karatekid

7 hours ago, Portugal25 said:

True that nowadays new FUE techniques drastically reduced the transection rate and made possible FUE mega sessions with results almost at the same level as FUT so it’s understandable that nobody believes it to be necessary to have a FUT scar to achieve a good result. 
However, in cases where donor area limited and there’s a lot of area to cover FUT is preferable for the first (and maybe second) surgery with FUE only being advisable after there is no more skin laxity for FUT. 

I was advised by Dr. Pekiner that in order to maximize my donor area I should go for another FUT with Dr. Rahal and only after 1 year go to him for FUE+BHT but I didn’t want another FUT strip taken off and go threw a FUT recovery again so I decided on heading straight for a mega session FUE+BHT to get things done in one go (was a tuff decision and I’m still waiting to see if I made the right call).

If I had went back to a second FUT it would have been either Rahal again or H&W. 

Why Pekiner tells you to go have FUT with another doctor? he doesnt perform FUT at all?

I dont get the saying that 'spanish guys has the best donot', why does it matter what donor density they have, at the end of the day there is a number of grafts used for the procedure, and when we compare results from different doctors we do it by comparing similar cases where same amount of grafts cover same area size,  dont we? so the question is why a non-spanish guy with same hairloss pattern would get different result with same number of gratfs?

I do understand the hair characteristic importance. But honestly I dont see something special in the hair of those guys. Actually the guy from the first video that @OliverAtom posted has kinda similar hair to mine, a dark wavy hair. And the results look very good

On 1/28/2020 at 1:52 AM, hairlossPA said:

i’m possibly eyeing up a FUT with H&W as well. I think even the slightest possibility of having a better result via FUT rather than FUE is a major point. atleast for me. The scar and recovery are what make me nervous however

Same for me.  I seriously think of getting FUT even though it is relatively small job (~2500),  because of the same reasons.  But my question is - is there any surgeon in Hasson level at Europe?? Canada too far for me... 

1 hour ago, Portugal25 said:

@Marty Mac I totally agree with @Melvin-Moderator you shouldn’t focus on price. 
If you want a affordable surgery I also recommend looking into @Dr. Bruno Ferreira as he works as the medical assistant of Dr. Jose Lorenzo (one of the best in the world) in Madrid and also has his own clinic in Porto where you pay 2.5€/graft (half price of Dr. Lorenzo clinic). 

When I did my research my short list was down to Bruno Ferreira and Kaan Pekiner.
I chose Pekiner because he had a lot of patients posting great results with mega sessions of beard grafts and I needed a lot of beard grafts to compensate for my lack of scalp donor area.
Otherwise I would have selected Bruno Ferreira (his clinic is just a 2h drive from my house). 

Why specifically Ferreira? Wouldnt you say De Freitas has better results? Or is it just because he is closer to you? 

Sick results man. you make me want to go for fut too

On 11/21/2019 at 1:21 AM, Thisisnotatest333 said:

Hairloss cure doesnt make money. I doubt this will ever happen

Why people keep saying this? Hairloss cure, if it is real, effective, lifetime cure, without side effects, will literally attract every second bald guy in the world, which is hundreds of millions, and believe me they will be willing to pay alot for it. It is tons of money. 

I personally will rob a bank if I need to

Damn as I keep reviewing patients results Im getting more and more skeptical. Until I already set up my mind on a specific doc I see a series of not-so-good cases. It seems like even the best docs have not so low percentage of unsatisfied / partially satisfied patients...   

It seems like no matter which doc I choose, at the end of the day I will have to pray really hard to god for a success... 

Sorry for rant guys

On 1/22/2020 at 2:05 PM, Sam818 said:

The only thing that is important is tons of genuine patient posted results. Have yet to find a patient who found recourse after a bad experience with a doctor thru one of those organizations. 

Ye I thought so, thanks for confirming this to me

On 1/23/2020 at 3:19 AM, ruca2 said:

There are many excellent surgeons out there performing fantastic transformations. The key is to find who is right for you and your individual situation. This situation involves your own goals for the restoration, your hair loss pattern, your family history, your use of finasteride, and most importantly  your donor availability. A great surgeon takes all these factors into consideration before even offering an estimate. You're on the right track by reviewing as many cases as you can. This is truly the only way to see if a particular surgeon is right for you. Pay attention to patients that have a similar hair loss pattern to you and have achieved a restoration that you would be happy with. There's so many different styles and philosophies from surgeons that it can be extremely confusing. The one surgeon that I think you can't go wrong with if finances are not a concern is Dr Konior. My advice is to fill out his online consultation form from the Chicago Hair Institute. He is extremely responsive and personally reaches out to you. He is meticulous and thoughtful and won't steer you wrong. He's a master of his craft and performs both FUE and FUT at the highest level achievable with today's technologies. He's expensive and at least a 15 month waitlist but worth it if you truly want quality. 

Thanks for the insight.  Although I didnt review lots of Konior cases, the ones that I did look impressive, however as we Hasson, the major problem for me it's the distance. If he requires face to face consultation it will be even bigger problem...

Another thing I wanted to get opinion on - I was researching lots of De Freitas cases, and it seems that he often take grafts from donor area that expand maybe too much to the sides, which might be unsafe zone (?). look at those pictures for example:

is it just me or he really goes too much to the side?  The result in this case was amazing by the way, but of course it's not the point, the question is if those grafts will survive in long term.

Bro I hope it will turn out great! very interesting to see this progressing.

I have a question which might sound stupid, but how exactly is it possible to use beard hair for the head? I mean, there are different in nature - my beard grow slower than head hair, and also has different characteristics (I think?) I never understood how those beard hairs are mixed along with head hair in a natural way.

Thanks for the suggestion Gasthoerer, I will definitely do it!

Btw how important it is to the Doctor to be in the ISRHS or IAHRS lists? I see the spanish docs are not in any of them, not even Couto or Lorenzo, and other surgeons that considered world top from rest of Europe as well. Im wondering if I should put any weight on those lists when I consider a surgeon.

11 hours ago, TheRealCurlyMcCoy said:

Hi Adam, 

Your results are amazing thus far! It is great to view your progress. I also had my hair transplant completed by Dr. De Freitas last year in May. It was the best decision I have made! I will be posting pictures and updates in the coming weeks. And likewise to everyone here, please feel free to ask any questions. Congrats again on the stellar results and ones that await! 

 

Ye bro please do it! Im seriously considering to have a surgery with him soon, Im reviewing patient results by him non stop in the spanish forum, they really are amazing.  we need more De Freitas reviews here.

25 minutes ago, 1978matt said:

You took this pill called finasteride and it grew back.  Amazing

lol. you can also just say you started eating healthier, or drink more water or shit like that lol    people that dont experience hairloss probably clueless enough to believe

This interesting topic since honestly, I dont understand how people can NOT notice that you have more hair or better hairline. Im talking about mid large operations, like 3000 plus. 

Im about to get HT soon and I dont want to tell people about it, so on one hand I dont want them to think its HT but on the other hand the whole point of the transplant is to look much better than Im now and if the whole reaction will be "nice haircut" then it's a bit disappointing lol

13 hours ago, Gasthoerer said:

I am not sure if 3000 FU is overkill for you (but I need to see more pictures). However, 3000 FUE would IMO rule out certain "Doc only" clinics (like Keser) and might be even to big for other ones for FUE (even Konior etc.). If you chose FUT (which could be a good option considering how you style your hair and considering your goals) it rules out most of the mentioned clinics IMO.

Konior, Bloxham etc. would be sth to look into for FUT as well. 

I never mentioned I want a Doc only clinic actually. I do of course prefer that the doctor will be involved in a good part of the procedure, but the eventually it's all about the results isnt it? if a doctor deliver consistent high quality results, it is all that matter, wont you say so?

Also Im just getting more and more confused, and more and more doubts lol 🤒

13 hours ago, Kaya said:

Hi karatekid,

If the reason for scratching out Turkey is solely based on Turkey having tons of cheap, low quality HT clinics (and that's a fact), you may be missing some A grade doctors. I will not talk about it since Portugal already mentioned those. If you have other reasons, I can't comment on those. 

If you are planing to have temporal point (side parts, under temples) work, I don't suggest any Turkish clinics. As a matter of fact, I myself was thinking of having it but I could not find any HT doctor doing a very good temporal point in the world; forget about Turkey. Because of the very fine nature with different color, temporal points will stand out from the rest easily unless you will keep them very long. If you researched and found out very good temporal point results of any doctor in the world, please let me know; I may have consider 

As for Keser, I am pretty sure he can give you a good density (unless you want a low, aggressive hairline)  with 2400-2500 (possibly even less grafts) but it will take at least 4 days which may be a showstopper for you. Pekiner can do the same in 2 days I believe. As for donor management, I got 1700 grafts and my donor is still very strong. Other doctors would be looking to spend at least 2500 grafts for the same so I am pretty sure I saved lot of grafts in my donor for future.

Most of the doctors you are considering in Europe and US/CA are top notch ones with very good records. I would suggest you to have your HT with Dr. Couto if you can find any availability in the next several years. Dr. Konior would be another excellent choice if you can fly to US and afford. For 3000 grafts, you are looking at 18K-24K Usd depending on what you will get (Fut/Fue) 

Another option: Since you are in your early 30s, you might wait a couple of more years and continue researching. There is a slight chance you could lose more from forelock. 

 

Ye I understand the fact that I ruled out whole Turkey might be irrational, I just got a bad feeling, after hearing so many bad stuff about doctors there. But Im really trying to be open to suggestion right now, as long as it's clear that my number one factor by far is quality. price and distance are much lower.  I started researching patient cases of those docs, and see how it goes.

About temporal points - Im not sure still, it's not a must for me I guess. Something  I will need to discuss with the doctor.

Also I really dont want to wait longer, I suffered too long, I want to get my hair back on my good years. that's why Couto isnt an option.

1 hour ago, Gasthoerer said:

Interesting, we had a similar discussion about another clinic once (forgot which one). I never heard this about Feriduni. Can you send me the link to this specific cases? Would be much appreciated. If you do not feel comfortable to link them here, you can also send a PM. 

Ye it is in the german forum, I sent you the links

1 hour ago, Portugal25 said:

@karatekid I know you said you crossed out Turkey but you really should talk with @Kaya because he had a smiliar hairloss to yours and had two HT with Dr. Keser.

For your situation Dr. Keser would be one of my top choices because he specializes in hairlines does max 600 grafts and one patient a day. He has his own punch (designed by himself) which cuts through with one move and increases the survival chance of the grafts. This kind of boutique treatment comes with the price which makes him the most expensive HT doctor in Turkey at 3.5€/graft.

Kaya is from LA and was also looking for the best of the best so he was considering Dr. Konior (8US/graft) but he`s super happy he went all the way to Turkey to Dr. Keser (twice).

Check his results: 

 

Max 600 per day? So any standard procedure take him few days? sounds weird to me. Anyway, as Kaya say himself in the thread, he doesnt accept patients that require more than 2500 grafts. And there is good chance that I need more. When I contacted Feriduni 2 years ago he suggested 2700. and my hair loss just got worse, very slowly, but still. I really want good, dense hairline, so I think I will need even 3000+.   even if he does somehow accept this, it means 5 days procedure? sounds pretty exhausting...

2 minutes ago, Portugal25 said:

@karatekid both Bruno Pinto and @Dr. Bruno Ferreira are located in Porto / Portugal not Spain.

Dr. Bruno Ferreira also works in Madrid at Dr. Jose Lorenzo clinic but that amazing clinic charges 5€graft.

I believe Dr. De Freitas has truly great results but be prepared for a long wait list and similar price to Lorenzo.

You are not being petty, research as much as you can before booking the surgery!

Ho sorry, got confused then. Anyway, it's about the same distance for me I guess

About the price - it's not really a consideration to me. And about the waiting list, well, I hope I could be pushed somewhere in the near future, I dont know, I hope to get it done soon as possible, but for this to happen I really need the initial contact to occur 😕

Ok update a bit, to get some feedback and maybe for other to benefit from my extensive research.

After continuing reviewing large number of patient cases, here and other forums, I decided sadly to take Hattingen off the list.  it seems more like it hit or miss with them, I mean the success cases are really good, but there is a not-so-small percentage of cases which dont look really great, especially regard to the high number of grafts used. They taking lots of (justified) criticism in the german forum, and honestly instead of taking responsibility their respond with execuses.

I have also had extensive research about Feriduni, which no doubt has great results, but there  is a weird thing that repeats itself in lot of the cases - on hairline procedures, the left temple is relatively thinner than the other areas. This is coming from the patient himself, as well as judging by the photos. I dont know whats the deal with it. although in many cases I saw that Feriduni offer a free touch up for this, which speaks volume about his ethics.

I saw some more good cases from Bruno Fereirra and Bruno Pinto, but I figure, if I already go for spain, for FUE, then there is no reason not to prefer De Freitas

so about Dr De Freitas - I send a request for estimation via the site, and still didnt got respond, I send also a mail, and even contact via whatssup, but nothing yet. Does anyone here has some experience with contacting them?

I send a consultation request also to H&W week ago and didnt got respond yet

About the other names that came up here, I keep researching however there arent lots of posted cases to many of them.

lol Im sorry if I sound too petty but as you understand this decision means the life for me, and I cant make any mistakes.

On 1/6/2020 at 11:05 PM, Carjoca said:

@karatekid fully understand the emotional situation you are in and that the hair loss is an emotional burden for you! Having said this I would be positive optimistic for your current hair status (some higher NWs would kill for that ;)) and key will be if your hair loss will progress in your 30s more severely or is more or less stable. Taking Fin (also consistently, not on and off) could help to stabilize it but can fully understand if you are not into taking meds that can cause quite some side effects...

If it can be confirmed that your hair loss is somewhat stable and your donor is not miniaturized then I would rather consider FUE over FUT as I would think you can achieve based on your desired hairline design a good result with 2000—2500 grafts and still would have enough reserve (if you have a good beard donor then even more so). But up to you...

Some feedback from my end to your doctors list as far as I can comment (coming from Central Europe focusing on the chaps in my neighbourhood ;))

Hattingen is based in Switzerland (orginally started in Hattingen, Germany, then moved to Switzerland) and offers both techniques, FUT and FUE. FUT is their original method which made them famous and the results I have seen in other forums are superb and I would say leading edge with H&W. Since some time they offer also FUE and also here the results are really looking good. Just met a guy last week who had a FUE there and it looked really great! Pricewise they are on the upper end per graft but also worthwhile to mention that doctors do big parts of the work.

 

Dr. Feriduni is a world class surgeon and quite famous in German forums (he is also German and his clinic is in Belgium) and also offers both, FUT and FUE. Also here results seen are really amazing. As far as I know he is involved in some parts of the HT and has an experienced team of technicians supporting him. Prices also upper end (especially since it got a duty to put the VAT of 21% for HTs in Belgium to the total cost and guess who has to pay that ;))

Next to Dr. Bisanga you already know there is also Dr. Mwamba in Belgium which is known for consistent and good results but also rather expensive. 

A rather not so often mentioned surgeon but being top-notch is Dr. Heitmann based in Zurich. He is doing everything himself and thus also only a limited amount of grafts per session. From other forums I have seen amazing results and not heard anything negative but also heard he has a very long waiting list. With around 6 Swiss Franks per graft also not really a cheap one... This short clip gives a good overview on what he does: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PoTHyiaPRR8&feature=youtu.be

Coming from Middle East and having somewhat not such a high interest in long flights I would definitely recommend to look into Turkey as amongst the majority of really cutthroat clinics there are some really world class addresses. Dr. Pekiner was already mentioned, apart from that Dr. Keser is known to deliver very good results (especially dense hairlines with little graft counts, how ever he does that...) and Dr. Ozgur and his team in the Hairline Clinic are delivering constant outstanding results where you have all major steps done by a Dr., with manual punch and limited amount of grafts per day.

 

All in all I wish you well on you journey and am sure whoever you will pick from your list will be the right choice as you are already showing with your list of potential Doctors that you know the first step to a successful HT is to familiarize yourself with the topic and understand that there are honorable and less so honorable clinics out there...

 

All the best

 

Carjoca

Big thanks! great input. 

About Hattingen - I know they are 2 doctors (married couple), so they both work on the same procedure? or I need to choose one of them (like with H&W)?

About Feriduni - I saw really great FUE jobs of him, but would you say his FUT is at the same level?  Im not saying I decided yet on FUT, just taking into consideration all the options.

Never heard about Heitmann before, didnt see any patient posted case by him,  would like to see if you can refer me.

by the way,  did anyone here heard that Lorenzo is retiring? someone here in he forum said this (dont remember who) and I just stopped research about him lol, maybe not the smartest thing... but if you have any idea would like to hear. It does seem like he more of a trainer now, he works / worked with all the big spanish names - DeFreitas, Pinto, Ferreira, Ximena...  maybe he is done playing and start couching

On 1/6/2020 at 8:35 PM, hairlossPA said:

it doesn’t matter if you choose FUT or FUE, when you go with H&W you can’t go wrong. if i ever get a transplant i’m going with them

Ye man, if they only were a bit closer to me it wouldnt be such a hard decision.

11 hours ago, Raphael84 said:

@karatekid

I hope you are well. Well done for your write up.

Considering the calibre of your hair and extent of your loss (minimal) in the photographs that you have posted, whilst also knowing your age, I would not personally have concern regarding the amount of grafts that your donor could provide with FUE.

Your choice of physician and preferred technique is a very personal decision and individuals have motivations for their own preferences, but if your main motivation to consider FUT is to be able to harvest more grafts long term, you need to ensure that this is the right channel of thoughts for you personally.

Almost all of hair loss sufferers have felt the pain of male pattern baldness, nobody more than myself. As you have explained in your write up, you have had a hard time with BDD. Would a FUT scar potentially cause complication for you personally in the future in terms of your BDD?

I would completely disagree regarding the quality of results being optimal with FUT. I dont believe that to be true at all. 

I would agree with @Triple7when he said that your wavy hair should definitely compliment your result.

You have named some great physicians. Continue to do your research and ensure that you are 100% confident in your ultimate decision of Doctor.

I wish you the very best!

About the scar, well, Im not really excited to go get a scar all over the back of my head. BUT, if I weight the importance of good, dense hair at the front and top parts, and good framing hairline against a scar, which hopefully be minor, it takes 100x times. So, if there is even small chance to get better results / more hair for longer term in exchange for that, I think it worth it.

Now, regarding the quality of FUT, I really dont know myself, Im not experienced enough, just by reading here and there. I was just reading actually a long thread here about arguments of FUT vs FUE,  and as you all probably know that there is no full agreement on this issue, so thats why Im not sure yet, still thinking about that. Also I know that my hairloss situation might be not that bad (relatively), but believe me, even just a small recession completely changed my look, my head shape is not suitable for that. And also, I dont really know how it's going to progress, I dont even want to think about it lol.

By the way I read your comments in this forum, and wanted to say that you always talk with sense and being objective and helpful, so thanks for your contribution.  You say you are hairloss sufferer too - did you have a HT? if so how did it effect you? interested to hear the story.

Hi guys, very interesting thread about those methods. I myself wonder which method should I choose for my coming procedure. I get the pros and cons, but interested on the practical matter - If I go for FUT, what is the minimal guard number I can have on my donor, without the scar be visible? I seriously consider FUT since Im not going to shave my head to zero guard ever, just not suites me, but I do shave my back and sides a bit closer than the top, so I was wondering.  Assuming average scarring, from reputable surgeon of course. I also have fair skin with dark hair if it matters.

On 1/3/2020 at 10:26 AM, Portugal25 said:

KarateKid I would advise you to go with Dr. Bruno Ferreira (2,5€/graft), Dr. Ximena Villa (2,5€/graft) or Dr. Kaan Pekiner (2.15€/graft). Dr.Ximena has dozen of results , Dt.Bruno is now posting results in this forum and Dr. Kaan has dozens of patient results

These are the 3 rising stars in the world of FUE and you won’t find any other Doctor performing the whole surgery with just 1 patient per day at this price point. 

I went with Dr. Kaan Pekiner and I can tell you that he’s the best and only option in Turkey (besides Keser but he only does small surgeries). Check out my video of the clinic in my results thread. 

My friend Gonçalo also went to Dr. Kaan last month but the Dr stopped the surgery because the grafts were miniaturized and Dr. Kaan didn’t want to take his money to then have him get a bad result due to hairs becoming increasingly more minituarized over time. 

This is a very ethical Doctor that takes pride in his work and will give you a great hairline if he accepts you as a patient. 

I looked at some Ferreira work in this spanish forum and it is really good work. Sometimes I wonder, almost all results posted in this forum are great, barely any failures,  I wonder if it is because the 'spanish hair', or because those doctors know how to work with this type of hair, or they just great doctors in general. But I still didnt really research enough  there so I might be talking nonsense.

On 1/4/2020 at 3:48 AM, elduterino said:

what meds did you take and how much/for how long. Why do you think those did not work ?

I took propecia and minoxi, for 2 years in the beggining I think. But my hair kept receding, So that's why I thought it didnt work 😕  .  however as I said I kinda kept taking it on and off over the years, nothing stopped the receding and thinning, but I really cant tell what my situation would be without it. I know that both of my brothers (one older than me and one younger) are in worse situation.

15 hours ago, Triple7 said:

With how wavy and thick your hair is, you will get an excellent result if you go to a good surgeon. I would say 1500-2000 in the frontal portion would make a nice difference. You are not in bad shape at all.

Thanks bro! it's really encouraging, I really hope you right.  about the number - on my consultations with the belgian doctos about 1.5 years ago I got estimation of ~2500. And I kept losing hair since then, but not alot since the progress really slow.

Im just not sure if I also need to take into account the type of patient's hair of the results I see, when researching a doctor. I mean, there are already too many variables and I just getting more lost 😕

12 minutes ago, 1978matt said:

FUT would be a good idea provided your scalp is not tight.  I would suggest Konior, Bisanga or Hasson as all 3 are capable of switching to FUE if necessary.  Not sure about the others or if Maras still does FUT.

I would guess you need 2000-2500 grafts.

How can I know if my scalp is tight or not? You say I need to have frontal consultation for the doctor to verify this? it will be kind of problem if I decide I go for Hasson, as I said because of the distance...

@Egy well, I dont know, of course I dont want to diss all Turkey doctors, but I just read alot that there is more like a hit or miss there. the results are not consistent, occasionly butcher jobs, clinics ran by technicians, doctors do several patients a day, feel like manufactory pipeline.  All this is just generalization and probably not true for all clinics there, but I just became kinda anti for turkey clinics, and stop researching results from there. 

But, if the experts here really think it worth checking, I would definitely do that. But, I want to emphasize that my first consideration BY FAR is quality result. And it might sound stupid but I dont think I could handle a failed procedure.