Mir_a_Mir

Hello, everyone!! Hope you all are doing well. Sorry for not posting in so many months post my surgery. I did get my hair transplant done with Dr. Yaman's team back in Nov and it was a very rough experience. Dr. Yaman and his team themselves were nice but over all I don't think it was a good choice now. I'll explain later, probably in a new thread with pics to do justice.

Coming to the @Tm2022, even though nobody has heard of Blue Magic or has worked with them over here in this forum, now after going to Turkey and seeing things firsthand, I wouldn't completely write Blue Magic off because they do what 100's of others are doing and are successful. I went with Yaman who is a preferred doc of this forum and I had a rough experience. I am not too happy about my transplant anyways. Remember this forum only recommends the BEST and I think that is amazing but this is not the be-all-end-all. 

I agree with @Euphoria there are so many good doctors out there who are not mentioned on this forum. Blue Magic was offering me 2 days of procedure for approx 5000 grafts while Yaman jammed all of that in 1 day and I had 11 grueling hours on the most uncomfortable bed. And that was horrible!!!

During my stay, I saw 100's of names and people getting their procedures from them and they were all good, at least they didn't seem to be having a rough time like me.

Everybody is different and will react differently to the procedure, no matter who does it, EXCEPT if you go with the most elite docs mentioned here who change a lot. If you are tight on the budget and need to get a transplant, Turkey is a good place. If you can go to India, then that is a very good option, but not everyone can go to India. 

Hello @London Geezer hope you are seeing some great results by now, would love to see any updated pic of your hair now. 

@Portugal25 @JohnAC71 @digi23 I am writing Blue Magic off, I was giving you a reference because now that I am talking to you guys, the sound of harvesting that many grafts does not sound good at all. I was thinking in the wrong way but now I have a good idea how to spot an over promising clinic. 

1 minute ago, BDK081522 said:

You guys are getting caught up in techniques and terminology when all that really matters is consistent results. I do want to point out that all of these "techniques" DHI, sapphire, stick and place, etc are all FUE hair restorations. FUE stands for follicular unit extraction and has nothing to do with implantation technique. So it sounds rather silly to suggest DHI is better than FUE when they are referring to completely different aspects of the procedure. Don't get caught up in the jargon. Focus on repeatable consistent results. 

Cool @BDK081522, that came out of no where, but its an excellent point. Although implantation is equally important. Messing up the implant can be devastating, I assume.

Okay great!, by the way, what is the most number of grafts one should be getting in one session with FUE? Yaman was saying 4500? Is that too much? The Blue Magic said they can do 5500-6000 in a 2 day session? Just so that I know what is a safe number, can you please advise what is a reasonable number is done in one session?

@Portugal25 @JohnAC71 @digi23 I really appreciate your guys filling me in on this and giving me your advice.

I did reach out to Dr. Bicer and she did say my restoration will be in 2 steps with a year apart in between the two surgeries. And yes she is reasonable and I like her but she is way booked out and I cannot wait that long. I have some other family obligations. Wife, Parents, Kids and life comes in the way and I don't want to drop this off to a point that I never get this done. I know this is not the best reasoning because I am making decision based on other factors instead of purely the relying how good the doctor is, but oh well such is my life. 🙂 No complaints, it works for.

I feel truly blessed to even come across this forum and talking you all. At least I am a bit more aware of the facts and will move forward knowingly and not like I am running it the dark.

God Bless you all!!............

2 minutes ago, JohnAC71 said:

@Mir_a_MirLooking at your pics/level of loss I would say that Eugenix could be worth a consultation. 

Hi @JohnAC71 I will reach out to them this weekend and get a quote as well. 

I think I am off of the Blue Magic plan but I think Dr. Yaman is not a bad option, albeit he not the best but you know if push comes to shove, and I have to go to Istanbul, I think I might go with Dr. Yaman.

I don't know if I looked into the European options, so focused on Turkey. 🙂

Still researching though. 

4 minutes ago, Portugal25 said:

Have you read my other posts in this thread?

They still do pre-made slits because that way they can have the Doctor doing pre-made slits on several patients per day and the techs can implant with implantor pens on the pre-made slits. This basically means you don’t get any benefit from DHI. In this case I agree it’s a marketing gimmick used by low tier Doctors and hairmills to charge extra to uninformed patients.

@Portugal25 I am following your comments in my thread, haven't got a chance for other threads. But like you said, these doctors are using the DHI technique name and using Choi implanter and still making the incisions so that they can covers more patients. I mean in that case its not technically the DHI technique, they are just using the Choi/Lion pen to implant. Technically its a FUE method.

1 minute ago, Portugal25 said:

Dr. Couto can do 2 patients per day like Dr. Ximena Villa if it’s two patients with up to 2000 grafts. More than that it’s impossible when using DHI technique without pre-made slits and techs implanting. 
Dr. Lorenzo can have up to 4 patients per day at this clinic because Dr. Bruno Ferreira is also doing surgeries at his clinic.

@Portugal25 You hit that nail on its head with this point. I was initially told that the maximum grafts that can be done with the DHI technique is 3500 in one day. And that is why I was a bit surprised that Dr. Yaman office was telling me that they are do probably 4500 grafts in one day with the DHI technique.

2 minutes ago, Portugal25 said:

Implantor pens are basically a hollow point needle loaded with a graft inside. When the Doctor push the button on the neddle/implantor pen it makes the punch/hole and implants the graft at the same time. 

That is what I thought initially but then got confused because a lot of consultants were telling its DHI but the they were also saying that the incisions are necessary. I got lost there.

10 minutes ago, digi23 said:

They always use Yaman pen. 

Hey @digi23 I don't think they always use the Yaman pen or may be I am not reading this properly. Here is what I received from Dr. Yaman as my two options:

Interesting, looks like they do offer a procedure that does not. Here are the two options that I received from his office.

1st Package: DHI with Yaman Implanter for including;
* Pre and post consultations with doctor
* Blood analysis and PRP (Platelet-Rich Plasma)
* DHI Operation
* Post operative control and cure
* Post operative medicines
* Special shampoo and lotion for the first 10 washing
* First washing by a specialist
* 3 nights 5* hotel (double room-breakfast inc.)
* Transfers (airport-hotel-clinic-airport) 

2nd Package: Sapphire FUE for including;
* Pre and post consultations with doctor
* Blood analysis and PRP (Platelet-Rich Plasma)
* Operation
* Post operative control and cure
* Post operative medicines
* Special shampoo and lotion for the first 10 washing
* First washing by a specialist
* 3 nights 5* hotel (double room-breakfast inc.)
* Transfers (airport-hotel-clinic-airport)
As attachment I am sending you your online consultation photos so you can see how these grafts will be distributed. The hairline will be designed by Dr. Yaman during your face-to-face consultation. These photos are only DRAFT. 

In the operation there are 3 major steps of the surgery which are incisions step, extraction step and implantation step. Incision step is the first step of the operation and it's performed with sapphiere blade by Dr. Yaman. I also confirm that your consultation, hair analysis, hairline design, local anesthesia and incision steps are completed by Dr. Yaman himself too. 
Extraction is performed with low speed modified micro motor by our extraction experts. We have 2 extractionist working with us. One of them is Dr. Yaman’s brother Muhammed Ali Yaman who has been working in our clinic for 6 years. The other is Dr. Yaman’s cousin Ufuk Yaman who has been working with us for 6 years. Both have been trained by Dr. Yaman himself personally. They perform only extraction step of the operation. 
Implantation is performed in 2 different ways considering the package you choose. 

If you choose DHI with Yaman implanter; implantation is perfomed by the implantation team with Yaman Implanter. Dr. Yaman worked on developing Yaman Implanter for 5 years and 2 years ago he took its patent. Since than we have been using Yaman Implanter for implantation step. Our implantation team members have been educated and trained personally by Dr. Yaman himself only to use Yaman Implanter. 

If you choose Sapphire FUE; implantation step is performed by Dr. Yaman’s experienced implantation team carefully with FUE technique. 

5 minutes ago, Portugal25 said:

It’s always about the quality of the Doctor and not the technique but if you look at mind blowing results using far fewer grafts it’s usually the Spanish Doctors like Dr. Couto that have done it using DHI. 

You have to understand that at the end of the day this is business and with pre-made slits a great Doctor with a amazing team can do up to 4 patients per day just doing the slits and crucial implantation on the hairline.

The shift to DHI will either require the Doctor to do the whole surgery meaning 3 less patients per day or he has to continue to do pre-made slits and have his team implant using implantor pens (like Dr. Laorwong does) but this to me make no sense because you lose the benefits from DHI that is to make the punch and implant the graft at the same time. 

I do believe some of the Doctors you stated will move to DHI but you have to remember that there’s a learning curve and they have doing pre-made for decades so they might not be so keen to change and get some not great results during their learning curve. 

So @Portugal25 are you saying that with DHI, in reality there is not requirement for pre-made incisions? You know that is what I had thought initially but then I got confused and thought that incisions are required regardless of the use of the pen or not.

Well, @Portugal25 Dr. Yaman uses Yaman Pen.... Hehe. 

Hey @digi23 you were with him just recently, did Dr. Yaman use the Yaman pen to do the implantation? Or did you go with the FUE package that he used the forceps? 

5 minutes ago, Portugal25 said:

This is simply not true.

You have to ask yourself why does Dr. Raymond Konior considered the best in the world for FUE does the most Doctor demanding technique which is stick&place if he could be doing a much less demanding technique like pre-made slits and get the same results?
If as you say “there’s no benefit from these different techniques” then that would make no sense!

Ofcourse a technique in which the Doctor extracts the graft and then implants each graft one at time immediately after making the punch is a better technique than punching thousands of holes and then implanting thousands of grafts.

DHI is the evolution of stick&place if done by skilled surgeon and a great team than can properly handle each graft by placing them one by one into implantor pens after extraction and then passing the implantor pen to the Doctor so he can use the implantor pen loaded with 1 graft to make the punch and implant the graft at the same time thus giving less trauma to the graft and reducing the time the graft stays out of the body. 

To say these techniques means nothing in the hands of skilled surgeons is “nonsense”!

Look at Dr. Couto and Dr. De Freitas work doing DHI. 

The best in the world are doing either stick&place or DHI. 

Hi @Portugal25 you bring up a good point. DHI seems to be the latest technique because it needs smaller incisions as the Choi pen is able to implant the graft in that small incisions compared to the FUE technique that requires comparatively bigger incisions because the grafts are implanted with forceps. 

Am I correct in my understanding? Please correct me if I am off. 

7 minutes ago, digi23 said:

Do you have any photos of your situation and how many grafts you need? I just seen that that shit hairmill quoted you 5500-6000 grafts which is quite alot of grafts. Are you a norwood 6 or?

I am not even sure you are a good candidate for surgery, but these hairmills accept anyone.

HI @digi23 here are my pics. May be I should have posted at the start of the thread. 

1 minute ago, digi23 said:

You need to know that Dr Yaman performs 2-3 hair transplants every day

Dr Demirsoy 1

Dr Bicer does not even do 1 per day, they sometimes have a free day so maximum 1 per day sometimes 0

Yeah, that is one thing about Dr. Yaman I don't like. Thanks for pointing it out.

Dr. Bicer has dates in April 2022 and I can't wait that long. \

One thing I wanted to ask about his technique though, does he do FUE or DHI? His rep said that he used Yaman Pen to implant the grafts, not sure what to make of that. 

2 minutes ago, digi23 said:

As I wrote, I want alot of Dr involvement. Dr Yaman does the most important part which is the incisions, then the tech team does extractions and implantation. Ideal for me would be that the Dr performs both incisions and extractions and leave implantation for techs because that part is mostly just time consuming not really much skill.

My experience was good but I would rather pay a little bit more for someone like Demirsoy or Bicer.

Another reason I choose Yaman was because he answer the same day, Demirsoy took about 1 week before I got any answer.

So true about Demirdoy, no response what so ever. 

That is true, Incisions and extractions are important, well implantations too but I agree the first two are important.

Thanks @digi23 for your quick response.

22 hours ago, digi23 said:

Dr Yaman got decent results, you can see my review of him aswell, though I have not seen my results yet, but it looked to be good work. He is one of the best choices on a budget but I feel like I should have paid a little bit more to get more involvement from the Dr.(I think you will only realize this after the procedure, it was like that in my case atleast.)

The other 3 you mention is very bad choices.

Hi @digi23 I read your review for Dr. Yaman and from what I see you had good results, so far. So what exactly was that you didn't like about the procedure? I am thinking about Dr. Yaman. I have not received any replies back from Dr. Erkan Demirsoy so not sure what to make of it.

Can you please let me know what I can ask for better with Dr. Yaman? Anything that you would do differently if you had to go back again?

18 hours ago, digi23 said:

Dr Yaman got decent results, you can see my review of him aswell, though I have not seen my results yet, but it looked to be good work. He is one of the best choices on a budget but I feel like I should have paid a little bit more to get more involvement from the Dr.(I think you will only realize this after the procedure, it was like that in my case atleast.)

The other 3 you mention is very bad choices.

@digi23 I am so glad that you mentioned about Dr. Yaman. I will check out your post and I do have some questions that I will post. Appreciate all your help.

2 minutes ago, Portugal25 said:

@Mir_a_Mir I’m very happy to see you have evolved from almost playing russion roulette with a irreversible surgery at a hairmill or a subpar Turkish Doctor to now at the least considering the low cost Doctors Bicer and Demirsoy.  
I advise you to save a bit more money and at least book Dr. Arika at Eugenix.

Wish you all the best with your HT.

Hi @Portugal25 yeah I am dropping the whole Turkey plan, so disappointing. Lets see what Bicer and Dermisoy have to say, if not then I'll go to Dr. Arika at Eugenix. Although, I do have someone that I know who got the transplant at Eugenix in Delhi, guessing it was Arika and it didn't turn out that great at all. No problems but just not a great result. He had a massive area to be covered and not a good donor area. So keeping in view those factors, I am now more leaning towards at least finding out what Eugenix has to offer.

Thank you for your time, appreciate it.

2 minutes ago, Egy said:

On their sites, Instagram or Facebook profiles, they post photos or videos of transplants performed by other surgeons and pass them off as themselves.

@Egy Oh man!!! So overwhelming!! Ugh, almost feel like I am okay being bald. At least I have good head on my shoulders instead of some botched holed one. 🙂

2 minutes ago, JohnAC71 said:

@Mir_a_MirGlad you arrived here before choosing the Black Magic Roundabout 😂 You have been given excellent advice and some really good suggestions for decent Drs/Clinics. Let us all know how you get on after consulting some of them. 

Hi @JohnAC71 what doctors are you recommending?

11 minutes ago, JDEE0 said:

Erdogan/ASMED are considered to be a hair mill these days and have been for a while - perhaps a slightly more high end model, yes, but a hair mill nonetheless and they are generally viewed with the same negativity as the rest by most on here (including myself). They were good a while ago before they shifted into the model they currently operate under, but those days are long gone. 

No need to risk things with an unknown clinic who's only credentials to go off are google reviews, there are a number of vetted doctors here at pretty much every price range, so don't be a guinea pig for no reason. Take advantage of others before you who have figured out who's good over the years..

You are so correct about not being a guinea pig, I definitely don't want to be on for sure. As for the vetted doctors list, I guess you are referring to the list the @blackislbackinitially posted. I mean from that, I guess the only ones I can probably try are Br. Bicer, Dr Dermisoy and then Eugenix since going to India will not be a problem for me.

Was there anyone else who you were referring to? What about Dr. Nader from Mexico?

7 minutes ago, Melvin- Moderator said:

Do people win in Vegas? Sure, it’s inevitable. Do I believe some of these technicians are good? Yes, but the problem is that there’s no way of knowing who you’re gonna get, you’re basically playing roulette with your head. If you want to go to Turkey check out Dr. Bicer, shes reasonably priced and does the work herself. 
https://www.hairtransplantnetwork.com/physician/Turkey/Ozlem-Bicer/694

You are correct Melvin, and like even I mentioned it is a gamble, especially with our health.

But I have to say one thing though. As I mentioned my brother got his HT from ASMED last year and paid 11K and even Dr. Koray did the same procedure, only made incisions and the rest was done by his team. His results are good, but not the best. And Dr. Koray is considered as a good doctor in Turkey.

I spoke to Dr. Bicer's office and yes I would like that. Will try Demirsoy as well.

And reading the forums, I stumbled upon Dr Nader from Mexico. He seems good as well. Will contact his office and see what they have to say in terms of procedures and prices.

5 minutes ago, BLE123 said:

Demirsoy and Bicer are both good choices, sure they might not be the elite of the elite but they're more than likely to deliver a very satisfactory result. Forget the Magic Roundabout clinic.

Haha....Magic RoundAbout...that was funny. Yeah, I am not really leaning towards it.