Senior Member DDD03 Posted June 4, 2009 Senior Member Share Posted June 4, 2009 FWIW had you confused?!?!? Jeez man...I was lost throughout Ron J's entire argument... "disanalogous cases" "perpetual cycle of folly" "malformed conclusions" "fallacious reasoning" "tout his extreme views carte blanche" I felt like I was back in a college english class or something. Ron J...are you a lawyer? (Only trying to make light of the situation. In the words of Rodney King "Can't we all just get along"?) My Hair Loss WebLog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member lost my swagger Posted June 5, 2009 Senior Member Share Posted June 5, 2009 look, i dont care if posters do not agree with me.. plenty of you feel im over the top, or whatever and plenty have voiced it.. most do so respectfully and in turn i respect their position back, while simply arguing my own position. it does NOT turn into personal attack, or in rons case a personal obsession.. its well known that my issue, when i have one, is with those WITHIN the indusrty.. not posters like ronj after trying to stay respectful, after biting my lip while this dude keeps going, after sending a PM trying to diffuse what i felt was hostility on his end. what does ron do?? he posts a SECTION of my PRIVATE message publicly in an attempt to make me look weak, when really i was doing nothing more that trying to be civil.. so yeah at this point forget this guy, he does not deserve respect, and yes, like i said earlier if we were in the same room id probably beat him bloody and do so with a smile on my face. it is indeed how i feel thanatopsis, i agree that debate is what its all about... but this guy doesnt want to debate, this guy has an obsession.. his new signature tells you this, if not the fact that hes followed me now in multiple threads with the sole intention of starting sh*t with only me...but yes, i admit that me snapping back the way i have recently is NOT the best way to go or to get my point across. winston baby-- to me the only thing that can be "learned" from RonJ is that hair transplants are the GREATEST thing ever created and you will be saved if you get one..... thats fine. if this guy wants to SUCK THE TIT of an industry thats done plenty of damage to plenty of guys so be it, he has every right to bounce around singing the praises of the "modern day" transplant as if its a cure.. BUT UNDERSTAND THIS, ITS COMING FROM SOMONE WHO IS NOT EVEN 2 MONTHS OUT OF HIS FIRST HT HIMSELF.. ITS COMING FROM SOMONE WHO, BECAUSE HES NOT SEEN POOR RESULTS ONLINE, BELIEVES THAT TOP DOCTORS DONT MESS UP, HE TRULY BELIEVES EVERY PATIENT THESE "ELITE" DRS WORK ON GETS A RESULT THEY ARE PLEASED WITH... ron, i can understand you not liking some of the things i have to say, now that i know your only 2 months out... in your eyes i had better NOT BE RIGHT, cause if even half of the "negative" things i bring up are true you might be in for more than you originally thought... but all the best man, you chose a recomended doc, thats all you can do.. hopefully in time you will want to share more details and pics from your own personal case since you want to be such a LOUD VOCAL advocate for hts.. i can understand you not wanting to "let us in" just yet tho... perhaps when your transplant grows out and is AMAZING your words will carry more weight.. til then your nothing more than a loud cheerleader for the HT indusrty. BTW-- if anyone would like to see my pics for whatever reason, send me a PM, im more than happy to sent you a link to the several pics ive posted online. but yes winston, ron does have a big fancy vocabulary...and i say, good for him now back to my original post, you could give farrel 3000, hell 3500 more grafts spread across his head back to his crown and i would bet DOLLARS TO NUTS that he would not come close to the appearance of density in the case i posted from Dr. Parsley...personally, i believe the TYPICAL result from a good HT dr. lies somewhere in between the two results, with some patients closer to that of farrel and others closer to dr. Parsley's patient *** RESULTS WILL 100%, without a DOUBT, VARY*** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member vincehair Posted June 5, 2009 Author Senior Member Share Posted June 5, 2009 All this drama is lame. Tho... Ron J for a guy with a tiny 60 something posts who registered a mere 2 months ago you sure have an attitude problem Is anyone else amused that Farrel clearly looks at THIS forum? When we mentioned his Wolf results all of a sudden his long dead thread on hairlosshelp got 2 updated pics of his locks. Haha yes indeed. http://www.hairlosshelp.com/fo..._FORUMVIEWTMP=Linear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member lost my swagger Posted June 5, 2009 Senior Member Share Posted June 5, 2009 this is a H&W patient who prior to surgury was a solid NW5... he recieved a little over 4100 grafts by a TOP Dr... he got a fantastic result that frames his face very well. IMO this is a GREAT example of a typical hair transplant in the hands of a good dr... http://www.hairlosshelp.com/fo...chid=20944&forumid=1 http://www.hairlosshelp.com/fo...chid=20929&forumid=1 http://www.hairlosshelp.com/fo...chid=20932&forumid=1 compare that to the down right FREAKISH case posted by Dr. Parsley in which only 3800 grafts were used.... http://hair-restoration-info.c...=158109192#158109192 lets imagine farrel had 2000 more grafts via STRIP spread throughout his entire scalp. giving him a total of 4000 grafts.. whos result would he look closer to?? ask yourself what can typically be achieved through hair transplants... even when your in the "best" of hands, like H&W.. *** RESULTS WILL 100%, without a DOUBT, VARY*** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Ron J Posted June 5, 2009 Senior Member Share Posted June 5, 2009 Originally posted by lost my swagger:...to me the only thing that can be "learned" from RonJ is that hair transplants are the GREATEST thing ever created and you will be saved if you get one...if this guy wants to SUCK THE TIT of an industry thats done plenty of damage to plenty of guys so be it..BUT UNDERSTAND THIS, ITS COMING FROM SOMONE WHO IS NOT EVEN 2 MONTHS OUT OF HIS FIRST HT HIMSELF.. ITS COMING FROM SOMONE WHO, BECAUSE HES NOT SEEN POOR RESULTS ONLINE, BELIEVES THAT TOP DOCTORS DONT MESS UP, HE TRULY BELIEVES EVERY PATIENT THESE "ELITE" DRS WORK ON GETS A RESULT THEY ARE PLEASED WITH...... perhaps when your transplant grows out and is AMAZING your words will carry more weight.. til then your nothing more than a loud cheerleader for the HT indusrty. lol just unreal! I'm going to keep this as simple as possible since your so fond of fantastical exaggerations, of which none of my words even remotely resemble. The fact that I'm only 2 months post op doesn't make my position any more plausible or implausible. -can't you see that my position is w/respect to a large sample size , & not a single case? According to your criteria, would you only allow a Dr. to perform a life saving surgery on you, if he himself was the successful recipient of the same surgery? Your reasoning skills are truly a work of wonder. I am a HUGE critic of the ht industry . -doesn't the fact that my personal choice of clinics reach a grand total of 3 speak volumes to you? -if I were to post every result I personally deem substandard from every clinic in the world, this thread could not contain them all. -unlike you however, I have chosen to be constructive & focus my energy on those clinics which DO consistently produce an appreciable positive improvement for men w/hair loss & be silent w/respect to those who do not. Just as if I was lending moral support to a friend who was depressed over breaking up w/his girlfriend I wouldn't point him to the 90% of women I deemed unsuitable & conclude he is destined to a lonely life as a monk, I would point him to the small sample size I would believe make him happy. I am only voicing my opinion to put your radical claims into perspective & here they are: " Show me a dr. & I'll show you a patient left worse off" -this was your initial position. you couldn't show a single case from my choice of clinics, so after watching your feet dangle gimp from the noose you wrapped so snugly around your own neck, I decided to loosen it up a bit & ask you to merely show 3 cases from each clinic, that you deemed to be substandard. Your efforts EVEN STILL proved to be fruitless, like a rotten dead tree that provides no fruit or shade from the sun, only dead branches & a foul scent to all who pass by. You laid limp & impotent, & even spoke fondly of the results you did post. All Dr.'s have patients that were in some way dissatisfied. I never said they didn't, the difference is your extremely hard pressed to find them from the good dr.'s, & even then they always look MUCH better than they did pre op. Having a debate w/you is like trying to play on the seesaw w/the chubba-lub FAT tub loud mouth kid in school. There is absolutely no middle ground, just radical swings and loud THUMPS of the rolls of his butt slapping against the wood. Delicately helping those fragile souls who suffer from hair loss, w/motherly nourishment & care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member PLEASE GROW PLEASE Posted June 5, 2009 Senior Member Share Posted June 5, 2009 Is anyone else amused that Farrel clearly looks at THIS forum? When we mentioned his Wolf results all of a sudden his long dead thread on hairlosshelp got 2 updated pics of his locks. Haha yes indeed. Farrel is obsessed by this forum. Plus hes got alot of extra time since his site has plummeted into a cavern of boredom . He also wont show a top shot but I will take back what I said earlier about bad work by Wolf. I remember seeing the 6 month pics thinking they were the final results. I was told by someone who was at a IHRS meeting that in person the work was subpar . Very thin and kinky but 1800 wont give much density on a nw 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member lost my swagger Posted June 5, 2009 Senior Member Share Posted June 5, 2009 I am only voicing my opinion to put your radical claims into perspective & here they are: " Show me a dr. & I'll show you a patient left worse off" -this was your initial position. you couldn't show a single case from my choice of clinics, yes ron, this was my initial quote, no doubt, and though i did post a few results i believe DO show ugly work from the named drs, as well as a link from a patient claiming he had a terrible experience, i ALSO admitted TO YOU that my choice of the phrase 'worse off' was not a good one.. not only that but i all but admitted defeat in our first meeting too... EVEN THOUGH I CLEARLY FEEL THE DRS YOU HAVE NAMED DO HAVE PATIENTS WHO REGRET THEIR HT DECISIONS. THE FACT THAT i could not find the older threads i KNOW ive read, and the fact that on the spot i was only able to produce few cases left my current argument somewhat empty.... SO HERE IS THE PROBLEM RONJ-- even though i admitted my initial 'worse off' quote was a bad choice, even though i said i could not turn into an archive and produce support by way of LINKS, even though i all but said 'you win this round ron'.. THAT STILL IS NOT ENOUGH FOR YOU.. your flat out obsessed...how do i know?? since then you have created your signature after me, you have followed me around in threads looking for ANY reason to mix it up....and whats SO pathetic to me is FINALLY you circle back to our ORIGINAL ARGUMENT from like 2 weeks ago! you bounce in here claiming im trying to use the parsley patient as a mirror image when i never tried to use it as such, u start talkin shit, and being disrespectful even though up into THIS thread i was really quite nice to you... and its ALL because you cant let go of out first argument.. pathetic... nice sigature ron, and way to circle back to an agrument that happened 2 weeks ago, and has nothing to do with this case... you really ought to keep quite,stick to your cute little "simply marvelous" "fantastic pelo" posts and wait for YOUR OWN RESULTS to fill in..... BTW-- i think winston baby wants to know who your Dr. was... any details about your personal case youd like to share with the forum ron? *** RESULTS WILL 100%, without a DOUBT, VARY*** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Ron J Posted June 5, 2009 Senior Member Share Posted June 5, 2009 Personal threats? Check..... Constant victimization? Check.... Refusal to respond to contentions within the debate? Check..... Refusal to post w/in fantastic ht result threads? Check.... Expectation of future radical generalizations w/out supporting evidence? Check... Lost, you didnt just waive the white surrender flag in the first debate, you dug your own grave in this one as well. Delicately helping those fragile souls who suffer from hair loss, w/motherly nourishment & care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member lost my swagger Posted June 5, 2009 Senior Member Share Posted June 5, 2009 Lost, you didnt just waive the white surrender flag in the first debate, you dug your own grave in this one as well. haha, you could not be more wrong here bud... so if you want we can keep this going. im sure everyone here will just be thrilled. however something tells me you might actually shut your mouth for little bit. you got me once chump, and what do you do when i admit it?? bring it up on OTHER threads? Check.. post others PRIVATE messages for you publicly? check.. disclose ZERO information about your own personal case while singing praise after praise?? Check.. once you move on from our first meeting, and you wanna have a healthy debate in the future about something we disagree on, ill be game... whats pathetic is you really dont even know what your arguing in THIS thread cause you just wanna live off your success in our first meeting... *** RESULTS WILL 100%, without a DOUBT, VARY*** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member Winston baby Posted June 5, 2009 Regular Member Share Posted June 5, 2009 Originally posted by HairDew:Originally posted by Winston baby: What does FWIW mean? and who did Ron J work? FWIW = For What It's Worth Thank you my friend, now i know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member Winston baby Posted June 5, 2009 Regular Member Share Posted June 5, 2009 Originally posted by Ron J:Personal threats? Check..... Constant victimization? Check.... Refusal to respond to contentions within the debate? Check..... Refusal to post w/in fantastic ht result threads? Check.... Expectation of future radical generalizations w/out supporting evidence? Check... Lost, you didnt just waive the white surrender flag in the first debate, you dug your own grave in this one as well. This post is petty, you fat man. I get two warnings from Bill and you get nothing for abusing LMS, this no fair, LMS i think you on own, without paddle! I not trust person who not give details of own transplant, something not right about that. I rather drink with LMS over Ron anyday, fancy vocab or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member DDD03 Posted June 5, 2009 Senior Member Share Posted June 5, 2009 I envision this argument going on for a long long time unless Bill puts an end to it! Both of you seem pretty hard headed and are looking to somehow earn a symbolic victory with this thread. Is it really worth it? I think we should all put away the guns, form a circle, hold hands, and sing some kumbaya together. We could even do it in succession... Ok, I'll start, then LMS, then Ron....Ready? Kumbaya my lord...Kumbaya... My Hair Loss WebLog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Ron J Posted June 6, 2009 Senior Member Share Posted June 6, 2009 Originally posted by Winston baby:This post is petty, you fat man...I not trust person who not give details of own transplant, something not right about that.. ht-I had 4K grafts w/Dr. Hasson almost two months ago. Nothing to hide, I just didn't see how it was relative to the discussion at hand. LOoOOOooL--I like you Winston Baby, I laughed so hard at this! FWIW I have lost 3 pounds since I hired Renaldo to paint that portrait of me, & I truly shouldn't have gone topless, but it was a fireside bedroom portrait; & in my defense the flaming flamino thong I'm wearing (which didn't fit in the avatar box) takes ~four pounds off, and really brings out the inner flare in my soul. At lest thats what Renaldo tells me. Delicately helping those fragile souls who suffer from hair loss, w/motherly nourishment & care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Ron J Posted June 6, 2009 Senior Member Share Posted June 6, 2009 I agree my last post was a bit petty, it's just a bit difficult to take the moral high ground when I have someone hurling fruity Huckleberry Fin statements at me---"why, I swear on my momma if we were in the same room I'd beat the living JESUS outa' ya!". This is truly proving to be an exercise in futility. Lost juxtaposes two cases, states the difference in grafts isn't very significant, then states he hates the inconsistency in the industry. What is one to logically conclude based on those sets of statements (?) Then when asked, in return I get a 500 word reply of PMS: 'stop ATTACKING Meeeeeeee!!!!' Lost, I truly wish you the best of luck & hope you find a remedy to your situation. I truly do. On reflection, I can understand how you always feel like your attacked. It's like dealing w/a victim of a traumatic experience who suffers from post traumatic stress disorder. Much like a wounded war veteran or someone suffering from a sexual assault any time their confronted w/anything resembling their trauma they have flash backs of their attacker (a la butcher) & go into fight or flight mode. Perhaps every time I post you see Dr. Bosley coming at you w/the scalpel & your natural compensatory mechanism kicks in--- 'wahahahha why are you ATTACKING me!?!?!?' (hands gesticulating wildly in the air). I wish you no harm & truly wish you the best, regardless of the fact that you seem to never have a point, other than that ht results will vary from individual to individual which is a self-evident truth one stumbles upon in there first five minutes of research, since we each have singularly unique donor characteristics. Nonetheless, I wish you well my friend. If I can ever be of help to you, even merely for moral support, just let me know. We are brothers in hair loss. I look forward to our new relationship together brother. Delicately helping those fragile souls who suffer from hair loss, w/motherly nourishment & care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member lost my swagger Posted June 6, 2009 Senior Member Share Posted June 6, 2009 ronj, when i first saw the parsley patient, my jaw dropped.. i dont think ive EVER seen 3800 grafts, recreate an entire crown with pretty decend density, AND provide adequate coverage throughout the entire top front, and hairline.. in fact the SKEPTIC in me(which, in this indusrty is a large art of me) is still not sure if i believe that result... so by chance, the next thread i visited was THIS thread.... but i just could not get that jaw dropping result out of my mind.... to be quite honest, if i was doing something wrong it was trying to pull attention away from farrel and focus it on the parsley patient.. because i looked at farrels overhead shot and thought, "yeah, thats about right'..... have you seen Bspots overhead shot? how about RTC overhead?... THOSE, to me show what 4000 grafts will do for the typical NW5-6... and BOTH were not even able to reach their crowns with that graft count... yet parsleys patient achieved a FULL SWIRL.... it seems not possible to me, i wanted to contrast it with what TYPICALLY can be achieved which is more along the lines of what farrel, bspot, RTC, Bill, and countless other NW5-6 recieved with 3800-4000 grafts..so while here i hinted at a quick question, 'give farrel,1800 to 2000 more grafts(which IS a small number when your dealing with a high NW) and what kind of coverage, REALISTICALLY whould we see?' now, with you calling me a baby with lines like this.." 'wahahahha why are you ATTACKING me!?!?!?' (hands gesticulating wildly in the air)." first id like to say, lets look at some facts, ron: fact 1. shortly after our first thread, you actually PATTERNED YOUR SIGNATURE after me, a regular poster.. fact2. you followed me in 2 other threads OUTSIDE our original confrontation thread, looking to criticize my every move, insult my intellegence and make me out to be a victim, by wrongfully stating that i am nothing more then a disgruntled/"disfigured" HT patient.. my results are not horrible ive stated this MULTIPLE TIMES. these are facts, ron. and they are NOT normal posting habits.. you became 'swagger-centric' and you did so with negativity, and hostility toward me. when i made what i felt was a decent effort in the beginning to keep things respectful, you made the decision to post parts of my private message public, and keep up with the insults, even OUTSIDE our first argument tread.. so yeah ron, finally, i had enough in this tread, and i DID say if were were in the same room id beat the hell out of you.. because at the time i posted that i would have. you pushed me far enough. in closing,as ive said, in the future if i say something you dont like please speak up, others do... they just dont do it like complete assholes, and then follow me around thread to thread looking to start shit, armed with a fancy vocabulary. thanks for the kind words ron at the end of your post, id be lying if i said i didnt tear upi wish you the best also.... look foward to seeing your result and learning who your dr was???? maybe?? what do you say? *** RESULTS WILL 100%, without a DOUBT, VARY*** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Ron J Posted June 6, 2009 Senior Member Share Posted June 6, 2009 Originally posted by Ron J:ht-I had 4K grafts w/Dr. Hasson almost two months ago. Nothing to hide, I just didn't see how it was relative to the discussion at hand. Delicately helping those fragile souls who suffer from hair loss, w/motherly nourishment & care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill - Seemiller Posted June 7, 2009 Share Posted June 7, 2009 Swagger and Ron J, For the most part, I don't see anything hostile or problematic with the majority of your posts back and forth to one another. Frankly, anyone who shares an opinion should be ready and prepared to have it challenged. But please try to keep personal insults (such as in some of your recent postings) out of your technical debates to preserve the educational and supporting nature of this community. Best wishes, Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member hdude46 Posted June 7, 2009 Senior Member Share Posted June 7, 2009 lms...read this http://www.regrowhair.com/hair...-transplant-results/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member lost my swagger Posted June 7, 2009 Senior Member Share Posted June 7, 2009 ive seen it..appreciate it. quote from Arocha: "The presence of curl can have a great impact on the volume;" ... hdude-- what type of hair would you say farrel has? actually id like to see a link to another ONE PASS, 3800 graft HT on a NW5 that is even in the same league as the parsley patient.he can have super thick shafts too. do you happen to have one? characteristics are paramount, obv.. i think thats what your getting at right? BTW-- side note. i find his examples somewhat funny, look at the lighting situation in his first example.. the before is taken in perhaps the absolute worst lighting ever captured. and his curly haired example shows an overhead before and a profile after.... kinda funny. it does have some good info in it, for sure, wish it went into more detail tho *** RESULTS WILL 100%, without a DOUBT, VARY*** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member hdude46 Posted June 7, 2009 Senior Member Share Posted June 7, 2009 yep, just that hair characterisitcs play a big role. people get so caught up in graft counts but overlook a lot of other things. Obviously coarse thick hair is going to look better than thin light hair. I dont know who farrel is so cant comment there. Its fair to analyzed every picture as far as lighting, flash, angles, ect. However, I think picking apart every single result is counter productive. I agree with you that their are some so called top docs producing not good results. To be completely honest, I would only go to Shapiro Medical Group or Hasson & Wong for a procedure out of all the coalition docs, which says something I believe. I think these are the only two who are truly "world class" and world leaders. Dont get me wrong there are other coalition docs doing good work, but not consistently enough for me to feel good about going to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Franklin Posted June 7, 2009 Senior Member Share Posted June 7, 2009 yep, just that hair characterisitcs play a big role. people get so caught up in graft counts but overlook a lot of other things Could not agree with you more!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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