Dr.Cole and ethics ?

[felixthecat]

from time to time - and on several different forums - i come across posts about Dr.Coles "ethics" .

none of these posts seem to be very specific , and i'm finding it impossible to find out what the issues are that everybody else seems to so wary of .

this is making me doubt cole .

can anybody here enlighten me about any issues that i should be aware of concerning this matter ?

i really dont want to do something that i may regret because of knowledge that i'm missing about Dr.Cole .

any help would be very much appreciated .

many thanks ,

felix the cat

[felixthecat]

from time to time - and on several different forums - i come across posts about Dr.Coles "ethics" .

none of these posts seem to be very specific , and i'm finding it impossible to find out what the issues are that everybody else seems to so wary of .

this is making me doubt cole .

can anybody here enlighten me about any issues that i should be aware of concerning this matter ?

i really dont want to do something that i may regret because of knowledge that i'm missing about Dr.Cole .

any help would be very much appreciated .

many thanks ,

felix the cat

[thanatopsis_awry]

http://www.hairrestorationnetwork.com/eve/showthread.php?t=154923

 

Very recent thread talking about pretty much the same thing; that aside, from (credible) sources I've heard Cole has had quite a few "unsatisfied" patients; behind closed doors. But, that link above goes into some fact-based issues that are 100% public knowledge, which people have concerning Cole.

[felixthecat]

i've read that thread previously - but its still not clear to me what the size of his punches and lawsuits against former employees have to do with "ethics" .

if you read dr.coles website he clearly states that he uses both 1mm and smaller punches , personalised to each patient .

and having lawsuits with former employees is neither unusual (in any business) nor a matter of ethics .

as for unsatisfied patients , after 2 years of scouring the net i cant find a single case of this .

surely an "ethical" issue would be performing 4000+ grafts on the hairlines of guys in their 20's who dont need a hair transplant in the first place (like a certain well know italian-sounding doctor)??

dont get me wrong - i'm certainly not here to defend dr.cole .

i'm just trying to find out concrete evidence of his questionable ethics .

[Bill - Seemiller]

Felix,

 

Welcome to our forum community.

 

Our legal consul has advised us, as the publishers of this community, to limit any mention of Dr. John Cole publicly due to previous legal threats.

 

However, his patients are free to detail their actual experiences and results on our forum. Unfortunately some of these patients have not felt comfortable or secure in posting critical comments publicly.

 

See also what Pat, our Publisher said about Dr. Cole on this thread.

 

Bill

[thanatopsis_awry]

A few things, which really concern a larger picture of what "ethics" means in a case like this:

 

The lawsuits and threats is suspicious to me especialy as it relates to a larger campaign in masking posts that are contrary to Cole's views. As far as I know, something like this isn't heard of w/ Feller, H&W, Shapiro, Alexander, et. al. This would be one deterrent to me, as I think it raises larger questions of charachter, which relate to perhaps the most important thing about a doctors judgement: "is this doctor 100%, no doubts about it, going to be operating for my best interest, and my best interest alone".

 

Using larger punches, which Cole does, while "easier on the doc and the staff", may very well promote excessive "subcutaneous scarring and potential damage to adjacent follicles....the larger the punch = more scarring and greater potential for damage".

 

This would be another deterrent for me. No doubt some people trust Cole's judgement and go to him.

 

Combine this with other shady, albeit unclear stuff, about Dr. Cole and I would not risk it, when I find there to be better options out there all things considered. I don't have, and don't beleive there to be a wealth of lucid, damning evidence against Cole's "ethics" and his practice; however, compared to the other choices that exist, I personally would not go to Cole. Again, this isn't to say I couldn't or wouldn't receive a great HT from him -- it's a judgement call that one has to make after gathering all of the info on a doc and comparing it to all the info on another, and deciding who you feel the most comfortable and confident with.

[felixthecat]

thanks for your replies guys .

i appreciate your thoughts and advice .

however , for pat to say that there are issues that he knows of regarding dr.cole that havent yet been made public on the forums - and then not back up this statement with any facts whatsoever - is less than helpful .

anybody could say this about any one of the doctors mentioned on here , and unless they elaborate on the topic its ultimately pure conjecture .

i'm not suggesting that he doesnt have this information , but what i would like to know is exactly what is it , and why hasnt it been mentioned on any forums ?

[Bill - Seemiller]

felix,

 

If you read the first part of my message, you will know why Pat didn't give specifics.

 

Bill

[felixthecat]

i read every part of your message .

it still doesnt alter the fact that to say such a thing on a public forum , and then not give any specifics whatsoever is not helpful .

if your lawyers advise you not to discuss dr.cole , you should delete posts such as that of pats that allure to some shortcomings in his abilities and/or ethics .

i cant be the only person ever to have read that post to have asked for more details , surely .

[kriss]

Felix, I've been trying tosort htrough the sam estuff. I've tried to get more info from these guys off the site, but they won't discuss it there either. Even gave them my phone number, or offered to call them if they gave me their phone. No response.

 

Another hair loss forum said that one reason this forum responsds in this matter to Cole is due to Cole not paying to be a sponsor of this site.

 

I'm wondering what to make of all these web forums. Can you actually get credible information here? Are the only DRs talked about and endorsed on these sites the ones who pay to sponsor these sites?

 

These sites cost alot of money to run, somebody has to pay for it. Are there plenty of good HT DRs out there that you don't hear about on these sites?

[the B spot]

Kriss, you can go to two other sites that are supported by Dr. Cole and get an overwhelming response to your questions about Dr. Cole.

 

They will give you all of the postive information they have available, and then some.

 

Unforntunately, this site does not offer or have a large Dr. Cole patient base.

 

In addition, there is legal history between this site and Dr. Cole. (I am showing my forum age, aren't I? )and part of what your asking for just isn't available, from what I understand.

 

So, again, I am really trying to help you out here (Felix as well) by stating that you should see several patients before you make a decision.

 

Do your homework---and then go forward--see some patients and talk to some patients.

 

Take Care,

Jason

[scalpman100]

this is my first post on this site but I just had to respond to this Dr Cole thread as it personally affects me.

 

firstly, I'd like to say that I think this site is excellent and it saved me from being butchered by an awful hair transplant surgeon. I think Pat and Bill do an excellent job.

 

However, I just don't understand the Dr Cole thing either. I have had many consultations and Dr Cole was by far the best.Since then I have researched him in depth and his results seem awesome. I've read every post on all the forum sites and I couldn't find one unhappy patient. In fact there were dozens of happy patients. I have also seen Cole patients in person and they also looked great.

However, I am now reluctant to have surgery with Dr Cole because of this site. Basically you are highly critical of him without giving a reason.

 

If it is just about the punch issue then please let me know. I never buzz my hair past a 3 so it makes no difference to me what punch size he uses (unless ofcourse there are other punch size factors you know of?)

 

I'll trust your judgment as I believe this is an excellent site but I hope this is not about politics (B-spott mentioned you had prior history which I was not aware of. It's just I'd hate to be deprived of a great result because of a feud.

[frog]

there is a forum i found once that just slags him off all the time but i can't remeber which one it was. it had some possesed poster called techhair or something. the forum was a good one i thought with many bitter ht veterans all slagging off their poor work and exposing bad clinics. all for that!

[scalpman100]

Originally posted by frog:

there is a forum i found once that just slags him off all the time but i can't remeber which one it was. it had some possesed poster called techhair or something. the forum was a good one i thought with many bitter ht veterans all slagging off their poor work and exposing bad clinics. all for that!

 

I know the site you mean. I looked in to the posts in the archive but I could not find any substance in the criticisms. I'm pretty sure that the guy wasn't even a patient - correct me if I'm wrong.

i'm desperate to find out all the info on cole because he was at the top of my list

are there any question marks over his surgical skills? because thats all i really care about. what have you heard frog if you don't mind me asking?

[kriss]

I know the 2 sites that Cole sponsor, and of course they are pro-Cole. But there are 2 other sites that appear to be neutral, and they have good things only about Cole.

 

This is the only site I have been on that is critical of Cole. I spend 2 to 3 hours every night studying these forums.

 

I've tried several times to get Bill and others to correspond with me in private, off this site to explain the concerns with Cole, but all I get is the standard "do you homework".

 

Well asking you guys for advice is doing "my homework"

 

This is suppose to be a site for individuals to get info to make a sound choice for their hairloss needs. What you guys are doing is being vauge and confusing. You may think you giving us good advice, but you are not.

 

If this is a personal thing with Cole you should keep it between you and him. If you have good advice why we shouldn't use Cole, you should give us all the info you have in the proper venue. I gave you the opportunity to discuss these matters away from the public forum, but was ignore. I was left with trying to geuss what you was impling. That's not what I was expecting in this forum.

 

My thoughts, and frustrations. Picking a HT DR is a very agonizing process, you guys all know that.

[the B spot]

hairlossadvances is the site your looking for.

[Mike1651]

I'm an ex-patient of Dr. Cole & found him to be an extremely ethical man & excellent HT surgeon...he absolutely went out of his way to consult with me & satisfy my hairloss concerns...I've always been satisfied with the 2000 grafts that I received a few years ago...the issues that currently surround Dr. Cole seem to be cloaked in mystery...as I said, my experience was a good one!

 

Mike

[thanatopsis_awry]

B spot, *great* reference for someone to run a search on Cole and see open diologues about him -- good....and bad.

[Bill - Seemiller]

Felix,

 

You asked and I gave you an answer. Other members are also welcome to contribute their thoughts and opinions.

 

It is not up to me to convince you one way or another. But you've asked a question and I gave you what I can give you at this time.

 

If you are not satisfied, keep researching and read what other members are saying.

 

The only other thing I'll say about it is that regardless of the legal issues, what has been said to me in confidence offline is not my place to reveal online.

 

I have however, invited and encouraged these patients to come forward to share their experiences. But this is their choice, not mine.

 

Therefore, obviously, I am not going to remove posts that discuss Dr. Cole.

 

I am also not going to try to convince people not to go undergo surgery with Dr. Cole if their mind is set on him. If you have done extensive research and met with a number of his patients and are satisfied with what you see, by all means, feel free to proceed. But if you want my opinion, I'd suggest seeking elsewhere.

 

Whomever you have surgery with, I encourage you to post your experience and photos with us from start to finish. AND, I hope that whomever you select, that you do so with confidence based on research and knowledge and that you have a great experience.

 

At least you can walk away from this conversation knowing there is an ethical question though at this time, until patients come forward, you will have to accept the mystery.

 

Kriss,

 

Firstly, if we have been advised by our attorney to limit the mention of Dr. Cole online, it only makes sense to apply the same principle offline. I am not trying to be secretive. But the fact that you brought up publicly that you are trying to draw out information from me only confirms why I didn't tell you.

 

Per your other concern, credible and not so credible information can be found on any public discussion forum. In my opinion, the Hair Transplant Network and our discussion forum is an incredible resource for learning. But there is a certain amount of discretion one must have when reading posts.

 

Bill

[kriss]

B Spot, now why couldn't someone just posted that from the beginning. That satisifies all my curosity. There's always a way to get the message accross. That's all I was wanting.

 

Thansks

[felixthecat]

hey Bill ,

i understand your position perfectly , and thanks for the advice .

b spot - that link is extremely informative , and i'm guessing that it contains most of the issues that are mentioned here .

really guys - thanks again . this is where the forums such as this one are of invaluable help to guys like us .

i'll let you all know of my final decision , and will certainly post on the progress of my HT as it happens .

felix

[kriss]

Bill, anything we discuss in private would be kept private. My online comment was only stating that you would not discuss it with me privately.

[markcia]

I feel compelled to defend Dr.Cole on this thread.

In the spirit of full disclosure I've had 2 passes w/ Cole- 1250 on my 1st pass and 1000 on my 2nd pass.

What is this ethics issue and why won't anyone discuss it?

I worked due dilligence and didn't find any ethics issues.

Did everyone forget that Feller i'snt really even a Dr.

FYI, I met w/ Feller and liked him but feel Cole does much better work(I'm 20 min.away from Feller in Great Neck but flew to Atlanta for Cole).

When I was in the chair he was the most expensive guy in H/T..........his pricing seems to be getting more in line.

Cole's operation does have problems-his office mgr needs to be replaced,Dr. Mauwamba has moved back to europe to practice FIT and I hear Dr. Bridges is no longer there.

This is about as honsest as it gets but Im sure it will start a sh!t storm.

 

Yes I'm very happy w/ my results but they were slow.........7,8,9mo. before any cosmetic improvement.

[chucky]

Hi markcia

Do you have any pictures you could share with us.

[felixthecat]

hey markcia ,

it would be great to see your results .

and feller isnt a doctor ??