Verteporfin HAIR REGENERATION HUMAN TRIAL Dr. Barghouthi *OFFICIAL THREAD

[Square1]

4 hours ago, David149 said:

If this works:

Hair transplant company’s revenues 📈📈📈

Hair preventing company’s revenues 📉📉📉

I think you overestimate the impact. Most people are not this deep in hair restoration research. On HLT, there isn't even a thread about it. I asked some people, but they ignore the subject. On the Dutch hairloss forum, nobody knew about it. Some are intrigued but the large majority does not care.

We think that if verteporfin is proven to regenerate 50% of grafts and you can do it over and over again, that people will abondon finasteride in mass because you can just do HT's until eternity. I don't think that will happen to any significant degree. 

 

[Square1]

5 hours ago, Dragonsphere said:

Hi Melvin, could you mention this idea next time you speak to the HT conducting a trial. 

I don't believe anyone has yet to discuss the idea of how Verteporfin can be used to transplant and replant in the donor area with each round having a compounding effect until the donor area is fully restored. 

I am trying to temper my expectations but to me it already looks like a given that Verteporfin regenerated 30% minimum in this test subject. Now if it can regenerate hair that has already been transplanted, without even being hyperbolic, we could all become Brad Pitt with a few surgeries. 🧑‍🦱

Were equal amounts of grafts removed from both sides? I am sure the information is somewhere here. 

There is a reason science is not done through pictures. It really is important to wait for more trials and scientific hair counts to confirm such findings

[Kistyle]

21 hours ago, Melvin- Admin said:

No, he doesn’t owe you, me, or anyone anything. It’s not “unfair” because he’s doing this from his own free will. You’re not paying him. We’re not paying him. Im sure he will update us when he has the time. His duty is to his patients who pay him for their results. 

I agree that he doesn’t owe anyone anything. But, he is the one creating expectations by informing the audience, that a monthly updates will be provided. Therefor it is not strange that questions will arise about updates.
 

A brief update statement w.r.t the delay will take 5 minutes. 

in my opinion, this point could be improved.

Provide a realistic timeline or inform the audience that there is a delay.

[takuma]

i had an idea, the HT Doctor could make the incisions in the recipient area and instead of placing follicles from the donor in them, they place verteporfin in those incisions to allow the skin to heal back normally hopefully with robust thick hair follicles. 

[TV_on_LazerDisk]

10 hours ago, Square1 said:

I think you overestimate the impact. Most people are not this deep in hair restoration research. On HLT, there isn't even a thread about it. I asked some people, but they ignore the subject. On the Dutch hairloss forum, nobody knew about it. Some are intrigued but the large majority does not care.

We think that if verteporfin is proven to regenerate 50% of grafts and you can do it over and over again, that people will abondon finasteride in mass because you can just do HT's until eternity. I don't think that will happen to any significant degree. 

 

Allot of people don't want to do fin, or minoxidil every day.

 

[TV_on_LazerDisk]

10 hours ago, Square1 said:

Were equal amounts of grafts removed from both sides? I am sure the information is somewhere here. 

There is a reason science is not done through pictures. It really is important to wait for more trials and scientific hair counts to confirm such findings

I think it would make sense to try just seeing if microwounding and verteporfin cause regeneration next too as it is less complicated. 

[ijustbethinkin]

On 12/23/2023 at 2:24 AM, takuma said:

i had an idea, the HT Doctor could make the incisions in the recipient area and instead of placing follicles from the donor in them, they place verteporfin in those incisions to allow the skin to heal back normally hopefully with robust thick hair follicles. 

You have mentioned that idea 100 times already....

Serious question: Why don't you buy Verteporfin and a 2mm Dermoroller and test it out yourself?

No need to waste a Hair Transplant Doctors time testing that. Focus should be on confirming this works on recovering donor hair, branching out and trying too many methods in these early stages will unnecessarily delay the process.

[Fox243]

 

[Nikoni]

11 minutes ago, Fox243 said:

 

Thank you, unfortunately nothing new.

So one big update is left for the near future, Dr. Bloxhams 4 and 5 months results.

[sansi]

12 minutes ago, Nikoni said:

Thank you, unfortunately nothing new.

So one big update is left for the near future, Dr. Bloxhams 4 and 5 months results.

The update should be the last piece of  the puzzle. I mean if it shows some good results then we can be certain that verteporfin works and it's a matter of finetuning the protocol .

[TV_on_LazerDisk]

1 hour ago, sansi said:

The update should be the last piece of  the puzzle. I mean if it shows some good results then we can be certain that verteporfin works and it's a matter of finetuning the protocol .

I have a feeling it works better with fue as the wound isn't stitched back 

[TV_on_LazerDisk]

2 hours ago, ijustbethinkin said:

You have mentioned that idea 100 times already....

Serious question: Why don't you buy Verteporfin and a 2mm Dermoroller and test it out yourself?

No need to waste a Hair Transplant Doctors time testing that. Focus should be on confirming this works on recovering donor hair, branching out and trying too many methods in these early stages will unnecessarily delay the process.

Some doctors do derma rolling if one of us did that with the verteporfin protocol that might be a good trial actually 

If someone did this on their own with an ht doctor it wouldn't add more time

 

[Melvin- Admin]

2 hours ago, ijustbethinkin said:

You have mentioned that idea 100 times already....

Serious question: Why don't you buy Verteporfin and a 2mm Dermoroller and test it out yourself?

No need to waste a Hair Transplant Doctors time testing that. Focus should be on confirming this works on recovering donor hair, branching out and trying too many methods in these early stages will unnecessarily delay the process.

Agreed, using this with microneedling is a waste IMO. This is best used in conjunction with surgery. Let’s see how the FUT turns out, but so far it looks like FUE might be the best option. 

[Nikoni]

@Melvin- Admin do you think we may try to fund an existing FUE scars revision trial ? (If Bloxham's trial shows success for older scar revision)

It should be cheaper and easier. No Hair Transplant is needed and the test can be done on a small area that will require very little verteporfin.

[TV_on_LazerDisk]

18 minutes ago, Melvin- Admin said:

Agreed, using this with microneedling is a waste IMO. This is best used in conjunction with surgery. Let’s see how the FUT turns out, but so far it looks like FUE might be the best option. 

If the first fue trial works, getting Dr zarev to try it would be monumental as his method combined with vert could mean game changing density.

 

Also if any of us who have connections could look into Hyaluronic acid-modified and verteporfin-loaded polylactic acid nanogels

[Dragonsphere]

22 hours ago, Square1 said:

I think you overestimate the impact. Most people are not this deep in hair restoration research. On HLT, there isn't even a thread about it. I asked some people, but they ignore the subject. On the Dutch hairloss forum, nobody knew about it. Some are intrigued but the large majority does not care.

We think that if verteporfin is proven to regenerate 50% of grafts and you can do it over and over again, that people will abondon finasteride in mass because you can just do HT's until eternity. I don't think that will happen to any significant degree. 

 

We still don't know the long term impact of endocrine alterating medicine has on the body. Could Dutasteride that removes nearly all type 2 and a significant amount of type 1 5α-reductase have some unforeseen consequences? Nobody knows. I personally don't want to be taking this medication when I am 60. 

Verteporfin could mean that preventative medication is no longer a requirement for most HT doctors conducting surgeries on younger patients. This is, of course, if they are advised that of the potential long term cost of full scalp coverage. 

 

Edited December 23, 2023 by Dragonsphere

[sansi]

 

[TV_on_LazerDisk]

19 hours ago, Dragonsphere said:

We still don't know the long term impact of endocrine alterating medicine has on the body. Could Dutasteride that removes nearly all type 2 and a significant amount of type 1 5α-reductase have some unforeseen consequences? Nobody knows. I personally don't want to be taking this medication when I am 60. 

Verteporfin could mean that preventative medication is no longer a requirement for most HT doctors conducting surgeries on younger patients. This is, of course, if they are advised that of the potential long term cost of full scalp coverage. 

 

Yep, and minoxidil interfers with collagen most of us want to look younger with our hair back so it's a catch 22.

 

Vert might ironically make it better to be a Norwood 7 where are your new hair should stay. Personally I think if vert works with micro needling or maybe doing punches where dormant follicles are that would be it's selling point for maintaince. 

You get a hair transplant and then every so often you get extractions of dormant follicles with vert injected. 

Edited December 24, 2023 by TV_on_LazerDisk

[takuma]

12 hours ago, sansi said:

 

That's a really big difference! the scar is practically gone and normal skin in it's place..wow!

Edited December 24, 2023 by takuma

[Dragonsphere]

1 hour ago, TV_on_LazerDisk said:

Yep, and minoxidil interfers with collagen most of us want to look younger with our hair back so it's a catch 22.

 

Vert might ironically make it better to be a Norwood 7 where are your new hair should stay. Personally I think if vert works with micro needling or maybe doing punches where dormant follicles are that would be it's selling point for maintaince. 

You get a hair transplant and then every so often you get extractions of dormant follicles with vert injected. 

Also ironically it could mean that HTs would be recommend earlier than later in life. Look at the donor area of 80 year old man with or without androgenic alopecia. People's hair naturally thins  later in life. I have seen elderly gentlemen without MPB hair loss but their density is probably 30% of what it was when they were in their teens. Taking advantage of the androgen resistance follicles at a younger age when density has peaked will result in a greater yield and less procedures. 

Respectfully I don't agree with testing it with micro needling for two reasons.

1. You would probably have to wound a lot deeper than with conventional micro needling and cover the entire area of your scalp. I don't think this is practical. 

2. Even if it works, you will be regenerating hairs that are prone to MPB and will keep have to this procedure in rounds in perpetuity. 

Edited December 24, 2023 by Dragonsphere

[TV_on_LazerDisk]

15 minutes ago, Dragonsphere said:

Also ironically it could mean that HTs would be recommend earlier than later in life. Look at the donor area of 80 year old man with or without androgenic alopecia. People's hair naturally thins  later in life. I have seen elderly gentlemen without MPB hair loss but their density is probably 30% of what it was when they were in their teens. Taking advantage of the androgen resistance follicles at a younger age when density has peaked will result in a greater yield and less procedures. 

Respectfully I don't agree with testing it with micro needling for two reasons.

1. You would probably have to wound a lot deeper than with conventional micro needling and cover the entire area of your scalp. I don't think this is practical. 

2. Even if it works, you will be regenerating hairs that are prone to MPB and will keep have to this procedure in rounds in perpetuity. 

True I was thinking more you do something like fue extraction on the balding area 

[Dragonsphere]

1 minute ago, TV_on_LazerDisk said:

True I was thinking more you do something like fue extraction on the balding area 

Possibly, but for really old scars will the body remember what the tissue used to be? 

I am tempted to send Dr Barghouthi an email requesting to do a small FUE procedure with verteporfin and if all goes well, in a years time extract the transplanted grafts with verteporfin to see if they regenerate, which would confirm an unlimited donor supply. Of course, I will pay the baseline cost for any procedure. 

I am just hesitant as I imagine he is bombarded with queries.  

[TV_on_LazerDisk]

7 minutes ago, Dragonsphere said:

Possibly, but for really old scars will the body remember what the tissue used to be? 

I am tempted to send Dr Barghouthi an email requesting to do a small FUE procedure with verteporfin and if all goes well, in a years time extract the transplanted grafts with verteporfin to see if they regenerate, which would confirm an unlimited donor supply. Of course, I will pay the baseline cost for any procedure. 

I am just hesitant as I imagine he is bombarded with queries.  

It doesn't have to be for scarred areas just for areas with minturarized follicles

The question would be how long if it grows fresh hair would those new hairs last.

That would a good idea but the question would be which hairs would regenerate, you might want to extract it in such a way that it leaves some of that follicle in the scalp for that case. 

Edited December 24, 2023 by TV_on_LazerDisk

[Square1]

25 minutes ago, Dragonsphere said:

Also ironically it could mean that HTs would be recommend earlier than later in life. Look at the donor area of 80 year old man with or without androgenic alopecia. People's hair naturally thins  later in life. I have seen elderly gentlemen without MPB hair loss but their density is probably 30% of what it was when they were in their teens. Taking advantage of the androgen resistance follicles at a younger age when density has peaked will result in a greater yield and less procedures. 

Respectfully I don't agree with testing it with micro needling for two reasons.

1. You would probably have to wound a lot deeper than with conventional micro needling and cover the entire area of your scalp. I don't think this is practical. 

2. Even if it works, you will be regenerating hairs that are prone to MPB and will keep have to this procedure in rounds in perpetuity. 

I do not see how you can be against any form of testing. Provided that an experiment is not done instead of a more fitting experiment. 

If it would be the case that microneedling + verteporfin does revive DHT-affected follicles, it completely depens on how quick they disappear again for how feasible it is. I know some guys that were nw7 at 18, so if you would revive their follicles, it would probably be a yearly occurrence to re-microneedle the area because their hair miniturizes so quickly. 

However, if your baldness started after 25, you're probably fine with needling once a decade or so. That's perfectly doable. 

So if somebody decides to test such an idea, I will thank them in the name of science

 

[Dragonsphere]

8 minutes ago, TV_on_LazerDisk said:

It doesn't have to be for scarred areas just for areas with minturarized follicles

The question would be how long if it grows fresh hair would those new hairs last.

That would a good idea but the question would be which hairs would regenerate, you might want to extract it in such a way that it leaves some of that follicle in the scalp for that case. 

It just seems redundant if we can regenerate hairs resistant to MPB. 

I would do it on an area of my beard, possibly the neck area in the corner and extract a small area completely. If hair regrew back in that area we could say with 100% certainty that Verteporfin works. Those grafts would then be planted into the area around my cheeks (the density in this region is poor). They could be extracted out a year later and we could see if they regenerate.