TC17

I trim up my chest hair roughly every other week (all of you old guys who are still rocking the Burt Reynolds 1970's machismo look can bust balls all you want), and I noticed that almost every follicular unit that I could see was a one or two hair graft. Does anyone know if that means that a vast majority of my scalp hair will also be 1's and 2's, or is there no correlation? On a semi related note, how many of you guys would consider yourself hairy? It seems that a lot of bald men are super hairy as well. My dad is almost 60 years old and NW 6.5 and he has full back and chest hair (it's gross) and has had it since he was in his early 20's. I'm 26 and would consider myself only marginally hairy, as my beard is not that thick, I have no back hair, and my chest hair is maybe only slightly more so than average. I'm hoping that means I didn't inherit my dad's hair loss pattern, but I'm pretty sure that there is no correlation between those two things. Any thoughts?

I trim up my chest hair roughly every other week (all of you old guys who are still rocking the Burt Reynolds 1970's machismo look can bust balls all you want), and I noticed that almost every follicular unit that I could see was a one or two hair graft. Does anyone know if that means that a vast majority of my scalp hair will also be 1's and 2's, or is there no correlation? On a semi related note, how many of you guys would consider yourself hairy? It seems that a lot of bald men are super hairy as well. My dad is almost 60 years old and NW 6.5 and he has full back and chest hair (it's gross) and has had it since he was in his early 20's. I'm 26 and would consider myself only marginally hairy, as my beard is not that thick, I have no back hair, and my chest hair is maybe only slightly more so than average. I'm hoping that means I didn't inherit my dad's hair loss pattern, but I'm pretty sure that there is no correlation between those two things. Any thoughts?

I've also seen a sizable number of older men with thinning in their donor area. There can be no doubt that if there is thinning in the permanent zone, that the permanent zone is not necessarily permanent. I also worry about what will happen in the future if my donor area thins and a scar becomes visible and I lose transplanted grafts. Although I have been told that the rim of hair thinning is rare, the fact that it exists is troubling because of what could potentially happen. What I don't understand is how the physicians estimate graft availability on younger patients when the potential for loss exists. For example, if person A visits a doctor at age 25 he may be told that he has 8,000 grafts available, but if the same person were to visit the same doctor but at age 55, he may only have 4,000 available. The question then is what happened to the 4,000?

Read what I wrote again and then see if you can understand the point. It's not that difficult. Further, and more importantly, I think you and your posts are of no value to this forum. You antagonize other members and never contribute anything of value. And on a more personal note, the vocabulary in your posts is obnoxious. It's laughable that you consciously choose "big" words to get your message across when there are more simple words to choose from. Ask any person who has undergone any advanced writing training, (or ask me, as a law student who is on law review I am one of those people!) and they will tell you that simplicity is key when trying to convey a message. Recognize who your audience is and write to them. This is a hair restoration forum that has a sizable number of foreign patients. Ease up on the douchebaggy vocabulary, and keep it simple. Last, I don't know if you didn't get enough hugs enough as a child, or if you got picked last too many times in gym class, but whatever the reasons are for your antagonistic attitude, just drop it. I come to this site get help and to help others when possible, not to argue with you over a difference of opinion. If you feel that Dr. Feller handled this situation fairly, or if you feel that we do not have enough information to formulate an opinion, then just say so, but stop being a douche about it, OK?

How about you don't take statements out of context Ron J? I stand by my statement that Dr. Feller's response was inappropriate. I don't understand what purpose your post serves other than to try and goad me into an argument with you. It seems as though now that your little pissing match with LMS has cooled that you're trying to pick another with me. Stick to the topic of the thread, and if you don't have anything constructive to say either way, don't say anything.

I can't believe that you actually responded in that manner Dr. Feller. John said "I AM NOT CRITICIZING DR FELLER AS IT IS MUCH TO (sic) EARLY TO EVALUATE HIS WORK". Even more astounding was your desire to see his post censored in some capacity. If John is indeed lying about the number of phone calls, a simple response rebutting his statements would have been sufficient for you to take the high road, while also ensuring that your reputation remain intact. I know you don't care, and I know that I will probably take some heat from the apologists on this site, but in my opinion, you should be ashamed of yourself Dr. Feller. *and before anyone attacks me, I freely and fully admit that I know NOTHING about this situation other than what is visible on this thread. John may be an overly sensitive pain in the ass, but that doesn't have any effect on my belief that Dr. Feller's response was inappropriate and should have been handled better.

Bill, Is there a link, or any other information for that matter, on her presentation on natural hairline density?

Not to take this thread too far off topic, but I think that Dr. Konior accomplishes more, with less grafts, than any other physician. Of course hair characteristics play a huge role in the success of a transplant, but it appears to me as though Dr. Konior places grafts in a manner that makes it seem as though more grafts were placed than actually were.

Bill, Any update on Dr. Bisanga and presenting photos for review?

Exchange rate is immaterial to the point I was trying to make. I wasn't looking at total cost for treatment in the US v. total cost in Europe. Of course, when you factor in a transatlantic flight, hotel stay, food, AND a weak US dollar, the total cost of the treatment would increase. Whether the increased expenses in traveling overseas can be offset by a cheaper surgery (like, say in Thailand, Brazil, or maybe Europe) is another discussion. Regardless, the costs associated with travel and exchange rates are personal to the individual, and do not have any bearing on the prices charged by a physician. A doctor being paid in Euros won't care if the exchange rate is favorable or unfavorable to a US patient, his profit margin on the surgery remains the same regardless. The doctors in Europe set their prices based upon what they deem reasonable and profitable for them. The question is why what is reasonable and profitable in Europe is so dramatically different from the United States? I haven't been to Europe in 10 years, but if things are cheaper there across the board, then you have your answer. However, if prices for other goods and services are comparable to the US, it does make you wonder.

What kills me is that the European doctors charge FAR less than their US counterparts. For example, Dr. Feriduni charges 8,450 Euros for 4000 grafts, and 3.95 Euros per graft for FUE. Dr. Devroye is also very close in price to Dr. Feriduni. The only thing that I can think of for the dramatic differences in price is that maybe the European doctors pay their assistants and techs far less than here in the US, or possibly lower insurance rates.

I normally don't care about female transplantation because I'm male, but I must say that yours looks great Jan. Congratulations! Where were the grafts placed and how many were used?

$8 per graft is obscene, period.

Most clinics only perform one surgery per day. Now, to answer your last question, I do not think it is at all "silly" to expect your surgeon to focus all of his energy on you for a full day. By almost everyone's standards, hair transplantation is an extremely expensive procedure. If I am going to shell out thousands of dollars for a days work, you better believe that I fully expect the doctor to dedicate himself to me completely the day of surgery, as well as be available for any follow up care, questions, and concerns I may need addressed in the future. You should never feel bad about expecting nothing but the best from your surgeon, and fortunately for you, a cursory glance at this forum shows that a number of the recommended physicians share that sentiment and provide top notch care before, during, and after the surgery.

My point was that since scarring from FUE is usually minimal in appearance when compared to strip, in my opinion it would make sense to undergo that type of surgery now, and hope for breakthroughs later. If you undergo strip, you will forever be limited in your options because of the appearance of a 30cm long scar. 20 years from now there may not be any breakthroughs of note, but at least I won't have to concern myself with a strip scar. In my opinion, short hair on the sides and coverage over the frontal 2/3rd's looks better than the longer hair necessary to cover a strip scar with a balding area in the back (i.e. Joe Biden).

Nobody really knows how far away we are from cloning, cures, etc., but I for one am cautiously optimistic that within the next 10 years or so we will have better tools to fight baldness. That's why I'm VERY hesitant to undergo a traditional strip surgery. I'm only 26 years old and I would hate to live the rest of my life with a scar that may prove to be a vestige from an antiquated method in a relatively short time from now. One has to believe that at the least there will continue to be refinements to FUE, and that strip will someday be obsolete.

Does anyone know what Dr. Alexander charges for FUE per graft?

Does anyone know what Dr. Alexander charges for FUE per graft?

Dr Feller, What is the percentage decrease in grafts using FUE as opposed to strip?

While there may appear to be a relationship between a resistance to MPB and geographic location in a warmer and sunny climate, such a link does not appear to truly exist. The scientific community has proffered that if hair on the top of the head existed to protect from the sun as a result of our bipedality, that hair on the shoulders, neck, and upper back should also have been selected for. Because those traits were not selected for, the theory goes that hair on the top of the head also was not selected for that particular purpose.

I would think that the doctors who are plastic surgeons would most likely give the best scar. Dr. Lindsey and Dr. Konior both have a plastic surgery background, so I think that you would be hard pressed to find a doctor who can give a better scar than either of them.

Does anyone know if you can use hat size to determine how much bald area you will have IF you progress to a NW6 or 7? I tried using the method Dr. Shapiro explained, but I kept getting a very high area. I'm like a 7 1/8 in hats, which is just about average, yet when I draw a NW 6 pattern I keep coming up with 300cm of bald area. Dr. Shapiro explicitly stated that men with "very large scalps" may have that much surface area, but my head is normal size, which means I should be around 200cm, right?

Ron, It's really getting old seeing you follow LMS around this forum and picking fights. Congratulations on high jacking another thread.

hdude46, Why do you say that rate of loss plays such a big role? I can see how if you have slow loss the transplant will look better for a longer period of time due to more native hair in the area, but eventually the hair that is destined to fall out will do so. You're then left with the same bald area as if you were to lose all of the hair in 5 years as opposed to 20 years.

B, That makes sense, thank you for the detailed response. Just to clarify though, the average person who has maxed out his strip still has an additional 1,000 to 2,000 available via FUE to harvest, right? And if that is true, then the average person has between 7,000 and 8,000 follicular units available for transplantation?