Open wound after strip removal and Necrosis

[the B spot]

http://www.hairlosshelp.com/forums/messageview.cfm?cati...id=65810&STARTPAGE=1

 

Please follow this thread and view the photos attached by this patient.

 

This is unacceptable and I am requesting that Pat investigate this issue.

 

I realize that this poor soul does not belong to our site, but this is one of our Coalition Docs who has performed this surgery.

 

I questioned Dr. Rassmans strip removal when he removed a 2 cm wide X 30 cm long strip in one piece.

 

Every other Doc I have spoken with removes the strip in 2-3 sections on larger cases, for this very reason.

 

I am sending Pat a copy of this email in order to make him aware of the situation.

 

Perhaps he can shed some light as to how the situation occured.

 

Thanks

J

[Salt-N-Peppa]

OMG-that is horrible!

[nobuzz4me]

If I were her I would see an attorney and get treatment from another doctor, not Dr. Rassman. Of course he will go overboard with her to make it right.

 

This lady has been severely butchered and deserves compensation. It is unbelievable with todays technology that this could happen. She paid TOP dollar for this too

 

I agree with B-Spot, Pat needs to get to the bottom of this.

[nobuzz4me]

Does anybody know how old Dr Rassman is?? Maybe he has lost it???

[Middleson]

Bless her heart. I hope she recovers really soon.

 

You know, perhaps every bad surgical outcome is not necessarily the fault of the surgeon? Every surgery is a risk. I would imagine that even the best of surgeons might have a patient(s) with a bad surgical experience, for circumstances beyond their control?

 

???

[Franklin]

Ok I found this quote on another site. About her first ht."

nan

Regular Poster

 

Posts: 98

Joined: Aug 2004

Wednesday December 08, 2004 8:19 PM

 

 

i did do a strip.. at nhi. I did about 1 inch ( and maybe a bit more at a widows peak) only at the top forhead and top temples. I hope 1200 is enough! I dint want to do it again. I had a bit of reaction to the medicril stiches and my scar has taken a bit too long to heal. I dont want to put pix cause im a girl..but i have quite good growth already. I jist hope it doesnt look lke a thinning hairline. I think i will have to chse my tail a nit and do some fues in my donor scar unfotunatly.

thanks for all the feedback!!

 

-------------------------

 

So in la that is Rassman. I ask the question why did she get a strip in the first place???? And if you really do search on this poster she says her laxity was not that good to begin with.

[nobuzz4me]

I wonder if there she followed her post op correctly. Even if she did not though, it would be hard to end up like that uless she was washing her head in the toilet.

[something]

you guys are very quick to react. take a second, wait for her reply, seems that she is under dr. rassman's care for the moment. this is a surgically procedure, and maybe all the cons have never been explained. although it is unfortunate, there can be many factors at play.

 

it could be mistakes made by the dr, mistakes made in post op care, and of course, everyones distinct biology. wait it out for a while, then make an assesment.

[HK500]

Yes, very scary. I believe we have to reserve our judgement until this situation gets resolved because I am sure it will be resolved. Logically a surgeon of the caliber of Dr. Rassman will take care of this situation in the best possible way. Once the smoke clears we'll find out what and how it happened.

[nobuzz4me]

Good point, their are a lot of unknows here and after reading the entire thread she mentions she just loves Dr. Rassman even after this???? Maybe she has some issues?

[Bill - Seemiller]

Hello everyone,

 

I agree that the situation should be waited out, but I also agree with B Spot that this is unacceptable. Now, I don't know that we can prove that this situation arose from taking the strip out in one long piece leaving the area exposed to open air too long, or as the NAN stated, Dr. Rassman may have overjudged her elacticity, or some other unknown reason. If it is either of the first two, it is totally unacceptable. But I'd like to see what happens with this over time to see if there are any other explanations given. Perhaps she had some kind of condition beforehand that wasn't revealed before the surgery took place? I agree with "something"...we may be a little quick to react...but I think it's still important that we raise alarm in this situation...it is truly disturbing to see. But before we point total blame to the doctor on this, let's wait and see what more information arises. I am glad though, that B Spot notified Pat...because he needs to be aware of this.

 

Bill

[the B spot]

Hey Guys,

 

I am not passing judgement as of yet.

 

I did note on the other site that I would no longer be recommending Rassman at this time.

 

I think that is the right thing to do for now.

 

I will wait until Pat gets back to me/us before I make any further judgement.

 

Again, this is Doc that is pretty well respected in the HT community, but I think the pressure to try and keep up with other Docs may be getting to be too much.

 

I will reiterate, I do NOT like the tissue removal techniques Dr Rassman employs.

 

My heart goes out to this poor woman.........

 

Thanks Guys.

[HK500]

Hi B Spot,

 

I do NOT like the tissue removal techniques Dr Rassman employs.

 

What makes his technique different from others?

[Pat - Community Publisher]

Sorry for my delay in responding. I took the day off from the Web on Saturday and I discovered this disturbing situation today (Sunday).

 

As patients we can all imagine how disturbing such complications would be. Fortunately, in my experience of being online for over seven years, such complications are very rare. In fact, this is the first time I have ever seen photos of donor complications like this posted on our forum or any hair loss forum.

 

It is also disturbing that such complications occurred under the care of such an experienced and renowned surgeon as Dr. Bill Rassman. I will certainly be contacting him to get his account of why this patient developed these complications.

 

While the patient states that Dr. Rassman has been very supportive and that she still thinks very highly of him and would still recommend him - Dr. Rassman's continuing participation and recommendation on this site remains to be determined.

 

I will certainly share what I learn in the coming days. In the mean time, let's try to be patient and not make any definitive judgments until all parties to this situation present their perspectives.

 

I certainly hope that the patient's donor wound makes a rapid recovery and that her hair in the donor area resumes growing in time.

 

Pat

[Bill - Seemiller]

Pat,

 

Thanks for taking action on this. We'll reserve judgment until more information has been determined.

 

HK500,

 

See B Spots answer to that quoted below

 

I questioned Dr. Rassmans strip removal when he removed a 2 cm wide X 30 cm long strip in one piece.

 

Every other Doc I have spoken with removes the strip in 2-3 sections on larger cases, for this very reason.

 

Bill

[HK500]

I see, mmmmmm ....

Thanks Bill.

[the B spot]

HK500,

 

Yeah, it seems that several patients have reported that Dr. Rassman removes the entire strip at one time, which in my humble opinion is reckless and poses an unecessary risk.

 

In fact, when Pat visited his clinic and posted his pics, I questioned the strip removal of that patient as well.

We are seeing first hand what can result when Dr's do NOT qualify patients properly for tissue removal over 1-1.3 cm wide.

Put simply, this wound will most likely rquire a skin graft, and the patient will be lucky not to be permanently disfigured as a result.

 

Pat, I appreciate your looking into this matter. I hope a full account of how/why this occurred can be disclosed.

Thanks Again.

[nobuzz4me]

Any updates on this ladies condition???

 

I do hope she does not have dead tissue to deal with. According to some of her posts on the other site, she continues to see Dr. Rassman daily. She also does not want anyone to bash him since he has been very nice to her

[the B spot]

Well, she is doing better.........

 

I think Dr. Rassman is in full image protection mode at this point.

This lady has a hole of rotting dead flesh in the side of her head, courtesy of Rassman, and still is willing to recommend him?

 

The part that really takes the cake is that she says she posted just to see how others dealt with this problem. I still don't think she realizes that this is not her fault or her physiological makeup or her wallets fault etc...

 

Of course, when people have the temerity to ask why I am so passionate about this.........

 

refer back to pics of this poor lady.

 

I am still waiting for Pat to get the full version of what caused this and whether or not he is getting a load of B.S.

 

Talk to you guys later.

[nobuzz4me]

Originally posted by the B spot:

 

I think Dr. Rassman is in full image protection mode at this point.

 

 

 

B, You are right my friend and I would add he is probably in full lawsuit protection mode as well.

 

By seeing her everyday it keeps her from getting other doctors opinions which could be used against him later. I am not saying he does not personnaly care but there are other issues here that he no doubt is aware of.

 

Just curious, (you are the law student )when you sign off on the procedure this is covered as a risk (infection). At what point is there negligence and how too prove it?

[the B spot]

It is very difficult to sue Dr.'s for elective/cosmetic surgery.

 

The old "reasonable expectations" clause.

 

Plus most Docs have patients sign an acknowledgment of potential risk form as well.

 

While I do think this woman would have a case, I am under the impression it is difficult to win these cases in California.

 

Again, she may have had a pre-existing condition that we are unaware of, or she may have been made aware that she was a high-risk patient, and went ahead anyway, etc...

 

Again, while I think Dr. Rassman is culpable (opinion), it is just speculation at this point.

 

Perhaps Bushy could comment further? (He is our resident attorney =)

[hairbank]

I agree...........the donor area, sores, loss, it does look terrible. I'll await Pat's response after he discusses this situation with Dr. Rassman to render an opinion. I'm not too familiar with Dr. Rassman but we've all heard of his fine reputation so maybe there's much more to this than just a bad HT job? Genetics play a very large part in how a person heals. Could be this gal has a variety of issues which have contributed to this. I'm far from excusing Dr. Rassman from his responsibility, I just want all the facts before taking a stance on this issue. Hopefully Pat will be able to discuss this situation with the Doc soon.

[something]

With due respect B-Spot, i feel that you have continued to vilify the Dr without the proper information. It is just not right to assume that this type of infection does not occur with other Drs because i will guarantee that it has. There is always the possibility of complications that arise from surgery, and no Dr. is free from having had some on there records.

 

I surely believe many have, although not everyone goes to the boards right after surgery. I assume that a very low number of people actually post on these boards anyway, compared to the numbers getting the procedures done.

 

You also assume that Rassman is trying to compete with other Drs and thus being reckless. Oh man, that is not fair. I think a man that was doing 4000graft megasessions and dense packing since the 90's isnt playing catch up to anyone. As much as we like to believe, there isnt that much of difficult technology involved in the procedure. It comes down to what works for each individual Dr and what they are comfortable with, usually regarding how many grafts to take out, and the implanting that we find descreptancy's between Drs.

 

Dr Rassman has also been preaching ethics more then any other Dr. Give it some time, get the information, then sound off.

 

I will also mention that although the sore looks bad to the eye, from my limited medical knowledge, it isn't as horrible as it looks.

[the B spot]

Your opinion/my opinion.

 

My primary goal is not to protect Dr's.

 

My primary goal is to protect and educate hairloss sufferers.

 

If that means that I have to raise some red flags on a particular Doc, then apologize afterwards, so be it.

 

Let's not forget this is ACTUALLY HAPPENING.

 

I was asked a question, and I responded.

 

As far as being reckless, I think the patient has already stated that Dr. Rassman "over-estimated" her laxity (his words courtesy of the patient)and because he took a large amount of tissue out at one time, he couldn't safely close the incision.

 

I consider that reckless, you apparently do not. This when every other doc who is doing large sessions removes donor in 2 or 3 sections for EXACTLY this reason.

 

Also, this woman has rotting dead flesh on her head, and her overall final appearance might border on mutilation, so I think it is a bit out of order for you to underestimate the seriousness of her issues. OR, this could cure up, the hair grow back and everything will be fine.

I think something in the middle, but who knows?

 

Last, looking through this thread, I cannot really find where I am being too harsh or tossing unwarranted criticism.

 

In fact, I think I have MUCH more room to criticize should I choose to do so, and raise some other issues as well.

 

I don't want to argue about this right now, because I think your entitled to your perspective and those who read this thread can read your comments and judge for themselves.

 

I appreciate your opinion and I HOPE this poor woman makes a speedy and full recovery.

[Bill - Seemiller]

Something (and everyone else reading),

 

Personally, I don't think B Spot is vilifying Dr. Rassman at all. He is raising alarm, which in all honesty, he should be. If I got to it first...I would have done exactly the same thing. This is a SCARY situation, and I think alarm is warranted. No out of line attacks have been made by B Spot or anyone else on this forum that I can see.

 

The bottom line is, we don't know exactly what happened in this situation, however, B Spot is right...the patient did state in the other forum that Dr. Rassman overestimated the laxity. That's a HUGE problem and something that he should be accountable for. It appears that he is taking at least some accountability (not sure how much yet) which is in his favor...but certainly this is a HUGE problem. Could you imagine being in her shoes? I certainly couldn't. I'm horrified just looking at the pictures to the point where I was almost traumatized by it. I instantly was able to relate with the patient since I've been through 3 of these...just obviously never had something like THAT happen to me.

 

We also have to consider also that this has NEVER happened before...at least not posted publicly on a forum. That doesn't make Dr. Rassman a villian, but by admittance of his own words through his patient, he over estimated...that signifies HIS action, therefore at least partially his fault. He should have been in control of that and known his and the patients limits.

 

Whether or not he's competing is of course irrelevant...we don't know why he overestimated. But remember...at best, his intent was trying to get the patient what she wanted...BUT, he should have known the limits being the experienced physician that he is.

 

I'm still here reserving final judgment until I know more about the situation, however, my heart goes out to the patient...and truthfully, this is something I believe strongly that could have been avoided. Nan is a very kind and gentle person from what I see...but most people wouldn't be so kind if they were in that position...and truthfully, I think Nan would have ever right to be extremely upset and angry. She is a better person than I for being so calm and ready to deal with it. Though I have reservations about why she praises him and would still recommend him...that concerns me a bit.

 

Anyway...something...please don't think I'm attacking you...certainly I am not. I'm glad that you are here and part of our community. You are entitled to your opinion of course, I just don't agree with it.

 

Bill