Low Waiting Time Top Tier Surgeons?

[mmokin]

17 minutes ago, NARMAK said:

It's not really a "weird take" per se, and that's why i did put the part in brackets to try and imply it is a very rudimentary type of example. 

Genetics are generally a wild bunch but i stand by the general sentiment that polishing yourself up cosmetically to add features etc. that might not be as much in your genetic pool can create a disparity. 

We generally inherit bits and bats from both our parents after all and sometimes things that may have skipped a generation. For example, my Father and his brothers never got the height of their father who was over 6 foot, but a handful of their kids did, whilst most of the other males didn't. 

I think the rest of what you mentioned about potential BDD is something to be explored. 

even hieght which what you brought up can be influenced greatly by enviroment, nutrition, hormones,sleep etc not involving genetics and would you agree that for most men the ideal woman would be maybe 5'6 whereas for most woman the ideal man would be 6'2 now lets say the ideal of both genders have kids, the daughters could be 6'1 and the sons could be 5'8 which are in the range of both parents and completely plausible but they are no longer the ideal from either gender.

that is what gender dimorphism is

[NARMAK]

4 minutes ago, mmokin said:

even hieght which what you brought up can be influenced greatly by enviroment, nutrition, hormones,sleep etc not involving genetics and would you agree that for most men the ideal woman would be maybe 5'6 whereas for most woman the ideal man would be 6'2 now lets say the ideal of both genders have kids, the daughters could be 6'1 and the sons could be 5'8 which are in the range of both parents and completely plausible but they are no longer the ideal from either gender.

that is what gender dimorphism is

I understand that, but again the very example you used is much more uncommon in occurrence too. 

I do believe height is less attributed to those environmental factors as much as your genetics creating the baseline. 80% or so is the figure cited commonly. 

Again, regarding ideal heights i think that's an individual preference but in todays age the most common sort of heights are probably near what you mentioned. Hell, even 6'2" is apparently considered short and some girls saying they want a 6'5" guy lmao. 

Honestly, i think we should probably try to control what is in our own hands within a reasonable range to improve our appearances. Being healthy with nutrition and working out, perhaps even a spot of bodybuilding here and there to sculpt your physique. Getting enough sleep, using safe products to moisturise with, protect the skin from sun damage etc. and cosmetic surgery etc. should be a last resort. 

Also, i am not against surgery but like you were trying to point out, it needs to be a proper consideration and underlying psychological issues that might be there to be addressed in order to get a realistic expectation and outcome. Heck, we tell people that they need to realise a hair transplant also isn't going to be a magic pill for life improvement. 

I personally have a laundry list of self improvement i want to make and some of those include surgery like for the eyes to be corrected for sight and also to fix a broken nose i picked up as a teen. However i don't think anybody really noticed the nose at all and the eyesight is easily managed with contact lense but i would love to be free of them and swim without fear of losing them in a water park, swimming pool etc. 

[mmokin]

2 minutes ago, NARMAK said:

I understand that, but again the very example you used is much more uncommon in occurrence too. 

I do believe height is less attributed to those environmental factors as much as your genetics creating the baseline. 80% or so is the figure cited commonly. 

Again, regarding ideal heights i think that's an individual preference but in todays age the most common sort of heights are probably near what you mentioned. Hell, even 6'2" is apparently considered short and some girls saying they want a 6'5" guy lmao. 

Honestly, i think we should probably try to control what is in our own hands within a reasonable range to improve our appearances. Being healthy with nutrition and working out, perhaps even a spot of bodybuilding here and there to sculpt your physique. Getting enough sleep, using safe products to moisturise with, protect the skin from sun damage etc. and cosmetic surgery etc. should be a last resort. 

Also, i am not against surgery but like you were trying to point out, it needs to be a proper consideration and underlying psychological issues that might be there to be addressed in order to get a realistic expectation and outcome. Heck, we tell people that they need to realise a hair transplant also isn't going to be a magic pill for life improvement. 

I personally have a laundry list of self improvement i want to make and some of those include surgery like for the eyes to be corrected for sight and also to fix a broken nose i picked up as a teen. However i don't think anybody really noticed the nose at all and the eyesight is easily managed with contact lense but i would love to be free of them and swim without fear of losing them in a water park, swimming pool etc. 

i agree with everything your writing 

[Curious25]

I wouldn’t class laser eye surgery as cosmetic surgery, personally. 
 

As for restoring your broken nose - this is more like restoration, as opposed to augmentation - these two key words are very fundamental when considering surgery. 
It is one thing to restore a feature back to its more youthful, or previous self - which is a lot less indicative of any such psychological issues such as BDD, perfect example being a hair transplant. 
 

Augmentation, unless it is a medically determined defect, such as a cleft lip, or due to perhaps a physically altering accident (which would be closer categorised as restoration), is a lot more indicative of psychological health concerns - which is certainly how the theme of this thread comes across. 
 

It’s quite disconcerting tbh, and reminds me of an article I came across years ago about online ‘incel’ communities. 
 

I would really encourage OP to seek out a psychological assessment rather than worrying about fitting in a hair transplant alongside an array of other seemingly full on surgeries (which on a whole new topic is far from an ideal scenario in terms of a healing and growing perspective in itself). 
 

Don’t do it, is my advice. 

[Nobody]

1 hour ago, Curious25 said:

I wouldn’t class laser eye surgery as cosmetic surgery, personally. 
 

As for restoring your broken nose - this is more like restoration, as opposed to augmentation - these two key words are very fundamental when considering surgery. 
It is one thing to restore a feature back to its more youthful, or previous self - which is a lot less indicative of any such psychological issues such as BDD, perfect example being a hair transplant. 
 

Augmentation, unless it is a medically determined defect, such as a cleft lip, or due to perhaps a physically altering accident (which would be closer categorised as restoration), is a lot more indicative of psychological health concerns - which is certainly how the theme of this thread comes across. 
 

It’s quite disconcerting tbh, and reminds me of an article I came across years ago about online ‘incel’ communities. 
 

I would really encourage OP to seek out a psychological assessment rather than worrying about fitting in a hair transplant alongside an array of other seemingly full on surgeries (which on a whole new topic is far from an ideal scenario in terms of a healing and growing perspective in itself). 
 

Don’t do it, is my advice. 

.

Edited March 26, 2022 by Nobody

[Curious25]

I think it’s the fact you’re so adamant that plastic surgery will improve ‘one’s life’. 
 

If you look at any study with regards to physical attractiveness and the correlations it has with success in both dating and the professional world, they always conclude and portray that the so called perfect maths never equates to the actual top 1% of people in each of these categories, rather that it is a combination of physical attractiveness and then intangible attributes, traits, wealth, social status, charisma, intelligence, etc. 

It is also proven time and time again, that perfect maths never produces the most chosen male or female when population samples are asked to rate people based on pure aesthetics - and it is a mixture of having striking or polarising features, dimorphism, and good mathematical ratios. 
 

You’re fighting a losing battle, and no matter how you try and justify this to yourself with whatever ROI or choice of lifestyle rationale you want to put forward - a man made, algorithmic aesthetic robot, which is essentially what your plan is proposing to become, won’t achieve your dating and professional goals on its own. 

[Nobody]

17 minutes ago, Curious25 said:

I think it’s the fact you’re so adamant that plastic surgery will improve ‘one’s life’. 
 

If you look at any study with regards to physical attractiveness and the correlations it has with success in both dating and the professional world, they always conclude and portray that the so called perfect maths never equates to the actual top 1% of people in each of these categories, rather that it is a combination of physical attractiveness and then intangible attributes, traits, wealth, social status, charisma, intelligence, etc. 

It is also proven time and time again, that perfect maths never produces the most chosen male or female when population samples are asked to rate people based on pure aesthetics - and it is a mixture of having striking or polarising features, dimorphism, and good mathematical ratios. 
 

You’re fighting a losing battle, and no matter how you try and justify this to yourself with whatever ROI or choice of lifestyle rationale you want to put forward - a man made, algorithmic aesthetic robot, which is essentially what your plan is proposing to become, won’t achieve your dating and professional goals on its own. 

.

Edited March 26, 2022 by Nobody

[NARMAK]

1 hour ago, Curious25 said:

I wouldn’t class laser eye surgery as cosmetic surgery, personally. 
 

As for restoring your broken nose - this is more like restoration, as opposed to augmentation - these two key words are very fundamental when considering surgery. 
It is one thing to restore a feature back to its more youthful, or previous self - which is a lot less indicative of any such psychological issues such as BDD, perfect example being a hair transplant. 
 

Augmentation, unless it is a medically determined defect, such as a cleft lip, or due to perhaps a physically altering accident (which would be closer categorised as restoration), is a lot more indicative of psychological health concerns - which is certainly how the theme of this thread comes across. 
 

It’s quite disconcerting tbh, and reminds me of an article I came across years ago about online ‘incel’ communities. 
 

I would really encourage OP to seek out a psychological assessment rather than worrying about fitting in a hair transplant alongside an array of other seemingly full on surgeries (which on a whole new topic is far from an ideal scenario in terms of a healing and growing perspective in itself). 
 

Don’t do it, is my advice. 

I guess i just generally meant laser eye surgery in the sense of it being a surgical procedure where technically its not necessary when you can manage it with glasses and contacts. 

The nose again, to probably 95% of people probably wouldn't get noticed so in that sense, it would seem a trivial procedure to undertake in some viewpoints when there's plenty that could go wrong. I think ultimately if i wanted to, it needs to be done in a way that does not alter my look negatively and the trap is the "refinement" sometimes people make with some corrective surgeries to also improve some aesthetic elements of the nose in a subtle way. 

Ultimately imo any elective cosmetic surgery undertaken by an individual for aesthetic enhancements should be carefully thought about and weighed up according to the risk being undertaken and the actual realistic outcome that will be achieved. 

53 minutes ago, Nobody said:

You should understand that I operate under a premise that various dimensions of success are "mathematical". Looks play a bigger role in some of than compared to others (i.e. dating - almost exclusively looks; social interactions - looks are significant; professional success - looks are somewhat significant). 

Looks themselves can be broken down into various areas (Face, Hair, Height, Frame, Posture etc.). Therefore, if you improve one of the areas within Looks, you can expect a higher degree or likelihood of success in one of the aforementioned dimensions.

Obviously you have to augment or improve whatever will actually improve your looks. So having BDD and obsessing about a slightly crooked nose that no one sees in motion would not improve one's looks. I'm quite objective about what needs to be augmented, so I don't see any problem there. 

You should think of plastic surgery akin to an alternative investment asset class. If plastic surgery has the highest ROI on the dollar compared to other investments for your desired outcomes (for me dating, social and professional success), then it is a good decision to do so.

For me, I care less about long-term stability or preparing to build a family or something like this. This reflects in the job I have, the decisions I take etc. So plastic surgery would give me the highest ROI for my desired outcomes. I don't see how this decision to spend 6-figures on surgery would be concerning in itself - maybe underestimatng the risks or overestimating the outcomes is, but not the decision to improve ones life through plastic surgery. 

Ultimately you will make the decisions you decide to. People can only offer their opinion but attractiveness is not entirely "mathematical" per se. 

Visually you may improve your looks and initially in your example of dating etc. it may open the opportunities a bit more and that's enough for you to consider it a success, but maintaining a relationship eventually goes beyond just the visual. Charisma, Confidence etc. that all are mentioned by @Curious25for example can be built up internally and cannot be imbued surgically.

The idea perhaps you and maybe others subscribe to is that the better and physically more attractive you are, that certain barriers are removed or reduced and that you can "get away" with not having those other traits as much. 

The more you concentrate on a superficial element, eventually you will come to a rude awakening at some point that it's not in the long term a fulfilling life for most. Perhaps you may be in the minority but only time and being in those situations could tell. 

I think you seem like a sensible enough individual to go to the trouble of clearly researching things you feel will improve your life and clearly are doing well enough to be able to afford to consider the procedures you are with that budget. Just don't get sucked into chasing the Rainbow/Unicorn which forever moves once you seemingly got where you thought you needed to. 

We all get dealt a hand in life, some better than others but if we try to at least improve our lot in life and blinker ourselves from unrealistic expectations, i think you might ultimately find things a lot more enjoyable. 

Good luck whatever you do decide, but please take care and consideration before moving forwards with any of these potentially life changing choices including a hair transplant. 

[Melvin- Admin]

Not sure if this topic is related to hair loss anymore. I will place this in the “cosmetic non related to hair loss” section. 

[mtb]

On 3/25/2022 at 6:08 PM, BDK081522 said:

 

Edited March 28, 2022 by mtb
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[mavigo]

I waited for Dr. Panine for 6 months. Not bad.