Finasteride/Propecia = Castration ?

[BaldPatient2]

So my understanding if someone gets castrated when he's teenager, he won't get bald and would just keep his juvenile hairline

Also an older man starting to bald would stop losing hair and probably even grow new hair if he gets castrated

After reading about the side effects of Finasteride Propecia, it looks the same side effects as someone who has been castrated , so does taking Finasteride/Propecia the same as being castrated ?

[Spanker]

I do not believe that is true, I believe an old man that is castrated can still lose hare. At least I have read that, I am not sure how they know? The castration before puberty found that they didn't go bald.

 

Also, no, it is not the same. It does reduce your DHT (slightly increases your testosterone I believe), but it is not the same as castration, as thousands upon thousands of men on finasteride still have fulfilling sex lives, whereas I believe this is impossible for a eunuch.

[Mark2010]

Yes Finasteride was originally designed for "chemical castration".

 

 

Finasteride

 

Finasteride, also called Propecia or Proscar is a toxic drug originally designed for chemical castration. And who wants to be chemically castrated you may well ask? Good question. Older men, with metastatic prostate cancer, that is cancer that has spread outside of the gland and into their bones, may gain some benefit from chemical castration with Finasteride. It usually puts their cancer into remission but it does not cure them. The benefits are, sadly, short lived. If it were I who had metastatic prostate cancer I would pass on the Finasteride thank you all the same.

Finasteride is the ultimate pleasure stripper, the nasty thief that robs you of so much joy. In order for testosterone to work as a sex hormone and pleasure giver, it has to be converted into a substance called 5a-dihydrotestosterone or DHT. On its own testosterone is but a grape, but converted into DHT it is the champagne. Finasteride stops this conversion from happening.

What are the effects of Finasteride?

 

Note here that we are not talking about the side-effects of Finasteride. No, these are the actual effects, the intended, deliberate results of ingesting this disgusting drug. They are:

 

• Loss of libido or desire for any sexual activity including self-pleasuring.
  
• Profound erectile dysfunction – not that it matters since you won’t want to use it anyway.
  
• Loss of morning or spontaneous erections.
  
• Loss of sensation on the rare occasion that you might ejaculate.
  
• Genital numbness.
  
• Penile size depletion.
  
• Brain fog, confusion and depression.
  

But it gets even worse. Finasteride was introduced into the pharmaceutical market for the temporary control of metastatic prostate cancer. It was then discovered that it actually has the capacity to shrink the prostate gland which is hardly surprising since it shrinks just about everything else. So here we go again, let joy be unconfined, happy days! We now have a new indication for Finasteride. Let’s give it to men with benign prostate hyperplasia. That’s a fine big market out there and the share-holders will be delighted!

Whatever sense it might make to give Finasteride to a man facing terminal prostate cancer, I can not for the life of me see what sense it makes to give it to men with benign prostate hyperplasia (BPH), which is, lets face it, just about every man on this planet over the age of 60. This is all the more so since we now have a range of treatments available for BPH which are self and effective and leave men with their sexual dignity intact.

Now here is the worst bit of all to this sorry saga of pharmaceutical companies’ greed. Recently Finasteride has been “approved” as a “treatment” for male pattern baldness. Male pattern baldness is not a disease or condition that warrants any treatment lease of all that of a potent and dangerous drug. However, leaving that aside for the moment, vulnerable young men are now being offered this “cure” for their poor self-image.

For some young men taking Finasteride the consequences can be a life sentence of sexual obliteration. The really horrible part of this is that while they are actually taking their Finasteride they may notice only slight or few side-effects. It is only when they actually stop taking the poison that the bomb goes off and it’s too late then. And nobody told them that this could happen. They were lied to, duped. To date there is no effective treatment for Post-Finasteride syndrome.

[Shampoo]

good golly I musta been "castrated" via Finasteride years ago and just not ever known it :eek:

[ForeverLacey]

The above information was obviously written by someone who didn't have a good experience with the drug lol. Gotta love that "If it doesn't work for me then no one can use it" mentality.

 

In regards to your chemical castration question, it is possible for a teen aged male to retain their hair through life. This doesn't mean they are safe, there is still a small amount of testosterone produced by the adrenal glands. If they are genetically sensitive to the MPB gene they can still experience some degree of hair loss. This would also prevent them from fully developing.

 

The same would kinda apply to someone who was older and had started losing hair. Cutting your androgen supply from the gonads will not regrow whats lost, and it certainly won't stop the loss. It may slow it down. This would also set an older person up for things like osteoperosis.

 

All drugs have side effects, and everyone responds differently. Finasteride is not considered a castration drug as it is not a true anti androgen. Without testosterone, you can not have dihydrotestosterone.

[Mark2010]

The above information was obviously written by someone who didn't have a good experience with the drug lol. Gotta love that "If it doesn't work for me then no one can use it" mentality.

 

 

 

The article is actually written by a Doctor who never took the drug.

[ForeverLacey]

That's great, I am chemically castrated and don't experience any of that except for the loss of ejaculation.

[wibbles180]

I've been using finasteride for 6 years and had 2 children .... I'm going to be having a serious word with my wife and surely need to book some paternity tests !!! ???

[Mark2010]

I've been using finasteride for 6 years and had 2 children .... I'm going to be having a serious word with my wife and surely need to book some paternity tests !!! ������

 

 

You may be fine now. But that doesn't mean the drug won't harm you in the future.

 

Some people can take the drug for 10 years or more without any side effects but then "crash" over night and they are never the same again for the rest of their life.

 

 

Edited July 6, 2016 by Mark2010

[Shampoo]

You be fine may now.

But that doesn't mean the drug won't harm you in the future.

 

You could say that about tons of prescription medications.

There are "HORROR STORIES" about most medicines.

But that doesn't mean those same medicines don't help millions of other patients.

Should we outlaw every medication if there are some bad results?

 

Advil Class Action Suits:

Advil Lawsuit | Advil Side-Effects Lawsuit | Advil Side Effects: Heart Attack, Stroke - Wright & Schulte LLC | Your Legal HelpWright & Schulte LLC | Your Legal Help

 

Nyquil Class Action Suit:

http://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/stories/2009/11/23/story7.html

 

Tylenol class action lawsuit:

https://www.drugwatch.com/tylenol/lawsuit/

 

Nexium Class Action Suit:

https://www.drugwatch.com/nexium/lawsuit/

[Mark2010]

You could say that about tons of prescription medications.

There are "HORROR STORIES" about most medicines.

But that doesn't mean those same medicines don't help millions of other patients.

Should we outlaw every medication if there are some bad results?

 

Advil Class Action Suits:

Advil Lawsuit | Advil Side-Effects Lawsuit | Advil Side Effects: Heart Attack, Stroke - Wright & Schulte LLC | Your Legal HelpWright & Schulte LLC | Your Legal Help

 

Nyquil Class Action Suit:

http://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/stories/2009/11/23/story7.html

 

Tylenol class action lawsuit:

https://www.drugwatch.com/tylenol/lawsuit/

 

Nexium Class Action Suit:

https://www.drugwatch.com/nexium/lawsuit/

 

 

A cosmetic drug which has caused at least 60 known suicides and destroyed countless other lives is not acceptable in my opinion.

 

[Shampoo]

A cosmetic drug which has caused at least 60 known suicides and destroyed countless other lives is not acceptable in my opinion.

 

 

the FDA approved it for MPB way back in 1997....almost 20 years ago

 

what are the multiple credible medical sources that specifically prove that finasteride was the sole cause of 60 suicides?

 

would you ban cosmetic Botox because people have bad reactions and even death, even-though millions have enjoyed the benefits of Botox?

 

Botox Injections Can Cause Serious Health Problems | Cosmetic Products & Treatments discussions | Well Being center | SteadyHealth.com

[ForeverLacey]

Give it a break Mark, it's obvious that it has effected you or someone close. If that is the case I am really sorry for you. However, don't knock a drug that has helped so many people with their own issues. The side effects are well documented now and rare, that doesn't mean everyone gets them. Propecia is elective medicine and believe any doctor who prescribes it should be well informed of the side effects as well as informing the patient.

[Mark2010]

what are the multiple credible medical sources that specifically prove that finasteride was the sole cause of 60 suicides?

 

 

59 finasteride suicides reported to the World Health Organization Progamme for International Drug Monitoring’s last year. The number is now 62 the last time i checked.

 

Finasteride-Induced Suicidal and Self-Injurious Behavior Rises 33% in WHO Database of Adverse Drug Reactions - The Post-Finasteride Syndrome FoundationThe Post-Finasteride Syndrome Foundation

[Shampoo]

I still am not seeing how it has been proven that Propecia is the cause of 62 suicides.

[ForeverLacey]

You won't get anything credible from him Shampoo. Hey Mark, Finasteride didn't work for me either, but I'm not here whining about it to others. This was with the combination of real anti androgens and estrogen therapy. You know what did work for me believe it or not? dutasteride.Go figure that one out.

[Mark2010]

I still am not seeing how it has been proven that Propecia is the cause of 62 suicides.

 

I don't see why its hard to believe "Suicidal ideation" is a recognised side effect of Finasteride.

 

I personally knew 2 guys who took their life as a direct result of using Finasteride.

 

 

 

Post-Finasteride Syndrome

 

Doctor says Propecia responsible for son

[Shampoo]

I don't see why its hard to believe "Suicidal ideation" is a recognised side effect of Finasteride.I personally knew 2 guys who took their life as a direct result of using Finasteride.

 

It's hard to believe because you are unable to supply specific data to support your specific claims. Do you realize that balding men can be prone to depression, anxiety, and yes even suicide over the balding itself? Yes balding in and of itself can be life-threatening. So where is the data that proves it's the finasteride causing the suicide and not that it is really a subset of men that are depressed about their balding in general and all that goes along with that? Many balding men are depressed. Depression can lead to suicide. So if a very small subset of balding depressed men commit suicide you cant just jump to a definitive conclusion that Finasteride is the cause when it could be the balding itself. How many of the 62 men (out of millions I might add) were having all kinds of other issues unrelated to Finasteride?...Job loss?...Alcoholics/Drug abuse?....Divorce?...Family Problems?...Aging Phobia?...Depression?

 

Men suffering from hair loss may face greater risk of anxiety | Health | Life & Style | Daily Express

 

You claim to have known "2 guys who took their life as a direct result of using Finasteride"....but how do you know the suicide wasn't about the balding itself, or a million other related issues that cause suicide? How can you scientifically prove the Finasteride was the sole cause or even any part of the suicide decision?

 

Have you also ever considered that using your same logic that Finasteride could be preventing suicide in a group of balding men that get great results from using Finasteride and thus suffer less depression/anxiety about their balding condition?

[Scotsman]

History will make the guys who deny a link between finasteride and suicide to be similar to holocaust deniers. Keep taking the pills that alter your neurosteroid levels if you like, just don't go crying here if you stop and find that you are one of the many men devastated by this drug. You won't get any sympathy from the men here who have so far not had any adverse effects from this drug which impacts your many hormonal pathways. I speak from experience. Jees, I feel suicidal cause I'm going bald. Try adding a shrunken dick, thinned skin, subcutaneous fat loss, persistant sexual dysfunction; and for other guys cognitive issues so severe that they don't even recognise their parents. Try telling the families and friends of those who have taken their lives that propecia side effects weren't a factor. Or trying reading the despairing online testimonies of those who ended up ending their misery by completing suicide and then say that these awful side effects weren't a factor. I appreciate that propecia is keeping the hair on your head, but it is also sending others to their grave.

[Spanker]

History will make the guys who deny a link between finasteride and suicide to be similar to holocaust deniers.

 

This is one of the sickest statements about the fin debate I have ever read, and I find it very offensive. Comparing a medical side effect where there is no proof to the extermination of 6 million Jews is crossing the line on this debate in my book.

 

Jees, I feel suicidal cause I'm going bald.

 

That is kind of my point. Were these people already suicidal? (Of course you will say no, but they were not perfectly happy with themselves or they would not have started fin) People come on this board who are not on finasteride who feel suicidal due to baldness. This is a mental condition with no proof that finasteride was an enabler. I understand the devastation baldness brings, which is why I am pro finasteride. For me, it is an anti depressant as well, because I would be depressed without hair.

 

Try adding a shrunken dick, thinned skin, subcutaneous fat loss, persistant sexual dysfunction;

 

Sooooo. Taking fin and aging have very similar side effects according to this? Lower libido, dick isn't walking around semi all the time because you have a job, mortgage, kids,and been having sex with the same woman for 10 years. Skin getts thinner becasue of collagen break down, getting a little spare tire......yeah, that ONLY happens to people on fin :rolleyes:

 

and for other guys cognitive issues so severe that they don't even recognise their parents..

 

Daaaaaaaaaaaaaaamn. Stuff just got real. That is probably the most severe side effect I have ever heard being attributed to fin to date. Really man, this is just getting ridiculous now. Next thing you know, fin causes heartworms in humans, global warming, Zika virus, religious extremism, spontaneous blindness, and AIDS. :rolleyes:

[Scotsman]

It's a shame that you didn't read my post properly spanker. The side effects I experienced occurred within a short time of stopping fin. I suspect that it is unusual for a man in his late 30s to have his penis suddenly get thinner, coupled with the other sides. My initial comment may have been appallingly crass, but you have ably demonstrated my argument in dismissing concern out of hand. And the anecdote about the man who wasn't able to recognise his parents comes directly from the son of the founders of the pfsfoundation who is now dead. I think that you would be a darned sight more depressed if these other things happened to you, but if you want to be selfish and throw other guys under the bus, then so be it. I find your response not unusual but wilfully ignorant and contentedly blind. Good luck. And like Merck it appears that a vested interest has clouded your judgement, whether that be keeping your hair at the potential expense of your health, or your hair industry links.

[Mikey1970]

Great post Spanker. You echo my thoughts entirely.

 

I strongly believe its more the hair loss or an existing pre-disposition that ties in to the depression, rather than FIN.

[Shampoo]

This is one of the sickest statements about the fin debate I have ever read, and I find it very offensive. Comparing a medical side effect where there is no proof to the extermination of 6 million Jews is crossing the line on this debate in my book.

 

Totally agree Spanker. Utterly ridiculous! I find in life a certain segment of people must always find a "crusade" to be on. They can't just live and let live. If Propecia doesn't work for them, well then it must be "evil" and others shouldn't be allowed to use it either. Except almost all medications don't work for everybody, so according to their logic there would be almost no medications available that actually work for most people that take them. "Oh My God Tylenol caused liver damage and "sent others to their grave" in a certain small segment of patients so lets use our "CONTROL FREAK DISEASE" and force everybody to not have the option just because it doesn't work for me. :rolleyes:

[Scotsman]

I strongly believe its more the hair loss or an existing pre-disposition that ties in to the depression, rather than FIN.

 

Yeah, it's more the hair loss that was stopped by fin, sure, or some existing pre-disposition, rather than permanent impotence, brain damage etc. Your logic is impeccable.

[Scotsman]

Shampoo. Of course medications can have side effects. But my issue with fin is that the benefit/risk analysis in my mind is that for what is fundamentally for cosmetic purposes and not for medical reasons it should not be on the market if there is a risk that it can cause permanent harm, no matter how small. Also, Merck weren't honest with you and didn't conduct a proper safety evaluation of its product and also didn't reveal until years later that sexual dysfunction may not resolve (as one example of their duplicity). I would be happier if it was a level playing field, but it is not. Despite not having side effects now, side effects can occur on cessation, much like SSRIs. This is education, not scare mongering.

 

Erectile Dysfunction and Low Sex Drive Inadequately Reported in Hair Loss Drug Trials for Men: Northwestern University News