate around 1500-1750 max. 
Please do say who the Dr/Clinic was, it would be a help to anyone who could be looking to book a procedure with them, now or in the future. 

[Oxiborick]

How much does 

6 minutes ago, Pbaird98 said:

I’m so sorry to see and read this. Unfortunately I have to say I can’t see 2k worth of grafts. And yes it’s not good work, it’s not refined and the implanted grafts are not likely going to make any real visual impact, I have absolutely no pleasure in having to write this. There is positives though, the next procedure you get (whenever that may be) you will much, much better informed and it’s better they didn’t actually take 3.8k of you’re finite donor area. 
The plan should have been to provide adequate cover at the frontal third, and then another procedure for the crown, not both with such few grafts, which I would only guesstimate around 1500-1750 max. 
Please do say who the Dr/Clinic was, it would be a help to anyone who could be looking to book a procedure with them, now or in the future. 

Thanks.

How much does it look like was taken from the donor?

[Pbaird98]

And yes the donor area does show that more grafts have been taken than they implanted. Was this someone who side lines in doing hair transplants? I would be surprised if they are doing it full time. I guess I’m just wondering how much experience they have?

[Oxiborick]

Just now, Pbaird98 said:

And yes the donor area does show that more grafts have been taken than they implanted. Was this someone who side lines in doing hair transplants? I would be surprised if they are doing it full time. I guess I’m just wondering how much experience they have?

The clinic does nothing but hair stuff. I don't know if the surgeon does it full time. The others who have commented on this say that it looks like about half the extracted grafts from the donor are "missing" from the implanted area. 

I'm just really sad about this as I was super excited to be getting my hair back, and because my working relationship with the clinic was so good. I'm not even angry, just... sad.

[Pbaird98]

16 hours ago, Oxiborick said:

The clinic does nothing but hair stuff. I don't know if the surgeon does it full time. The others who have commented on this say that it looks like about half the extracted grafts from the donor are "missing" from the implanted area. 

I'm just really sad about this as I was super excited to be getting my hair back, and because my working relationship with the clinic was so good. I'm not even angry, just... sad.

Was it a chain like clinic like Bosley? Or a independent? Im sad and angry that this work still flys in 2022. I cant disagree with whats been said already, its difficult to get the balance right between calling out poor work and not going overboard with the criticism. 

Edited October 29, 2022 by Pbaird98

[StillAlive]

Brother, you got bitten bad.

That's more like 1500-1700 grafts and the crown bleeding indicates really sloppy work. The surgeon who recommended this design/placement should be named and shamed. 

[asterix0]

How much research did you do before picking this clinic?

[Oxiborick]

1 minute ago, Pbaird98 said:

Was it a chain like clinic like Bosley? Or a independent? Im sad and angry that this work still flys in 2022. I cant disagree with whats been said already, its difficult to get the balance right between calling out poor work and not going over board with the criticism. 

Independent. Not comfortable naming them until I know more for sure.

[Pbaird98]

Just now, StillAlive said:

Brother, you got bitten bad.

That's more like 1500-1700 grafts and the crown bleeding indicates really sloppy work. The surgeon who recommended this design/placement should be named and shamed. 

Yeh this was my guess for the amount of grafts. No way is it 2k Plus. And in a way thats better as the more grafts not used the better.

[Oxiborick]

1 minute ago, asterix0 said:

How much research did you do before picking this clinic?

Quite a bit. Or so I thought. They had really good reviews on Google reviews, and I even spent a lot of time at their clinic going over everything. They didn't seem suspect at all.

Now I'm thinking that I was super naive in this approach. You'll probably think I'm an idiot after reading that, lol.

[Oxiborick]

Just now, Pbaird98 said:

Yeh this was my guess for the amount of grafts. No way is it 2k Plus. And in a way thats better as the more grafts not used the better.

Any guesses as to how many were taken from the donor area?

What's really weird is that I only had to pay for half, with the other half to be paid in monthly installments (which it looks like I won't be doing, haha). If they were going to rip me off, why not get all the money up front?

[StillAlive]

Not an idiot, but a victim of disinformation like the majority of our balding brethren.

If you never really got into the Internet baldosphere and the world of obsessive research, you were quite likely to be taken advantage of by unqualified con artists. You should go after the clinic requesting a full refund, do your homework on this forum and only proceed with a reputable surgeon producing consistent results with heads similar to yours. 

 

[Pbaird98]

2 minutes ago, Oxiborick said:

Quite a bit. Or so I thought. They had really good reviews on Google reviews, and I even spent a lot of time at their clinic going over everything. They didn't seem suspect at all.

Now I'm thinking that I was super naive in this approach. You'll probably think I'm an idiot after reading that, lol.

Online reviews are not worth sh*t as they are easily faked, just about every single clinic worldwide has 5 star reviews.

[Pbaird98]

2 minutes ago, Oxiborick said:

Any guesses as to how many were taken from the donor area?

What's really weird is that I only had to pay for half, with the other half to be paid in monthly installments (which it looks like I won't be doing, haha). If they were going to rip me off, why not get all the money up front?

Yup, try and get a refund, do what you can and stop any future payments.

[BurnieBurns]

A clinic Bering ‘friendly’ does not mean they know what they’re doing..

I was suckered in by a butcher with great bedside manner

Edited October 30, 2022 by BurnieBurns

[Xanadu]

43 minutes ago, Pbaird98 said:

And yes the donor area does show that more grafts have been taken than they implanted. Was this someone who side lines in doing hair transplants? I would be surprised if they are doing it full time. I guess I’m just wondering how much experience they have?

I agree. It looks like they took more out than were put in. And the way they were put in seems like it won't be dense at all. I really hope there are something we cannot see on those pics.

[asterix0]

40 minutes ago, Oxiborick said:

Quite a bit. Or so I thought. They had really good reviews on Google reviews, and I even spent a lot of time at their clinic going over everything. They didn't seem suspect at all.

Now I'm thinking that I was super naive in this approach. You'll probably think I'm an idiot after reading that, lol.

You were just taken advantage of unfortunately by a smooth talking salesman, it happens but I wish you would have found this site earlier while you were still deciding what to do.  

[Vann]

This is really tough to say... first and foremost thanks for sharing your experience. 

I think... they started with your crown with all the grafts and ran out of grafts when working on your hairline. If you can recall the process, you can probably try and figure out what they did with all the grafts they took out. Were there multiple people working on you, who did the extractions, implants, anesthetics? It doesn't seem right that they took out that many grafts, unless they were making an error and needed to take more(esp. if this was a one day procedure). How did they examine your donor, did they use any instruments when checking or did they just eyeball it and tell you? I only ask these questions because I really want to know if this would be considered malpractice (a, legal, case you can use if this was in the US you may have some grounds) this doesnt seem like something a surgeon should do to your finite donor.

16 hours seems like a ridiculous long time. I wouldnt be comfortable with someone working on me that long. If I feel tired I cant imagine how the people working on me would have felt. 

Once again, I really dont mean to attack you in any capacity, I just hate to see this type of work done on people who place their trust into 'doctors.'

 

Next steps I would consider doing a repair at a different doctor perhaps 9-12 months for now. 

 

Best wishes man.

Edited October 28, 2022 by Vann
typo

[AndyDouglas]

I'm sorry to say but I had 3800 grafts densely implanted and no way have you had 3800 grafts implanted. 

You may not want to be angry or upset, but you should be because you have clearly paid for a service/grafts which you were not given. 

[Z--]

This is shoddy work. Why in the world did they create a hairline, but leave the area behind it bald to focus on the crown?

Tbh, it looks like they took 3.8k, but only implanted half of that max. They might treat you like a king, but at the end of the day, the result isn't good and donor is wasted, what's the point? I think it's important to mention this: Do not seek a repair with this clinic -- nothing short of a refund should be accepted. I they deny you a refund, it's best to move on and find a repair doctor.

This is disgraceful and proof that poor clinics can exist anywhere.

[Melvin- Admin]

There’s no point beating yourself up, if you want send me a private message. I’ll help you. 

[Berba11]

11 hours ago, Oxiborick said:

Quite a bit. Or so I thought. They had really good reviews on Google reviews, and I even spent a lot of time at their clinic going over everything. They didn't seem suspect at all.

Now I'm thinking that I was super naive in this approach. You'll probably think I'm an idiot after reading that, lol.

I’m really sorry that this has happened to you. It’s very hard to tell how many were extracted from your donor because the extraction is reasonably well spaced out, which usually gives the appearance of more grafts having been extracted than the reality. 
 

If you have good enough resolution photos post op, you might be able to count the extractions to a reasonable degree of accuracy using dots as a counter on a basic computer editing software. Ditto the implanted grafts/incisions. I’d recommend doing this otherwise your ability to convincingly evidence your grievance to the clinic will be limited. 
 

As for the work… I can’t fathom what the hell they were even thinking. They’ve given you a very, very sparse hairline area, zero grafts into the midscalp and I suppose decent coverage in the crown, albeit with rows of hairs & no apparent whorl pattern. What a good clinic would have done is tackle the frontal third first, & then address the crown in a second sitting. Given the status of your hairloss as being Norwood 6 going on 7, you’d have been best advised to consider any combo of FUT + FUE + beard and even chest hair as a supplementary donor resource for maximum coverage. 
 

Lastly, what’s done is done but a note for newbie lurkers who might be reading… The biggest thing I’ve learnt regarding HT’s is how badly researched most guys are, including guys who think they’ve done their research. Unfortunately most people don’t seem to know what they’re actually supposed to be looking for in the first place, so all subsequent “research” is often fatally flawed from the off. Eg, it’s fine to spend time at a clinic in advance, but if you don’t have a fundamental framework of understanding about what is needed to create a natural HT result in the first place, how are you going to know what to look for? How are you going to know what questions to ask? How are you going to evaluate the results you’re seeing & how are you going to be able to identify potential red flags?

And Google reviews; 1) anyone can leave a review - there’s no vetting or validation process. 2) Google My Business ranks businesses higher on the Google map & organic search rankings based on several criteria including number of reviews. Most businesses will get people to write reviews for this purpose, including made up reviews from friends, family, staff etc. 3) a lot of clinics ask their patients to write or give reviews shortly after surgery, long before final results are ever known. 4) Google reviews are not evidence; detailed patient journeys on independent forums evidenced with progress photos is the best form of review available. 
 

Please keep us posted and try to focus on a solution rather than the work as it stands. That’ll be hard but in the right hands you could come out of this with a decent head of hair and a life lesson well & truly learned.
 

We’re all on your team here 🙂

[John1991]

15 hours ago, Oxiborick said:

Independent. Not comfortable naming them until I know more for sure.

There isn't too much more to know other than that they're an atrocious clinic whom you should never deal with again.  It doesn't appear that this was one of those ridiculous 5-6000 graft over-harvesting sessions the likes of which Asli Tarcan would perform, but given how much ground you need to cover, this definitely puts getting full coverage in jeopardy going forward.  @Pbaird98, it would  be hard to go "overboard" in criticizing this work.  I feel for you, OP.  Keep your head up.

[Pbaird98]

2 minutes ago, John1991 said:

There isn't too much more to know other than that they're an atrocious clinic whom you should never deal with again.  It doesn't appear that this was one of those ridiculous 5-6000 graft over-harvesting sessions the likes of which Asli Tarcan would perform, but given how much ground you need to cover, this definitely puts getting full coverage in jeopardy going forward.  @Pbaird98, it would  be hard to go "overboard" in criticizing this work.  I feel for you, OP.  Keep your head up.

What the OP had on Reddit was the overboard response, it’s a much more measured response here thankfully 🙏🏿