What Norwood level is this?

[LookMaxx]

Hello

What Norwood level am I? And am I a good candidate for hair transplant? What kind of results can I expect?

I am on finasteride 0.5mg EOD but I don’t plan to use it long term if I can avoid it, no sides but I just don’t like using medication for the rest of my life. 

Please also note that hair on sides of my head are thinned out but I have a lot of chest hair and good beard hair as well, not the most dense but definitely good beard. 

Which surgeons would you recommend if I am a candidate for hair transplant or should I use minoxidil and no hope with hair transplants?

 

 

 

Edited July 21, 2022 by LookMaxx
Photos weren’t showing

[THE TRUTH]

Well it's really really hard to say what would be "ideal" for you. 

Looks like  Norwood 5-6. 

On one hand, I think you are way too far gone for medication to "regrow" hair unfortunately.  Medication can boost the remaining miniaturizred hairs that you still have on top but the problem is you don't have many left...You should certainly give it a try though. Try oral dutasteride 0.5mg,  oral minoxidil, some topical anti androgens such as fluridil/RU58841 and microneedling.  And give it a good 6 months. Definitely give a try. 

On the other hand, you're not the "ideal" candidate for hair transplant because your hairloss is extensive. In other words this would require a huge investement on your part (money, energy and significant time spent on researching, waiting time etc...) and thus would take several years to achieve.  BUT you do seem to have a good donor area based on these pictures. 

Don't rush into surgery. While you are on medication spend time daily on this forum and research research research....Transplants are a huge deal my friend. 

Truth is they are life-altering, leave irreversible consquences such as permanent scarring (FUE is not scarless...) and extremely consuming emotionally... The risk of failure (poor growth, damaged donor, low density etc...) is always high. Certainly higher in turkish hairmills but just because your choose a reputable doctor is by no means a guarantee of sucess. 

Depends on your goal.... if your goal is to "just get a decent hairline" and you would be happy with just some baseline coverage to improve your overall appearence then I would look into decent budget options such as Dr. Bicer, Demirsoy, Gur, Turan. They do decent work and get improve your image for a fair price. 

If your goal is to recreate the illusion of "full head of hair" then forget about Turkey completely...

I think you should go with 

A) A 3-step procedure with one of the best spanish/portuguese FUE surgeon. Pinto, Freitas, Couto,  Ximena, Ferreira 

B) 2 FUT  strip sessions with Hattingen, Hasson & Wong or Konior if you can afford him. The FUT in my opinion would be beneficial in your particular case because it would allow to better optimize your donor area. 

C) Megasession with FUE master like Zarev, Sethi, Pitella. 

These are your 3 options.

[Z--]

Agree with the above. Donor looks great and idk, doesn't look like the crown dips. I think this is a Norwood 5. Super fixable. 

[Gatsby]

Personally I would be trying finasteride and minoxidil for a year and then reassess what gains or stabilization you have made. After then I would be considering a hair transplant. All the best!

[Melvin- Admin]

You are a Norwood 6. If you stop finasteride, you will lose the rest and possibly the sides could drop. I think the smart thing would be to switch to the topical version if you’re worried about sides. 

I’m gonna be blunt. Hair restoration is a lifelong commitment. It’s not a one and done type of thing. If you don’t wanna commit to surgery or transplants, the best solution is to shave. 

[IMM1979]

Personally I think you should take surgeon recommendations mentioned above with a grain of salt. I have been on this forum for less than two months, and there are tens of thousands of clinics in the world, yet the same handful of clinics keep getting mentioned.  Which also implies you won’t be able to book a procedure there for a while.
Hair restoration is not rocket science. Speak to some doctors and they will tell you the same. I recently went to a “hairmill” in Turkey for my procedure,  yet after less than three months I get told by friends and colleagues that my hair looks fantastic. The same clinic was a recommended clinic on this forum a few years earlier. Which tells you clearly no one on here is an expert. 

If you do get serious about surgery, firstly I would never go somewhere that “requires” you to take finasteride to qualify. Secondly, find a place that is close to home, at least to get some initial consultations. 
 

 

Edited July 21, 2022 by IMM1979

[LookMaxx]

12 hours ago, HAIRLOSS IS MY LIFE said:

Well it's really really hard to say what would be "ideal" for you. 

Looks like  Norwood 5-6. 

On one hand, I think you are way too far gone for medication to "regrow" hair unfortunately.  Medication can boost the remaining miniaturizred hairs that you still have on top but the problem is you don't have many left...You should certainly give it a try though. Try oral dutasteride 0.5mg,  oral minoxidil, some topical anti androgens such as fluridil/RU58841 and microneedling.  And give it a good 6 months. Definitely give a try. 

On the other hand, you're not the "ideal" candidate for hair transplant because your hairloss is extensive. In other words this would require a huge investement on your part (money, energy and significant time spent on researching, waiting time etc...) and thus would take several years to achieve.  BUT you do seem to have a good donor area based on these pictures. 

Don't rush into surgery. While you are on medication spend time daily on this forum and research research research....Transplants are a huge deal my friend. 

Truth is they are life-altering, leave irreversible consquences such as permanent scarring (FUE is not scarless...) and extremely consuming emotionally... The risk of failure (poor growth, damaged donor, low density etc...) is always high. Certainly higher in turkish hairmills but just because your choose a reputable doctor is by no means a guarantee of sucess. 

Depends on your goal.... if your goal is to "just get a decent hairline" and you would be happy with just some baseline coverage to improve your overall appearence then I would look into decent budget options such as Dr. Bicer, Demirsoy, Gur, Turan. They do decent work and get improve your image for a fair price. 

If your goal is to recreate the illusion of "full head of hair" then forget about Turkey completely...

I think you should go with 

A) A 3-step procedure with one of the best spanish/portuguese FUE surgeon. Pinto, Freitas, Couto,  Ximena, Ferreira 

B) 2 FUT  strip sessions with Hattingen, Hasson & Wong or Konior if you can afford him. The FUT in my opinion would be beneficial in your particular case because it would allow to better optimize your donor area. 

C) Megasession with FUE master like Zarev, Sethi, Pitella. 

These are your 3 options.

Great post bro, unfortunately Eugenix isn’t an option for me as I live in Pakistan and they don’t allow us in India, I think.

I would be happy if hair transplant can get me result like this ( with toppik) 

 

I am saving up money right now, do you think the doctors in Turkey can’t give me results like that^?It would be the least expensive option for me. 

Shaving isn’t an option for me as I still want to have a dating life and I tried the shaved look, zero interest from girls which was heartbreaking. 
 

 

[LookMaxx]

10 hours ago, Gatsby said:

Personally I would be trying finasteride and minoxidil for a year and then reassess what gains or stabilization you have made. After then I would be considering a hair transplant. All the best!

I have been on finasteride for a year now and have seen some regrowth, the hairs used to be less thick than they are now and allows me use of fibers when I couldn’t in past. 

What do you think together with beard and body hair, can I just get decent coverage and drop finasteride al together for life? 

I don’t want density, just coverage so the bald spots don’t show. I have had great dating success as a diffuse thinner when in wet or harsh lighting you could see I am balding but under normal social conditions I looked like I had hair.
 

 

Edited July 21, 2022 by LookMaxx

[RTC]

6 hours ago, IMM1979 said:

Personally I think you should take surgeon recommendations mentioned above with a grain of salt. I have been on this forum for less than two months, and there are tens of thousands of clinics in the world, yet the same handful of clinics keep getting mentioned.  Which also implies you won’t be able to book a procedure there for a while.
Hair restoration is not rocket science. Speak to some doctors and they will tell you the same. I recently went to a “hairmill” in Turkey for my procedure,  yet after less than three months I get told by friends and colleagues that my hair looks fantastic. The same clinic was a recommended clinic on this forum a few years earlier. Which tells you clearly no one on here is an expert. 

If you do get serious about surgery, firstly I would never go somewhere that “requires” you to take finasteride to qualify. Secondly, find a place that is close to home, at least to get some initial consultations. 
 

 

You went to a hairmill and got a good result. What about the others who got botched by said hairmill? And got blocked and ignored on WhatsApp after?

You got lucky mate

[Melvin- Admin]

2 hours ago, LookMaxx said:

Great post bro, unfortunately Eugenix isn’t an option for me as I live in Pakistan and they don’t allow us in India, I think.

I would be happy if hair transplant can get me result like this ( with toppik) 

 

I am saving up money right now, do you think the doctors in Turkey can’t give me results like that^?It would be the least expensive option for me. 

Shaving isn’t an option for me as I still want to have a dating life and I tried the shaved look, zero interest from girls which was heartbreaking. 
 

 

I don't believe this is realistic. You will never look as good as you do with hair fibers in after a hair transplant. The facts are undertaking such a restoration is going to take a lot of time and money. That's something you have to accept before embarking on a journey.

[sukh123]

It’s obvious it’s taking a toll on your mental health and I’m sorry about that . What’s your budget , because your donor looks good . Stick with fin to keep the donor from dipping,  so you have more grafts for transplant 

[NARMAK]

Personally i think once you get to Norwood 6/7, there's very few options that could leave a person satisfied and actually apart from a hair system if you want hair, the other options to shave. There's nothing wrong with either of those. 

Hair transplants can be great, but they're just not for everybody. Unfortunately hair loss is progressive and does require the majority of people to be on medication to keep their hair for as long as possible. 

[mr_peanutbutter]

the donor looks good imho, hair is probably more coarse then fine too

 

i think op could get decent coverage. then add hairfibers to the transplanted hair and it can look very decent

[Adier]

NW5A

[Melvin- Admin]

10 hours ago, mr_peanutbutter said:

the donor looks good imho, hair is probably more coarse then fine too

 

i think op could get decent coverage. then add hairfibers to the transplanted hair and it can look very decent

Yes, but he must be willing to accept that he will need to continue using fibers after surgery. Many don’t wanna do that, which is reasonable, but not realistic when you’re that far gone.

[mr_peanutbutter]

are there hairtransplant surgeons in pakistan?  

why cant you travel to india?

how old are you op?

[NARMAK]

2 hours ago, mr_peanutbutter said:

are there hairtransplant surgeons in pakistan?  

why cant you travel to india?

how old are you op?

There's Hair Transplant surgeons in Pakistan but its probably really hard to get a proper independent patient review of the clinics there and YouTube or the clinic sites will be cherry picked. 

In terms of travelling from India to Pakistan, the two countries don't have very good diplomatic ties and there's a MAJOR rigmarole to apply from Pakistan to India for a Visa. 

I'm a British born person but my grandparents etc. were considered Pakistani and they literally made it as difficult as possible for me even though all i had was a UK passport. Google British Pakistani visa to India and you'll see how bad it is. A normal British person can apply and get a Visa within a week or two at most during COVID-19. I was made to sign a document stating i have to wait a minimum of 45 working days and present significantly more documents. It's ludicrous. I'm happy it got sorted in the end but with the money i was spending, i wad prepared to walk away almost before the Visa finally got granted after i had to keep chasing them day after day with emails once it hit 45 working days. 

[civic]

The donor looks great, lateral humps are high,  i think 5k grafts with right surgen will be more than enough for good coverage & frontal density,  the contrast between scalp & hair is low, which is very good. 

[LookMaxx]

11 hours ago, mr_peanutbutter said:

are there hairtransplant surgeons in pakistan?  

why cant you travel to india?

how old are you op?

What scares me is there was a famous celebrity here who had nasty skull infection from his hair transplant like big craters on his head hahaha and I am sure he had done his research and the clinic seeing a celebrity tried their best but yeah, this sort of thing is actually pretty common with HT clinics here. It’s because doctors can murder patients in my country if they so wish due to being lazy, incompetent, rape them, and there is no concept of government or courts here, the victims don’t get any justice nor the doctors get punished or lose their license. Funny story there was a pedophile doctor punished in England ( lost his license, behind bars for sometime), he came here got a job in government and started doing his thing, a year later after opposition parties noise, all he got was removed from the post, still a doctor here still doing his thing.

So yeah I just don’t feel safe here with something as trivial as hairs when people’s lives are worth nothing here, even our ex-PM got his hair transplants in Dubai and UK. So Pakistan is out of consideration for me unless there’s a doctor that gets independent reviews and shows results from every angle of the head ( they only show front facing hairline photos lol, what about the midscalp and the donor hair no photos of that all!!) 

Anyway, thanks for the suggestions and replies guys. I was feeling really depressed and thought my hairloss was too progressed and out of options

 

 

[LookMaxx]

On 7/21/2022 at 7:37 PM, Melvin- Moderator said:

You are a Norwood 6. If you stop finasteride, you will lose the rest and possibly the sides could drop. I think the smart thing would be to switch to the topical version if you’re worried about sides. 

I’m gonna be blunt. Hair restoration is a lifelong commitment. It’s not a one and done type of thing. If you don’t wanna commit to surgery or transplants, the best solution is to shave. 

You really think so? I managed to find old pics which I took before starting Laser light therapy to track differences and I was wrong, I don’t think I have regrowth or lost anything. 
 

See this August 2020 ( before LLLT )

 

I used LLLT for 5 months and saw no positive growth. Honestly, it appeared boring and I felt like an idiot running a laser comb over my head expecting hairs to grow, 5 months of doing this and nothing changed, felt like a waste of money.

See these photos taken in October 2020, 3 months later after using LLLT

 

 

 

My hairloss went pretty aggressive, up until September 2018 I had a diffuse full head of hair NW0? ( I had high hairline since teens) with good density then in just one year by January 2020 I became like this with no change at all afterwards
 

I started finasteride in December 2020 or January 2021 to not become shiny bald NW7 but it seems I was wrong. I don’t have any regrowth or loss, the only change appears to be thickening of the hairs. wow, this makes me disheartened, I felt like I was regrowing hairs but 2 years later and it feels like nothing has changed. 

Edited July 23, 2022 by LookMaxx

[THE TRUTH]

37 minutes ago, LookMaxx said:

You really think so? I managed to find old pics which I took before starting Laser light therapy to track differences and I was wrong, I don’t think I have regrowth or lost anything. 
 

See this August 2020 ( before LLLT )

 

I used LLLT for 5 months and saw no positive growth. Honestly, it appeared boring and I felt like an idiot running a laser comb over my head expecting hairs to grow, 5 months of doing this and nothing changed, felt like a waste of money.

See these photos taken in October 2020, 3 months later after using LLLT

 

 

 

My hairloss went pretty aggressive, up until September 2018 I had a diffuse full head of hair NW0? ( I had high hairline since teens) with good density then in just one year by January 2020 I became like this with no change at all afterwards
 

I started finasteride in December 2020 or January 2021 to not become shiny bald NW7 but it seems I was wrong. I don’t have any regrowth or loss, the only change appears to be thickening of the hairs. wow, this makes me disheartened, I felt like I was regrowing hairs but 2 years later and it feels like nothing has changed. 

Well that's the main issue with Finasteride....

Finasteride/Dutasteride are great for stopping or at least signiticantly slowing down the progression of Androgenic Alopecia and SOMETIMES in some rare cases regrowing existing miniaturized hairs but sadly they are total crap when it comes to regenerating follicles on bald scalp. That's why you have to start as soon as possible....

I think you should at least give oral Duta + oral minox combo a try. 

There was recently a patient of Dr. Mwamba who had similar degree of hairloss like you and he got pretty good results from the use of these 2 drugs. Not even close to " full regrowth " but big change compared to baseline. 

There are even stronger pharmaceuticals. Some transgender guys on Transtimelines are able to  sucessfully regrow hair using estrogen and spironolactone/bicalutamide/cyproterone but I just cannot recommend these drugs since they would totally mess your endrocrine system....Especially cyproterone which is pretty bad and linked to brain tumor. Not worth it. 

Like I said, Duta & oral minox for 6 months. You could throw in some topical AA and microneedling too. 

And then from there 

A. Get a decent hairline and baseline coverage with a decent budget doctor like Bicer, BHR Malaga, HDC Cyprus, Demirsoy, Fuecapilar. 

B. Go for a big hairloss "redemption"  with a top doctor specialized in high Norwoods   But that will cost you tens of thousands of dollars and take several years. So you really really gotta be ready mentally.... Your donor quality seems good and I think it's feasable but like Melviño said, it is not guaranteed that you will be able to achieve the same degree coverage as you showed on the picture with Hair Fibers so....

Good luck !

[Legend007]

Well when u don’t do anything for ur hair when it was telling u too .. u can’t expect medications to miraculously regrow hair .. I have a full head of hair n the meds are barely keeping it alive .. but I can tell the days are numbered .. if I waited another two years I would of been done for ..

when ur hair goes bald there is no turning back .. 

[mafpe]

^^^^^

as the above post says. mostly the meds work to PREVENT FURTHER HAIR LOSS, instead of "regrowing". there are a few case of some regrowth, but it's not much, if anything, very abysmal that you can barely notice it. still, without it, you'd be more likely to be bald fully. my own estimate is that i saved myself from balding another 2 NW level compared to if i don't use the meds.

laser might work for some people, but for the vast majority, it doesn't. i've never seen any laser therapy that has been proven to be effective without other elements, such as meds, dietary change, lifestyle change, etc. none of the cases are result from the laser therapy itself, meanwhile the other elements has been effective, which leads me to believe that it's doing almost nothing. i myself had the laser therapy for a year, with no result to show.

if you end up having a HT, there's a chance that you can still lose the transplanted hair, especially so if your balding gene is strong. taking meds minimize the risk of losing them.

[NARMAK]

It's already been mentioned above that Finasteride is to slow down or stop hair loss if you're lucky but not to help you regrow. In fact, that's where you have to start using Minoxodil and Microneedling to help with that. 

You could have a good response but realistically you have to be very patient and allow a MINIMUM of 12 months for it all. You even said your hair got thicker with Finasteride and that's clearly a good sign. 

Overall, i think by the time you realise to act, a fair bit of damage was done but that doesn't mean you're still at a point where its not worth trying at all. You can use the 12 months to research and save up for a really good clinic and then decide whether it's right for you or maybe whether to use the money for something else. 

[Havar]

On 7/22/2022 at 6:34 PM, Melvin- Moderator said:

Yes, but he must be willing to accept that he will need to continue using fibers after surgery. Many don’t wanna do that, which is reasonable, but not realistic when you’re that far gone.

So you mean every NW6 an 7 needs fibers? I guess it depends on demands and expectations.