Eugenix (Drs. Das/Somesh/Vinita) | 11,102 grafts | NW 6/7 | 28 yrs old | 2022/2023/2024

[general-etwan]

17 hours ago, Hair4Days said:

Could you put grafts there ? 

Considering my scalp donor is looking pretty good already at 1 month, and knowing I have at least 700 more beard grafts available, I would think it might be possible in a future procedure if I ever wanted to. I may have another 1,000 grafts available from my scalp donor, because Eugenix also didn't take anything from my thick sideburns area when they could have and originally marked it as suitable for donor use. So say 1,000 scalp grafts still available + maybe 1,000 beard grafts, so I think it's going to be reasonable to say I could still have 2,000 grafts moved to that thinning area if I ever want to.

6 hours ago, Jay said:

i have my HT scheduled for Jan- do they guide you as to how to obtain visa and travelling. I tried contacting them and it has been really hard with them recently @Eugenix Hair Sciences

You can contact them via Whatsapp for some help with those things. Traveling will largely be up to you, however. You have to figure out your own travels TO India...they will have everything arranged and ready for you as soon as you touch down at the airport. As far as the visa goes, if you are from the U.S. you can apply for the India e-visa online here (https://indianvisaonline.gov.in/evisa/tvoa.html) and they approve you within a few days max.

5 hours ago, Melvin- Moderator said:

It’s actually the other way around. Sessions biggest advantage is donor management, and ensuring that grafts grow optimally, WAY lower risk. Doing sessions all at once is a gamble. 

Yeah, I think what he meant to highlight was that there are perceived disadvantages of only covering one area at a time when someone is completely bald, having more to do with physical appearance and travel burdens. If I would have went to a more local clinic in the U.S. or one with a more questionable reputation, I would have not requested that my entire area be covered at once. I did so because I had full confidence in Eugenix to handle this situation as I envisioned and cover the entire area in one go. They're one of only a few clinics in the world I would trust to do that knowing it can be more risky.

2 hours ago, asterix0 said:

@general-etwan The reason for that discrepancy in color in your donor area is because you are headed to norwood 7, and that lighter area will eventually be bald. This is why the grafts were not extracted from that region, because it is not a stable donor area suitable for hair transplantation.  

SMP may be an option there but ultimately it is best to do nothing now and wait for your hair transplant to grow out for the full year.

In my opinion considering your donor area and status I am not sure you were quite a candidate, at best I would recommend that you get a suitable hairline to frame your face from the hair transplant and combine it with smp eventually to go for the buzzed but 3D look that the transplant would allow you to have. 

For Norwood 7 patients with weak donor it is very, very difficult to achieve a good result, it is not your fault, it is just a physical limitation of transplantation at this time.

Yes, I understand all of this. I didn't want grafts extracted from that region - they shouldn't ever be extracted from that region because that region is susceptible to thinning with age. I have been considering what to do about that area in terms of making it look more uniform with the donor area on the lower back of the head. I thought that maybe after the HT, the scalp donor area would be thinned out enough so that it would look more similar to that thinning region above it, but actually my donor area is looking too good at this point and it's still way thicker than that area above it.

This is less of an issue when the hair is longer, because I can leave that thinned region longer and buzz the lower back shorter to create a more uniform appearance (a fade upward). However, I may need to at least occasionally buzz my head uniform length for a future professional position, and so when the entire head is buzzed short like this, you can see the contrast in skin tone because of the thinned lower crown region.

I don't quite understand this "not a candidate" stuff...by what parameters? By whose parameters? Where is the line between being a HT candidate vs. not being one? These things can vary depending on a person's goals and desires, and so I don't think it's right to make such judgments from afar. I can assure you that I am already far happier than I've been in years knowing that I'm going to have hair on the top of my head. Hair on the top of the head is always superior to no hair on the top of the head.

These other more minor imperfections (and by imperfections I mean discrepancies that result in a distribution of hairs across the head that is not completely uniform) are things to address in time, if I need to.

The reason I wonder about SMP is because of the contrast in skin tone when everything is buzzed down to no length, due to the genetic thinning. Finasteride has done a decent job at thickening some hair in that thinned region enough so that when grown a bit longer and the lower back buzzed shorter, it can make for an acceptable look. I may just have to take that route and have it maintained by a barber constantly to look its best.

Edited October 19, 2022 by general-etwan

[asterix0]

32 minutes ago, general-etwan said:

Considering my scalp donor is looking pretty good already at 1 month, and knowing I have at least 700 more beard grafts available, I would think it might be possible in a future procedure if I ever wanted to. I may have another 1,000 grafts available from my scalp donor, because Eugenix also didn't take anything from my thick sideburns area when they could have and originally marked it as suitable for donor use. So say 1,000 scalp grafts still available + maybe 1,000 beard grafts, so I think it's going to be reasonable to say I could still have 2,000 grafts moved to that thinning area if I ever want to.

You can contact them via Whatsapp for some help with those things. Traveling will largely be up to you, however. You have to figure out your own travels TO India...they will have everything arranged and ready for you as soon as you touch down at the airport. As far as the visa goes, if you are from the U.S. you can apply for the India e-visa online here (https://indianvisaonline.gov.in/evisa/tvoa.html) and they approve you within a few days max.

Yeah, I think what he meant to highlight was that there are perceived disadvantages of only covering one area at a time when someone is completely bald, having more to do with physical appearance and travel burdens. If I would have went to a more local clinic in the U.S. or one with a more questionable reputation, I would have not requested that my entire area be covered at once. I did so because I had full confidence in Eugenix to handle this situation as I envisioned and cover the entire area in one go. They're one of only a few clinics in the world I would trust to do that knowing it can be more risky.

Yes, I understand all of this. I didn't want grafts extracted from that region - they shouldn't ever be extracted from that region because that region is susceptible to thinning with age. I have been considering what to do about that area in terms of making it look more uniform with the donor area on the lower back of the head. I thought that maybe after the HT, the scalp donor area would be thinned out enough so that it would look more similar to that thinning region above it, but actually my donor area is looking too good at this point and it's still way thicker than that area above it.

This is less of an issue when the hair is longer, because I can leave that thinned region longer and buzz the lower back shorter to create a more uniform appearance (a fade upward). However, I may need to at least occasionally buzz my head uniform length for a future professional position, and so when the entire head is buzzed short like this, you can see the contrast in skin tone because of the thinned lower crown region.

I don't quite understand this "not a candidate" stuff...by what parameters? By whose parameters? Where is the line between being a HT candidate vs. not being one? These things can vary depending on a person's goals and desires, and so I don't think it's right to make such judgments from afar. I can assure you that I am already far happier than I've been in years knowing that I'm going to have hair on the top of my head. Hair on the top of the head is always superior to no hair on the top of the head.

These other more minor imperfections (and by imperfections I mean discrepancies that result in a distribution of hairs across the head that is not completely uniform) are things to address in time, if I need to.

The reason I wonder about SMP is because of the contrast in skin tone when everything is buzzed down to no length, due to the genetic thinning. Finasteride has done a decent job at thickening some hair in that thinned region enough so that when grown a bit longer and the lower back buzzed shorter, it can make for an acceptable look. I may just have to take that route and have it maintained by a barber constantly to look its best.

Not a candidate in the sense that, it is unclear if you have a truly stable donor region. You may be one of the people who's transplanted hair thins.

But yes I agree, having some hair on top is better than no hair, so it was certainly worth a try.

[general-etwan]

8 minutes ago, asterix0 said:

Not a candidate in the sense that, it is unclear if you have a truly stable donor region. You may be one of the people who's transplanted hair thins.

But yes I agree, having some hair on top is better than no hair, so it was certainly worth a try.

Not common to be able to declare that for anyone. You'd have to measure exact diameters of donor area hairs over many months to see if there's any decrease in diameters. No one does that. At the same time, no one completely loses more than 50% density of that narrow band around the back in their lifetime. The fact that it has looked and felt stable to my own observation and touch since I started worrying about hair loss, so about age 20, is good enough for me.

[asterix0]

1 hour ago, general-etwan said:

Not common to be able to declare that for anyone. You'd have to measure exact diameters of donor area hairs over many months to see if there's any decrease in diameters. No one does that. At the same time, no one completely loses more than 50% density of that narrow band around the back in their lifetime. The fact that it has looked and felt stable to my own observation and touch since I started worrying about hair loss, so about age 20, is good enough for me.

Understood, look I also don't mean to be cynical. I want you to have a successful procedure and I hope everything turns out well.

Nothing is guaranteed for anyone. Generally speaking though, the higher Norwood you are, the greater your DHT sensitivity is, even for supposed "safe" hairs.

There's no need for added pessimism in your thread so I'll graciously bow out as I don't want to contribute any negativity, that was certainly not my intention 🙂. What's done is done now. 

 

 

[general-etwan]

9 minutes ago, asterix0 said:

Understood, look I also don't mean to be cynical. I want you to have a successful procedure and I hope everything turns out well.

Nothing is guaranteed for anyone. Generally speaking though, the higher Norwood you are, the greater your DHT sensitivity is, even for supposed "safe" hairs.

There's no need for added pessimism in your thread so I'll graciously bow out as I don't want to contribute any negativity, that was certainly not my intention 🙂. What's done is done now. 

 

 

Absolutely, that is all true. Still, so glad I did this, and with the growth I've seen others receive from these types of cases, I feel very good that I'll like the results far better than any other alternative.

[danielx111]

1 hour ago, asterix0 said:

Not a candidate in the sense that, it is unclear if you have a truly stable donor region. You may be one of the people who's transplanted hair thins.

But yes I agree, having some hair on top is better than no hair, so it was certainly worth a try.

Unfortunately he is right.

 

I do wish you success and hope it will turn out great for you!

 

However, you and me are sharing the same situation. We are the same age, I started to lose my hair when I was 15-16 as well, by 23 Norwood six.

 

Started to wear hair piece when I was 21 (no one knew I ever got bald because I used Toppik while I was losing my hair and transfered to Hair piece when Toppik couldn't work anymore).

 

At age 25 I went under HT (FUT), 2k grafts to transplant my hairline and place the hair piece behind it.

 

At age 26 I went under FUE (1k grafts) to transplant the scar + 800 grafts to fill temples and lower the hairline by 3/4 inch.

Everything grew perfectly, I would say I had 95%+ growth. I went to one of the best doctors in US, however... About a year after my first HT I started to shed some transplanted hairs, I did notice it gets thinner and thinner. 3 years later (Today), I lost about 30% if not more.

 

Just to clarify, the hairline was SUPER dense and gradually decreased the destiny. Honestly? I wasn't shocked, I knew it would happen but I was like, if 30% will remain I may still be able to work with it. However as it seems now, I don't think 30% will remain in two years from now.

 

The reason I knew I may lose some of it (I never knew I would lose so much and so soon), is because I am shedding from my donor. When the hairloss is aggressive and especially for young people as us the donor takes an effect as well sometimes.

 

Now I am in a stage where :

My "hair" looks great, impossible to know I have hair piece and I have brushed back hairstyle, However I am concerned about the future, How far my hairloss will continue in my back and sides, what if it will become so thin that even hair piece won't be an option?

 

Looking at my uncles/father/grandfather's, we are ALL Norwood 6, all of them have hair on sides and back but it's definitely thin compared to the average person.

Look at your relatives, it may give you an idea how your donor will be at theirs age. The fact your taking propecia may help you as well, for me it just didn't work even when I took it 4 years straight, always shedded the same amount of hairs.

 

Something weird that I experienced though, after FUE (The second producer), my shedding has stopped for 3 months straight. Something that never happened to me for many years, my entire scalp felt better and not oily etc. I think due to the blood circulation (taking out the grafts and the numbing) actually "Cured" me for couple of months. I tried to pull hairs out, it was impossible, If I go to my donor now and try to pull gently, at least two hairs will go out.

Anyway, I wish you lots of success and will definitely follow this thread. Your beard looks good as well and I believe you have additional 1k+ to take from there. 

 

Edited October 19, 2022 by danielx111

[general-etwan]

@danielx111 My first question was going to be if you've taken finasteride. I'm sorry it didn't really do anything for you. In some people the genetic hair loss is simply so aggressive that even finasteride won't do anything positive. So far it's been good for me, but I am considering the idea of dutasteride since it blocks the other type of 5a enzyme that finasteride does not. 

I think it's hard sometimes to forget, when we get so involved in all of this hair loss stuff in life, that perfection is never realistic, nor is it a healthy thing to obsess over at all. I've heard of the shedding that people apparently experience...luckily I haven't experienced any shedding in the past few years. I know I didn't share many pictures between the age of about 21 and 26, but my hair was all gone in the pattern you see in the pre-op pics by about age 21. Since then, there has been essentially no more loss. I've never noticed any shedding at all on my pillow or in the shower. So that's as best a situation I can hope for sitting here today. 

Edited October 19, 2022 by general-etwan

[danielx111]

2 minutes ago, general-etwan said:

@danielx111 My first question was going to be if you've taken finasteride. I'm sorry it didn't really do anything for you. In some people the genetic hair loss is simply so aggressive that even finasteride won't do anything positive. So far it's been good for me, but I am considering the idea of dutasteride since it blocks the other type of 5a enzyme that finasteride does not. 

I think it's hard sometimes to forget, when we get so involved in all of this hair loss stuff in life, that perfection is never realistic, nor is it a healthy thing to obsess over at all. I've heard of the shedding that people apparently experience...luckily I haven't experienced any shedding in the past few years. I know I didn't share many pictures between the age of about 21 and 26, but my hair was all gone in the pattern you see in the pre-op pics by about age 21. Since then, there has been essentially no more loss. I've never noticed any shedding at all on my pillow or in the shower. So that's as best a situation I can hope for sitting here today. 

I am extremely happy to hear that, If you didn't suffer any shedding from your donor by now, I am pretty sure you be 100% fine. 🤗🙏🙏🙏

[general-etwan]

Here is a visual display (yes they're different length haircuts but still somewhat close)

2017 (age 21):

 

2022 (age 26):

 

Yeah, so I'll just watch how this comes in, and then see what options might be available for the contrast issue on the back as we get into next year. 

Thanks for all the comments so far from everyone!

Edited October 19, 2022 by general-etwan

[Xanadu]

On 10/19/2022 at 11:27 PM, asterix0 said:

Not a candidate in the sense that, it is unclear if you have a truly stable donor region. You may be one of the people who's transplanted hair thins.

But yes I agree, having some hair on top is better than no hair, so it was certainly worth a try.

Quoted the wrong post

Edited October 26, 2022 by Xanadu

[Murat-kz]

On 10/10/2022 at 12:29 AM, general-etwan said:

Hello everyone,

First I want to thank everyone here who may have played a role in helping me find a clinic I was confident in and helped me achieve this. This will document the journey for me.

Pre-HT Situation
MPB runs very aggressively on my father's side of the family. My grandfather, two uncles, and father have all lost significant amounts of hair by their 20s-30s. In my early teens, I already had thin hair, but didn't recognize it at the time. The aggressive hair loss probably began around age 15. I wasn't into the science of hair loss back then and so I didn't really know what was happening/didn't think about it much. But by the time I was 18-20, I knew I had lost a significant amount, suffered from the mental and social effects of knowing I disliked the look so much, etc. Below is a progression of the situation at different ages.

I remember trying minoxidil very briefly in my early 20s, but quickly "gave up" after it (obviously) didn't regrow all of my hair. I also saw a dermatologist around age 22 who presented the option of finasteride to me, but I chose not to begin taking it at that time for a few reasons: 1) He (correctly) informed me that it would not regrow all of my hair, and 2) I was in a period of being irrationally scared of taking it based on claims I had read online. So I essentially continued to do nothing while still dreaming of the possibility of having a HT somewhere, somehow. At age 24 I had a transplant consultation at a world-renowned doctor in NYC, and was politely turned down for the possibility of a transplant. My hair loss was too aggressive, they said, and a transplant at the time would not yield satisfactory results. They also said they would require finasteride for 1 year first before even considering a procedure.

So, at that point I was discouraged and essentially gave up again, though mentally I never gave up on trying to figure out how to change the situation. When you're still very young and suffer from this amount of hair loss, it makes you feel like you don't belong in many ways. Even though I've always had a fantastic family, great friends, and good people in my life, went to a great school, played sports, attended a great university and had several great involvements, I never felt confident in the look of having such aggressive hair loss and so I wore hats everywhere. The only time I would not wear a hat was when I was alone. I would read about hair cloning all the time, knowing it will probably be available someday, but that day surely won't come for decades yet.

So in early 2021, at age 25, I tried something that I learned my father has done since his 20s: wear hair systems. I actually didn't even know that he wore them until I was in my early 20s; that is how authentic and natural they looked. One of my uncles was also starting to get into the process of wearing them, so they taught me all about them and I decided to try it out. I purchased systems online and took them to HairClub to apply and maintain. I did that for about 8 months in 2021 and sported a bit of a medium-length messy look on top. There are pros and cons to hair systems. The pros were that they looked pretty good and allowed me to go outside without hat wearing which was a whole new feeling of freedom that I appreciated. The cons are that they become very expensive recurring costs, the adhesives break down constantly and require regular maintenance (appointments, scheduling), the daily time commitment of styling and making sure the edges were not coming up, the careful washing in the shower, the occasional irritation. Ultimately, I decided that continuing to wear systems forever was simply not satisfactory enough for me. I am a very active person and while you absolutely can learn to make systems work with an active lifestyle, it certainly is not without irritation and annoyance, and it just wasn't what I wanted to do going forward.

In January 2022 at age 26, after reading a lot of the science behind it, I decided I was going to try finasteride, as I was no longer irrationally afraid of any side effect claims. I did not experience any noticeable negative side effects and within a few months already started to see some improvement around the edge of the pattern of hair loss. I also added minoxidil and microneedling to that strategy; simply a "final stand" attempt at a natural hair recovery.

By spring, I had found Eugenix and had read a lot of the cases posted here. I was highly impressed with what they've done for higher Norwoods, and finding a clinic that was also within my financial means for the number of grafts I would need also felt like a miracle. At first they quoted me for around 5,500 grafts; upon more communication I requested they plan to be as aggressive as possible because I care far less about the back and sides of my head than I do the top. They re-assessed a plan for 6,500 grafts using 4,500 scalp donor + 2,000 beard donor, but I did understand that was a high projection and it would likely end up being around the original estimation. 

First, some pre-HT pictures from the last year or so (age 24-26):

  

  

 

Eugenix Pre-HT Plans
I chose the Exclusive Package at Eugenix, which is 120 INR/graft + 18% tax (so about $1.45 USD/graft right now). The Exclusive Package has the procedure led by a senior doctor; senior doctor performs 100% of slits and then all extraction and implantation is performed by senior technicians. I was informed that Dr. Priyadarshini Das would be doing my HT, and I've seen great work from her in some other cases. I also received complimentary 4 nights in a 5-star hotel, all transportation from New Delhi airport to the hotel and to the clinic, and food included in that package. They scheduled me for September 15-16 and I began my travel planning.

I only told a few people about my plans early on because I wanted to focus on all of the travel planning required without worrying people in addition. Only a few people in my family have traveled very far; certainly never to the other side of the Earth. I was never even on an airplane myself until age 24, but I'm very independently driven and I had no concerns about my ability to travel to India to do this. It was worth it for me. I just didn't want to worry too many people too early, because not everyone understands everything involved, and attempting to explain everything to people who aren't into this topic can be very exhausting.

I am from the eastern USA so I chose a flight from JFK to DEL for around $1,000 round trip. Direct flight from JFK to DEL, but then on the way home, a stop in Doha, Qatar to save money. It would have been $600 more for a direct flight home. I had miles racked up from a credit card, so I actually ended up only paying about $200 out of pocket for my flights. My procedure was scheduled for September 15-16, Thursday and Friday, so I had to leave home on Tuesday evening to arrive in New Delhi Wednesday evening. 

I had to have blood work done a few weeks prior and forward the results to Eugenix for standard inspection: red/white blood cells, Hep, HIV, prothrombin time, etc.

The communication from Eugenix leading up to my travel was excellent. I had members of the Eugenix Concierge team reach out to me consistently every few days to ensure I was prepared, understood the way things would go, etc.

Evening Before HT
After about a 15-hour flight from NYC to DEL, which honestly wasn't too bad because I slept for most of it, I arrived at Indira Gandhi International Airport a little after 9 pm Wednesday night and proceeded through customs and immigration. As for travel documents needed for this journey: passport, India e-visa printout, negative covid test result (if not providing vaccine card), and Air Suvidha declaration form required for all international passengers arriving to India.

I was contacted by the concierge team in the airport and was informed of how to locate my driver who was waiting to take me to the DoubleTree by Hilton hotel. Upon walking outside to the taxi area, I was immediately bombarded with multiple "taxi drivers" asking me where I was going, offering rides, etc. I was prepared for these "scams" ahead of time as I had heard about them. It was a bit chaotic and I was trying to find the gate where my Hilton driver was, but it took me about 5-10 minutes and in that time I was approached by 5-10 taxi drivers offering rides and demanding info on where I was going. You have to just politely say "I already have travel arranged, thank you" and keep walking away. Eventually I found the Hilton representative and my driver, who had his car parked in the parking lot. He went and got his car, pulled up to the curb, took my bags, and we proceeded to the hotel. 

I stayed in the DoubleTree by Hilton in Gurugram (Baani Square) which is only a couple minutes down the street from the Eugenix clinic. All of the attendants at the hotel were fantastic in getting me checked in and settled in my room. By that time it was after midnight and I had been informed of my reporting time at 9 am to Eugenix the next morning.

Day 1
I woke up around 8 am and stuck to my breakfast snacks I had brought with me because I didn't have a lot of time. At 9 am Eugenix called me and said the driver was outside; he picked me up in a very nice luxury SUV and we proceeded to the clinic. I brought my backpack with me with just a few belongings needed and a buttoned shirt which you need to wear after the procedure starts so you're not messing up your head. The roads in Gurgaon/Gurugram are very chaotic. The constant honking, aggressive maneuvers of drivers, but I found it amusing.

There, I checked in with some attendants and they showed me around. Then I was met by some doctors who informed me of how things would go, gave me some medication, etc. Then Dr. Das greeted me. Then I was met by a leading technician (who would take the primary care for me for all 3 days) and he led me into the photo area to take pre-HT photos. Below are some of those.

  

 

Dr. Das was initially stressed at the examination of the situation; I could tell. Her goal was to get 4,000 grafts from scalp donor area but she told me honestly that she was not sure if she could get 4,000. I did seem to experience some thinning in the 2 months leading up to the procedure, which I'm not sure why occurred...I do not know whether finasteride's effects hit a plateau and reversed, or if it was temporary caused by stress or something, or just an illusion. Anyway, Dr. Das then consulted with me for 15-30 minutes on the design of the HT on big screens with these pictures. We agreed on no temple work because it would require too many grafts, and when I grow my hair out, my temples are still acceptable to me anyway. She suggested a pretty conservative hairline, which of course I understood because of the advanced hair loss. She also explained that the plan would be to cover to the upper part of the crown, but not all the way down to the lower donor area, for 2 reasons: 1) Not enough grafts available and 2) that lower crown region is area that can improve with finasteride + minoxidil and be addressed in other ways. So, the plan was to cover approximately the below area (though I drew the hairline inaccurately), utilizing 1,000-2,000 beard grafts as well since I have good facial hair:

Once we agreed to the plan, an assistant sat down with me and went over the pricing and payment, and we took care of that. Then the lead caregiving technician got me ready with a change of clothes and settled me into the room, made sure I was comfortable, and began the preparation.

First I was given the local anesthesia all over the top of the scalp and the donor area. Dr. Das made all of the slits across the entire scalp, which I could feel the sensation of but of course not feel the pain from. That took a while. Then the leading techs began the extractions and implantations; the first day consisted of using scalp donor hair from the sides of the head on the hairline and the middle half of the scalp. I believe 2,400 grafts were implanted the first day according to the whiteboard the next day. Lunch was around 2-3 pm and they order anything you want; I'm a big pizza and fast food guy (bad I know) so they ordered some pepperoni pizzas for me which were very good. They also ask you what kind of music you like and they'll put on a playlist on a big TV in the room. They played some rap/hip-hop, pop, and some relaxing meditation music which was all uniquely enjoyable. After all the slits were made, Dr. Das left but would check in every 30 minutes or so during the extraction and implantation. We finished up around 6-7 pm. I was given full instructions on how to care for my head overnight along with a kit of items; mainly a bottle of saline spray that I was told to spray on the recipient area every hour. Also an absorption cloth to put on the pillow at night to absorb the donor area.

  

 

 

Day 2
The second day again began at 9 am. I was able to wake up earlier and order room service breakfast at the hotel. Chocolate chip pancakes, one of my favorites.

The plan for the second day was to cover the mid-scalp all the way back to the crown. The hair in the middle of the scalp donor area was used for this. I believe around 1,600 were implanted, bringing the 2-day total to 4,000 grafts.

   

  

Note that in the donor area on the back, I have a scar where no hair grows...that is just a scar from a cut in childhood; leaving it alone was absolutely fine with me.

Day 3
The entire area had been covered in the first two days but rather than rush to extract and implant beard grafts for more density Friday night, after an already long day, Dr. Das wanted to take Saturday to finish everything up. 1,300 beard grafts were used I believe in the mid-scalp to crown region. This part of the local anesthesia was the most painful as the jaw area can be very sensitive, but I just had to push through and get it done. A lot of this work was done in a position that allowed me to sit upright leaning over the reclined chair and I was able to use my phone a bit.

  

My head was very sore after these 3 days and I also started experiencing a lot pain in the implantation phase; the anesthesia kept wearing off so the technician had to keep giving me more, which blew my head up like a balloon (not seen here; the worst of it happened later that night and the next day). It was exhausting to say the least, but I felt extremely cared for by the team and they did whatever they had to do to make me as comfortable as possible. 

So the total was 5,300 grafts (4,000 scalp + 1,300 beard). When we finished up, Dr. Das inspected everything and expressed that she was super happy with the density achieved given the situation, and also that she was able to get 4,000 grafts from scalp donor. I was able to go sit in the "chill" room for a while, eat lunch, and relax. Then we took post-HT pictures.

  

  

I had seen Dr. Sethi while walking through the clinic, so after a few minutes I asked an assistant about him and they said "Oh yeah, of course, he's going to be so happy to see you" or something like that. Then I met Dr. Sethi; he has an absolutely elated personality. He examined the work done and then grabbed my hand and said "Come on, let's go!" It was a busy Saturday at the clinic and there were multiple people there for consultations/planning. Dr. Sethi took my hand and led me all around the building, showing my results to people and having me say hello to other technicians and team members I had not met yet. He asked me where I was from, about my family and schooling, etc. It was a SUPER fun time and his care made me feel fantastic after an exhausting procedure. Dr. Arika Bansal also arrived sometime after and I briefly got to say hello to her on the stairs, and she smiled a bunch at me and told me to send her pictures of the results as time went on. I wish I had taken some selfies with them but everything was chaotic and I was just focused on enjoying the moments. 

Then I spent at least a half hour with one of the leading doctors who gave me a kit full of items and explained the post-care to me. This included: saline spray for the recipient area every hour for 7 days, betadine solution and healing ointment for the donor area daily for 7 days, recovery medication to take for 7 days, months supply of hair growth vitamins, a year's worth of finasteride tablets at no cost, more absorption cloths for pillow, many surgical caps to wear gently over the head if desired while out/traveling, a neck pillow to help with sleeping for the first few nights, a letter to TSA instructing permission for me to travel with oversized items if stopped at the airport (I was not), a book by a Yogi, and an absolutely beautiful letter thanking me for entrusting this clinic and promising a lifetime of friendship.

  

Weekend & Travel Home
I extended my hotel reservation by one night, so I stayed 5 nights stay total. Saturday evening and Sunday I simply relaxed and caught up some movies I wanted to watch in my hotel room. My head was blown up from all the fluid in it; I had to keep pressing it to the sides of my forehead and downward to help the body get rid of it more quickly. Sleeping was not too bad at all. I left Monday morning; my driver took me to the airport and I was on my way back home. Well, first to Doha, which was a fun few hours in Hamad Airport, and then the long flight back home to JFK.

I chose to wear my surgical cap and a loose high-crown hat over top of it, just 2 days after the procedure was finished. If you are careful, this is absolutely safe to do, as the top of the hat lays above the head and does not put pressure on the recipient area.

 

I especially want to thank the leading caregiver technician who worked with me for all three days. He led me around, told me what was next, took all of my pictures, took care of my Gatorade and water drinks, phone, made sure my positions in the chair were comfortable, etc. I did not get to learn his name and wish I had, but he treated me like royalty, as did everyone on the team, and I would never expect or ask for so much love. It made my anxiety in a completely unknown place go away and he made me feel great about every step of the procedure.

I will be posting some updates here since it has already been a few weeks, though I don't plan to spend as much time on this forum as maybe some users going forward. But I know there is a lot of interest in Eugenix and cases like mine, so I will be sure to check in. If you desire, you can also follow me on Instagram @ethanlculver (http://instagram.com/ethanlculver) as I enjoy responding to DMs on there, and I may upload some pictures in the future of the results, if you should be interested. Thank you to all here who contributed to me embarking on this journey. See you around!

Have you noticed that they used microscope for the grafts identification (whether it is single or multi haired grafts) and refining? It is just I have some doubts about DHT method. If they have only 15 minutes for tha grafts examination and refining does it create some rush which can affect quality?

[general-etwan]

1 hour ago, Murat-kz said:

Have you noticed that they used microscope for the grafts identification (whether it is single or multi haired grafts) and refining? It is just I have some doubts about DHT method. If they have only 15 minutes for tha grafts examination and refining does it create some rush which can affect quality?

Yes they used a microscope for identification and separation. I felt no rush at all. About the smoothest, high quality chain of people working together that I could have possibly expected. 

[Murat-kz]

1 hour ago, general-etwan said:

Yes they used a microscope for identification and separation. I felt no rush at all. About the smoothest, high quality chain of people working together that I could have possibly expected. 

Dear Friend. I see from your description that everything was just perfect. No any even slight negative thing about the whole process?

Edited October 27, 2022 by Murat-kz

[MazAB]

@general-etwan so happy I just came across your thread! Very well documented and lots of great detailed info for anyone traveling overseas for a transplant or Eugenix for that matter. I give a ton of credit to guys like you that have a very severe case of androgenic alopecia at a very early age. Not an easy road, but your checks and balances and detailed due diligence has really set you up well. 

I remember chatting with you on WhatsApp a few months back as well!😄 So happy to see it all came together well for you. Definitely excited for you and can't wait to see the progress!

Follow my Journey with Eugenix and Dr Arika Bansal!

[general-etwan]

1 hour ago, MazAB said:

@general-etwan so happy I just came across your thread! Very well documented and lots of great detailed info for anyone traveling overseas for a transplant or Eugenix for that matter. I give a ton of credit to guys like you that have a very severe case of androgenic alopecia at a very early age. Not an easy road, but your checks and balances and detailed due diligence has really set you up well. 

I remember chatting with you on WhatsApp a few months back as well!😄 So happy to see it all came together well for you. Definitely excited for you and can't wait to see the progress!

Follow my Journey with Eugenix and Dr Arika Bansal!

Your guidance and recommendations over the phone helped me so much. Really appreciate it!

[general-etwan]

On 10/27/2022 at 3:20 PM, Murat-kz said:

Dear Friend. I see from your description that everything was just perfect. No any even slight negative thing about the whole process?

Only negative was some of the pain I had to battle through. Some of the implantation was quite painful (more like a persistent soreness that increased with each and every implantation). I endured more than I had to because I didn't want to keep taking breaks to get more anesthetic, but the tech in charge of it was extremely kind and assuring every time we had to get more in me.

[Murat-kz]

2 minutes ago, general-etwan said:

Only negative was some of the pain I had to battle through. Some of the implantation was quite painful (more like a persistent soreness that increased with each and every implantation). I endured more than I had to because I didn't want to keep taking breaks to get more anesthetic, but the tech in charge of it was extremely kind and assuring every time we had to get more in me.

I spoke to Eugenix about dr Das. They said she can do operation on me too. I saw her on youtube. Kinda yong lady. Is she even o er 30? How do you think?

[general-etwan]

1 hour ago, Murat-kz said:

I spoke to Eugenix about dr Das. They said she can do operation on me too. I saw her on youtube. Kinda yong lady. Is she even o er 30? How do you think?

She was great, very kind and caring. She did my hairline design, consulted with me if I liked it and approved of it (I did), and explained that temple work was not necessary because mine grow in decently still, and conveyed what her goal was for the procedure (getting 4,000 scalp donor in this 1 procedure). She made all of the slits and then after that checked in every hour or so that I was there, along with reviewing the entire head when it was finished and talking to me about how it went. 

[Murat-kz]

7 minutes ago, general-etwan said:

She was great, very kind and caring. She did my hairline design, consulted with me if I liked it and approved of it (I did), and explained that temple work was not necessary because mine grow in decently still, and conveyed what her goal was for the procedure (getting 4,000 scalp donor in this 1 procedure). She made all of the slits and then after that checked in every hour or so that I was there, along with reviewing the entire head when it was finished and talking to me about how it went. 

How much it was taken for making slits? You had 4 000 within one or two days?

[general-etwan]

1 minute ago, Murat-kz said:

How much it was taken for making slits? You had 4 000 within one or two days?

All the slits (5,300+) were made on the first day by Dr. Das, first step of the procedure. Not sure exactly how long it took; maybe 1-2 hours.  They remain open and able to be filled for a few days, so they were filled on days 1, 2, and 3, and if some were left over and not filled that's ok because they will close up in time.

[general-etwan]

Not much happening yet obviously, but here is a 5-week post-op pic. Shedding in full force. Some hairs starting to burst through on the surface, I can feel them. Also, do not mind the blonde hair on the side...I bleached my non-transplanted hair for a Halloween costume. I do not advise anyone to do such things unless you really know what you're doing. But I would never touch the newly transplanted area. 😄 Hopefully come winter I will have some great progress to share.

Edited October 28, 2022 by general-etwan

[Xanadu]

40 minutes ago, general-etwan said:

All the slits (5,300+) were made on the first day by Dr. Das, first step of the procedure. Not sure exactly how long it took; maybe 1-2 hours.  They remain open and able to be filled for a few days, so they were filled on days 1, 2, and 3, and if some were left over and not filled that's ok because they will close up in time.

 

40 minutes ago, general-etwan said:

All the slits (5,300+) were made on the first day by Dr. Das, first step of the procedure. Not sure exactly how long it took; maybe 1-2 hours.  They remain open and able to be filled for a few days, so they were filled on days 1, 2, and 3, and if some were left over and not filled that's ok because they will close up in time.

I know this is how it's done, but it seems weird to me. The longer a scar is open it seems to me the risk of scar tissue becomes. Wouldn't it be better to make the cut and then asap put the graft in so it can start to heal with the graft?

[Berba11]

13 minutes ago, Xanadu said:

 

I know this is how it's done, but it seems weird to me. The longer a scar is open it seems to me the risk of scar tissue becomes. Wouldn't it be better to make the cut and then asap put the graft in so it can start to heal with the graft?

Not necessarily. Eugenix published a paper showing that graft survival rates can be improved by reducing the amount of time that the grafts are out of the body. The channels can remain open for about 72 max before they aren’t usable anymore, so the key is the time the grafts are out of the body & not the time the channel is open for (within reason). 
 

Secondly, allowing the channels to be open longer can have advantages such as allowing any excess oozing to pass. I oozed a lot during the first day of surgery & it slowed things down massively to the point where I ended up having to finish the next day. If we’d have ploughed through and put the grafts in anyway the survival would have been impacted through ‘popping’. So leaving the channels open a bit longer can be useful. 

[Xanadu]

4 minutes ago, Berba11 said:

Not necessarily. Eugenix published a paper showing that graft survival rates can be improved by reducing the amount of time that the grafts are out of the body. The channels can remain open for about 72 max before they aren’t usable anymore, so the key is the time the grafts are out of the body & not the time the channel is open for (within reason). 
 

Secondly, allowing the channels to be open longer can have advantages such as allowing any excess oozing to pass. I oozed a lot during the first day of surgery & it slowed things down massively to the point where I ended up having to finish the next day. If we’d have ploughed through and put the grafts in anyway the survival would have been impacted through ‘popping’. So leaving the channels open a bit longer can be useful. 

 

4 minutes ago, Berba11 said:

Not necessarily. Eugenix published a paper showing that graft survival rates can be improved by reducing the amount of time that the grafts are out of the body. The channels can remain open for about 72 max before they aren’t usable anymore, so the key is the time the grafts are out of the body & not the time the channel is open for (within reason). 
 

Secondly, allowing the channels to be open longer can have advantages such as allowing any excess oozing to pass. I oozed a lot during the first day of surgery & it slowed things down massively to the point where I ended up having to finish the next day. If we’d have ploughed through and put the grafts in anyway the survival would have been impacted through ‘popping’. So leaving the channels open a bit longer can be useful. 

Interesting. Yes, there are two separate e issues.The first is their method of cutting the slots before Taki g from the donor (usually it's the o their way around). That makes a lot of sense that it would increase graft survival.

 

The issue I was wonder ng about is scaring due to the scars/slots not being allowed to heal for longer. I would intuitively think that a scar has a lower chance of leaving visible scar tissue (anywhere on the body) the quicker it heals. 

 

But maybe not.

 

The oozing argument is interesting. Cheers.

[Murat-kz]

1 hour ago, general-etwan said:

All the slits (5,300+) were made on the first day by Dr. Das, first step of the procedure. Not sure exactly how long it took; maybe 1-2 hours.  They remain open and able to be filled for a few days, so they were filled on days 1, 2, and 3, and if some were left over and not filled that's ok because they will close up in time.

O My. All the slits opened at the first day and implantation went 2 days? This is new to me. I thought they do slits for hairline and the middle at first day and do implantation. Than they do slits and implantation for the crown for second day. Because I thought slits start to shrink if you do not implant anything in them within 5 hours let’s say

Edited October 29, 2022 by Murat-kz