Help on choosing the surgeon

[Portugal25]

21 minutes ago, Cristero said:

Do you guys know how long is Bruno Ferreira's waiting list?

And any idea about pricing?

Still didn't get any answer from him by the way.

Dr. Bruno Ferreira charges 2.5€/graft per graft. My friend just booked him for May 28th. 

[Cristero]

Anyone knows Dr Bruno Pinto?

He seems quite famous on recuperartupelo.com

[LonelyGraft]

33 minutes ago, Cristero said:

Anyone knows Dr Bruno Pinto?

He seems quite famous on recuperartupelo.com

Isn’t he the most popular doc in Portugal? I haven’t seen any results posted on this forum. The Spanish forums probably have his work showcased. 

[Cristero]

25 minutes ago, LonelyGraft said:

Isn’t he the most popular doc in Portugal? I haven’t seen any results posted on this forum. The Spanish forums probably have his work showcased. 

https://m.youtube.com/channel/UC5yNTsOPK7Z6V_00wTjiXnA

That's his YouTube channel 

[Portugal25]

On 2/14/2020 at 12:26 AM, Cristero said:

Anyone knows Dr Bruno Pinto?

He seems quite famous on recuperartupelo.com

Dr. Bruno Pinto became famous in Bilbao/Spain in a well known clinic. 
After he built a name for himself he returned to his hometown of Porto/Portugal and started his clinic that basically dominates the Spanish forum with patients posting results all the time. So his clinic mainly caters to our friendly neighbors, the Spanish.

Portuguese don’t know Dr. Bruno because they go to clinics that pay celebrities to endorse them (Saude Viavel and C2MC) where the Doctor role is minimum and the surgery is done by techs.

Dr. Bruno Pinto is truly a great Doctor but he is booked solid until 2021 and olny has a few dates available in 2021.
He charges 3,5€/graft which is still much cheaper than his Spanish competitors Lorezon, Couto, De Freitas that charge 5€/graft.

Edited February 15, 2020 by Portugal25

[karatekid]

10 hours ago, Cristero said:

https://m.youtube.com/channel/UC5yNTsOPK7Z6V_00wTjiXnA

That's his YouTube channel 

Wow. I know his work from the spanish forum but never looked at his youtube channel, the results there are literally natural density, just amazing. how those spanish/portuguese doctors achieve such natural density results? I find it hard to believe it's just because of the hair nature of the ethnic people there.

Edited February 14, 2020 by karatekid

[Cristero]

Quick update.

Armamed estimated 2000 - 2500 grafts which is what I was expecting initially, but they want me on finasteride or minoxidil and they say the result in the crown can be sub-optimal and that is something recognised by all the surgeons in the world. Meh! 

Hattingen asked me if I tried to shave my head ever and that should be tried before surgery, that should be the very last option. 🤦🏼‍♂️ They quoted me roughly the same as Bisanga, 1200-1500 for the front, 2000 for the crown.

I'll cross out both from my list.

[Fozzie]

Not really understanding the 2000 graft recommendations for the crown from Dr Bisanga and Hattingen to be honest, even more so seeing as you are not on/not prepared to use meds. You're still quite young and your hairloss pattern is still developing. Crown isn't slick bald yet and good chance loss there will expand without meds. If the crown really goes on to expand a lot, it may leave you in somewhat of a difficult position in the future if you were to have a 2000 or so grafts placed in there now.

If i were in your shoes, I would probably be tempted to address the crown with concealer for now and see how things progress with loss in the area in the next few years.

Not a huge fan of 'spot treating' areas on the crown without meds and in most cases the resultant chasing after loss in that area but if it's something you really want to address it now, focus should be on a smaller procedure with the aim of improving coverage and managing expectations in line with that.

 

[Cristero]

11 minutes ago, Fozzie said:

Not really understanding the 2000 graft recommendations for the crown from Dr Bisanga and Hattingen to be honest, even more so seeing as you are not on/not prepared to use meds. You're still quite young and your hairloss pattern is still developing. Crown isn't slick bald yet and good chance loss there will expand without meds. If the crown really goes on to expand a lot, it may leave you in somewhat of a difficult position in the future if you were to have a 2000 or so grafts placed in there now.

If i were in your shoes, I would probably be tempted to address the crown with concealer for now and see how things progress with loss in the area in the next few years.

Not a huge fan of 'spot treating' areas on the crown without meds and in most cases the resultant chasing after loss in that area but if it's something you really want to address it now, focus should be on a smaller procedure with the aim of improving coverage and managing expectations in line with that.

 

Thanks for your suggestion.

Waiting is an option definitely. Can't be on finasteride for the reason mentioned in the first post and I don't want to touch that poison anymore. I became hypogonadal and need to be on low dose HRT for the rest of my life. I could consider minoxidil as a last resort, but the skin ageing and bad under eyes bags I saw from some users were pretty bad.

So I'm a bit concerned of that as well.

[Portugal25]

On 2/14/2020 at 12:58 PM, karatekid said:

Wow. I know his work from the spanish forum but never looked at his youtube channel, the results there are literally natural density, just amazing. how those spanish/portuguese doctors achieve such natural density results? I find it hard to believe it's just because of the hair nature of the ethnic people there.

@karatekid  Spain and Portugal are not ethnic countries.

Spain and Portugal have a small ethnic minorities from their former colonies in Africa, Latin America, Asia and India but other than that small imigrant population if a typical European were to speak with you in fluent US accent English you wouldn`t be able to tell the difference between a caucasian North American next to a caucasian Portuguese/Spanish/French/Italian/Irish/British (the settlers of North America).

Edited February 19, 2020 by Portugal25

[Cristero]

Can I ask you guys your opinion on Demirsoy? Some of his results are impressive:

https://www.hairtransplants-armamed.com/beforeafter/1049/3188_grafts_fue.aspx

And he charges the half of the surgeons I contacted until now.

[Portugal25]

21 minutes ago, Cristero said:

Can I ask you guys your opinion on Demirsoy? Some of his results are impressive:

https://www.hairtransplants-armamed.com/beforeafter/1049/3188_grafts_fue.aspx

And he charges the half of the surgeons I contacted until now.

@Cristero there`s a reason for him to charge half. 

Demirsoy does up to 4000 grafts in one day while Bruno Ferreira does a maximum of 2000 grafts (both operate on 1 patient per day).

So Demirsoy can charge half and still have his clinic make the same daily turnover as Bruno Ferreira clinic.

The reason why Dr. Bruno does a maximum 2000 grafts per day is because he does the whole surgery and implants with DHI while Demirsoy opens all the holes at once and has several low paid techs implanting the grafts (most common and most profitable practice). 

Pekiner does less (1500 max per day) because he doesn`t extract with motorized FUE and Keser also does manual extraction but limits the day to a max 800 grafts (he aims for 100% survival rate).

So by knowing the prices they all charge you can easily calculate who has the most profitable clinic but the important question is, who is getting the best results?!

Edited February 14, 2020 by Portugal25

[Cristero]

13 minutes ago, Portugal25 said:

@Cristero there`s a reason for him to charge half. 

Demirsoy does up to 4000 grafts in one day while Bruno Ferreira does a maximum of 2000 grafts (both operate on 1 patient per day).

So Demirsoy can charge half and still have his clinic make the same daily turnover as Bruno Ferreira clinic.

The reason why Dr. Bruno does a maximum 2000 grafts per day is because he does the whole surgery and implants with DHI while Demirsoy opens all the holes at once and has several low paid techs implanting the grafts (most common and most profitable practice). 

Pekiner does less (1500 max per day) because he doesn`t extracted with motorized FUE and Keser does even less (max 800 grafts per day).

So by knowing the prices they all charge you can easily calculate who has the most profitable clinic but the important question is, who is getting the best results?!

Thanks for the explanation.

Demirsoy's assistant said the doctor does the extraction and incisions and the nurses fill in the incisions with the grafts. So he has been honest in that. But they are keen on having me on meds, even if some of their patients didn't take any.

Pekiner is not an option, as I followed a discussion with a patient being unsuccessful of the result, and the clinic basically blaming him. I didn't like the whole thing, really unprofessional. He's also really stubborn on the medications part.

[karatekid]

20 minutes ago, Cristero said:

Can I ask you guys your opinion on Demirsoy? Some of his results are impressive:

https://www.hairtransplants-armamed.com/beforeafter/1049/3188_grafts_fue.aspx

And he charges the half of the surgeons I contacted until now.

Bro if you did enough research you should know that you shouldnt put much weight on clinic posted results, but instead reviewing lots of clients testimonies. it's easy to cherry-pick/edit/lie with those cases that the clinic published.

[Portugal25]

1 minute ago, Cristero said:

Thanks for the explanation.

Demirsoy's assistant said the doctor does the extraction and incisions and the nurses fill in the incisions with the grafts. So he has been honest in that. But they are keen on having me on meds, even if some of their patients didn't take any.

Pekiner is not an option, as I followed a discussion with a patient being unsuccessful of the result, and the clinic basically blaming him. I didn't like the whole thing, really unprofessional. He's also really stubborn on the medications part.

Nice to know Demirsoy hires nurses instead of techs to implant the grafts but I still wouldn’t opt for a surgery where the doctor is not performing the whole surgery. 
From your list I would save up and book Bruno Ferreira. 

[Cristero]

12 minutes ago, Portugal25 said:

Nice to know Demirsoy hires nurses instead of techs to implant the grafts but I still wouldn’t opt for a surgery where the doctor is not performing the whole surgery. 
From your list I would save up and book Bruno Ferreira. 

I'm between Bruno Ferreira and Ximena Vila at the moment. The latter replied to me and I'm waiting for an opinion on my case, a quote and availability.

Bruno Ferreira still no news.

Third option would be waiting, but, as I said, I'm unhappy with my hairs situation at the moment, so, unless dermaneedling, scalp massages and hair peptides will trigger regrowth in the next months, I don't really know how waiting will help out my situation.

[Portugal25]

5 minutes ago, Cristero said:

I'm between Bruno Ferreira and Ximena Vila at the moment. The latter replied to me and I'm waiting for an opinion on my case, a quote and availability.

Bruno Ferreira still no news.

Third option would be waiting, but, as I said, I'm unhappy with my hairs situation at the moment, so, unless dermaneedling, scalp massages and hair peptides will trigger regrowth in the next months, I don't really know how waiting will help out my situation.

@Cristero I don’t understand how you can be undecided between those two because Ximena Villa charges the same price as Bruno Ferreira (2,5€/graft) and does surgery on two patients per day.
How can you compare being able to have the Doctor focused solely on you the whole day versus a Doctor that splits her attention between two patients

Edited February 14, 2020 by Portugal25

[Cristero]

1 hour ago, Portugal25 said:

@Cristero I don’t understand how you can be undecided between those two because Ximena Villa charges the same price as Bruno Ferreira (2,5€/graft) and does surgery on two patients per day.
How can you compare being able to have the Doctor focused solely on you the whole day versus a Doctor that splits her attention between two patients

Because I really like her work.

[Portugal25]

10 minutes ago, Cristero said:

Because I really like her work.

She does have tons of great results on the Spanish forum and was Lorenzo’s medical assistant for many years (even did his HT).  
I’m sure if Bruno Ferreira had more patient results online it would be easier for you to make this decision.

[Cristero]

1 hour ago, Portugal25 said:

She does have tons of great results on the Spanish forum and was Lorenzo’s medical assistant for many years (even did his HT).  
I’m sure if Bruno Ferreira had more patient results online it would be easier for you to make this decision.

Yeah he definitely needs to put more pictures online 

[Cristero]

Demirsoy's assistant said I need to be on Minoxidil before and after the transplant, because apparently it raises the chances of grafts survival. It's the first time I hear anything like that.

Anyone familiar with that?

[karatekid]

I heard quite the opposite actually, that you should avoid minoxi few months post op

[Portugal25]

23 minutes ago, karatekid said:

I heard quite the opposite actually, that you should avoid minoxi few months post op

@karatekidI heard the same! 
@Cristero I am 7 weeks post-op and only now considering starting Minoxidil. 

Edited February 14, 2020 by Portugal25

[Cristero]

Ok Demirsoy crossed out of the list definitely.

[MachoVato]

On 2/14/2020 at 6:17 PM, Portugal25 said:

Keser also does manual extraction but limits the day to a max 800 grafts (he aims for 100% survival rate).

I'm scheduled with Keser in April. I'm doing about 2,000 grafts over 4 days. I selected him because of this. He's known for density with fewer grafts (other clinics quoted up to 3,500). My number one requirement is a natural hairline and Keser's hairlines are brilliant. The fact that he only does 500-700 grafts per day, does the whole procedure himself, and only one patient per day... that sold me!  

 

For the OP, you don't need many grafts for your hairline. I'd recommend Keser and HLC (also Ankara, Turkey). But I also think you shouldn't touch your crown yet. Wait until later, save your donor area.