VIDEO: This video will come as a shock to the LLLT industry. Produced by Dr. Feller of Great Neck, NY

[Dr. Alan Feller]

BEFORE YOU BUY A LASER COMB OR OFFER LASER TREATMENTS TO PATIENTS SEE THIS VIDEO.

 

I produced this video off the top of my head in an effort to educate LLLT doctors and the public as to why lasers CAN'T grow hair. The conclusions are plain to see and appreciate. They also have the benefit of being demonstrable, repeatable, and undeniable- which is much more than can be said for those who make the bold assertions that lasers can grow hair.

 

The ignorance and arrogance of the LLLT industry has led them to make a fatal mistake. They didn't realize that once their magical lasers strike even the thinnest of surfaces, the light disperses and loses it's "laser" quality instantly.

 

This means the light that finally makes it down to the deep layer of the follicles is nothing more than standard red light which, in their own words, has no "follicle stimulating" effect.

 

Of course NO light has any stimulating effect on hair follicles since we are humans and not plants. This video will come as a shock to the LLLT industry

 

The video takes about 1 minute to load, but be patient and give the stream a chance to download.

 

Short version:

http://www.fellermedicaldata.com/Video/laser2.wmv

 

Long version:

http://www.fellermedicaldata.com/Video/laser1.wmv

 

[FenderPlayer]

Dr. Feller,

Thanks for taking the time to produce this video, and post it on here. Everything youve said makes perfect sense to me. It just seems ridiculous to me for a company say that lasers can regrow hair without having anything to back it up.

[thanatopsis_awry]

If LLLC docs got KO'd in the main thread, this is akin to them waking up and getting choked out.

 

I wouldn't mind knowing which docs/clinics, exactly, are promoting LLLC.....if they are ethical -- even if they are wrong -- they should have some sort of viable argument, or at least train of thought, to defend themselves on some level....

[blowdry]

Nice job by Dr. Feller in backing up his statements. Notice how his discriptions and comments are well thought out and organized. Exactly the same way he goes about a hair transplant procedure.

By the way I just reached my 1 year HT Anniversary on Sept. 18th.

Lets play some Wiffle Ball!!!!!.

[PLEASE GROW PLEASE]

Very nice Dr Feller .

Thanks for taking the time to make this .

Yeah if lights were to grow hair Id have afro with all the raves I went to back in the day.

 

Do you believe that laser light could possibly have any growth properties if it were to not dispersed into regular light Once it hits scalp?

 

Your presentation is saying that it couldnt work because it cant even get to the follicle but if there was someway to saturate the follicle with the beam would there be a benefit?

 

Basically what Im asking is it possible that laser light has the ability to energize human cells in the first place.

First laser advocates say its more blood flow that the laser brings that attributes growth.

Well Im sure we have all massaged our head ,hung upside down and plenty of other things to increase bloodflow with no results.

Then they say its the increase in protein synthesis and ATP that brings about growth.

Well I have taken supplements ,and synthetic enhancements for sports that are proven to assist with protein synthesis and increase ATP levels very high and my hair only kept getting worse.

So Im thinking not only does the light not get to the root of the problem but even if it did and magically increaseed those 3 things bloodflow ,protein synthesis and ATP it still wouldnt do a damn thing.

[Dr. Alan Feller]

Thank you all for the comments.

Blow,

Someone walked off with my wiffle ball bat. Pretty low, huh?!

 

PGP,

No, it wouldn't matter if you could deliver laser light directly to the follicles even if you could. We are NOT plants!

 

Remember, hair loss is GENETIC, not the end result of rotting. This means the follicle shuts itself down from the inside. Blood supply nor ATP has antyhing to do with it. The cells in the follicle are simply executing a genetic program downloaded during conception. Nothing more. Anything that would allow a cell to funciton more efficiently would only allow that cell to carry out its programming that much more effectively.

[Dr. Alan Feller]

I have included a shorter version of the video. It is my hope that we will read the responses of the LLLT doctors and other industry professionals soon.

 

Shorter version of video:

http://www.fellermedicaldata.com/Video/laser2.wmv

[latinlotus]

dr. Feller:

 

You are a man on a mission (against the laser comb industry)!

I always admire your honest comments and your desire to give your patients the absolute best, whether it is information, services etc.

 

Keep in mind that you can't convince every idiots out there (the mass in not intelligent). There's a lot of desperate hair loss sufferers out there who would buy into any marketing gimmicks, despite all the scientific evidences against that, especially in the case of laser combs. Therefore, don't lose any sleep on this.

[bullitnut]

wow just another useless piece of junk then in the battle to prevent hairloss. It strikes me as amazing that such a straight forward video as that one doc can ultimately prove the ineffectiveness of such a piece of crap, yet millions of desperate folk have wasted their money buying these things this hairloss industry doesn't have know how to squeze money out of desperate folk. BRAVO doc for showing and making this its nice to see someone making a stand and proving it without a doubt against this scumbag industry kudos to you. ps come on laser supporters/makers the stage has been set ha ha bet you cant worm your way out of this one

[Dr. Alan Feller]

Latin,

I hear you. But I'm really not trying to convince the lay public. I am trying to educate the doctors, my collegues, to stop engaging in pseudo-science. There complicity in the quack endevour of LLLT degrades the medical profession in general and the hair transplant field in particular.

 

What truly amazes me is that NO other doctor is speaking out against LLLT except Dr. Lindsey and myself.

 

If we can make it so obvious that LLLT doesn't work, although I don't see how it CAN be made much more obvious, perhaps we can shame these LLLT doctors into explaining themselves. Every day of silence they let slip by is just another degree of credibility that they all lose. The problem is, their loss of credibility reflects on ALL doctors, and that's why I keep sounding the alarm against this junk-science.

 

A belief in junk medicine is anathma to me. When it is promulgated by licensed medical doctors it is abhorent and must be countered. I plan to take this challenge to LLLT much further than a few videos and postings on the internet.

[Dr. Alan Feller]

Thanks Bul.

LLLT proponents won't come on here and face the music. They are content to be humiliated on here because the bulk of their customers don't read these forums. Threads like these concern them, but not too much yet. They tried to market their quackary on this site, and got their hat handed to them. Check out the Dr. Alan Bauman threads before he high-tailed it out of here.

My real goal is to organize a group of enlightened and intelligent doctors and patients who have not been taken in by the mass delusion of LLLT. With such a group we can counter the slimey LLLT industry and expose it for what it is: Quackary. And for what it isn't: a method to regrow a cosmetically signficiant amount of hair.

[indian_balding26]

well....i don't know what types of laser guns are used for hair loss treatment, i am not sure if they are the same ones used in some laser toys? those are just light and nothing more.....

 

But not all lasers just bounce off our skin, laser is used for permanent body hair removal( killing hair follicle??), eye surgery, kidney stones removal,surgeries.. treatment of skin scars etc...

[bullitnut]

you ought to post that video on youtube as theres all sorts of crap promoting these things on there that will save a few folk wasting money

[indian_balding26]

BTW i had a friend who had a bad acne scar and went to a place where they did some laser skin treatment, and i definitely see a difference....not sure if the laser really did anything? Just sayin..

[PLEASE GROW PLEASE]

I personally commend Dr. Feller for being willing to throw himself to the wolves and explain his reasons for discouraging laser therapy for anyone.

[badger_01]

I took fiber optics in grad school and I can say that none of the classes were as well presented ...nice work Dr Feller.

[Ceasar08]

The video is very clear and well done, so much so that a Junior High School science student would understand it. What amazes me is how this whole "laser" thing has been allowed to happen. It's clear from the video that it's so ridiculously counter-intuitive to reason. Why have the FDA and so many reputable doctors even entertained (not to mention endorsed) such a ridiculous product?

 

If I showed up at these doctors offices, or applied for an FDA clearance on a magic hat or flashlight that grows hair, I'd be laughed at (or at least I hope so). How did we get back to the days of snake oil being promoted by reputable people in mainstream science? It's shocking to me.

 

Is it me, or did the FDA actually state that the thing grows a modest amount of hair? I would love for someone to investigate the "studies" that were submitted.

[thanatopsis_awry]

On the one hand, the LLLC backers like to take a muddled stance of being proponents -- not because they actually have irrefutable, clear, scientific support, but because they have that which is subjective and difficult to directly dispel...."anecdotal evidence".....

 

On the other hand, statements like this get made: "laser works by absorbtion of light (photobiostimulation) by the cells and that increases the growth (anagen) phase of the cycle".

 

I wonder if Dr. Mohmand, and others, still believe in this assertion.

 

Either LLLC works or it doesn't; and either you believe it can work or you believe it can't. If you offer LLLC on any level to a patient, as a medical doctor, as part of a treatment plan you simply *must* believe in LLLC and believe that it can and does work for the treatment of MPB and the like.

 

As such, *any* doctor who offers LLLC to patients should absolutely feel compelled -- out of both professional and ethical forces -- to defend their position. If you hawk LLLC you must believe in it; as a doctor encouraging it to patients you simply must have excellent reasoning. In light of the candid presentation of fact and argumentation that Dr. Feller has provided, there are only so many choices of interpretation for such deafening silence of proof, fact, and argumentation.

[Bill - Seemiller]

Dr. Feller, Thanks for presenting this video to further solidify your thinking. However, like Pat stated to you in an email, I too don't think it conclusively proves that LLLT doesn't have some benefit on scalp tissue.

 

Laser therapy seemingly has been accepted as legit for other healing applications and recently, many ethical hair transplant surgeons provide laser therapy for free on patients right after surgery because they believe it can speed up healing.

 

I also think it's unfair for Dr. Feller to charactize those who regularly use laser therapy without overselling its benefits, as unethical.

 

We can see clearly from Dr. Feller's examples that lasers penetrate whatever it touches. The question is, what effect does it have to the area it penetrates?

 

The laser verses LED light examples was also interesting. However, a laser is much more direct in its target than LED light. I would suspect therefore, that the conversion of light to energy is much more direct on the scalp than light that disperses every which direction. Devices like the laser comb, and more expensive clinical ones, have a number of diodes that target many areas of the scalp at the same time.

 

Supposedly, lasers work by releasing targeted energy to the cells causing metobolic changes. This process is said to provide additional nutrients and oxygen to the scalp assisting normal cell chemical processes. If indeed this energy conversion process reaches derma papilla cells, I suspect it may help improve their normal function - to grow healthy hair follicles. What role, if any, this energy conversion process has on DHT, appears to be unknown from my research.

 

Laser therapy is backed up by several studies as noted by Dr. Mohmand on this thread, thus one can argue it has been proven to work (somewhat perhaps). But the question remains, how reliable are these studies?

 

One statement by Dr. Feller on the same thread indicated that those who have a financial interest in lasers cannot possibly be believed. Yet, every ethical surgeon recommended on this community has a financial interest in hair transplant surgery. And they should.

 

But does a financial interest in something guarantee corruption? I hope not! Otherwise, every working man or woman (including the doctors, patients, and publishers of this community) must be unethical.

 

Like laser therapy, even hair transplant surgery has had its benefits oversold in the media by several clinics. Online hype about FUE megasessions is just one example.

 

The difference of course is that follicular unit hair transplantation as been proven to work (by surgeons who do a meticulous job) with a great deal of public evidence and many patients (not just doctors financially interested in it) can attest to it. I am one of them.

 

But the burden of compelling visual proof falls upon those who support laser therapy. I fear without it, this community (including me) will have a hard time buying the science.

 

So who is the enemy? Is it laser therapy itself or those who regularly overpromote its benefits?

 

I think we can all agree that those who overpromote laser therapy as a hair loss cure are enemies to balding men and women. But whether or not laser therapy has any level of benefit on scalp tissue or hair follicles is much more arguable.

 

In my opinon, this is a worthwhile debate. I personally commend Dr. Mohmand for being willing to throw himself to the wolves and explain his reasons for encouraging laser therapy for some of his patients.

 

I would also think that selling a laser comb when he has to buy them first, is of very little financial gain for him when he could just as well be doing more hair transplants and make a lot more money.

 

Best wishes,

 

Bill

[indian_balding26]

if laser is just a light with no other properties why is it be used in eye surgery and other plastic surgeries ...

[Dr. Alan Feller]

Indian,

Yes, the laser in toys are the exact same lasers used by the LLLT industry.

The lasers used for scar resurfacing are hot, high energy destructive lasers, not low power cold lasers. The former actually work and have a sound basis for doing so, the latter does not.

[indian_balding26]

jeez.....thanks for the clarification Dr feller! that really sucks....nobody should be charging a penny for treatment with those flash toys!

[Dr. Alan Feller]

Bill,

I have to ask you this flat out, do you purposefully try to create a disingenuous middle ground for yourself in all posts, or just mine?

Outright misquoting me and then building off of that false premise serves neither you, me, or the community.

 

You wrote:

-------------

"One statement by Dr. Feller on the same thread indicated that those who have a financial interest in lasers cannot possibly be believed."

-- - - - - - - - -

If you can show me where I wrote or reasonably implied this I would be most appreciative. If you can't, I would ask that you erase that grossly erroneous misquote or misinterpretation from your post.

 

As for the rest of your post, I wonder if you even watched the video. And if you did, I can only be led to believe that you didn't understand it. And I don't just mean the basic scientific truths I demonstrated, but the much deeper consequences it has for the LLLT industry as a whole.

 

Although such a video would never be greeted with fanfare, it is nevertheless ground shaking to the LLLT industry because it utterly and completely sweeps away the one theory they built their entire industry upon. They went quite far out on the branch, and now it has been cut. But all this seems lost on you. I don't quite know how I failed you, I really don't.

 

What part of the video did you not understand? The part where a piece of tissue stopped a 500mw laser beam in its tracks, or the part where within 1mm of tissue paper the light lost it's all important laser property? You know, the property that ALL laser therapy proponents point to as the foundation of their belief that their devices stimulate hair growth?

 

Bill, your analysis of my video and LLLT in general is factually incorrect:

 

You wrote:

-----------------

We can see clearly from Dr. Feller's examples that lasers penetrate whatever it touches. The question is, what effect does it have to the area it penetrates?

------------------

The answer is nothing. And that's not just according to ME that's according to the LLLT camp themselves, including Mr. David Michaels of Hairmax in his own FDA clearance application where he stated that LED light is ineffective.

And the point wasn't that lasers penetrate whatever they touch. They don't. The issue was to demonstrate that laser light MUST lose its coherency in order to illuminate anything. That is, if it is illuminating a scalp or my thumb it MUST be incoherent light that's doing the glowing NOT laser light. That's why my thumb glowed the same whether I hit it with a laser or a an LED. The final result was the same and it represents a nail in the coffin of LLLT theory.

 

You wrote:

------------------

The laser verses LED light examples was also interesting. However, a laser is much more direct in its target than LED light. I would suspect therefore, that the conversion of light to energy is much more direct on the scalp than light that disperses every which direction

---------------------

You are incorrect. As my video clearly demonstrates, the moment the laser strikes the skin it instantly looses it's laser properties and from that point on acts like regular monochromatic light coming from a standard LED. The power and directionality of the light are inconsequential- and this comes not just from me, but from the LLLT proponents themselves. They never claimed the problem with standard LEDS was that enough power and directionality couldn't be achieved. They claimed that even under equivalent power (allowing for normal dissipation) LED light could not grow hair because it was incoherent. By the way, we have LEDs that can transilluminate your entire hand and blind you as fast as any laser. Don't confuse the coherency of light with power and directionality.

 

Your wrote:

--------------

Supposedly, lasers work by releasing targeted energy to the cells causing metobolic changes. This process is said to provide additional nutrients and oxygen to the scalp assisting normal cell chemical processes. If indeed this energy conversion process reaches derma papilla cells, I suspect it may help improve their normal function - to grow healthy hair follicles. What role, if any, this energy conversion process has on DHT, appears to be unknown from my research.

--------------------

And again you are incorrect. You are taking a simplified talking point form the LLLT camp and then creating your own lay simplistic conclusion. There is no evidence that lasers cause beneficial metabolic changes nor provide nutrients and oxygen. If they did, you can be sure all hospital patients would be sleeping under laser lights. Bill, it's just not true. Stop buying into false premises regurgitated from one lay LLLT proponent to the next. We are NOT plants!

 

Bill, it is obvious that you want to take an anti-laser position because I can read between the lines of what you have been posting about it for years. And you would be absolutely correct. But why do you strain credibility and distort what I wrote in a weak attempt to move to the middle?

 

In your post you asked who the enemy is. That's easy, it's the person who is either incapable or unwilling to see the truth and tell it for what it is. It's the guys in the middle, because ALL LLLT proponents are in the middle. Not one of them say it works effectively in all patients and at all times. By hedging they avoid taking responsibility for providing a therapy they themselves have serious doubts about. But it doesn't stop them from collecting the money, does it? After my video, I don't see how any ethical "middle of the road" doctor could still accept money for laser therapy. I just proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that coherent light does not reach the follicle.

 

The only righteous people are those who took a look at the dearth of LLLT results and the pseudo-science used to justify it and rightly concluded rightly that LLLT is a non-starter.

[latinlotus]

yet millions of desperate folk have wasted their money buying these things this hairloss industry doesn't have know how to squeze money out of desperate folk.

 

not just wasted money, but TIME as well. If they just spend that precious time on exercise losing weight, gain muscles, they would look much better even if they remain bald.

[Bill - Seemiller]

Dr. Feller,

 

Though I don't appreciate the demeaning tone of your post as if I'm some idiot who couldn't understand your very basic video demonstrating the pointing of a laser at tissue paper, I don't have time to respond to your entire post right now.

 

However, I feel it's pertinent to address the following immediately, more specifically, your second statement.

 

I have to ask you this flat out, do you purposefully try to create a disingenuous middle ground for yourself in all posts, or just mine?

 

Outright misquoting me and then building off of that false premise serves neither you, me, or the community.

 

First off, I never quoted you. I specifically said

 

"One statement by Dr. Feller on the same thread indicated that those who have a financial interest in lasers cannot possibly be believed."

 

This is 100% different than a direct quote. However, my conclusion is based on the statements I presented below. If I am wrong in my interpretation of the words you spoke, I'd like you to offer an viable explanation other than what seems obviously implied.

 

You said to Dr. Mohmand:

 

"Why do you blindly follow the "studies" of other doctors who have obvious agendas concerning LLLT?"

 

and more emphatically...

 

"Also, Dr. Leavitt has already publicly acknowledged that he is in the laser business, so how could you rely on their presented "study"?"

 

Can you please explain these comments if you are not implying that those studies performed by those with a financial interest are not reliable?

 

Regards,

 

Bill