Do I need 2500 grafts or less to lower my hairline and temples ?

[Natoe]

Hello everyone,

I am 27 and I've always had redecing temples. I remember a girl telling me "you're going to be bald sooner or later" when I was 16. Well thanks for the compliment..

Actually I am 27 and I am not bald (yet ? 😶) but I think my redecing temples are a bit worse, but it is really slow and I didn't really notice. I just knew I had a a bad hairline ahah

Of course I always hated my hair. Quite thin and hard to style.

But recently I stumbled upon some hair transplants posts I told me "of course that's what I need!". I though that was only when I will be completly bald, but it can help lowering my hairline and temples too.

So I searched the internet a bit. I found 2 clinics in Paris where I live. The first surgeon told me that he won't lower my hairline because I was too young, but only my temples for 1500 grafts.

The second one told me he could lower my hairline for 2500 grafts. He drew 2 lines on my forehead, one for 2000 grafts (red line) to show what it would look like and one for 2500 grafts (blue). I redrew both line on paint to show you 😅

 

But since then I started to think about all of this... do I really need 2500 grafts for the area he drew? Because I started comparing myself to other hair transplants before and after here and there, and sometimes it is close to me and that was 1800 grafts needed for them, sometimes more... I really don't know.

The crown seems ok to both.

 

I give you more of my pics for a better opinion on my case. (more pics is better ahah) 

 

And my donor also concerns me. I really like to keep it short on the sides, will be able to do it even a year after fue?

 

That's a lot a pictures but I think it is better than not enough.

I am sure you can hear my french accent from across your computer screen ahah, but it is the best forum for hair transplants I think.

 

Oh here is a picture when I was 16 and another one when I was 19! I had a little bit more hair on my temples, what do you think ? ahah

Well I hope some people are going to make it this far to help me.

Thank you a lot in advance!

 

[Britanium]

Welcome 🤗 

Thanks for posting a detailed account of your hair loss. And the pics really help ! We don’t see many results coming from France here. But you do have some really good options you could consider in Spain, Belgium and Portugal. Definitely worth consulting with some of the top European options. 
Looking at your pics I would say that 2500 or maybe a little more is going to be needed. 
Also have you thought of the usual Fin/Minox combo ? At present your still young and have a fair amount of loss. It will continue unless you consider meds. 

[JDEE0]

Looks like your hair-loss isn't super aggressive, but you are young and it did have an early onset of progression, so it will continue to happen (most likely increasingly slowly as you age for the most part). As a result, you really should look into medications to prevent further loss and hold onto what you have currently if you're going to get a HT.

Don't go to any surgeon in Paris or even the whole of France for that matter, instead have a look at this list, I would personally go for any of the doctors listed in Spain, Portugal or Belgium and avoid the cheaper options below 2.5 EUR per graft: 

I don't like the designs that have been drawn on you as your temple peaks/points have receded heavily (the triangular shapes that slope down from either side of the hairline towards the eye and then curve into the sideburns) and I really think they need to be rebuilt at least somewhat for your case. Will look a bit strange if they're not IMO. I think around about the 3000 graft mark, give or take a few hundred depending on the design, will sort you out.

[Britanium]

Agreed with @JDEE0the graft count is going to be 2.5k plus. Maybe your quotes would come in anywhere between 2.5 - 3k approx.

 

[digi23]

1 hour ago, Natoe said:

Hello everyone,

I am 27 and I've always had redecing temples. I remember a girl telling me "you're going to be bald sooner or later" when I was 16. Well thanks for the compliment..

Actually I am 27 and I am not bald (yet ? 😶) but I think my redecing temples are a bit worse, but it is really slow and I didn't really notice. I just knew I had a a bad hairline ahah

Of course I always hated my hair. Quite thin and hard to style.

But recently I stumbled upon some hair transplants posts I told me "of course that's what I need!". I though that was only when I will be completly bald, but it can help lowering my hairline and temples too.

So I searched the internet a bit. I found 2 clinics in Paris where I live. The first surgeon told me that he won't lower my hairline because I was too young, but only my temples for 1500 grafts.

The second one told me he could lower my hairline for 2500 grafts. He drew 2 lines on my forehead, one for 2000 grafts (red line) to show what it would look like and one for 2500 grafts (blue). I redrew both line on paint to show you 😅

 

But since then I started to think about all of this... do I really need 2500 grafts for the area he drew? Because I started comparing myself to other hair transplants before and after here and there, and sometimes it is close to me and that was 1800 grafts needed for them, sometimes more... I really don't know.

The crown seems ok to both.

 

I give you more of my pics for a better opinion on my case. (more pics is better ahah) 

 

And my donor also concerns me. I really like to keep it short on the sides, will be able to do it even a year after fue?

 

That's a lot a pictures but I think it is better than not enough.

I am sure you can hear my french accent from across your computer screen ahah, but it is the best forum for hair transplants I think.

 

Oh here is a picture when I was 16 and another one when I was 19! I had a little bit more hair on my temples, what do you think ? ahah

Well I hope some people are going to make it this far to help me.

Thank you a lot in advance!

 

You will need maybe 3000 grafts. Also maybe temple peaks because they have receded, so they are basically non-existant at the moment. It can do alot for the appereance, but need a great Dr since they are one of the most difficult to get right.

You have some of the best Drs in the world close to where you are located in Dr Patrick Mwamba, Dr Christian Bisanga and Dr Bijan Feriduni, all three in Belgium.

Edited November 6, 2021 by digi23

[Berba11]

2,500-3,000 sounds reasonable if - and it's great big IF - you a) go to the right doctor (ie, not one in France) and b) you try to preserve that forelock and the rest of your hair on finasteride.

As other's have said, you may also benefit from the temple peaks being restored or at least touched up a bit to strengthen them.

3,000 grafts can go a really long way. My favourite example of this is this tremendous result for Anil at Eugenix: 

I have extremely similar loss in terms of amount and shape in the frontal third so I love this result because it so closely resembles what I'm hoping for myself in a few weeks time. So 3,000 grafts in the right hands for you might well be fine.

I'd also agree with others that I'm not keen on the design offered to you by the clinic. It looks too much like the sort of stock hairline template that most of the crap & cheap Turkish clinics give every guy that comes through the door.

 

[Natoe]

Thanks a lot for your answers.

Yes I think the temples peaks may need some grafts too. They go a bit too far. I guess you're talking about the red area on this picture of me:

They indeed didn't cover that area.. I suppose it was only a quick skectch they made on my forehead... I hope so though ahah

When I searched for "best clinics in paris" (in french though ahah), I found this clinic amongs others.

But when I try to search in english, I don't find it ahahah

Go figure ahah

 

The fact that they could find me a date for the operation quickly (2-3 weeks) is a big no-no or it doesn't matter?

[Britanium]

With the options available to you in Spain, Portugal and Belgium no way would I be even considering a unknown in France. 
And yes it’s a massive red flag 🚩 decent Clinics are booked up quite far in advance. Ok so cancellations are always a possibility.. but being available tomorrow/next couple of week ? Noooope.

Edited November 6, 2021 by JC71

[Britanium]

Please don’t rely on online “best clinics” searches 😔 come here and look at real results from the decent clinics that have proved themselves on a consistent basis. 
 

Edited November 6, 2021 by JC71

[JDEE0]

45 minutes ago, Natoe said:

Thanks a lot for your answers.

Yes I think the temples peaks may need some grafts too. They go a bit too far. I guess you're talking about the red area on this picture of me:

They indeed didn't cover that area.. I suppose it was only a quick skectch they made on my forehead... I hope so though ahah

When I searched for "best clinics in paris" (in french though ahah), I found this clinic amongs others.

But when I try to search in english, I don't find it ahahah

Go figure ahah

 

The fact that they could find me a date for the operation quickly (2-3 weeks) is a big no-no or it doesn't matter?

Look through the table I linked you, whatever clinic it is you're considering in France, they're not going to be very good and are probably going to be no cheaper than many of the choices in the table. All of those have been carefully selected and agreed by upon by people here who have done lots of research as a summary of some of the best HT surgeons in the world.

[Natoe]

Thank you very much, I will search into the table. It's a pity there are none in france though 🤔

 

[Britanium]

5 minutes ago, Natoe said:

Thank you very much, I will search into the table. It's a pity there are none in france though 🤔

 

I’m also a member of a Italian forum and don’t see any French clinics being recommended there either. Sometimes it’s the language that stops people posting here. But other times it’s just because the clinics just are not that good. 

Edited November 6, 2021 by JC71

[Natoe]

Should I try minox until a HT? And/or fin? 

Even though I heard there are some quite sides effect on fin.. (I guess you hear people say that a lot ahah). No alternatives?

[Britanium]

Fin and Minox should be tried at least, after consulting with either your own Dr and/or a Dermatologist. Oral or topical can be considered as to helping keep and maintain your existing hair. And you so much to save ! If you get the sides then you can stop. Everyone is different. 

[Natoe]

2 minutes ago, JC71 said:

I’m also a member of a Italian forum and don’t see any French clinics being recommended there either. Sometimes it’s the language that stops people posting here. But other times it’s just because the clinics just are not that good. 

ahah that's what I thought, no enough french speak english good enough to tell others about good doctors in France 😅

 

[Natoe]

Just now, JC71 said:

Fin and Minox should be tried at least, after consulting with either your own Dr and/or a Dermatologist. Oral or topical can be considered as to helping keep and maintain your existing hair. And you so much to save ! If you get the sides then you can stop. Everyone is different. 

Thanks, I will try that

[Britanium]

Just now, Natoe said:

ahah that's what I thought, no enough french speak english good enough to tell others about good doctors in France 😅

 

Did you try any French forums before joining here ? I wouldn’t say they would all be awful but it’s a possibility none are world class. Here in the Uk i wouldn’t say we have the best Drs in the world, same for Australia. 

[Natoe]

3 minutes ago, JC71 said:

Did you try any French forums before joining here ? I wouldn’t say they would all be awful but it’s a possibility none are world class. Here in the Uk i wouldn’t say we have the best Drs in the world, same for Australia. 

There are not really active forums like english ones ahah

[Gatsby]

@NatoeI would seriously consider speaking with your doctor (because I am not a doctor) and look at commencing finsteride and minoxidil. With the amount of hair you still have I would definitely be giving both drugs at least 6 months (preferably 12) to see what benefits you will be able to achieve from medication alone. You can still look at consultations with recommended surgeons that the forum lists. You have a lot of hair to keep and if you spend your time doing your research and asking lots of questions you have the makings for a great result! All the best!

[Natoe]

34 minutes ago, Gatsby said:

@NatoeI would seriously consider speaking with your doctor (because I am not a doctor) and look at commencing finsteride and minoxidil. With the amount of hair you still have I would definitely be giving both drugs at least 6 months (preferably 12) to see what benefits you will be able to achieve from medication alone. You can still look at consultations with recommended surgeons that the forum lists. You have a lot of hair to keep and if you spend your time doing your research and asking lots of questions you have the makings for a great result! All the best!

I will do this, no need to rush things I may regret. Thanks a lot!

[Berba11]

41 minutes ago, Natoe said:

I will do this, no need to rush things I may regret. Thanks a lot!

Definitely take your time!

Regarding finasteride/minoxidil... My best advice would be to start on one first, and then add the other 4/5/6 months down the line (or longer), rather than jump on both at the same time. Ideally ignore minox for now and start off with finasteride. The reason being is that if you jump on both and see progress, you won't really know which is doing the heavy lifting. It may be that the minoxidil isn't doing much for you, but you're spending money on it and going through the hassle of applying it twice daily pointlessly. Equally, you may notice some side effects but won't know which is causing the issue (unless it's sexual side effects in which case it'll obviously be the finasteride). And then finally - and this is more of a personal hang-up... I'd rather be on as little stuff as possible, and maintaining multiple topical/oral interventions is harder than maintaining just one.

So start off on finasteride. Maybe keep the dosage lower, such as 1mg 3 or 4 times per week, or 0.5mg daily (which is what I do) and see how you get on. Any bad sides will show up reasonably soon in all likelihood so if you get them you'll know early doors. If you want to up the dosage later to 1mg per day you can. If you come through without sides (which you likely will!), stick to it for half a year and if you want to introduce minox then you'll be in a good place to do so. It's a tried and trusted combo, but be scientific about it rather than just jump on both right away and not really know what is doing what.

Finally! Knowing that you can tolerant Fin is going to be important if you decide to have a transplant as you'll have a strategy to retain your native hair. You'll want to work that out before hand. Minoxidil can take a while to work, will leave you shedding in the early stages and you'll have to stop taking it before your HT anyway. For me it's very much a secondary option - finasteride is more critical but whatever you decide to do, remember that surgery is the very last resort!

[Natoe]

35 minutes ago, Berba11 said:

Definitely take your time!

Regarding finasteride/minoxidil... My best advice would be to start on one first, and then add the other 4/5/6 months down the line (or longer), rather than jump on both at the same time. Ideally ignore minox for now and start off with finasteride. The reason being is that if you jump on both and see progress, you won't really know which is doing the heavy lifting. It may be that the minoxidil isn't doing much for you, but you're spending money on it and going through the hassle of applying it twice daily pointlessly. Equally, you may notice some side effects but won't know which is causing the issue (unless it's sexual side effects in which case it'll obviously be the finasteride). And then finally - and this is more of a personal hang-up... I'd rather be on as little stuff as possible, and maintaining multiple topical/oral interventions is harder than maintaining just one.

So start off on finasteride. Maybe keep the dosage lower, such as 1mg 3 or 4 times per week, or 0.5mg daily (which is what I do) and see how you get on. Any bad sides will show up reasonably soon in all likelihood so if you get them you'll know early doors. If you want to up the dosage later to 1mg per day you can. If you come through without sides (which you likely will!), stick to it for half a year and if you want to introduce minox then you'll be in a good place to do so. It's a tried and trusted combo, but be scientific about it rather than just jump on both right away and not really know what is doing what.

Finally! Knowing that you can tolerant Fin is going to be important if you decide to have a transplant as you'll have a strategy to retain your native hair. You'll want to work that out before hand. Minoxidil can take a while to work, will leave you shedding in the early stages and you'll have to stop taking it before your HT anyway. For me it's very much a secondary option - finasteride is more critical but whatever you decide to do, remember that surgery is the very last resort!

Thank you very much. I'm really going to think it over. Good strategy to start by one ahah

[Spaceguy]

Density depends on your hair thickness, colour and skin colour but in general count it as you need 40-60 grafts per cm2....45-50 grafts on average per cm2.

Measure surface of your bald area (cm2) that ypu want to fill, add some extra for going deeper into existing hair and multiply it with ~50 grafts.

But as others said from the pics seems it's 2500+ needed