Dr Hasson | November/December 2022 | 3872 FUE Grafts | 22M

[Savemyhairline]

So essentially H&W will give you a 100% refund? I am a big fan of Dr. Hasson’s work but I understand where you’re coming from on choosing a different doc after all this. Especially if you’re getting refunded. If they were to not refund you and you had to start over financially, I’d maybe have a different opinion.  I’d say at 9 months that is disappointing and you are right to not be happy. 
 

My advice emotionally would be to try and look at guys like Melvin and Gatsby who did not have a successful first go around but with perseverance and patience, look great today. You’re a very young guy and you have a great beard, so you should have options as far as grafts down the line. It seems you did all your research beforehand and you did choose a world class clinic, so nobody can fault you, you did nothing wrong, try to remind yourself of that.

 

Any doctor can and has had less than satisfactory results. Them refunding you fully is nice, though of course you can’t be refunded on all the time, energy, and emotion you’ve inevitably put into this. Try to keep your head held high man, don’t quit. I think Bisanga and Rahal could both do you well, I feel like I’ve seen multiple impressive repair cases from Bisanga.

[mister_25]

1 hour ago, Savemyhairline said:

So essentially H&W will give you a 100% refund? I am a big fan of Dr. Hasson’s work but I understand where you’re coming from on choosing a different doc after all this. Especially if you’re getting refunded. If they were to not refund you and you had to start over financially, I’d maybe have a different opinion.  I’d say at 9 months that is disappointing and you are right to not be happy. 
 

My advice emotionally would be to try and look at guys like Melvin and Gatsby who did not have a successful first go around but with perseverance and patience, look great today. You’re a very young guy and you have a great beard, so you should have options as far as grafts down the line. It seems you did all your research beforehand and you did choose a world class clinic, so nobody can fault you, you did nothing wrong, try to remind yourself of that.

 

Any doctor can and has had less than satisfactory results. Them refunding you fully is nice, though of course you can’t be refunded on all the time, energy, and emotion you’ve inevitably put into this. Try to keep your head held high man, don’t quit. I think Bisanga and Rahal could both do you well, I feel like I’ve seen multiple impressive repair cases from Bisanga.

I did not say they are giving a refund, but a refund is on table if the areas do not have growth. Here is what they said word for word.

"Dr. Hasson stands behind his work so if after a year there is an area that has not regrown he would either replace those grafts for free or refund your money for those grafts."

The thing is, I did my research obsessively and followed specifically Melvin's and Gatsby's cases and advice to avoid the same pitfalls they had so that I can have my hair when I was young like I am now. However, it doesn't matter how much research I put in or if I did everything right because I still fell in those exact same pitfalls regardless.

It was implied by Doug from H&W in a previous email that a person of my retrograde alopecia severity probably/is estimated to have a total of 5500-6500 Grafts in their donor. Which would mean that my donor reserves equal out about 1628 at its lowest, to 2628 at its highest. Which is either half of the amount that Doug said I would need to restore my hair following this outcome, or mildly less than the requirement to restore my hair following this outcome. I believe that I probably have enough donor to meet my original expectations, but the issue arises on how well the yield will go the second time around.

When everyone tells me "I did nothing wrong and nobody can fault me or my methods" its puts me in a loop because it makes me feel like any other follow up choice I am going to make will merit the same results, which I am destined to be unhappy with.

Another thing that wasn't stated is not only can they not refund me the "emotion, time and energy" that I had to go through but they can't refund the potential grafts that were burned through the procedure, which equates to the final long term result for both your donor preservation and your hair on your head. that's is what is really bothering me.

I really don't want to come across as someone begging for pity, But I do want to show that for just as much as a good result can change your life for the better with restored confidence, a result your unhappy with has the opposite effect and makes you have doubt in yourself and reinforces the insecurity to some degree. 

Edited September 8, 2023 by mister_25

[Savemyhairline]

3 hours ago, mister_25 said:

I did not say they are giving a refund, but a refund is on table if the areas do not have growth. Here is what they said word for word.

"Dr. Hasson stands behind his work so if after a year there is an area that has not regrown he would either replace those grafts for free or refund your money for those grafts."

The thing is, I did my research obsessively and followed specifically Melvin's and Gatsby's cases and advice to avoid the same pitfalls they had so that I can have my hair when I was young like I am now. However, it doesn't matter how much research I put in or if I did everything right because I still fell in those exact same pitfalls regardless.

It was implied by Doug from H&W in a previous email that a person of my retrograde alopecia severity probably/is estimated to have a total of 5500-6500 Grafts in their donor. Which would mean that my donor reserves equal out about 1628 at its lowest, to 2628 at its highest. Which is either half of the amount that Doug said I would need to restore my hair following this outcome, or mildly less than the requirement to restore my hair following this outcome. I believe that I probably have enough donor to meet my original expectations, but the issue arises on how well the yield will go the second time around.

When everyone tells me "I did nothing wrong and nobody can fault me or my methods" its puts me in a loop because it makes me feel like any other follow up choice I am going to make will merit the same results, which I am destined to be unhappy with.

Another thing that wasn't stated is not only can they not refund me the "emotion, time and energy" that I had to go through but they can't refund the potential grafts that were burned through the procedure, which equates to the final long term result for both your donor preservation and your hair on your head. that's is what is really bothering me.

I really don't want to come across as someone begging for pity, But I do want to show that for just as much as a good result can change your life for the better with restored confidence, a result your unhappy with has the opposite effect and makes you have doubt in yourself and reinforces the insecurity to some degree. 

Can they speak to any possible reasons why your yield seems low? I think before doing any additional surgery you should have an in-person consult with a Dr. Closely examining your scalp with a microscope.

[Melvin- Admin]

Here are my thoughts, if this was a complete failure, then I would consider switching surgeons. But, in this case. It looks like the yield is low. But it looks natural. 

It also looks like the hair hasn’t matured yet. Possibly because you’re a late grower. The transplanted hairs look thin in diameter, what you would expect from someone at 5 months. Its possible these hairs thicken in the next 6 months. To a point where it look’s significantly better.

My advice is to wait another 6 months and track your progress before making a decision. If it looks 85% then it makes sense to return to Hasson to get it to as close to 100% as possible. The reality is he’s still one of the best in the world. The fact he’s offering a free touch up or refund speaks volumes. I understand and empathize with you. The emotions are hard. But we’re a brotherhood here, we know what you’re going through. Reality is you look better, and you don’t look like someone who’s botched. Things can and probably will improve in the next few months.
 

[Turkhair]

You mentioned you had tonsillitis during surgery, could that have affected your outcome? How long did it last?

Recovering from stress hairloss takes a very long time ( a year almost) , perhaps that’s what is happening with you. You should wait few more months in hopes this is stress hairloss before doing another surgery. 

[Savemyhairline]

I think what Melvin is saying makes sense and I genuinely hope he’s right, he very well may be. I still think Dr. Hasson is one of the best in the world for sure. Nothing to me about the actual work looks bad, just the strength of the hairs at this time. There’s another thread with a Dr. Konior (who’s also regarded as one of the best ) patient with people concerned due to the patient requiring a free touch up after 6 months. His case is of course not the same as yours, but my point is a top tier surgeon making an error shouldn’t remove all confidence in their ability. Actually in the Dr. K instance I think, while the work also is not bad, he made a judgement error in that he tried to cover a very large area with only 2k grafts. Dr. K does amazing work but math is still math and 2k for what he was trying to cover was unrealistic imo.

 

I think at this point 3 more months will give you a better understanding just based on you being a slow grower. At least you should be able to use fibers now, as you mentioned. 

[Kent]

I agree your new hairs look very thin and wispy. That’s probably good news as the hairs will undoubtedly strengthen and increase in diameter. I’m noticing this with my HT.  The ends of my new hairs are fizzy and thin compared to the base of the hair strands.  It has made my hair appear thicker.  You should start seeing the hairs thicken by 10 - 12 months.   I also think you need to be realistic as you were quite bald.   Placing thin hair in a bald region without an adjacent patch of full hair is bound to require more than one surgery.   Your result is not a failure and there is only so much one procedure can accomplish.  If you’ve lost confidence in your doctor then choose another top surgeon.  I wish more multiple procedure folks would share their stories.  People are mainly hearing from the guys who largely have a full head of hair but need their corners corrected.  In looking at your photos I think you should go to a good stylist and get cleaned up.  Use styling powder and some toppick and I bet you’ll look a lot better.  And add some relaxation techniques like yoga and breathing exercises.   If you’re stressing out about this then you’re not helping matters.   Sending you lots of growing vibes brother.  

[mister_25]

5 hours ago, Turkhair said:

You mentioned you had tonsillitis during surgery, could that have affected your outcome? How long did it last?

Recovering from stress hairloss takes a very long time ( a year almost) , perhaps that’s what is happening with you. You should wait few more months in hopes this is stress hairloss before doing another surgery. 

Dr Hasson assured me that the tonsillitis would have absolutely 0% affect on the outcome, if he had said that it could then I would of asked him to stop the surgery.

In my opinion it’s not about my current hairs being wispy, there is in general a very little amount of hair. The left side as you can tell has about <10% yield that goes across the whole left side hairline. And the right side whilst doing particularly better than the left side still has rather poor density all over. To further reinforce this point, when I comb my hair from left to right, the forelock and the left area reveals bald circles of no growth.

Just a reminder these photos are flipped.

I will have to reiterate what I was told by the clinic, “the plan was to reinforce the front to a strong degree, anything else would work towards giving me a illusion to work with on my crown”. It was agreed upon that the front would look good enough to meet my expectations with only needing minor touch ups if issues were to arise (I was under the impression that these minor touch ups would not or barely exceed 100 grafts). Also if you look at my post scabs photos the density looks sufficient and strong on the hairline. Just to really state it here because I was called delusional last time. Dr Hasson told me my expectations on a strong frontal third were very achievable and reasonable

I spent two years researching on what was possible, and I’ve had non stop comparing graft numbers, hair caliber, thickness, multi and etc other factors. I had 4364 hairs implanted which should look a lot better than this.

I don’t feel any less bald, I was constantly told before the operation that I was about a NW3 with a diffuse NW5 pattern, i only feel like it’s moderately gotten me closer to being a NW3 altogether.

I’m not saying I’m botched, because a botched person would have hairs growing in unnatural directions with the wrong hairs scattered across everywhere. I just feel like my growth is that poor that barely anything has grown in the front. 

I don’t know how to move forward here. All I want is my hair back, not any new stress relief hobbies, not any more expenses towards my third psychologist, not any new concealer although I might have to due to the damage done to my donor reserves for future HTs. All I want is to feel like someone my age, I’ve been bald since I was 19/20 and I’ve never heard the end of it. Unlike what people say, people actually do care on what your hair looks like and they will never make you forget it.

What are my actual options here? What can I do to almost guarantee that the same mistakes and outcome won’t happen again?

 

[jjalay]

53 minutes ago, mister_25 said:

Dr Hasson assured me that the tonsillitis would have absolutely 0% affect on the outcome, if he had said that it could then I would of asked him to stop the surgery.

In my opinion it’s not about my current hairs being wispy, there is in general a very little amount of hair. The left side as you can tell has about <10% yield that goes across the whole left side hairline. And the right side whilst doing particularly better than the left side still has rather poor density all over. To further reinforce this point, when I comb my hair from left to right, the forelock and the left area reveals bald circles of no growth.

Just a reminder these photos are flipped.

I will have to reiterate what I was told by the clinic, “the plan was to reinforce the front to a strong degree, anything else would work towards giving me a illusion to work with on my crown”. It was agreed upon that the front would look good enough to meet my expectations with only needing minor touch ups if issues were to arise (I was under the impression that these minor touch ups would not or barely exceed 100 grafts). Also if you look at my post scabs photos the density looks sufficient and strong on the hairline. Just to really state it here because I was called delusional last time. Dr Hasson told me my expectations on a strong frontal third were very achievable and reasonable

I spent two years researching on what was possible, and I’ve had non stop comparing graft numbers, hair caliber, thickness, multi and etc other factors. I had 4364 hairs implanted which should look a lot better than this.

I don’t feel any less bald, I was constantly told before the operation that I was about a NW3 with a diffuse NW5 pattern, i only feel like it’s moderately gotten me closer to being a NW3 altogether.

I’m not saying I’m botched, because a botched person would have hairs growing in unnatural directions with the wrong hairs scattered across everywhere. I just feel like my growth is that poor that barely anything has grown in the front. 

I don’t know how to move forward here. All I want is my hair back, not any new stress relief hobbies, not any more expenses towards my third psychologist, not any new concealer although I might have to due to the damage done to my donor reserves for future HTs. All I want is to feel like someone my age, I’ve been bald since I was 19/20 and I’ve never heard the end of it. Unlike what people say, people actually do care on what your hair looks like and they will never make you forget it.

What are my actual options here? What can I do to almost guarantee that the same mistakes and outcome won’t happen again?

 

Have you considered doing strip with dr. Wong this time as a repair? This will be i persume without cost and you might be able to obtain more grafts as doing another fue.

[mister_25]

1 hour ago, jjalay said:

Have you considered doing strip with dr. Wong this time as a repair? This will be i persume without cost and you might be able to obtain more grafts as doing another fue.

I don't think I would get a FUT or a procedure from Dr Wong. 

I was told originally that I have enough donor supply where FUE is more than enough, If I had to have FUE and FUT Scars and still face the prospect/possibility of poor yield, I would be deeply unhappy. 

As for Dr Wong. I am not a fan of the rows as many people have brought up, mainly because I wanted the possibility of having a shaved head in the future without things looking unnatural or being a standout feature. Also there was a recent case of a pretty horrible FUT Scar from Dr Wong that shakes my confidence in this option.

Edited September 9, 2023 by mister_25

[mister_25]

2 hours ago, Turkhair said:

I would suggest you do small procedures after this. 1500-2000 grafts procedures. You don’t have a big bald area to go for big procedures anyway

I like this approach. Whoever I select for a second procedure I will be asking towards surgeries/procedures tailored towards maximizing yield in every possible way. I think 1500 at a time is the safest bet I have and will only take me two or so procedures I think to get me somewhere I want to be.

If its anything worth noting, I believe the crown is coming in at the expectations that I had, and it only had 950 grafts implanted in that area compared to the 2900 in the front. Might be a sign that I am sensitive to more tightly packed grafts.

 

2 hours ago, Turkhair said:

You have a massive beard probably 8k-10k beard grafts if you don’t mind above chin grafts perhaps even more. Be grateful for that. You can use that to get add density even if your scalp donor is thinned out. 

I think my beard hair might not be ideal for my situation because of the very big difference between my scalp characteristics and my donor characteristics. It is something that I will have to ask. Are any of the options I listed renowned or have notable skill in using beard hair?

Also I will never know until I get my beard checked, when I first posted photos of my donor asking opinions on it everyone was telling me that it had fantastic characteristics such as high density, coarse hair and numerous other factors. I even had my scalp examined under a microscope and they told me I had a large amount of triples compared to the average person.

Now that my result is less than stellar, other people have come out and said I probably have DUPA and that my donor was below average and quite poor. Who knows if this could also apply to my beard and it could be very below average as well.

2 hours ago, Turkhair said:

More than likely your tonsillitis had something to do with it. Sorry but I don’t believe that it didn’t. When our bodies fight infection, hairs are the bottom in priorities list.

I generally doubt that this is the case. I imagine H&W could be liable to some form of negligence in their duty if they saw a potential sickness/illness arise that could compromise the surgery and continued anyway. Correct me if I'm wrong on this.

Also if this is the case I would of been lied too which isn't ethical in anyway.

2 hours ago, Turkhair said:

Good luck and try to be positive. There are people who were in far worse position who now have fantastic heads of hairs. 

This is true and is a saving grace, but most of these people come from stories where they made foolish ill thought-out decisions at the beginning, and they come back with the right research, planning and selection. I am stumped on where to move forward considering the universal conclusion is that I did everything right since the very start.

 

 

Edited September 9, 2023 by mister_25

[shiba1985]

2 hours ago, mister_25 said:

I like this approach. Whoever I select for a second procedure I will be asking towards surgeries/procedures tailored towards maximizing yield in every possible way. I think 1500 at a time is the safest bet I have and will only take me two or so procedures I think to get me somewhere I want to be.

If its anything worth noting, I believe the crown is coming in at the expectations that I had, and it only had 950 grafts implanted in that area compared to the 2900 in the front. Might be a sign that I am sensitive to more tightly packed grafts.

 

I think my beard hair might not be ideal for my situation because of the very big difference between my scalp characteristics and my donor characteristics. It is something that I will have to ask. Are any of the options I listed renowned or have notable skill in using beard hair?

Also I will never know until I get my beard checked, when I first posted photos of my donor asking opinions on it everyone was telling me that it had fantastic characteristics such as high density, coarse hair and numerous other factors. I even had my scalp examined under a microscope and they told me I had a large amount of triples compared to the average person.

Now that my result is less than stellar, other people have come out and said I probably have DUPA and that my donor was below average and quite poor. Who knows if this could also apply to my beard and it could be very below average as well.

I generally doubt that this is the case. I imagine H&W could be liable to some form of negligence in their duty if they saw a potential sickness/illness arise that could compromise the surgery and continued anyway. Correct me if I'm wrong on this.

Also if this is the case I would of been lied too which isn't ethical in anyway.

This is true and is a saving grace, but most of these people come from stories where they made foolish ill thought-out decisions at the beginning, and they come back with the right research, planning and selection. I am stumped on where to move forward considering the universal conclusion is that I did everything right since the very start.

 

 

 

as you know,absolutely NOTHING can 100% guarantee a successful surgical result. All you can do is try your best. 

You did your best researching and planning. Things did not work out but you can hold your head high that you crossed all the Ts and dotted all the Is and made a very informed decision, which as a patient is all you can do. 

I would say before you commit to another full blown procedure, who ever you select for the next surgery do a test run with 300-500 grafts. See how they take. Then plan on a larger procedure. 

[mister_25]

On 9/10/2023 at 4:16 AM, shiba1985 said:

 

as you know,absolutely NOTHING can 100% guarantee a successful surgical result. All you can do is try your best. 

You did your best researching and planning. Things did not work out but you can hold your head high that you crossed all the Ts and dotted all the Is and made a very informed decision, which as a patient is all you can do. 

I would say before you commit to another full blown procedure, who ever you select for the next surgery do a test run with 300-500 grafts. See how they take. Then plan on a larger procedure. 

I do not think getting a test procedure of 300-500 grafts is a option, the surgeons I am interested in charge per session so I would be paying something like 60$ per graft. At the end of the day, I am 23 years old with the resources of a 23 year old. What your asking is unreasonable and will never be achievable for me.

I keep hearing the “you did everything right and as a patient made a fully informed and correct decision” arguement here, but what does that mean for my case exactly? That no matter what and that even if I selected any other surgeon that my results were destined to be poor? Is that what is being implied here?

To be honest, this comment and many others like it just make me feel worse about myself. I honestly feel like I could of gotten a similar result for a fraction of the price at a hairmill, but I paid a premium for a feeling of security in my choice which completely backfired.

A small update here, I had to attend a sudden funeral and a hat wasn’t a option, I also didn’t have fibres yet. I received two comments from people that haven’t seen me in years that something was wrong with my head. Very embarrassed and ashamed of myself.

I am also losing confidence in the advice/input I am receiving here and from elsewhere. Here are the direct contradictions that I will point out.

1. Mixed comments on the state of my donor, I have been told by one group of people that my donor hair is fantastic, above average and will accomodate all my needs and future loss. On the other hand on a previously deleted thread, I was told that I have DUPA and should never of had a transplant to begin with.
2. A poster here implied that my tonsillitis could of had realistically a massive effect on my yield, which implies that Dr Hasson was negligent and lied to me saying it would have no impact on the surgery. 
3. Mixed Comments in the actual result of my hair transplant, people are saying it’s natural but if people in real life can point out that something is wrong is it really natural?
4. Constant back and forwards of people saying my expectations were delusional and reasonable.

Please give me advice on what to do. These contradictions are overwhelming and have left me lost. I have no confidence in my ability to research myself because my choice and selection has placed me through a painful ordeal with a result that has left myself and others questioning. 

How do I turn this around to meet my goals?

Also does anyone know how to contact Dr Ferreira?

Edited September 18, 2023 by mister_25

[shiba1985]

34 minutes ago, mister_25 said:

I do not think getting a test procedure of 300-500 grafts is a option, the surgeons I am interested in charge per session so I would be paying something like 60$ per graft. At the end of the day, I am 23 years old with the resources of a 23 year old. What your asking is unreasonable and will never be achievable for me.

I keep hearing the “you did everything right and as a patient made a fully informed and correct decision” arguement here, but what does that mean for my case exactly? That no matter what and that even if I selected any other surgeon that my results were destined to be poor? Is that what is being implied here?

To be honest, this comment and many others like it just make me feel worse about myself. I honestly feel like I could of gotten a similar result for a fraction of the price at a hairmill, but I paid a premium for a feeling of security in my choice which completely backfired.

A small update here, I had to attend a sudden funeral and a hat wasn’t a option, I also didn’t have fibres yet. I received two comments from people that haven’t seen me in years that something was wrong with my head. Very embarrassed and ashamed of myself.

I am also losing confidence in the advice/input I am receiving here and from elsewhere. Here are the direct contradictions that I will point out.

1. Mixed comments on the state of my donor, I have been told by one group of people that my donor hair is fantastic, above average and will accomodate all my needs and future loss. On the other hand on a previously deleted thread, I was told that I have DUPA and should never of had a transplant to begin with.
2. A poster here implied that my tonsillitis could of had realistically a massive effect on my yield, which implies that Dr Hasson was negligent and lied to me saying it would have no impact on the surgery. 
3. Mixed Comments in the actual result of my hair transplant, people are saying it’s natural but if people in real life can point out that something is wrong is it really natural?
4. Constant back and forwards of people saying my expectations were delusional and reasonable.

Please give me advice on what to do. These contradictions are overwhelming and have left me lost. I have no confidence in my ability to research myself because my choice and selection has placed me through a painful ordeal with a result that has left myself and others questioning. 

How do I turn this around to meet my goals?

Also does anyone know how to contact Dr Ferreira?

hey, 

I am busy so can’t reply in detail but my intention was not to make u feel bad. I meant to say it wasn’t your fault at all, and if I was in your shoes would have done everything u did. So no. Nothing u did was wrong. 

[Tiger2050]

I think Melvin and Shiba made some great points. The poor growth is unlikely due to a botched procedure by Dr. Hasson and is more likely attributable to an underlying health condition or simply slow growth. I would recommend waiting a few more months and working with Dr. Hasson to figure out what went wrong. I don’t think switching surgeons is going to help much.

 

I don't like that Dr. Hasson operated on you in the first place considering your age. You listed some good alternative docs however Pinto and Bisanaga are very ethical and rarely accept young patients. There is also a Ferriera case with poor growth on this forum. Surgery is a risk and nothing is 100% guaranteed, no matter how much research you do. If you dig deep enough you'll find some poor cases from every doc.

Edited September 18, 2023 by Tiger2050

[jjalay]

Can you post a picture of the actual stand of your donor area?

[HappyMan2021]

I am no expert but i do not think tonsillitis had an effect on outcome

I had a HT when I was symptomatic and testing positive for covid, and there was no effect. 

You keep emphasizing how much research you did, while research reduces risk it does not guarantee a good result

Alot of it is random unfortunately. There are a lot of uneducated ppl out there who blindly follow ht influencer advice, go to turkey and get a cheap ht, and actually get good results. 

There is always an element of chance/risk with hair transplants

I would actually say all your emotions are completely normal. The hair transplant industry does not have a good reputation, and one of the significant factors in that is that there are NO guarantees

Im also surprised ppl are noticing your hair in its current state. I wonder how it looks buzzed down. If a buzz cut or shorter style is acceptable to you at least until your next HT, maybe do that and it will alleviate a lot of your distress

My advice to you is to be patient and keep doing consults with other doctors. This journey is a marathon, not a sprint. 

You were really young to get a HT in the first place. I think you were always destined for multiple HTs, and this is just how it plays out

[stephcurry30]

On 9/8/2023 at 5:01 AM, mister_25 said:

I did not say they are giving a refund, but a refund is on table if the areas do not have growth. Here is what they said word for word.

"Dr. Hasson stands behind his work so if after a year there is an area that has not regrown he would either replace those grafts for free or refund your money for those grafts."

The thing is, I did my research obsessively and followed specifically Melvin's and Gatsby's cases and advice to avoid the same pitfalls they had so that I can have my hair when I was young like I am now. However, it doesn't matter how much research I put in or if I did everything right because I still fell in those exact same pitfalls regardless.

It was implied by Doug from H&W in a previous email that a person of my retrograde alopecia severity probably/is estimated to have a total of 5500-6500 Grafts in their donor. Which would mean that my donor reserves equal out about 1628 at its lowest, to 2628 at its highest. Which is either half of the amount that Doug said I would need to restore my hair following this outcome, or mildly less than the requirement to restore my hair following this outcome. I believe that I probably have enough donor to meet my original expectations, but the issue arises on how well the yield will go the second time around.

When everyone tells me "I did nothing wrong and nobody can fault me or my methods" its puts me in a loop because it makes me feel like any other follow up choice I am going to make will merit the same results, which I am destined to be unhappy with.

Another thing that wasn't stated is not only can they not refund me the "emotion, time and energy" that I had to go through but they can't refund the potential grafts that were burned through the procedure, which equates to the final long term result for both your donor preservation and your hair on your head. that's is what is really bothering me.

I really don't want to come across as someone begging for pity, But I do want to show that for just as much as a good result can change your life for the better with restored confidence, a result your unhappy with has the opposite effect and makes you have doubt in yourself and reinforces the insecurity to some degree. 

OP This is complete BS. Looking at the placement of grafts of your post op, the clinic 100% made mistakes in graft angulation and graft placement. If you take a look at the photo below. The crown area circled in blue shows grafts being placed in rows and not around native hair. There are CLEARLY visible bald spots where grafts should of been placed but weren't. And then here are more dense areas (right side of the blue circle) where it seems like too many grafts were placed with the native hair. If you also take a look at the before photos of OP the biggest bald spot in the crown was the center not the outsides. So why were more grafts placed on the out skits than the center? 

The other issue is the angulation. I recently had an operation with Dr. Konior and one thing that we talked about was angulation and why it's so important (via email and in person (twice) for about an hour each time). A friend of mine had a transplant in turkey and when he came back it looked so UNNATURAL. Why? Angulation. During our post op consultation Dr Konior legitimately said something along the lines of "angulation is extremely important and has a huge impact on the illusion of density." If a patient has a large balding spot the grafts need to be placed closer to 15 to 35% from the scalp to give the illusion of a full head of hair. The reason for this is because the grafts will then lay down on the scalp and cover your scalp. This is what SKILLED surgeons are supposed to do when there is a patient with a high Norwood scale. If grafts aren't placed within these angles and they are placed perpendicular to the scalp you can NEVER have the illusion of density and this is what also cause the see through effect. If you take a look at the hairline sots you can CLEARLY see grafts sticking straight up in the air which allows people to see more of the scalp and gives the see through effect. This is CONCLUSIVE of a poor surgical result and planning by H&W. Paying top dollar for this is blasphemy. OP should 100% be refunded his money solely based on the fact that a) a large number of grafts were burned and b) surgical planning was awful. Angulation is off, graft placement is off (not placed in correct locations), planed in rows, etc. 

Blaming a patient for a poor result should be the last option if they did something wrong in the post op but if you look at the top of the list and ask why a result was poor. The first thing you need to note is the design, surgical planning, and angulation. And looking at the post op photos plenty of mistakes were made. 

 

"Another thing that wasn't stated is not only can they not refund me the "emotion, time and energy" that I had to go through but they can't refund the potential grafts that were burned through the procedure, which equates to the final long term result for both your donor preservation and your hair on your head. that's is what is really bothering me."

 

 

[shiba1985]

53 minutes ago, Tiger2050 said:

I think Melvin and Shiba made some great points. The poor growth is unlikely due to a botched procedure by Dr. Hasson and is more likely attributable to an underlying health condition or simply slow growth. I would recommend waiting a few more months and working with Dr. Hasson to figure out what went wrong. I don’t think switching surgeons is going to help.

I am not saying that at all. 

[stephcurry30]

On 9/8/2023 at 11:42 PM, mister_25 said:

I don't think I would get a FUT or a procedure from Dr Wong. 

I was told originally that I have enough donor supply where FUE is more than enough, If I had to have FUE and FUT Scars and still face the prospect/possibility of poor yield, I would be deeply unhappy. 

As for Dr Wong. I am not a fan of the rows as many people have brought up, mainly because I wanted the possibility of having a shaved head in the future without things looking unnatural or being a standout feature. Also there was a recent case of a pretty horrible FUT Scar from Dr Wong that shakes my confidence in this option.

Completely agree here. I wouldn't advice going to Wong as well solely based on the fact that you've stated that shaving your head might be the way to go if your HT's are failures. And Wong places his grafts in rows and columns. Would stick out like a sore thumb if you ended up buzzing or shaving your head. 

[Tiger2050]

19 minutes ago, shiba1985 said:

I am not saying that at all. 

You suggested a small test surgery to rule out any underlying medical issues and I think it's a good idea. A good doc would probably ask mister_25 to go see a dermatologist and runs some tests before attempting  another surgery. 

Edited September 18, 2023 by Tiger2050

[stephcurry30]

I know I already got a warning from Melvin regarding critiquing the surgical planning from another patient/thread of H&W but this time it's different. This is closer to the final outcome and OP is searching for answers and lost as to why his result are so bad. We need to give him all the information possible to make a decision. I myself know I would want the truth (this is the truth from my years of watching HT videos and researching the design). 

My responses are 100% honest and do not lash out personally at H&W I am just looking at the photos that the clinic/patient themselves have placed in the thread and analyzing it and critiquing it. 

I considered myself a perfectionist and even before my surgery with Dr. Konior we discussed for an hour plus about importance of angulation, direction, illusion of density, etc. And look at the post OP photos this doesn't look like it met the standards that H&W have placed on themselves as a top clinic. OP is right he could of gone to another clinic and got a similar result for a fraction of the cost. 

There is a reason why people pay top dollar and it's to get the most natural result with highest success rate. It doesn't seem like this is what happened here. If clinics are paring amounts similar to a brand new car patients should at least have top tier surgical planning with correct angulation, direction, and design/planning. 

 

[GoliGoliGoli]

2 hours ago, mister_25 said:

 

1. Mixed comments on the state of my donor, I have been told by one group of people that my donor hair is fantastic, above average and will accomodate all my needs and future loss. On the other hand on a previously deleted thread, I was told that I have DUPA and should never of had a transplant to begin with.

I hesitate to say this, but something I've noticed on this forum is that people tend to "err on the side of optimism" when it comes to stuff like this. If people say you have an above average donor, that likely means you have an average donor. If people say you have an average donor, that likely means you have a sub-average donor. "Donor" of course doesn't just mean the amount of grafts available, it also means the caliber of the grafts, # of hairs per graft, ect 

This isn't to imply you did anything wrong. This doesn't mean you aren't a candidate for HT. But I do worry that this forum sometimes creates a false hope for people when it should be a bit more discerning. 

That isn't to say HW did everything right. I'm not smart enough on HT's to really get into the fine details the way some are. But to be honest I don't think the people who told you you have an above average or fantastic donor are correct at all. 

[stephcurry30]

OP can you provide a more recent photo of your crown? I want to make sure my analysis is somewhat accurate.  

I also should of PREFACED saying that these are just my opinions and just posting this to give OP some sense of direction and opinion from somewhat else. I am not an expert and don't claim to be one, I am just putting my thoughts and knowledge out there to start a discussion on the surgical planning because I personally think there could of been better and if it was better would Op be more satisficed with the result?

Going forward OP I would honestly have ion person consultations with other surgeons. Seems like you're locate in canada? Go to Rahal and get his opinion. Maybe on your next vacation plan a trip to Chicago and stop by Konior/Nadimi or Panine's clinics and get an honest in person evaluation. Maybe you and your family/friend want to travel to Turkey. Go to some of the top recommended clinics listed on here while having fun and traveling. I know OP mentioned he has the resources of a 23 year old but I'm hoping he can at least make a few trips to a few clinics to get different opinions. 

If there is one person I would highly advise OP to see would be Shapiro. He is one of the top doctors in the world and located pretty close to Canada (In Minnesota) He has written numerous publications and is one of if not the most knowledgeable doctor's out there. 

There is no quick fix to this. Come prepared to these consults with all the photos in the thread. Ask the other clinics about the surgical design, grafts left, donor density. etc. You need to make a calculated decision/risk going forward. And we will be here to help you give additional advise and direction but AGAIN we are not professionals. Seek multiple opinions form multiple doctors and ask them about these things I touched upon:

Angulation of grafts, illusion of density, planting in rows and columns within native hair, direction of hair. BE extremely detailed. 

[stephcurry30]

7 minutes ago, Tiger2050 said:

Not defending Dr. Hasson but it’s impossible to see the angle of grafts from one pic that shows blurry red dots.

Completely agree. Which is why I asked to see another more recent photo. But judging based on how the grafts were placed at the hairline, these grafts were also probably placed a similar way. 90 degrees from the scalp. Even the grafts at the hairline should be at MAX 35-45 degrees from the scalp. I have had this discussion and confirmation with numerous top surgeons during all my consultations.