Cost of FUE, increasing or decreasing?

[gemini310]

Hi, I was just wondering how much pricing has changed for FUE throughout the years. When I first started doing research for FUE transplants about 7 years ago, I think it was averaging around 3.50-5.00 per follicle. I've recently had consultations with 3 Dr's and its ranged anywhere from 7-10 dollars per follicle. Do you guys see prices going up or down for FUE procedures in the next 5 years? If money is an issue, would it be smart to rush a surgery now, or wait?

[SySperling10]

Hi, I was just wondering how much pricing has changed for FUE throughout the years. When I first started doing research for FUE transplants about 7 years ago, I think it was averaging around 3.50-5.00 per follicle. I've recently had consultations with 3 Dr's and its ranged anywhere from 7-10 dollars per follicle. Do you guys see prices going up or down for FUE procedures in the next 5 years? If money is an issue, would it be smart to rush a surgery now, or wait?

 

I was in your spot recently while looking for a surgeon. Depending on where you are located can contribute a lot to cost? From what I understand, outside the US it can be significantly cheaper. In the US, there are a couple of decently priced options but you have to be willing to travel overnight, most likely. Dr.s Cooley and Vories are both well priced and recommended by this site.

 

Regarding your question, it's hard to predict. FUE is more labor intensive and takes longer for the practice. When done correctly, the physician is doing both the extraction and implantation, which makes this technique a bit more difficult to compare cost to traditional FUT. I image supple and demand will dictate this for some time, as there are less practices which are mostly FUE in the states, and more patients demand the technique, it could drive the cost up, while there are less physicians in the space.

 

The unintended consequence with increased cost is patients will pay for less grafts, which in turn directly affects results, giving the illusion FUE isn't as effective as FUT.

[1966kph]

IMO the price of fue in the states has to drop because IMO the demand for fue is slowly killing off fut and europe and especially turkey have perfected fue over the last 10 years

This has left the states dead in the water floundering about because of its own laws that technicians cannot be fully utilised as they are in europe and Turkey.

And this nonsense that techs can't do this and can't do that is ridiculous as is clear with Erdogan and Lorenzo to name a couple that have been utilising techs for years and their results are still top of the tree.

I dont know if the states is ever going to catch up with europe and turkey and at the moment the way is drop prices dramatically otherwise people are going to drive by the US clinics on their way to the airport.

For the sake of US sufferers I hope a big change comes and comes quickly because for far to long now the USdocs have been over charging people they are meant to be helping.

Have a nice day

[BUSA]

I think the real problem isn't techs assisting. the issue is without regulation techs can essentially run an entire practice. I'm sure there r techs that do great work but without close scrutiny that cud be a slippery slope.....

 

its such a joke tho. this is a billion dollar business yearly. ud think the US doctors wud learn to charge more appropriate rates. I mean how much money does a doctor really need to make weekly? $25k isn't enough? smh....:rolleyes:

 

IMO the price of fue in the states has to drop because IMO the demand for fue is slowly killing off fut and europe and especially turkey have perfected fue over the last 10 years

This has left the states dead in the water floundering about because of its own laws that technicians cannot be fully utilised as they are in europe and Turkey.

And this nonsense that techs can't do this and can't do that is ridiculous as is clear with Erdogan and Lorenzo to name a couple that have been utilising techs for years and their results are still top of the tree.

I dont know if the states is ever going to catch up with europe and turkey and at the moment the way is drop prices dramatically otherwise people are going to drive by the US clinics on their way to the airport.

For the sake of US sufferers I hope a big change comes and comes quickly because for far to long now the USdocs have been over charging people they are meant to be helping.

Have a nice day

[Noodles123]

Elective cosmetic surgery is exactly that. Cosmetic surgeons are not in the business of "helping" anyone. Patients are free to exercise the power of the purse and not use a particular surgeon if they believe he charges an exorbitant fee. Eventually these doctors who charge higher fees will be forced to reduce their prices.

 

 

 

 

IMO the price of fue in the states has to drop because IMO the demand for fue is slowly killing off fut and europe and especially turkey have perfected fue over the last 10 years

This has left the states dead in the water floundering about because of its own laws that technicians cannot be fully utilised as they are in europe and Turkey.

And this nonsense that techs can't do this and can't do that is ridiculous as is clear with Erdogan and Lorenzo to name a couple that have been utilising techs for years and their results are still top of the tree.

I dont know if the states is ever going to catch up with europe and turkey and at the moment the way is drop prices dramatically otherwise people are going to drive by the US clinics on their way to the airport.

For the sake of US sufferers I hope a big change comes and comes quickly because for far to long now the USdocs have been over charging people they are meant to be helping.

Have a nice day

[Sean]

Elective cosmetic surgery is exactly that. Cosmetic surgeons are not in the business of "helping" anyone. Patients are free to exercise the power of the purse and not use a particular surgeon if they believe he charges an exorbitant fee. Eventually these doctors who charge higher fees will be forced to reduce their prices.

 

True, but elective or not. This surgery isnt done by a tech or hair stylist. A doctor has a responsibility to have a proper surgical protocol in place for the safety and well being of the patient and to be honest and not Decieve or commit marketing fraud. There are multiple things a doc goes against when they market a particular way. Now, more than ever, regulatory eyes may be monitoring this industry, methods, best practices, business ethics, claims, repair patient filngs and etc. People pay top dollar for services that should be rendered as marketed. Any harm to grafts or tissue or disfigurement is downright unethical and illegal. I dont know how some docs can sleep at night doing half ass jobs and taking peoples money and not delivering on goals. Especially, when most North American docs demand top dollar for services that do not even meet the labor and effort of docs in India and Turkey. You het the most bang for your buck there with docs doing most of the work. Very few exceptions like Dr Vories, dr Konior, and etc seem to do all if not most of the work in North America. It is a damn shame when people pay premiums for services at what one could consider hair mill operations. It is important clinics come clean with their consent forms and surgical FUE protocol on all forums for transparency. Strip is where nNorh America has catered and mastered, but FUE definitly seems to have the the championship belt overseas. Doctors should not let their patients down or unfinished.

 

Penis surgery is elective too, if a doc screws up, it is the patients fault. No way.

Folks should not pay deposits until you have been explained surgical protocols and have seen all consent forms relating to the surgery you select.

[wylie]

I know prices are lower in Europe, and still do not know the level of involvement of technicians there. Outside of the branded doctors recommended on this forum (and even including some of these doctors) comes the very real concern: Who is actually doing the work? I know when I see a U.S. doctor that they will be involved in two main aspects of the procedure: The harvesting of grafts, and directing where these grafts will be placed. The tech's are expected to do the work of actual placement of grafts. For this I pay a premium in the U.S., in comparison to Europe and India.

 

I don't doubt that many technicians in Europe and India are very good at what they do, but my greater question is, what exactly will the doctor be doing in comparison to his U.S. counterparts? Do technicians extract the grafts also? Surely they do not make the incisions where the grafts are placed?

 

Doctors are no different than any industry, they try and do less and get more. From everything I read, they do even less outside the U.S., but the cost is far less than in the U.S. The risk is you have no idea who your "technician" will be the day of surgery, so as a repair patient myself, I would be inclined to pay more for a U.S. doctor, unless I knew exactly what to expect from someone outside the U.S.

[1966kph]

Hello Wylie.

In Turkey in a lot of places yes they do both extractions and incisions and have been doing it for years and in europe a awful lot of techs are charged with the graft extractions.

Have a good day.

I don't doubt that many technicians in Europe and India are very good at what they do, but my greater question is, what exactly will the doctor be doing in comparison to his U.S. counterparts? Do technicians extract the grafts also? Surely they do not make the incisions where the grafts are placed

[Sean]

Well how many doctors in north america stay in the room for one patient entire surgery and extract all grafts themselves? What do they charge? Even break surgeriies for that same patient apart to maximize yield?

 

Some docs who extract themselves overseas at really low rates:

dr. Bhatti

Dr. Resul

Dr. Keser

Dr. Karadeniz

Etc etc etc there are many more

 

Example of rates , i think Dr Resul mentioned 1 dollar a graft.

 

So would you pay for a surger $7 or more where doc does more than one surgery has techs extract and chckin on you wvery so often or have a doc be in the room with you at all times and extract themselves and charge you like a dollar a graft? I no longer buy that bull that international docs are subpar or do limited work vs most north american docs. In fact it is probably the otherway around for FUE right now. There are only a handful of recommended fue docs that do their stuff themselves thats why before you do some friggen surgery, ask that doc of his or her fue surgical protocol!

[SySperling10]

Well how many doctors in north america stay in the room for one patient entire surgery and extract all grafts themselves? What do they charge? Even break surgeriies for that same patient apart to maximize yield?

 

Some docs who extract themselves overseas at really low rates:

dr. Bhatti

Dr. Resul

Dr. Keser

Dr. Karadeniz

Etc etc etc there are many more

 

Example of rates , i think Dr Resul mentioned 1 dollar a graft.

 

So would you pay for a surger $7 or more where doc does more than one surgery has techs extract and chckin on you wvery so often or have a doc be in the room with you at all times and extract themselves and charge you like a dollar a graft? I no longer buy that bull that international docs are subpar or do limited work vs most north american docs. In fact it is probably the otherway around for FUE right now. There are only a handful of recommended fue docs that do their stuff themselves thats why before you do some friggen surgery, ask that doc of his or her fue surgical protocol!

 

This is just part of the surgeon choice decision tree, which layers into the economics of the decision.

 

You have to decide on the type of transplants (FUE v FUT)?, understand how much you can afford? grafts needed? determine technique? travel? Physician involvement?

 

Somehow after determining the above, you land on a handful of Drs. Now if it involves crossing the Atlantic, that's an entire different element, which could be too stressful for a first timer.

[PupDaddy]

Wylie,

It really depends on which clinic you're talking about. In Turkey there are reportedly hundreds of technician-only FUE clinics, where technicians perform the entire surgery (extractions, graft incisions, graft insertions) and the doctor plays no hands-on role and is not even in the operating room (1966kph recently had his FUE transplant done at one such clinic). The doctor uses his license and name as a "supervisor" of the FUE surgeries performed at the clinic. In terms of actual involvement, at most, the doctor will do the pre-surgery consult with patients and mark the hairline and transplant areas with a pen. The rest is all technician work.

 

None of the Turkish/European doctors and clinics recommended here operate in this way. At a bare minimum, the doctor will personally cut each graft recipient incision site -- which is where the artistry and surgical expertise for FUE hair transplantation really comes into play, imo. Most FUE clinics outside the United States, including the majority of the Turkish/European docs recommended here, have technicians do the FUE extractions from the donor (using a handheld motorized punch), and technicians usually do most or all of the graft insertions into the graft recipient sites cut by surgeon, as has long been one of the customary roles of technicians in FUT transplant work. However, there are still a few docs in Turkey/Europe who do the FUE extractions themselves in whole or in part. I believe one such doc is Dr. Emre Karadeniz (recommended here), if I'm not mistaken.

[wylie]

Hello Wylie.

In Turkey in a lot of places yes they do both extractions and incisions and have been doing it for years and in europe a awful lot of techs are charged with the graft extractions.

Have a good day.

 

Well, if that is the case, the doctor is primarily involved only in planning of your HT, not in the execution of it. If techs both extract grafts and place grafts, then doctors in Turkey and elsewhere should only charge a dollar or two per graft, based on their participation level.

 

This raises the troubling question of a patient not knowing who will be performing their surgery. The doctor is there in the event of a medical emergency and to plan where the grafts will be placed, while the technician does all of the actual work, a technician you have never met or discussed your concerns with.

 

It's a risk, yes, but it also shows that with practice anyone can do these types of surgeries. The greater risk is will you get a technician performing their first surgery, or their 500th surgery?

[wylie]

Wylie,

It really depends on which clinic you're talking about. In Turkey there are reportedly hundreds of technician-only FUE clinics, where technicians perform the entire surgery (extractions, graft incisions, graft insertions) and the doctor plays no hands-on role and is not even in the operating room (1966kph recently had his FUE transplant done at one such clinic). The doctor uses his license and name as a "supervisor" of the FUE surgeries performed at the clinic. In terms of actual involvement, at most, the doctor will do the pre-surgery consult with patients and mark the hairline and transplant areas with a pen. The rest is all technician work.

 

None of the Turkish/European doctors and clinics recommended here operate in this way. At a bare minimum, the doctor will personally cut each graft recipient incision site -- which is where the artistry and surgical expertise for FUE hair transplantation really comes into play, imo. Most FUE clinics outside the United States, including the majority of the Turkish/European docs recommended here, have technicians do the FUE extractions from the donor (using a handheld motorized punch), and technicians usually do most or all of the graft insertions into the graft recipient sites cut by surgeon, as has long been one of the customary roles of technicians in FUT transplant work. However, there are still a few docs in Turkey/Europe who do the FUE extractions themselves in whole or in part. I believe one such doc is Dr. Emre Karadeniz (recommended here), if I'm not mistaken.

 

Thanks for the clarification Pup, I replied before reading your post.

 

I find it both fascinating and troubling at the same time how this new crop of Turkish clinics is operating. It may be driving the cost of FUE way down, but it is also driving the risk way up.

[BUSA]

cudnt agree more! seems like many HT docs these days spend more time planning patient HT's then performing them. I thought doctors hired ppl to do that while they actually performed HT's....:rolleyes:

 

there is no doubt that some techs do great work but which ones considering none went to medical school? there are rare gems in every field that just have incredible talent but considering the patient doesn't discuss his concerns with techs how wud a tech know wat ur concerns are?

 

maybe the doctor can relay ur concerns to the tech.....:rolleyes: or even a better idea, maybe the doctor himself can perform the HT. now theres a crazy idea!

 

Well, if that is the case, the doctor is primarily involved only in planning of your HT, not in the execution of it. If techs both extract grafts and place grafts, then doctors in Turkey and elsewhere should only charge a dollar or two per graft, based on their participation level.

 

This raises the troubling question of a patient not knowing who will be performing their surgery. The doctor is there in the event of a medical emergency and to plan where the grafts will be placed, while the technician does all of the actual work, a technician you have never met or discussed your concerns with.

 

It's a risk, yes, but it also shows that with practice anyone can do these types of surgeries. The greater risk is will you get a technician performing their first surgery, or their 500th surgery?

[KO]

None of the Turkish/European doctors and clinics recommended here operate in this way. At a bare minimum, the doctor will personally cut each graft recipient incision site --

 

I will make a small correction here, as I know Hakan Doganay has technicians implant the grafts for the midscalp using the Choi Implanter. I believe he suffers from arthritis.

 

As for techs extracting grafts, in North America, Rahal and Shapiro have technicians doing extractions. Still they charge $7-8/graft for FUE.

 

Other docs who are heavily involved and may do most if not all of the procedure:

 

Juan Couto

Erkan Demirsoy

Muttalip Keser

Chris Bisanga

De Reys

Mwamba

[PupDaddy]

KO,

I didn't know that about Dr. Doganay. Thanks for letting us know.

[KO]

Regarding techs doing extractions, I'm not against it, but you have no idea how skilled the tech is, it could be his or her first day, or perhaps 10th year, you just have no idea. And doctors will NOT tell you this information.

 

That said, I think it is good if surgeons can build a good team with competent techs, as it reduces fatigue, and therefore will improve results. You don't want the doctor to get tired extracting 3k grafts and then implant them. In great Michelin star restaurants, the chef only does a small part of the cooking, the bulk is left to a team of line cooks, however the chef's job is to build and maintain great teams, and in many cases they do. As a result, I like Erdogan and Lorenzo's setups, as it allows the doctor to do the core aesthetic work of graft insertion.

[MAGNUMpi]

A lot of good points made in this thread.

In my opinion a HT is to important a procedure to let even the possibility of a subpar tech hinder the outcome. Before getting a HT I would/will be 100% sure who is doing work on me, how much the Dr. is involved, etc, etc. Save for a few years for the cost of a top doc. Research until my fingers are blue. Know exactly what I'm walking into.

It doesn't matter if he is in America or elsewhere. Results, results, results.

[wylie]

I will make a small correction here, as I know Hakan Doganay has technicians implant the grafts for the midscalp using the Choi Implanter. I believe he suffers from arthritis.

 

As for techs extracting grafts, in North America, Rahal and Shapiro have technicians doing extractions. Still they charge $7-8/graft for FUE.

 

 

Dr. Shapiro does not have a technician doing any extractions, they have a medical doctor doing the extractions (now that the Artas is gone) and he works at the clinic. He is not a technician.

[KO]

Dr. Shapiro does not have a technician doing any extractions, they have a medical doctor doing the extractions (now that the Artas is gone) and he works at the clinic. He is not a technician.

http://www.hairrestorationnetwork.com/eve/178460-input-needed-fue-2521-grafts-1-year-post-op-results-post2422212.html#post2422212

[wylie]

http://www.hairrestorationnetwork.com/eve/178460-input-needed-fue-2521-grafts-1-year-post-op-results-post2422212.html#post2422212

 

From the link:

 

The Reps for Restoration Robotics only come if there is a Artas case scheduled

 

So I guess they are still using the Artas, which I thought they had abandoned. For manual extractions, this is who the Shapiro's employ:

 

Dr. David Josephitis

[KO]

Wazaam stated that the person doing the extractions was a tech, under supervision from Dr J.

[MAGNUMpi]

Is Dr. Lorenzo using techs for placement now?

[1966kph]

To be honest pup I did not trawl through the website so I have not seen it but I would presume its a translation issue because its definitely incisions with custom cut blades.I wonder if it means the extractions are done with motorised punch!

I will mention to him the next time he emails checking on how I'm doing.

If it is on there its not a very good advertisement.

Have a good evening

[1966kph]

Because of censorship some posts have been removed in this thread just in case readers are wondering what's going on.

Have a good day

Edited March 16, 2015 by 1966kph