mafpe

most people here claim that turkey is like 90% hair mills. this is a big exaggeration but the reason isn't farfetched. hair transplant in turkey isn't regulated much, which means you can have a random 18 y.o working on your head none the wiser. not to degrade these people, but they aren't equipped with the skills for operation.

i just tried to look up on the place you were looking for, but all i found is a totally marketed facebook and instagram account, i can't really find any doctor or patient result that seems real. it kind of looks like a telltale sign of a marketed hair mill clinic. sure there might be some real one, but the risk of a botched job is enough reason to not go there.

sure it seems like a great deal and would be great if it works, but do search for bothced or just bad works on hair transplant. instead of looking handsome, many many people are instead thinking of suicide and ruined life and self esteem. not worth the risk.

for doctors, do your own research. the forum list is good, and even if you pick someone outside of it, it's still ok as long as you know what you're getting into (seriously, look for the doctor credibility, results, attitude, and the bad results as well). the list doesn't mean that they're the only good doctors, but at least it is "vouched", with the forum having their own set of rules/standard, and perhaps you can ask the mod to intervene on your behalf later, which hopefully is not needed.

most people have 5.5k donor on average, maybe 6.500 on the higher side. there are few with 8k, more than that usually is coupled with body hair or beard.

looks like a clean work for TS, and i think he only need to wait now. from how it look at a glance, unless anything bad happens i think it will turns out great for TS. best of luck!

5 hours ago, Match_no1 said:

I was given 3 packages. 
Package 1 - €1.5 per graft. Dr Demirsoy will extract and open the incision himself and the nurse will put in the grafts.

Package 2 - €1.25 per graft. Half the extraction will be done by Dr Demirsoy and the opening then the rest will be done by his nurses

Package 3 - €1 per graft. The entire extraction will be done by his nurses and Dr Demirsoy will only perform the openings

I will go for the package 1 but was curious as to whether anyone had gone for package 2 or 3.

What made you choose Dr Demirsoy over other doctors like Dr Turan, Dr Gur, Dr Bicer  or Dr Peckiner?

i see... so now it's like other places with option of partial / non doctor extraction. 

i wen't because at the time there were several peopel that went to him and the results were quite good, i've also checked german forums and the result were mostly great. there are bad works (one of the result i am aware of, have probably less than half growth), but mostly were positive. and that it seems that they didn't put much if any effort in marketing, so i reckon the reviews were among the most "honest".

when i was making my decision, there were only a few mention of fuecapilar here, otherwise it'd be one of my choices as well. demirsoy sticks out because he was listed by many members despite not being "recommended" by the forum "elite coalition".

i also asked to dr bicer, but they ruled me out as good candidate, said that best that i rethink and just save money instead of  HT due to my shedding (i shed alot of hair daily). all other doctors i asked said that i am a candidate though, so i'm not trying to just desperately get a HT, i decided i'm a "decent" probably borderline "poor" candidate, but still is an HT candidate.

i also asked dr pekiner, dr path, and doctor laorwong, but their pricing were around 2.5+ euro per graft, and their results seems similar if not only a little different? i can't say this for sure since i'm untrained to pick out HT results. so i decided that price wise, demirsoy is my go to if the results aren't so different. do note however, i do acknowledge that dr. demirsoy results are different to "top doctors", either with the service/aftercare, or the softness of hairline, nor the amount of "great" or top results compared to these top doctors (they are very expensive though, around 4 eur or more per graft). so my pick were influenced by results, reviews, but ALSO value and pricing. i can't claim like other members here who can spend very big amount (for me, at least), otherwise like them i would just go to the "best" among the surgeons, like H&W like how many of the members here swear by him (and yes i saw his results to be very great on a lot of the cases i seen).

for me though, 1.5 euro was a good spot that i felt safe, and that the doctor does almost everything himself that is crucial sold me. and i thought that the pricing is very good for turkey due to dicer being @1.5 euro at last year (november/december i think), and at february when i asked bicer it went to 2 euro (now is at 2.5 apparently), so i reckon that at this price point and experience, it felt right.

5 hours ago, Jason Blaha said:

How was Dr. Demirsoy ? Is he a nice guy ? How long did the initial consultation last ? 

nice is very subjective so i's hard for me to say, and there is a translator, so what i hear and understand comes from the translator's mouth. but as far as i'm concerned, he did address my concerns, and one of the main question were "what is my foremost concern" with my hairline. which means he did tailor the hairline / graft count/placement with mind of what we do want. he wouldn't accept your desired hairline if it won't look "natural" though from what i hear. i think one of the members here posted where he isn't happy because the hairline isn't symmetrical, but after some looking around, apparently since our face isn't symmetrical mostly, it's quite normal to have an asymmetry on hairline, so i scratched that out of my mind.

consultation was around 30 mins i think, because i don't really have a lot of questions due to having researched most of my questions beforehand and asked the muzzafer about it, so in my opitinion it did end up rather quickly. it does seem rather hurried but i did blank out a bit on what i want to ask. i do wish that my temple and hairline is a bit more forward (by rule of facial third, i need another cm of hairline for best ratio), but i did tell them that i'd like their the hairline to be more flat ( --- ) instead of U shaped ( \____/ ) since that's how most asians i know look like, but other than that i leave it to them and just want the most "natural" look.

5 hours ago, BaldBobby said:

I went with Sahinoglu because he only does package #1

i see, i haven't really heard of hium before though. when will your HT be?

oh i meant in length ahhaha sorry that sound's off now 😂, and yes, hopefully it's be there till the end, and for now it looks very promising, especially for only 5 month those photos looks like you have a full hair.

i notice when i was starting receding, that having trimmed sides makes it so that my front and top doesn't look as thin, which is why i've been having the mainstream cut instead of medium hair now.

i think i had problem with shedding the first few months with minoxidil also, and seeing how many other reports the same, i'm guessing it's just the first couple months, after that the problem dissapeared, and if anything, i think i shed a little less compared to before using minox, so it's a good thing to use.

looking good! how long do you plan to have your hair? i notice the donor area is already getting quite long. have your crown begin to show good growth or is it slower than the front?

45 minutes ago, Match_no1 said:

Looks great. Overall how would you say your experience was with Dr Demirsoy from booking to after the op?  
Which package did you go for?

thanks! hopefully it will come to grow as good as it looks.

my booking was with muzzafer, apparently for germans, they have another agent, but otherwise most are handled by him. response rate is probably around a day usually, depend on condition really but it is faster than some surgeons here since the clinic has less demand. there was a slight hiccup on hotel booking because apparently i arrived in peak season, so they end up housing me at their other hotel option. that hotel does have less option and comfort but it's decent.

i think i actually am one of the more troublesome one because i do have a lot of questions and likes to plan things in order to minimize any hiccups. muzzafer answered all my questions and is helpful, so i'd say the experience was good. post op, i actually fly the day after the op (should have stayed for a few more days but didn't manage to change my plane ticket). i did have questions while recovering and he answered the question well, and there was a worry from me since i saw white spots below the skin on the graft placed, which means there are pus below, which then i asked on what to do. thankfully with the antibiotics and proper care it doesn't become anything and healed quite well.

there isn't any package i think, my price was 1.5 euro per graft, you'd need to ask the agent if there is other option, but i picked him not just because of the pricing, but also that he does everything mostly himself other than pulling the graft out (extraction done by dr, nurse helps pulls out the cut graft), and the implantation.

16 minutes ago, Melvin- Moderator said:

I would say that meme is better suited for this:

”I’m not gonna care what I look like when I’m 40”

40 comes

”I won’t care what I look like when I’m 50”

50 comes “ I won’t care what I look like when I’m 60” 

It never stops. The analogy is also not true about being in good shape when you’re young and not caring once you’re older and married. Fitness is a lifestyle, not a phase. Take a look at @MazAB he’s almost 50, married with kids. He stays in amazing shape, and STILL cares about his hair! Nothing has changed, and will not change. 

This idea is very common amongst unmarried, younger men. They have this narrative that once they get married, they can just forget about looks and let themselves go completely. But I guarantee these are the same guys who will expect their wives to maintain their figure and looks. You can’t have your cake and eat it too. Marriage is work, and let’s face it, looks do matter! Married or not. 

The fact is that if you care about your hair at 20, you will care about your hair at 40,50,60 and so on. Life doesn’t stop at 30. Priorities change, yes, but if looks are important enough for you to consider getting surgery, looks are likely to always be on that list. There’s nothing more foolish than this YOLO mentality, especially with surgery. 

That is not the line i was meaning ti convey with the picture, and there are more to the post after the picture that i addressed the concern and i think that it's best planned, but if that's your take on my post, that's alright.

Your examples and points are all true.

And for the example and analogy, of course it's just an example, not everyone will be like that. We humans all have varying degree of difference, we're not programming codes made up of only 0 or 1.

One important thing i expressed exist in this paragraph i had in the post before.

"consider your options, what NW are you gonna be, how good of a candidate you are, are you using medication to prolong your time? do you have body hair to use? make a good plan, so you don't regret it later on the line."

i think everything is back to each people's own situation and culture.

for people who say they want it young and not going to care much when older, the situation is similar as to people having a shredded/jacked body before they are married and have children, and are fine with having a dad bod later on. they'd rather have jacked body still, true, but their priority in life has changed, and they aren't as vain as before since they don't need to be that attractive for a fighting chance in the fighting scene anymore.

you can argue that people would still look since divorce etc are common, but while preparing for the future is good, your enjoyment of life will be less meantime because you keep preparing for a worse future that might not come. i agree with preparing for future but if you don't live in the moment as well

you can ready yourself for the future, i wholeheartedly agree with it, which is why i barely moved my hairline forward instead of another 2cm like how most of my age have their hairline. most likely i'm going to end up as NW6 as the future, that's why i'm only using 3k grafts atm, so i can use the rest when my head bald some more, and i'd have kind of thin but even hair, instead of a shiny platform in the middle if i go greedy.

consider your options, what NW are you gonna be, how good of a candidate you are, are you using medication to prolong your time? do you have body hair to use? make a good plan, so you don't regret it later on the line.

of course you might regret it in the future, but isn't it the same that you might regret not biting the bullet in the past?
if you're to use a hair system, either now or later, that still means you're going to wear it for a period of time. if you are having a bald scalp for 5 years, that means if you want to cover it up, you'll be covering it up for that 5 years anyway, you either do it at your 30 or your 60, you still will need to cover it.

alot of people and doctors put 25 because they "trust" the patient to make enough educated and mature thinking, instead of just jumping on it by impulse, as people would say, younger guys are more 'impulsive' or 'brave', but they didn't think things through as much as an experienced older people would.

people do have different maturity and older isn't always more mature, but the doctor doesn't know if the patient is mature enough or not, so they either put hard limit on age / situation, and or discuss the risk etc with the patient first.

28 minutes ago, Match_no1 said:

Thank you everyone for all the valuable information. I will try finasteride and minoxidil first before going for the transplant. 
Hopefully i will see some good regrowth and stabilisation and will less grafts if I need a hair transplant.

One last question are there any finasteride and minoxidil brands which are better or are they all pretty much the same?
 

Thanks

in general it's the same, but some brand do up and low the actual dosage and content for their own marketing/financing gimmick, but technically you can pick any 'trustworthy' brand. for example many places finasteride is actually proscar, which is 5mg finasteride which then they break into quarter for daily consumption (that's 1.25mg though), there are some who just grind them and dose them individually to sell into capsule. it's best if you can get a prescription and get them in apothecaries however.

best of luck to OP, hopefully everything heals up fine and all graft will be healthy and all grow.

11 hours ago, LaserCaps said:

Let me throw in my 5 cents. 

Have you noticed, most patients, after one procedure they tend to complain because of how thin it looks? So typically, multiple procedures are required to achieve density. Do you know why this happens? Most doctors are under the impression grafts compete for blood supply. They will explain they will be placing a foundation from which they can add grafts in future.  You return 12 months later, and you do it again.  Third procedure and you may have achieved fullness.  A few doctors, given technique, knowledge, experience and background, can achieve density in a single procedure.  Search for a Fellowship trained doctor and look at photos of results, particularly those similar to you. And, of course, in one visit. Why go into this way?

When you consider cost, consider how many times will you need to do this to accomplish what you set out to do.  If it's 3 procedures, $6X 3 = $18! What if you can accomplish the same in a single visit?! Cost can vary from clinic to clinic and from technique to technique. FUT seems to be in the $4.50 to $5 range while FUE in $6-$10 depending on a few variables.  My suggestion, once you've found the right clinic/doctor, is to make yourself available to the clinic.  They may work with you if a sooner slot becomes available.  

i understand the straight logic on the cost that you put on 3 procedure = triple the cost.

but the problem with density is that the more dense you pack it, the more grafts you are going to use. so to say doing 3 x 1000 grafts is just the same as doing 3000 grafts in total cost. the reason where they are "under the impression" that grafts compete for blood supply, is that very dense packing in one procedure give way to the posibility of lesser amount of grafts surviving, and possibly in the worst case, necrosis which is the worst most imagine. the only difference if the pricing is in graft, is the amount of time people need. booking, accommodation, and convalescence are all doubled or tripled, yes, but not the operation cost itself.

if the doctor is able to go for 80/cm2 safely, there is no need for double or triple the surgery. still, 1 cm will take 80 while if you make it 2 surgery of 40/cm each, both will take the same amount of grafts. that is unless you take an all inclusive package of any number of graft  = xxx $

General consensus is to usualy wait after a year with meds since there is a small chance you might regain some hair while also arresting the development.

Like thay you'll probably need less graft, and plus side of stabilising the hairloss that both party knows where it's gonna head. Afterall if even with meds it's still agressive, then you're not really a good candidate and the risk of keep losing hair is there

4 hours ago, Raphael84 said:

It really depends on many factors specific to the patient and therefore why a unique surgery approach for each patient is essential.
Donor density is obviously an influential factor. Patients with significantly above average density may be able to achieve higher graft counts providing their donor is healthy.
Density however is not the only consideration.
FUE takes from surface area and therefore patients who may have a dipping or drop in the lower crown or potential retrograde alopecia with thinning from the nape of the neck moving upwards and possibly weakness above and around the ears, may mean that despite a natively higher density, weaker areas limit the surface area viable for FUE extraction.

4000 is pushing the average donor. We would personally prefer to see the patient in person for consultation before recommending or considering a 4000 graft surgery and much more commonly a patient may safely reach 3500 grafts for example. 

If the donor is pushed too much, then due to the overall negative effect that this can have on untouched grafts as detailed in my above post, this would mean that less grafts would be available in subsequent procedures due to a decline in general health of the donor and that is never the preference.

If you have no concerns with dipping in the crown or retrograde alopecia and density is high, then 4000 grafts can be achieved, but again this is not every patient.

The following case is a good example of higher graft counts being suitable.

You can see the patients rear donor has great height. No signs of decline in the lower crown or anywhere within the rear occipital, and you can see the strength and density moving toward the nape which is not so common.

This patient had an average density of 82.5 follicles per cm2 (70 - 75 is an average patient) so he was above average and his donor allowed a "safe" zone of 8cm in height and 32 in length, providing a surface area of 256cm2.
Another patient may only be able to consider a surface area of donor of 180cm2 for example, and therefore density is not the only consideration.
 

 

does this mean usually after 3500 grafts, on average person the donor area would start to look "thinned"?

i had thought that we're okay until around 5000/6000 grafts since that seems to be like the limit on most people graft count with high NW

14 hours ago, Niki94 said:

Thank you all for your opinions. I'm from Slovakia so it was Slovak surgeon (for this reason I believe it's not necessary to give name of clinic/surgeon as probably nobody from here will ever go there). It's very hard to choose a good surgeon here but I will check what my options are. 
 

@mafpe I got it done on both sides, but I showed only (right) one which is worse and more noticeable (but both have the same issue).

in that case a coverup with a new hairline would do the trick, make sure your chosen surgeon would use only single grafts and soft hairs if you want to achieve a very natural result. otherwise, a few row of single grafts while will emulate a natural look, will still look a little thick.

you can have the transplanted hair removed but i think that's a wasteful way to do it, better just to cover it up. it's rare people's look would deteroriate from a slightly lower hairline. they'd look younger if anything. *unless your forehead end up only being 4 cm from the glabella, that is

that's... a big pimple.... my clinic advised me to take antibiotic as precaution, but it also act in order to prevent any infection. i can't say what's happening with your head because i'm not well educated on that, if those white yellow spots are just shed skin/scab, or something else.

go to a dermatologist to get checked, better safe than sorry.

Alright so... everyone has been dissuading you, so i don't need to tell you more about the clinics you're considering.

What i want to tell you is to check bad results posted here. That way you can see what kind of nightmare can happen, and why everyone is trying to steer you clear. With the hair mills, its not always a botch, but less than average result is commonplace. Problem is you become one of the very badly botched work. If you want to fix them, its gonna cost you probably triple, and no, just shaving it won't rid you of the problem.

Other thing, it seems like your receding area are scarred? What happened? Any skin and scalp condition can greatly affects HT result.

it is if you draw your hair back, and you didnt have the operation on the other side? it's a little visible because it's not even on the whole hairline.

a few row of soft single graft could mask them though i think.

i think if you can post your picture or at least approximate norwood condition + if there's any condition you're having, it would help people point you to the right direction.

i'd also ask about budget, but budget comes after you understand enough of your condition and risk, especially if you're picking the cheapest one, there's a high chance it can turn out to be a hair mill.

Just now, BaldBobby said:

I only asked cuz they share the same last name.

LMAO HAHAHAHA, I DIDNT KNOW THAT.

no idea but somehow that made me get a good laugh due to how serious i was taking it 😂

chance with people with similar name/surname is there but hey, they might be related 😂

2 minutes ago, BaldBobby said:

is he related to Turkey's president?

no idea, it's not always the president though. in any government, the ministry has rights to move in their workscope. big and vital decision or where many people has interest in it, would require agreement on some levels. 

this case, it doesn't have to be the whole health ministry that is on a certain organization side, perhaps this guy who the documenter contacted, simply have good view on erdogan, or he might be pro asmed etc etc. if the video maker contacted other person, it'd be different name perhaps, nobody knows unless you're inside the trade.

one thing i know of organization and ministry is that USUALLY, they move by interest. for whose interest, that's hard to say. either way turkey has been a whole mixed bag of good bed for hair transplant since it's cheap and is the "hair transplant capital" which accelerates the growth of the industry even more. hard to say with how rocky their economy has been. in turkey alone, you can check how their currency, the turkish lyra has fluctuated wildly in value, with price on some items doubling or even tripling. it has been somewhat stabilized the last half year though. but there's also oil price hike on the whole europe especially since the ukrainian-russia war.

back to topic, again, the fact that the documenter said that the health ministry told them to talk to dr.erdogan, doesn't have to mean that they're in bed together. it can be they have relations, either with the ministry or the documenter, or it can simply be that he is well regarded and have good reputation. we have no idea.

best thing to do is for anyone considering asmed is take all aspect, including but not only the bad jobs, to make as informed a decision as they can.

two side of a coin:

1. having a very big amount of patient will result in several bad job, this doesn't mean the clinic is doing a badly or sloppily. math wise 10% bad work means there are 10 out of 10, and 100 out of 1000. (not implying asmed have 90% success rate, just example)

2. there are real people here with botched works and their life ruined. like good reviews, these bad reviews is the tip of the iceberg. not everyone write reviews, some just wallow in despair as they have no idea how to fix it. some got repair by the same clinic, some got a settlement and so on the reason continues. (again, this can apply to any and all clinic. this is an actual business practice that people do)

they asked the health ministry and got told to talk to dr. erdogan?

... i think i'm going to take everything both good and bad about asmed with a whole truck of salt now...
everything is muddy when politic's involved... way more than just good marketing...

i don't think heart attack would affect HT result unless it was on operation day or very shortly after... 

anyway @Nccan, do take care if you're to give your information. i don't know the actual condition but i just searched the forum and there were talk of harrassments / suing. again, i have no idea if these are true or not, but if it is, do document it, for your own safety (not telling you to post here etc, just record it if it happens, you have proof that they did so you'd be safe from any defamation etc and can instead countersue).

due to the interest i also have searched abit more and... well... its possible that asmed had once been recommended (not 100% sure on this) until their standard dropped. the dr claimed that there was nothing that changed, and it's just unhappy patients that the mods seems to agree with. it's a fact that there are a lot of asmed patients, and many of the threads seems like somewhat sketchy and as if they are paid or asked to do so (i have no idea if this is the case or not, just that they do seem like a marketing moment), as many aren't exactly update by time, more like "bam, here's the result". not to accuse asmed of doing these purely by marketing, and marketing is fine in my opinion, what matter is the actual result that is being dished out, and they do deliver correct information and result as good as they promised.

it seems that it's a fact however that asmed did have a lot of bad result on certain period, and as for recent event i have no idea if it is good or bad, but there are people here with 'botched' works (all doctors have them). 

dr. laorwong

i'm curious as he's located in SEA, mostly his patients are people from AUS, with some asians going to him. asian hair is easy to extract as it's pretty straight, but is somewhat troublesome as their donor is way coarser than the front. i just notice that even with single grafts, the thickness is markedly different compared to the native hair. i had my family comment that the new hair is very thick (which is good for density, but in bad way, can be seen as a little pluggy).

i've also almost gone with him if not with dr demirsoy, and still am interested, and is on my list if i decided to ever get another HT for whatever reason.

whoa yeah you don't seem to lose any on the front. i think best bet is to go to  a... trichologist? *might be wrong spelling

i've never seen a naturally thin top but it might be stress/thinning, so you can benefit from minox for example which thickens the hair. if you aren't balding, there's no need to get a HT yet, unless then after your consultation, the result is that you have poor density and no baldness problem at all, then a HT to top up your density would be a great cosmetic improvement for you.

10 minutes ago, Nccan said:

You were so lucky and smart to stay clear.., I found this forum just when the ASMED hype was high and was fooled into selecting them... I wish every day, every minute and every single second of my life that I had done a little more research... you only have one donor, and one life, if you have a failed transplant, you are setting yourself up for a lifetime of fibers, weird hairstyles, constantly worrying about your hair, feeling ugly and depressed.. it affects all facets of your life... this is why I try to help people stay clear of hair mills like ASMED, even years ago when I did my transplant there were  better and safer options than ASMED.. today it is pure madness choosing them.. insanity ..

yes... usually being worrywart or paranoid is bad for me in general, but thankfully this trait came in handy for this particular instance... i was about to go to cosmedica at first, but i did look for possible failure etc just in case, and then found out more about HT due to this. to be honest i almost picked cosmedica as well, that is until i saw a few really bad results... one of them is here and the thread has been locked but can be viewed (it's rather infamous back then). dr erdogan was considered one of the best back then but when the bussiness model transitioned, it changed quite a lot.

i've no real idea on what transpired with you, but since on the post before you, the rep said that they would always stand with their patients, can @ASMEDMANUALFUE adress @Nccan's trouble seeing that he had an operation with your clinic?

this way people here can get a clearer picture of what's with ASMED currently and if the reputation is true or not. not to mention OP here said that they're just sharing their experience but get stamped as a marketing scheme in some people's mind. Hopefully this can clear people's misunderstanding or misgiving. ofc if this would be considered a thread derailment it's best to make a whole new thread (unless it's not, then perhaps it can continue here).