Blond

I have spoken to a doctor about this... he suggested to just stop taking it straight away. He said that there are loads of people who take 5mg/day for an enlarged prostate and he'd never heard of any problems after stopping it cold turkey..

I personally would not take it until you conceive. Once you know you are, I would then start to take it but ALWAYS strap one on when being intimate ; ) Blondie

Hi, Does anyone think they'll be a day when we can have transplants and use topicals to maintain native hair rather than propecia (I would be happy if it just mantained... it doesn't even need to grow hair back). The thing that puts me off getting a HT is the contract with finasteride that you typically have to take on. What would be a realistic date for something like that to happen...i.e. a topical that maintains hair.....

Quote 'Although Propecia/Proscar is thought to reduce the overall risk of prostate cancer, it actually increases the risk of developing a high-grade prostate cancer in those people who go on to get the diseas' --------------------------------------------- Hi jonjon71, This link has not really been determined! If you look at the research properly you can see that they did not account for the fact that detection of high grade prostate cancer is aided by finasteride treatment as it shrinks the prostate. We still do not know if there is a link!? Some recent reviews claiming no link.... http://www.cancer.gov/clinicaltrials/results/finasteride0907 http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/576433 Regards, Blondie

Hi everyone, I was just wondering whether people felt hair transplants are likely to go down in price in the next few years? Any views?? Regards blondie.

Hi everyone, I was just wondering whether people felt hair transplants are likely to go down in price in the next few years? Any views?? Regards blondie.

quote: Originally posted by Matt: 'Yeah something that seeps into the follicles and has DHT receptor modulationg properties. Such as that the molecule would bind to the receptor like DHT would, but it would have much weaker or no action. This way circulating DHT will not be able to bind to the receptor. I think RU-5884 might work this way.' --------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Yeah I've read about RU-5884. It seems really promising but I don't know how available it is. I think those type of compounds are the way forward. Do you know of any more... and any evidence they might work??

O.K. Well at least your honest about how you feel! My personal experience with the drugs has been mixed! I started about 4 years ago when I was 20 and I'm not going to lie - thanks to them I have lost very little on top. If anything they have made my hair thicker. Note: both my brothers went practically bald by my age!! On the flip side I feel that the drugs have affected me in other ways. I have considered all other options for treating hairloss (from HTs, hair pieces to topical meds) and I know without doubt if you want to keep on to your hair... your most likely to by using a combo of minox and fin (although doesn't work for all). I wish there was a good topical cream/lotion that specially inhibits DHT produced within the scalp or its effects on the follicle but I just don't think it's going to happen for a while. I would really like to find out why DHT is bad for the follicle? Is it due to inflammation / cell cycle control? Its important questions like these that need answering. If anyone has products with logical science then I'll be glad to hear of it and consider it. I guess an anti-androgen / compound that irreversibly binds to the hair follicle that protects it may help. Just my thought......

In no way does estrogen result directly in an increase in DHT! If anything estrogen has been known to be beneficial to hair growth / thickness for sometime. This is why when women are pregnant and their estrogens are higher they notice an increase in hair thickness / density etc. Women often notice their hair thins after the birth and this is due to the hormones returning back to their physiological state (prior to pregnancy). An increase in estrogen is due to inhibition of 5alpha reductase and hence more substrate (testosterone) available to be converted into estrogen via aromatase enzymes. One of the major places this takes is in the liver. Estrogen will act as an antagonist to androgen receptors and that is why DHT receptors will become sensitised to any stimulation/binding of DHT. Most likely you would get upregulation of androgen receptors meaning more sites for DHT to bind to!! I imagine that taking an aromatase inhibitor would increase your testosterone production whilst increasing your bodies' expression of aromatase enzymes. So yes it may reduce estrogen if you get the dose right but when you stop taking the inhibitor you'll be in trouble.

Matt, I thought you were set against the use of finasteride due to Side effects?

It seems to me that saw palmetto and finasteride work via separate mechanisms. We all know how finasteride works however there is quite a lot of debate on saw palmetto's mechanism of action. Some studies seem to indicate that it has anti-estrogenic qualities and as estrogen adversely affects the prostate this may be just one way it works to protect guys with BPH. Also my understanding is that it can reduce the presence of the androgen receptors and hence lessen the responsiveness of the prostate/androgen sensitive tissues to androgens. Why is this of interest? Well because I don't see any reason why people shouldn't take saw palmetto along with Propecia. It may help by reducing androgen receptors and promoting antiestrogenic activity. Also, I was also thinking if someone was coming of propecia for what ever reason.. it may help reduce the androgen receptors that have probably been up regulated via finasteride use.... so the systems not so shocked by a sudden surge of DHT! I can't work out whether saw palmetto would act on other parts of the body i.e. scalp. I guess it would but not very well.. so this might limit advantages over hair loss but still may be good for overall hormone profile? This is just a thought and I wanted to know what you guys think. It is by no way advice on how to self medicate!!!!!!!!

It seems to me that saw palmetto and finasteride work via separate mechanisms. We all know how finasteride works however there is quite a lot of debate on saw palmetto's mechanism of action. Some studies seem to indicate that it has anti-estrogenic qualities and as estrogen adversely affects the prostate this may be just one way it works to protect guys with BPH. Also my understanding is that it can reduce the presence of the androgen receptors and hence lessen the responsiveness of the prostate/androgen sensitive tissues to androgens. Why is this of interest? Well because I don't see any reason why people shouldn't take saw palmetto along with Propecia. It may help by reducing androgen receptors and promoting antiestrogenic activity. Also, I was also thinking if someone was coming of propecia for what ever reason.. it may help reduce the androgen receptors that have probably been up regulated via finasteride use.... so the systems not so shocked by a sudden surge of DHT! I can't work out whether saw palmetto would act on other parts of the body i.e. scalp. I guess it would but not very well.. so this might limit advantages over hair loss but still may be good for overall hormone profile? This is just a thought and I wanted to know what you guys think. It is by no way advice on how to self medicate!!!!!!!!

I have been thinking about stopping propecia as I have been unfortunate to suffer from some side effects. Are there any topical dht inhibitors that I could use without systemic absorption that people have reported to be successful and which one is best? Also are there many people who have HT without taking propecia?

Perhaps this will help with the discussion??

Thanks for your reply Bill. I have another hypothetical question...and I think this one is quite difficult to answer due to patient variation etc. Let's say that a patient has lost most (if not all of his 'DHT sensitive' hair) and wants to replace as much as he can in the frontal zones. What likely density can be achieved?? Is it likely to be similar to that of normal density or is that completely unrealistic? Considering they wouldn't want to look like a monk lol! Cheers

Does anybody know of / has any pics of people who opted for a HT to replace the entire front half (filled in with decent density) knowing that they're unlikely to have enough donor hair to replace crown? The reason I ask is because the thought of having a bald spot at back seems quite acceptable however the thought of having full on recession sends shivers down my spine! Perhaps people don't do this type of HT because it looks unnatural????? Any comments? Links to pics would be greatly appreciated!!!! Cheers, Blondie p.s. apologies if the subject title was misleading!

Does anybody know of / has any pics of people who opted for a HT to replace the entire front half (filled in with decent density) knowing that they're unlikely to have enough donor hair to replace crown? The reason I ask is because the thought of having a bald spot at back seems quite acceptable however the thought of having full on recession sends shivers down my spine! Perhaps people don't do this type of HT because it looks unnatural????? Any comments? Links to pics would be greatly appreciated!!!! Cheers, Blondie p.s. apologies if the subject title was misleading!

Hey guys, I'm still thinking of strategies to tackle hair loss and was hoping for your advice. He's my story......... I have a decent head of hair but have a patchy/slightly receded hair line. I have been taking propecia and use minoxidil for 3 years and now I am keen to come off propecia as I don't feel comfortable with the systematic side effects I am experiencing (the usual + vision blurring + insomnia). I just feel that I can't keep taking propecia for the rest of my life. I don't want the side effects + potential new ones. I know that this is a bad decision as far as hair loss goes and it makes hair loss treatments such as HT and systems very difficult as I am bound to loss the density that I have managed to retain. My initial thoughts were to have a HT for hair line construction and replace hair loss on top with a system but now I just don't see how that will work... or will it?? Alternative options may be to have HT (but not so dense packing). Deep down I think perhaps allowing baldness to progress over the next few years and then seek out treatment may be my best (and only) option but for me and most other young ones ..... the main issue is with not wanting to go noticeable bald to start with. Is this just unrealistic or does anyone have experience with how best to tackle this?? I'm all out of ideas.... Any suggestions? Many thanks, Blondie p.s. I'm 24 years old and my brother is basically bald at 33.

Hey guys, I'm still thinking of strategies to tackle hair loss and was hoping for your advice. He's my story......... I have a decent head of hair but have a patchy/slightly receded hair line. I have been taking propecia and use minoxidil for 3 years and now I am keen to come off propecia as I don't feel comfortable with the systematic side effects I am experiencing (the usual + vision blurring + insomnia). I just feel that I can't keep taking propecia for the rest of my life. I don't want the side effects + potential new ones. I know that this is a bad decision as far as hair loss goes and it makes hair loss treatments such as HT and systems very difficult as I am bound to loss the density that I have managed to retain. My initial thoughts were to have a HT for hair line construction and replace hair loss on top with a system but now I just don't see how that will work... or will it?? Alternative options may be to have HT (but not so dense packing). Deep down I think perhaps allowing baldness to progress over the next few years and then seek out treatment may be my best (and only) option but for me and most other young ones ..... the main issue is with not wanting to go noticeable bald to start with. Is this just unrealistic or does anyone have experience with how best to tackle this?? I'm all out of ideas.... Any suggestions? Many thanks, Blondie p.s. I'm 24 years old and my brother is basically bald at 33.

Hey Matt thanks for replying! I'm glad things are looking up lol! The main thing that I'm concerned about is the facial sagging/complexion part. I don't seem to have had any other side effects. How long in total were you on propecia before you noticed the sagging? How bad was it? You mentioned it started to clear up... how long did it take after you quit the drug? Or was it the sagging wasn't until after you quit the drug? Did you have any loss of facial fat?

Behappy, you have really hit the nail on the head (so to speak lol)! I know that what Bill informs us of is very true and essential for young patients to consider. And I know that in 10-20 years time I will be just as vein as I am now. But the truth is... for someone who has lost all of their confidence due to hair loss, to just have 10 more years with a nice hair line seems almost worth the risk alone because despite having a thick head of hair on top... I can't style it how I would like and basically hate it anyway. It makes me feel 20 years older now anyway! It has been made worse due to comments from people that they have always loved my hair. Its not that I think hair is even that important when considered in isolation. I think it's the shape of the face/contours. I see a lot of guys before and after pics and I actually think they look quite cool and young with a shaved head. The problem with me is I know I will look awful and a lot older due to shape of head etc. Its also quite difficult if you are blonde and fair skinned as you rely on hair to give contrast to facial appearance. To some sense I have already decided that I will not let myself go bald...I'm just deciding now the best way to go about it(to achieve a natural look) and when to act on it. My current plan is to save up and wait at least another year or two (at most), to see how my hair loss develops. Then I will bring the hair line/temples back to what looks aesthetically pleasing (that isn't to say I want to restore my 16 year old hair line). Then bite the bullet, and see what happens other the next few years and decide from there. The way I see it.. as behappy stated, even if the front hair is restored I believe that will satisfy me vs waiting to go very thin all over. It is of course silly that someone can be so put of life because of hair loss, I know..but I just am. And the truth is people judge you more whilst you younger and that why it's such a difficult subject to address and the ethics involved are even more complicated. Thanks for your comments guys.

Hey Matt, When you say a change in facial complexion.. in what way? How long were you on finasteride before you noticed this and now that you have stopped the medication...have the face sagging reversed?? How long did it take to reverse? Have you come across anyone else reporting finasteride effects on facial sagging and complexion?? Blondie

Hey guys, thanks for your comments!! I suppose the reason why I'm thinking a hair system at a later date is because I would quite like to have decent density at the front and due to all patients having limited donor hair and the density that would be required to match the front, I felt like a system might be a better option!? I know it sounds like a lot more hassle for maintenance! I concerned having previously read in other discussion forums, the view of restoring hairlines in young patients as ??unethical'. The general view is that young patients should not lower the hairline as they may get further regression behind and if that happens you are in trouble!! No one to my knowledge has discussed the option of a system at a later date for those who are deeply distraught due to a receding hairline.

Hi Guys, I am 24 years old and am experiencing a receding hairline. I currently take minoxidil and propecia which has maintained good growth on top but has been unsuccessful with stopping frontal regression! Is it possible to have a HT concentrating on rebuilding the hairline for the purposes of having a system behind at a later date? Cheers, Blondie

Hi Guys, I am 24 years old and am experiencing a receding hairline. I currently take minoxidil and propecia which has maintained good growth on top but has been unsuccessful with stopping frontal regression! Is it possible to have a HT concentrating on rebuilding the hairline for the purposes of having a system behind at a later date? Cheers, Blondie