Dr. Steven Paul Holt, Grand Rapids, MI 1400 grafts FUT - bad outcome

[mavigo]

I know I'm going to get a lot of flack for this so go easy on me guys. I fully understand the gravity of my mistake and obviously am paying for it.

In 2019, I was a workaholic NW3/4 full time student and work. I consulted with a local surgeon Steven Paul Holt who initially recommended 1200 grafts FUT. He said that FUT was the gold standard and that 70% of procedures are still FUT. He is board certified by AHRS and license was in good standing (I know this is meaningless now). I always wore my hair long and really have no intention of having short hair if I go through all this.

So in April 2019 I went through with it. I went in on a Friday or Saturday and was back to work/school on Monday. My long hair covered the donor sutures and transplanted sight. Nobody could. Very soon after I could tell something was wrong, obviously not enough density. I also now felt my hairline was too low.

I held on to hope until after 12 months but it dawned on me I was now a repair patient. And added another stupid mistake to my long list.

In my post op consultations with Dr. Holt, I complained that it looked fake and bad. He told me it looked "patchy" but nobody could tell I had an HT and technically I don't need another one. I kept going on how it's not what I expected and he said " okay, okay you need one. I can do 700 - 1000 more grafts". I was stunned again because this still seemed so low.

Dr. Holt wanted to do another FUT, saying that it'll look better with my dark brown hair and that FUE would look moth eaten. When I complained about the scar, how it was itchy and more sensitive than I expected he countered that "FUE looks like you got shot in the back of the head with a shotgun". 

I'm consulting with 2 well known surgeons in the Chicago area discussing options for repair.

Obviously I'm embarrassed and humiliated. Now that I'm no longer under such high stress situations, I'm moving forward with fixing the issue, doing much more careful research and moving on.

Thanks everyone.

Edited August 3, 2022 by mavigo
I'm going to leave this post up for now, if this too long for you to read, don't read it. But also please don't respond if you're not going to read or if you're not going to provide me with constructive feedback.

[Britanium]

Thanks @mavigofor this 🙏 Very much appreciated you sharing you’re result, it’s going to be helpful if anyone else looks for the same Dr. 

[mavigo]

2 minutes ago, Britalien said:

Thanks @mavigofor this 🙏 Very much appreciated you sharing you’re result, it’s going to be helpful if anyone else looks for the same Dr. 

As ashamed and stupid I feel, he does have regular patients, probably locals and he himself stated he has done 7,000 procedures. Whether those were 7,000 good procedures, that is a matter of debate. I'd like to find more of his patients to talk to. 

[Gatsby]

@mavigo sadly you are not the first and what’s even sadder is that you will not be the last. So many patients find that their first hair transplant turns out to be the precursor for a repair hair transplant. I’m one also. The feelings you feel of shame and stupidity lie firmly on the the shoddy doctors so please be kind to yourself. You are fortunate that you have found this forum with excellent doctors that you can verify by patient results. There are lots of repair cases you can view (including my own 😊). Thanks for calling this guy out. It prevents another person going through the same problem. You have a great head of hair and donor still. What your doctor really meant was he has no idea how to perform state of the art FUE and all I want is your money. Take care and all the best! 

[mavigo]

2 hours ago, Gatsby said:

@mavigo sadly you are not the first and what’s even sadder is that you will not be the last. So many patients find that their first hair transplant turns out to be the precursor for a repair hair transplant. I’m one also. The feelings you feel of shame and stupidity lie firmly on the the shoddy doctors so please be kind to yourself. You are fortunate that you have found this forum with excellent doctors that you can verify by patient results. There are lots of repair cases you can view (including my own 😊). Thanks for calling this guy out. It prevents another person going through the same problem. You have a great head of hair and donor still. What your doctor really meant was he has no idea how to perform state of the art FUE and all I want is your money. Take care and all the best! 

Appreciate it. I agree, him saying it wouldn't look good is because he isn't good at FUE. But his FUT does not look good either so...

I've been in contact with multiple reputable physicians, all recommended by this community. One is proposing 1500 - 2000 grafts FUE with a jagged/faded hairline. Getting additional opinions to not repeat the same mistake again.

[Britanium]

4 minutes ago, mavigo said:

Appreciate it. I agree, him saying it wouldn't look good is because he isn't good at FUE. But his FUT does not look good either so...

I've been in contact with multiple reputable physicians, all recommended by this community. One is proposing 1500 - 2000 grafts FUE with a jagged/faded hairline. Getting additional opinions to not repeat the same mistake again.

Are you happy to leave the FUT scar the way it is ? Just curious, I have had x2 FUT and since had a scar revision to improve it. Have you had any discussions to either go with FUT again and/or improve on the existing scar ?

Edited August 1, 2022 by Britalien

[Britanium]

Since you mentioned Chicago, are you consulting with Dr Konior and Dr Panine ? Usually we say it’s worth travelling to get some more elite choices, however between the 2 aforementioned you would have arguably a pretty good choice 😉

[Melvin- Admin]

I’m sorry you’re not satisfied with your results. We can certainly help you. I’m a bit confused at the sequence of the photos? The top photos are they before or after your hair transplant? 

[mavigo]

6 minutes ago, Britalien said:

Are you happy to leave the FUT scar the way it is ? Just curious, I have had x2 FUT and since had a scar revision to improve it. Have you had any discussions to either go with FUT again and/or improve on the existing scar ?

No my biggest regret was doing FUT because I now don't have the option of shaving it off. I would only consider another FUT if it's 3000+ grafts but it sucks and I don't want to deal with it again. 

No discussions yet, I've only had virtual consultations and no physical examination yet. I'll be going down to Chicago to see what they think. I may to SMP but honestly I expect to keep my hair pretty long so I'll probably do nothing. I have a lot of scars to remind me of my stupid mistakes. 

[mavigo]

Just now, Melvin- Moderator said:

I’m sorry you’re not satisfied with your results. We can certainly help you. I’m a bit confused at the sequence of the photos? The top photos are they before or after your hair transplant? 

I don't know how to upload photos onto this thing, the ones with the dark red background are before photos from the clinic. 

[Britanium]

3 minutes ago, mavigo said:

No my biggest regret was doing FUT because I now don't have the option of shaving it off. I would only consider another FUT if it's 3000+ grafts but it sucks and I don't want to deal with it again. 

No discussions yet, I've only had virtual consultations and no physical examination yet. I'll be going down to Chicago to see what they think. I may to SMP but honestly I expect to keep my hair pretty long so I'll probably do nothing. I have a lot of scars to remind me of my stupid mistakes. 

A decent/elite  Dr would definitely improve on the existing scar if needed, a decent FUT scar can be pencil like thin if done well. Mine is so much better since it was revised, my next plan is to get Beard grafts implanted in to the scar tissue as that will also help disguise it. 

Edited August 1, 2022 by Britalien

[Melvin- Admin]

1 minute ago, mavigo said:

I don't know how to upload photos onto this thing, the ones with the dark red background are before photos from the clinic. 

Ok, that clears it up. Don’t feel embarrassed. I made a similar mistake. Chose a local surgeon and ended up looking slightly less bald but also more awkward. I think this is a relatively easy fix. The good news is it doesn’t look unnatural, just lacking density. I believe more grafts were required from the start. You have great options in Chicago, Konior, Nadimi, Panine. 

[mavigo]

10 minutes ago, Britalien said:

Since you mentioned Chicago, are you consulting with Dr Konior and Dr Panine ? Usually we say it’s worth travelling to get some more elite choices, however between the 2 aforementioned you would have arguably a pretty good choice 😉

Yes, both of them with me being basically decided on Panine. I've also been with some docs in Atlanta and Miami but I honesly don't want to fly. Panine stated that it looks alright but the hairline is too low. Although I don't totally agree, I have a big forehead so even where it's at now, it still corresponds roughly to the "rule of 3s".  I'm just worried that I have midscalp/vertex issues and I don't know if fin is helping or not. So I feel I shot myself in the foot by having Holt bring it down so low.

However, Panine's staff told me it would be 1500-2000 grafts to fix the hairline with a jagged/ faded look and that I have enough donor supply to address the mid in the future if needed. 

[Britanium]

1 minute ago, mavigo said:

Yes, both of them with me being basically decided on Panine. I've also been with some docs in Atlanta and Miami but I honesly don't want to fly. Panine stated that it looks alright but the hairline is too low. Although I don't totally agree, I have a big forehead so even where it's at now, it still corresponds roughly to the "rule of 3s".  I'm just worried that I have midscalp/vertex issues and I don't know if fin is helping or not. So I feel I shot myself in the foot by having Holt bring it down so low.

However, Panine's staff told me it would be 1500-2000 grafts to fix the hairline with a jagged/ faded look and that I have enough donor supply to address the mid in the future if needed. 

Yes 2k seems about right from what I can see In the pics, I have long admired Dr Panines work. Are you on a med regime ? As you mentioned future issues, just wondering if you’re taking or have taken Fin ? 

[mavigo]

3 minutes ago, Melvin- Moderator said:

Ok, that clears it up. Don’t feel embarrassed. I made a similar mistake. Chose a local surgeon and ended up looking slightly less bald but also more awkward. I think this is a relatively easy fix. The good news is it doesn’t look unnatural, just lacking density. I believe more grafts were required from the start. You have great options in Chicago, Konior, Nadimi, Panine. 

Appreciate it. I think it looks weird but you're right and many others have said that it just looks like I'm balding, which I didn't need an HT because I already looked that way! Yes, Holt originall proposed 1200, i asked what's the max we could do? 1400. I just trusted his judgment. I really don't know what his issue is, when I complained about how it looked, he recommended 700-1000 single grafts, densely packed. But why didn't we do that in the first place? I think originally I needed 2500 - 3000.

[mavigo]

4 minutes ago, Britalien said:

Yes 2k seems about right from what I can see In the pics, I have long admired Dr Panines work. Are you on a med regime ? As you mentioned future issues, just wondering if you’re taking or have taken Fin ? 

When I confronted Holt that I felt my hairline was too low, he responded with saying he's done lower. 🙄

Panine stated surgically removing grafts would cause too much scarring and it proposing a jagged hairline which I'll discuss with him more in person next week. He also stated that it wasn't bad, just not enough and that he can work it. I'm leaning towards Panine because of his successful track record with repair patients. 

[mavigo]

Just now, mavigo said:

When I confronted Holt that I felt my hairline was too low, he responded with saying he's done lower. 🙄

Panine stated surgically removing grafts would cause too much scarring and it proposing a jagged hairline which I'll discuss with him more in person next week. He also stated that it wasn't bad, just not enough and that he can work it. I'm leaning towards Panine because of his successful track record with repair patients. 

And sorry, forgot to answer your question: yes, I've been on finasteride for about a year and a half. I was using minoxidil foam for almost 5 years but it really only helped to grow my eyebrows, so I no longer take it. 

[asterix0]

@mavigo From your post-op pics it looks like you had accurate yield for what was actually implanted, the doctor just didn't dense pack enough. 

I think this repair can be done pretty well, just keep in mind also, the hairline is the hardest part of a transplant to look full. It is directly exposed to light, especially if you pull it up. So have realistic expectations that maybe it won't look completely full even after your second procedure, in some lighting conditions.

 

[Britanium]

1 minute ago, mavigo said:

When I confronted Holt that I felt my hairline was too low, he responded with saying he's done lower. 🙄

Panine stated surgically removing grafts would cause too much scarring and it proposing a jagged hairline which I'll discuss with him more in person next week. He also stated that it wasn't bad, just not enough and that he can work it. I'm leaning towards Panine because of his successful track record with repair patients. 

Sounds like a really good plan, you’re doing all the right things going forward. As he didn’t actually use that many grafts it’s a bonus really, be interesting when Dr Panine sees you in person how many grafts he will estimate you have left. 

[mavigo]

2 minutes ago, Britalien said:

Sounds like a really good plan, you’re doing all the right things going forward. As he didn’t actually use that many grafts it’s a bonus really, be interesting when Dr Panine sees you in person how many grafts he will estimate you have left. 

Well, the original doc stated that I have 8,000 - 10,000 grafts available and Panines staff concurred with that, basically saying that I have enough. 

Implying there's 6,600 - 8,600 left. 

[Britanium]

Just now, mavigo said:

Well, the original doc stated that I have 8,000 - 10,000 grafts available and Panines staff concurred with that, basically saying that I have enough. 

Implying there's 6,600 - 8,600 left. 

This is more good news, that’s more than the average guy will have 👍🏽

[mavigo]

7 minutes ago, asterix0 said:

@mavigo From your post-op pics it looks like you had accurate yield for what was actually implanted, the doctor just didn't dense pack enough. 

I think this repair can be done pretty well, just keep in mind also, the hairline is the hardest part of a transplant to look full. It is directly exposed to light, especially if you pull it up. So have realistic expectations that maybe it won't look completely full even after your second procedure, in some lighting conditions.

 

Appreciate the feedback, the doc who is my number 1 pick is known for his hairlines and has had hundreds of repair patients. 

Yeah, I understand that and I'm okay with that. I just can't keep it the way it is now, half baked. 

[mavigo]

On 8/1/2022 at 12:02 PM, Britalien said:

This is more good news, that’s more than the average guy will have 👍🏽

The bad news is I had another doctor come back with a quote ~2,000 grafts as well but states that I have diffuse thinning of the frontal area and that any surgery would provide a "short term" density boost as the front continues to thin. 

As the side-effects king, I was shocked when I didn't experience any with finasteride but it's not working or working as well as I would like. Fin indeed doesn't work for everyone and it looks like I am in that bucket. 

I can't really see how any result could be worse than what I have now. I will see what Dr. P thinks. 

[Legend007]

Your doctor is probably not very good .. he’s unable to do a large session ,, that’s why he only did a small amount of grafts at first.  
If  u not experiencing side effects from fin .. then u need to stick to it, most of the time it just helps maintain ur hair that ur currently Have n give it a longer long span ..  u can tell this by less hair fall ..

 

. as u already know hair transplants are tricky .. so u can’t afford to lose anymore hair .. 

[HappyMan2021]

I haven't read every word you wrote but it seems like you are still trying to get a sense of closure from Dr. Holt and maybe trying to still come to terms of why and how he did gave you a poor result. 

I would "simply" chalk it up to going to a no-name doctor who uses an ARTAS machine to boot. The explanation of why you got a bad result is pretty clear to me. 

This is not like a mystery of the universe why you got a bad result. 

Hope you find a sense of closure from Holt regardless. 

 

Edited August 2, 2022 by HappyMan2021