Blond

Hi Bike, If your script is for 1mg why don't you just cut the pill into 5 and then you'll have your 0.2 dose. Personally, I would leave the alcohol out. We don't know the effects of finasteride dissolved in alcohol, as it hasn't been studied. The half-life of a drug is the time it takes from when the drug enters your body until it reduces by half in its concentration through being metabolised. How long it remains intact in ethanol will be its shelf life. I’m not sure if anyone knows the shelf life for finasteride in alcohol but it will have one as everything eventually breaks down. What I do find interesting is that you can think yourself into having less DHT! I wonder if you can think yourself into having more DHT : )

I think your right. I'll just declare it and be done with it. Thanks!

I have just got a job in the NHS and have been given a 'declaration of health questionnaire' to complete. Do I have to declare that I take finasteride for hair loss? If it's on my medical records will they be able to access them and if I don't declare it will I get in trouble' Many thanks in advance,

'Just like you re-posted your last reply taking the emphasis off of the negaitive comments and changing the tone and reception of your points. Before that little alteration of wording it came across as being quite confrontational and negative, BUT, it now reads as being quite open and receptive' Agreed, that's why I edited it. I felt like a bit of an arsehole after reading it back to myself. I didn't feel it reflected what I truly felt as it was negative and you guys are just trying to help others. So I apologise. There's a difference between disease, and 'diseased'. It's all about semantics. If you say "Hey, that guy has a disease" then there's an element of mutual understanding going on there. If, on the other hand, you say "Hey, that guy's diseased!"... well, sounds kind of derogatory, doesn't it? Again I think you're refering back to the unedited version, I agree that it certainly has a more negative connotation (but at the time that was what I was going for as a spin on words). Anyway, let's agree to disagree about the disease definition thing. Regards,

Hi Lynette, First of all let me say that having read the threads more closely I have changed my opinion somewhat. For me, I don't want to get involved with the whole justification of hair wearing and comparing in which case it's acceptable or not. After all, who am I to tell people whether or not they should wear hair? The fact is it's not my place and I feel that as you have outlined people should solve their issues by choosing the appropriate solution for their needs. If you are happy and confident with yourself than that's what truly matters. I completely understand how it could make someone feel about oneself and why they would want to do it especially for people who have significant hair loss that will, by today's standards, never be restored to the 'full' head of hair look that people so often want. '<span class="ev_code_BLUE">I'm a little confused as to why people, who belong to a hair restoration site offering threads on ALL TYPES of hair restoration and who have obviously chosen a different path to solve their hair loss issues, would feel the need to visit other threads within the site to bash the success others have found with their methods?'</span> I agree, I feel that the 'bashing' is unnecessary as it obliviously works for some people. I guess that some people just have very strong opinions on hair systems that are likely to be from their own individual experiences. I visit these threads as I'm interested about hair systems and as I haven't had surgery or anything else I believe that you should always research options. I have for a long time considered a strategy in which you replace hair loss via surgery (specifically at the hairline and temporal recession) and possibly wear a system behind it as that may help disguise the problem areas in hair wearing. As currently my hair loss has been so minimal I am thinking that I may not need to do that but I still like keeping track on advancements in all areas of hair loss treatments. <span class="ev_code_BLUE">'I would LOVE to hear about it. I'm not going to tell you that you are ridiculous for taking drugs to grow hair and that you are growing dishonest hair since it isn't attained naturally...lol I find that kind of silly, don't you?'</span> I guess so ; ) However, for me the hair that I'm keeping is my own in origin. I'm just taking away the factor that causes them to be lost. I don't think it's quite the same as restoring options. It's the whole, 'prevention is better than the cure', thing (especially if there is no current cure). <span class="ev_code_BLUE">'As a side note, I notice that you have been a member here for three years, can you tell us how the regimen has worked for you during that time? Are you totally happy with your results?'</span> Yes, I am currently a Norwood 1 at 27 and have been for the last 6 years since I noticed initial stages of hair loss. I did something about it and I have been very successful in preventing further loss. I have two elder brothers who are both very envious as they lost most of their hair by my age. I guess I was very lucky. I do feel like I am receding still but at a slow rate. One of the main reasons (if not the only) I look at hair systems is that we don't know the long term health effects of taking hair loss medication. I don't like the fact that I have to manipulate my hormones in order to maintain a full head of hair but there aren't many alternatives that work. I'm clearly to vain to let go of my hair lol. As of now I have had minimal side effects, touch wood ; ), and believe the benefits out way the potential risks. Also, I think the chemicals that you have to put on your scalp when attaching hair systems may pose more of a health hazard but please let me know otherwise? Do you worry about that or is there a way you can get around it? What do you use? <span class="ev_code_BLUE">'Others only notice when people wear bad hair poorly'</span> I agree but also wearing good hair poorly and I think if people really inspect your hair closely they may notice. <span class="ev_code_BLUE">'Come on...when these guys started wearing hair, cell phones were huge boxes you had to plug into your car and you had to connect your cell phone antenna to your car if you wanted to use it, remember''</span> Agreed, phones like hair systems have radically advanced but I don't think there at the stage in which they are 'undetectable'. Now that's not a problem if you are in a loving relationship like yourself and you can share all secrets but a lot of people want a result in which they don't need to have to share with a loved one. I am genuinely interested in hair systems. I know a fair amount about the modern ones and have been to conferences to see the best of the best in hair replacement. There is no doubt that they are good if done correctly but I have never seen one that is 'undetectable'. I use to be a member on the Toplace forum and you would read people saying how good their systems looks and that they were 'undetectable' but when I met them in person, I could see the thin mesh lining their scalp. And with the 'thin skin' type the highline was never quite natural to the eye. As Bill has mentioned, if you could attach some high definition photo's of your highline exposed and your hair parted than you would be competing along with the same scrutiny in which others here on this forum are subjected to. It is also your chance to prove us doubters wrong! I would be the first to admit it! Also, let's not forget you are female. Wearing a hair piece for female can be very different in terms of how you may need to wear your system and in terms of detectability. I will just say again that I in no way want to bash hair systems and degrade people who choose to wear them. It's possible that one day I may wear one too??! I just want to be realistic about what they look like by learning more. <span class="ev_code_BLUE">'the rest of the people out there who see baldness for the disease that it is (yes, disease; a bodily reaction out of your control) they know that they can do something about it' Quoted by THG</span> Not sure I agree with that. By that definition, everyone on Earth is born diseased as even normal aging is a bodily reaction out of our control. <span class="ev_code_BLUE">'I noticed that the pictures I posted are really poor quality, so I'm going to search for my hairline pictures and post some of those so you can see the quality that I'm talking about. Hope to have them up by tomorrow'</span> That would be very good of you and I look forward to seeing them. <span class="ev_code_BLUE">'do YOU want to be with a woman whose tits hang down to the floor and are full of celluloid when her harness comes off, or one that had her tits surgically removed from breast cancer but FOOLED YOU with some FAKE cushions under a bra ?' quote by Labrat69</span> I do have to say that I don't agree with that comment. I misread it and do not agree that I mastectomy patient should have to visually disclose to people that she hasn't any breasts. Anyway I'll stop now as this reply is getting very long. When I originally read the threads I could understand the views that Labrat69 was trying to express but do feel they were said brazenly! I do feel that THG and yourself have made some great points and that you're trying to help people by showing them viable options! There is a clear divide in people's opinion and your way of being will selectively filter out the people you do not want to associate with and that's a good thing. As long as you're happy and don't care about negative comments then you will always come out on top. Happy hair wearing.

I'm not sure whether I'm for or against hair systems but I have to say I agree with everything Labrat69 has said! He makes some very good points. I guess they have their place but there is currently a stigma associated with them and you cannot deny that... shame, I'd love it if they were accepted. I personally think that hair systems will become acceptable when they look completely natural. Perhaps that day will come (or has) but that is the true measure of all cosmetic treatments.

What we need is a spy on the inside!! Any volunteers? lol

I would definitely keep clear of propeciahelp.com, as it is a concentrated collection of people who blame their whole lives on Propecia. Perhaps that's a bit harsh but it's certainly not a good place to research facts. Best place to look in my opinion is the FDA 5 year study as that is the most comprehensive study preformed to date. I think you can assess it through Merck's website. Cheers,

Well that depends on whether you would like to bleed to death! Only joking, but you want to try and minimize chances of abnormal bleeding otherwise I'm guessing that your surgeon will have difficulty transplanting when blood is running freely everywhere.

Frequent masturbation or lack of abstinence will affect your sperm count. Not only will seminal volume decrease, so too will your sperm count. For a consistent sperm count at least two days abstinence is generally recommended. Cheers,

Do any of you know where you can order Dirt from in the UK?? I can't seem to find it anywhere !!! Thanks,

Hey Bill, thanks for the reply. It does answer my question. Sorry I didn't phrase it very well. Cheers.

Bill, Relating to question 3 ??“ after the grafts are taken and repositioned into the recipient site (e.g. the hairline) can you feel that they are there when you tug on them (like with native hair)? I mean will the grafts become innervated with a nerve supply? Many thanks,

Jotronic, Thats an amazing result! Can I ask how old the patient is and whether he is on the meds?

Hey Labrat69, DHT is not the driving force behind libido. I have noticed an increased libido since being on finasteride as its likely my testosterone has gone up. I believe there are many people who experience this. Also its called a 'side effect' when its seen to be secondary to a main or therapeutic effect. It's like initially when finasteride was marketed for shrinking prostates, the 'side effect' was re-growing hair. There was no way that they could have marketed proscar as 'hey, shrink your prostate and grow your hair back at the same time. Who knows, maybe Merck might rebrand finasteride as 'Libidolow' for people suffering problems with perminant erections .

According to this graph there is an increase of 80+ hairs at 6 months when using 1mg of finasteride! That pretty impressive! Spex or anyone, do you know what the units are (e.g. hairs per cm2), where the counts were taken (e.g. vertex) and also info about the plot (numbers of patients / whether the values are averages etc)? Cheers,

This is interesting. I commented on this a long time ago and felt that I had observed a similar thing. I do happen to know that there are obscure links between subcutaneous fat and DHT/T ratio. I feel pretty sure there is a link however, like you I felt in the same position, hair or face? I chose hair. I have never stopped taking fin so I cannot comment on stopping and starting. Just a few questions; 1) Were there any times when you stopped taking it for several days before the first time you noticed any aging of the face? 2) In the month in which you got off finasteride, did you notice any improvement to your skin? 3) Did you at any point research into the side effects of propecia (especially on propeciahelp.com). If so at what point? Cheers,

No worries mate. All the best.

3 x 2.5mg (half a 5mg pill) = 7.5mg of finasteride a week not 15mg.

You're definitely right there - but that paragraph was published by Reform mag not in a forum. It also states estrogen is good for muscle gain but so is DHT.! Both may act through IGF-1. He is the article/webpage to read if interested - http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/reform8.htm Getting back to the topic, I'm going to finish my input here. The only reason why I chimed in to start with is because I don't want you to harm yourself by messing with too many drugs (just to gain muscle mass). I know it's important to a lot of people but it's important also to think of the potential long term effects of such uses of hormone level manipulators. Your body will always try to equilibrate back to its predisposed genetic state and when you eventually stop the meds who knows what will happen. Anyway, take care of yourself mate.

That's interesting, I didn't know that. The reason why I ask is because I thought you could apply the same logic to levels of DHT (i.e. you need a small amount). I have just been looking at bodybuilding websites and the information, although probably very good, is somewhat misleading. For example this is a copy and paste of a paragraph on a bodybuilding webpage: 'I have heard several anecdotal reports of individuals who have stacked testosterone with Proscar (a 5-AR inhibitor) and have noticed significantly reduced performance enhancement effects. What's going on here? We know it couldn't be due to the inhibition of the direct anabolic activity of testosterone on muscle anabolism. Most likely it is due to the reduction of androgenic effects in other parts of the body that contribute to the ergogenic effects. Specifically the CNS, which is stimulated by androgens to increase neural output leading to greater strength and greater recoverability. Another possibility is a reduction in the production of androgen dependent liver growth factors (such as IGF-1), since DHT is an important androgen in the liver" Hi Julius, I have seen no such significant evidence for that. There are some who believe that increasing levels of finasteride only inhibits slightly more DHT production as it can inhibit type I 5AR at high levels. This isn't logic. It really does not work like that. Please read through the earlier posts. All the best,

Can i just ask why do you say that? This goes back to what I was saying about synergic effects of drugs, e.g. FIN (60% reduction in serum DHT) + DUT (90% reduction in serum DHT) = 90% reduction in serum DHT. Regards,

It's not as simple as that. You learn by knocking genes out and then putting them back. I believe that knocking out 5 alpha reductase type I is too toxic in development. However, type II mutations are found to occur naturally without major health issues. There is an awful lot we do not know about signaling in the brain. However, with more and more people using drugs like dut we're likely to learn more ??“ but likely the hard way.

Cheers pal. Unfortunately, I don't really know a lot about dut, especially when taken at 2.5mg daily. I'm guessing sides may be similar and potentially stronger than what people get with finasteride. All I do know is that type I alpha reductase (present in the brain and skin etc) will be inhibited, where as it should not with finasteride treatment). So you have more potential for cognitive problems. I think it is likely to affect mood, body fat distribution and possibly even quality of your skin. Whether its in a good way or not, I don't know? However, this is just speculation and I haven't researched into any sides of dut. Perhaps someone else who has taken higher doses may be able to chime in'

Thanks, I'd love to have a crack at curing hair loss. It's just finding the funding. For now I'm quite happy with researching infertility. I don't think you need to worry about the extra T. It's the rate of enzyme activity that will largely determine DHT production. The only real exception is if your T is very low. Think of it like this, testosterone is like 'water' in your bath. If you pull the plug out you get a constant flow of water through the plug hole. Now, no amount of increasing the level of water will affect the rate of flow through the plug hole (unless you put your foot over it ??“ which is kind of what you're doing when you use fin and duta). So using duta is like having more toes in the plug holes but it really isn't a good idea to try and completely cut off flow. Your brain and body need at least a bit of the stuff. I'm not sure my analogy has made it more complicated or not. Makes sense in MY head. Regards,