Think Minoxidil Doesn't WORK? Think AGAIN

[Melvin- Admin]

 

[Britanium]

@ShiftyLooking good here 👌Nice video 👍🏽

[mister_25]

I always thought the Big 3 was Finasteride Minoxidil and Microneedling. 

Don't you need to stop Minoxidil before a hair transplant around 6 or so weeks before hand? Doesn't this induce a shed that could potentially be a obstacle to the final result because the hairs that are provided by minoxidil are missing and the surgeon will be unable to see them?

Informative video as always!

[Melvin- Admin]

8 minutes ago, mister_25 said:

I always thought the Big 3 was Finasteride Minoxidil and Microneedling. 

Don't you need to stop Minoxidil before a hair transplant around 6 or so weeks before hand? Doesn't this induce a shed that could potentially be a obstacle to the final result because the hairs that are provided by minoxidil are missing and the surgeon will be unable to see them?

Informative video as always!

Stopping minoxidil for a few weeks isn’t gonna be a big deal. 6 weeks no, more like 2 weeks before a hair transplant. 

[mister_25]

Thanks for the input, Bit worried there. My doctor wants me to stop minoxidil all together or at the very least 6 weeks before and thinks that minoxidil is not worth the effort. Saying that continued usage of minoxidil can make hair transplantation difficult in the long run with collagen damage, destabilization of the tissue and other things like premature facial aging and excess bleeding. Are those factors eliminated within two weeks of discontinuing?

I will say that I got pretty good results with Minoxidil and generally don't want to discontinue it if I don't have too.

[sunsurfhair]

I have been using oral minoxidil (generic) for a while now with good improvements and will continue to do so.

No side effects and I just had cardiac workup plus blood work - AOK.

Generic costs me $0 from US pharmacy under my prescription plan and I take 2.5mg.  

[Tiger2050]

21 minutes ago, mister_25 said:

Thanks for the input, Bit worried there. My doctor wants me to stop minoxidil all together or at the very least 6 weeks before and thinks that minoxidil is not worth the effort. Saying that continued usage of minoxidil can make hair transplantation difficult in the long run with collagen damage, destabilization of the tissue and other things like premature facial aging and excess bleeding. Are those factors eliminated within two weeks of discontinuing?

I will say that I got pretty good results with Minoxidil and generally don't want to discontinue it if I don't have too.

Dr. Victor Hasson?

[mister_25]

1 minute ago, Tiger2050 said:

Dr. Victor Hasson?

Yes

Edited July 29, 2022 by mister_25

[GoliGoliGoli]

Are you doing FUT or FUE?

Have any other Doctors besides Hasson made this comment on Topical Min? My Doctor told me to increase my dosage from 1 to 2 applications per day. 

This was Hasson's response in a Reddit AMA when asked about Topical Min. I can't tell if he's saying its only a problem for FUT or also FUE? Sounds like both? 

 

Dr. Hasson: When we perform surgery on patients who have been using topical minoxidil, we find that the tissue is incredibly fragile with markedly reduced tensile strength. This has affected the amount of tension the scalp can withstand during wound closure in FUT surgery and also the density that we can pack grafts into the recipient areas. In addition, I have had multiple patients complain of increased wrinkles in the face after using the drug (this suggests possible premature facial aging).

It has now been shown that minoxidil inhibits the production of an enzyme, lysine-hydroxylase, which is responsible for the production of hydroxy-lysine which is of great importance in the cross-linking of collagen in the skin.
In my opinion, this mechanism can account for my clinical observations.

 

Edited July 30, 2022 by GoliGoliGoli

[mafpe]

huh... i hear about the concern above as well, but it's still pretty beneficial imo. but minox does make people have some dandruff problem and itching for example, which is usually caused by dryness, which might be because minox is alcohol based. it would decrease flexibility, and probably wrinkles as well. not sure if this is right though.

[mister_25]

10 hours ago, GoliGoliGoli said:

Are you doing FUT or FUE?

4000-4500 Grafts FUE. I am about a Norwood 3 Vertex / Norwood 4 but I was a Norwood 5 before I started medication.

10 hours ago, GoliGoliGoli said:

This was Hasson's response in a Reddit AMA when asked about Topical Min.

I asked if switching to Oral Minoxidil would be beneficial to avoid the collagen damage and tissue destabilization. Doug emailed back saying that he thinks that it would probably not and he would get back to me. After a email back I was told that Dr Hasson does not prescribe Oral Minoxidil. I got the general idea that he is against Minoxidil all together not just Topical but also Oral as well, but I cant say for sure.

[Melvin- Admin]

I spoke to Dr. Hasson, a lot of his feelings are anecdotal. He told me he can always tell when a patient is on minoxidil by the skin. I don’t doubt it, but minoxidil is very effective. Leaving it out of your regiment isn’t a good idea. 
 

At the end of the day, there are pros and cons to everything. Long term suppression of DHT may cause cognitive issues. I’m sure long term use of minoxidil can affect collagen. But I believe those affected are a small percentage. I don’t believe it’s every person that uses minoxidil.

[sunsurfhair]

1 minute ago, Melvin- Moderator said:

I spoke to Dr. Hasson, a lot of his feelings are anecdotal. He told me he can always tell when a patient is on minoxidil by the skin. I don’t doubt it, but minoxidil is very effective. Leaving it out of your regiment isn’t a good idea. 
 

At the end of the day, there are pros and cons to everything. Long term suppression of DHT may cause cognitive issues. I’m sure long term use of minoxidil can affect collagen. But I believe those affected are a small percentage. I don’t believe it’s every person that uses minoxidil.

I agree 100% with Melvin. I have personal experience with oral Fin and unfortunately suffered quite badly from it. Some men do fine with it and some men unfortunately get affected quite badly. I would take Minox over Fin any day. The label is changing again due to the effects and (some) persistent effects of the medication. I heard rumors theres going to be a big news post about this and the big companies (Keeps Hims etc) are going to have inform all patients.  Long term suppression of DHT can cause many issues, not just cognitive. Not trying to stir a huge debate by any means as I have friends on it with no or little issue, but it absolutely can cause problems in many men - more than reported. 

[sunsurfhair]

7 minutes ago, Melvin- Moderator said:

I spoke to Dr. Hasson, a lot of his feelings are anecdotal. He told me he can always tell when a patient is on minoxidil by the skin. I don’t doubt it, but minoxidil is very effective. Leaving it out of your regiment isn’t a good idea. 
 

At the end of the day, there are pros and cons to everything. Long term suppression of DHT may cause cognitive issues. I’m sure long term use of minoxidil can affect collagen. But I believe those affected are a small percentage. I don’t believe it’s every person that uses minoxidil.

Also hate to say it since I respect Hasson and his work completely, but wonder if it’s a bit of bias since they are releasing the gel encapsulated Fin - which I think could have tremendous possibilities if it doesn’t go systemic but I was a bit surprised after watching their presentation that there was still a decent amount of the drug that went systemic. 

[Melvin- Admin]

20 minutes ago, sunsurfhair said:

Also hate to say it since I respect Hasson and his work completely, but wonder if it’s a bit of bias since they are releasing the gel encapsulated Fin - which I think could have tremendous possibilities if it doesn’t go systemic but I was a bit surprised after watching their presentation that there was still a decent amount of the drug that went systemic. 

It’s definitely not a bias. He could easily formulate his own topical minoxidil, and I bet it would be better than 90% of the minoxidil out there. I’ve spoken to Dr. Pimstone, he’s more open to the idea of minoxidil. He could combine minoxidil and fin in a gel that increases scalp absorption, and decreases systemic absorption. That would be a winner.

[sunsurfhair]

5 minutes ago, Melvin- Moderator said:

It’s definitely not a bias. He could easily formulate his own topical minoxidil, and I bet it would be better than 90% of the minoxidil out there. I’ve spoken to Dr. Pimstone, he’s more open to the idea of minoxidil. He could combine minoxidil and fin in a gel that increases scalp absorption, and decreases systemic absorption. That would be a winner.

Sounds like a winner for sure 

[GoliGoliGoli]

Ya someone in the Reddit AMA accused him of being anti Min because he's releasing a Fin topical but that sounds like nonsense to me. I imagine this guy is loaded and plus he seems ethical anyways so to think he's doing some sort of backroom propaganda campaign to knock Min in order to boost his Fin sales seems a bit ridiculous.

[sunsurfhair]

3 minutes ago, GoliGoliGoli said:

Ya someone in the Reddit AMA accused him of being anti Min because he's releasing a Fin topical but that sounds like nonsense to me. I imagine this guy is loaded and plus he seems ethical anyways so to think he's doing some sort of backroom propaganda campaign to knock Min in order to boost his Fin sales seems a bit ridiculous.

I’d be surprised too I just don’t understand why he seems so against it when there is a lot of evidence of the benefits. 

 

[Melvin- Admin]

He’s against it because he told me he’s had issues with patients who’ve been on minoxidil. Their skin isn’t healthy. It’s understandable from his perspective, but I believe it’s his perspective. I would love to convince him to add minoxidil to his brand. I believe he has a high quality product. I’m sure if he put that dedication in minoxidil it would be fantastic. 

[Vann]

3 minutes ago, Melvin- Moderator said:

He’s against it because he told me he’s had issues with patients who’ve been on minoxidil. Their skin isn’t healthy. It’s understandable from his perspective, but I believe it’s his perspective. I would love to convince him to add minoxidil to his brand. I believe he has a high quality product. I’m sure if he put that dedication in minoxidil it would be fantastic. 

Is this for FUT or just in general? I can understand FUT with the skin being less elastic with less collagen in that cell. But would it matter for FUE?

[GoliGoliGoli]

22 hours ago, Vann said:

Is this for FUT or just in general? I can understand FUT with the skin being less elastic with less collagen in that cell. But would it matter for FUE?

Yes I'm curious about this too. But judging on his answer below I would guess both FUT and FUE. Fragile skin can't be a good thing in FUE, and not being able to pack grafts into a recipient area would not be a good thing in FUE either. 

 

When we perform surgery on patients who have been using topical minoxidil, we find that the tissue is incredibly fragile with markedly reduced tensile strength. This has affected the amount of tension the scalp can withstand during wound closure in FUT surgery and also the density that we can pack grafts into the recipient areas.

[A Fue Good Men]

On 7/29/2022 at 4:30 PM, Tiger2050 said:

Dr. Victor Hasson?

He told me the same exact thing in person. What’s odd is that I’ve asked several other surgeons about this and they have claimed to never have seen this phenomenon 

[mavigo]

I think it depends on the person. I found minoxidil to be not be very effective. 1) I'm allergic to generic liquid min and my dermatologist advised me to use namebrand rogaine foam. Generic turned my scalp bright red. I didn't have the same reaction from namebrand rogaine but it was a hassle and I stopped before my first procedure. I couldn't imagine how bad it would sting on a transplanted area. I resumed rogaine about 6 months after but just got on fin and stopped topical min all together.

Edited August 3, 2022 by mavigo

[Melvin- Admin]

1 hour ago, mavigo said:

I think it depends on the person. I found minoxidil to be not be very effective. 1) I'm allergic to generic liquid min and my dermatologist advised me to use namebrand rogaine foam. Generic turned my scalp bright red. I didn't have the same reaction from namebrand rogaine but it was a hassle and I stopped before my first procedure. I couldn't imagine how bad it would sting on a transplanted area. I resumed rogaine about 6 months after but just got on fin and stopped topical min all together.

You should seriously reconsider. Minoxidil is very effective especially when combined with finasteride. You should consider oral minoxidil.

[mavigo]

40 minutes ago, Melvin- Moderator said:

You should seriously reconsider. Minoxidil is very effective especially when combined with finasteride. You should consider oral minoxidil.

Appreciate the suggestion. 7 - 8 years ago, oral minoxidil was almost unheard of and I believe my dermatologist said it was not as effective as topical or efficacy was unknown. Topical anything is an ordeal, smearing lotions & potions on your head, 2x daily for eternity, ugh. I'd much prefer a pill. I'll talk with my doctor about it.