De Freitas or Bicer

[TXGuy]

Hello - been a lurker for a while now, but would appreciate some advice from the group. I experienced pretty rapid (and significant) hair loss due to hormonal issues (was on far too high of a TRT dose for too long), and went from a pretty full head of hair (save for some minor receding) to the attached. It’s been mentally hard to say the least. I am in Europe for the next 10 months and was researching clinics in Turkey and Spain  I started thinking I’d go for a better but cheaper option (Dr. Yaman - who recommended 4500 grafts - if they could even be extracted in that quantity), but am now looking at Dr  Bicer and Dr  De Freitas. I can get into see Bicer the summer of 2024, but cannot into De Freitas until May 2025 at this point. Both doctors tell me (3,000 grafts due to my donor region - at least the first surgery—will evaluate whether 2nd is possible after. I feel this more conservative approach is probably realistic given my hair loss and donor region. I do have thinner hair. I understand my crown is likely gone but the hope is to re-create the front hairline and middle portion (all clinics say this will be the focus).

 

I have NOT to date been on medication. Years ago I experienced sides from oral propecia and disliked the Rogaine foam. I have a iRestore coming any day now…along with Nizorale shampoo. I also have a topical liquid Minoxidal coming and am considering a derma pen . 
 

Dr Bicer said nothing about medication whereas De Freitas said once booked a medication treatment plan would be prescribed and must be followed prior to the surgery date.

My hair loss (from what I see in shower and pillow) has stopped mostly bc my hormone levels are now well managed. 
 

Any advice regarding what doctor to go with and medication suggestions? 

Edited December 23, 2023 by TXGuy
Wrong word choice

[BaldGuy]

Well you need 3800-4000 grafts for frontal third and midscalp and 2500 for crown area.

 

[Gatsby]

You should consider topical Finasteride. If you disliked the minoxidil foam you could see a dermatologist for oral minoxidil. Dr Bicer and Dr De Freitas are both excellent surgeons. Have a look at the results by the recommendation list of surgeons here. Look for patients with a similar/same pattern of hair loss and with results you are looking for. All the best! 

[TheGreatPretender]

What Gatsby said. Consider topical Dutasteride aswell, Melvin also had side effects from the Finasteride pill and responded greatly to Zyon.

You got some good doctors in your list, consider spreading it with a few more names in case you already havent and consult with them all to see what are their views.

Bruno Pinto and Bruno Ferreira are also class doctors to consider.

[A_4_Archan]

Two phased approach would be appropriate unless you go to surgeons like zarev and pittela.

3k grafts for the markeed area would be appropriate...

Regarding medication as the above poster suggested you can try topical dutasteride if you are not able to tolerate oral finasteride/dutasteride and you can also try oral minoxidil after consulting a doctor.

In between bicer and de freitas ,i would pick de freitas anyday...in 3 euros per graft price segment he can be the best bet.

If you wanna explore some more options who are more affordable (around 2 euros per graft) than you can look at dr gur, hdc clinic and de laorwong 

[Reina]

1 hour ago, A_4_Archan said:

 

If you wanna explore some more options who are more affordable (around 2 euros per graft) than you can look at dr gur, hdc clinic and de laorwong 

Gur and turan are more affordable. if you select the standard package of dr Gur is 3500€ for 3200-3500 grafts. Turan charges about 1.2€/graft

Demirsoy is also between 1-1.5 €/graft. 

Edited December 23, 2023 by Reina

[A_4_Archan]

51 minutes ago, Reina said:

Gur and turan are more affordable. if you select the standard package of dr Gur is 3500€ for 3200-3500 grafts. Turan charges about 1.2€/graft

Demirsoy is also between 1-1.5 €/graft. 

Vip package of gur is i think 1.75 euros per graft now and demirsoy is 1.5

Edited December 23, 2023 by A_4_Archan

[Eli_Avdikian]

If De Fretias hasn't increased his price, and if money is not an issue, I'd choose De Fretias

[TXGuy]

All,  thanks for the replies thus far. I will look into the topical finestriside (XYON). Not cheap at $99/month but if it works really well—-we will see. I’ll have to do some research. The oral minoxidil is intriguing as well. I don’t know much about Dutesteride unfortunately. Using which combo and in which dosages (and avoiding unpleasant sides) isn’t easy to figure out!

 

I started out being more conscious of cost, but now (not that I have deep pockets—more worried about this really being a one shot deal—so need to get it right, and with my advance thinning and not the greatest donor region, I want to be sure) I am more concerned with which doctor gives me best chance of positive results. I like De Freitas, and I know the long wait list is indicative of his talent, but having to wait until May 2025 has me worried (what if hair loss or donor region further degrades in interim). I am hopeful I will respond positively to the medication and the laser helmet and shampoo and all that but you never know. 
 

de Freitas actually said 2800-3000 over 2 days and Bicer said 3,000 but perhaps a bit more and done in 1 day. 
 

also want to know who is better for Post op care - I read some not too flattering reviews about the lack of after care for Bicer (no first wash, poor instructions and information provided etc. 
 

 

[TheGreatPretender]

44 minutes ago, TXGuy said:

All,  thanks for the replies thus far. I will look into the topical finestriside (XYON). Not cheap at $99/month but if it works really well—-we will see. I’ll have to do some research. The oral minoxidil is intriguing as well. I don’t know much about Dutesteride unfortunately. Using which combo and in which dosages (and avoiding unpleasant sides) isn’t easy to figure out!

 

I started out being more conscious of cost, but now (not that I have deep pockets—more worried about this really being a one shot deal—so need to get it right, and with my advance thinning and not the greatest donor region, I want to be sure) I am more concerned with which doctor gives me best chance of positive results. I like De Freitas, and I know the long wait list is indicative of his talent, but having to wait until May 2025 has me worried (what if hair loss or donor region further degrades in interim). I am hopeful I will respond positively to the medication and the laser helmet and shampoo and all that but you never know. 
 

de Freitas actually said 2800-3000 over 2 days and Bicer said 3,000 but perhaps a bit more and done in 1 day. 
 

also want to know who is better for Post op care - I read some not too flattering reviews about the lack of after care for Bicer (no first wash, poor instructions and information provided etc. 
 

 

I cannot say of Bicer since she wasn't my doctor but having waited 14 months for my surgery with De Freitas was worth it. 

All instructions were clear, his staff is always quick to reply even during holidays and easily reachable. They also made my mind at ease in moments of doubt and panic. 

They knew their thing and their job was nothing more then professional. 

I can't vouch for the results yet but I have seen some good progress so far within these 5 to 6 months but I will have to wait before evaluating further. 

[Reina]

4 hours ago, A_4_Archan said:

Vip package of gur is i think 1.75 euros per graft now and demirsoy is 1.5

Yes vip package for Gur is that price but he also has the standard package for 3200€ with him doing the plan, design and incisions. 
 

dr demirsoy also his vip package is at 1.50€/graft but he also has standard package with him doing the incisions, plan and design at 1 €/graft. 

[Berba11]

8 hours ago, TXGuy said:

I like De Freitas, and I know the long wait list is indicative of his talent, but having to wait until May 2025 has me worried (what if hair loss or donor region further degrades in interim).

Then you’ll be pleased you waited as the alternative is get a HT sooner (with Bicer) and then still lose more hair, which might be a problem that can’t be easily addressed down the road. 
 

Waiting longer will give you plenty of time to try and stabilise or even improve your current rate of loss and will give a more accurate picture of things when it comes time for surgery. 

[TXGuy]

Follow-Up. I took the HT plunge now and went with Dr. Bicer. We had discussed 3,500 and possibly more, but as she was extracting she felt that due to the bleeding and described poorer circulation she thought it best to dial back to 3,050. Showing her honesty and integrity throughout, she informed me afterwards and refunded me money. She hopes that within a year we can strengthen the remaining donor area and also take beard/chest grafts to further strengthen the frontal hairline and mid scalp and touching the crown to cover some of that as well. The procedure went quite well. No significant pain throughout. After removal of the bandage the following day I slept that night using the next pillow  and woke up to blood and puss on my hotel pillow which was unsettling, though the Dr. tells me this is not abnormal. There is a ton of redness particularly on the large donor area. I will post updates as things proceed. I really am hoping for the best with this first HT, and if results are good I will return for a second to fill in and obtain even more significant results. She did tell me to start on minoxidil and finestriside to strengthen existing hair and prevent further loss. I do not want to do oral finestrisid due to the sides. Keeps makes a topical combo product, then there is the Xyon dusteseride (but I’m not as familiar and it is very expensive). Thoughts?

[Al - Moderator]

 

Dr Bicer does some very good work. This looks good so far. Please keep us updated on your progress as the months go by. Good luck with the hair growth.