Regular Member Midiman Posted July 28, 2006 Regular Member Share Posted July 28, 2006 I'm ten days post-op with Dr. Keene (2500 at 25-30cm2). So far very little shockloss to grafts and surrounding hair. Also, I haven't had much in the way of itching or scabs. However, I have been using a fair amount of saline.. not sure why, maybe to relax the scalp a bit and aid its cleanliness? I'm wondering if there's such a thing as using "too much" saline after a procedure. My concern is that it may be hampering the graft's attachment to the scalp. Any concern in doing so or am I just paranoid? Thanks '06/2500 w/Dr. Keene '07/1500 w/Dr. Keene My Hair Loss Weblog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member Midiman Posted July 28, 2006 Author Regular Member Share Posted July 28, 2006 I'm ten days post-op with Dr. Keene (2500 at 25-30cm2). So far very little shockloss to grafts and surrounding hair. Also, I haven't had much in the way of itching or scabs. However, I have been using a fair amount of saline.. not sure why, maybe to relax the scalp a bit and aid its cleanliness? I'm wondering if there's such a thing as using "too much" saline after a procedure. My concern is that it may be hampering the graft's attachment to the scalp. Any concern in doing so or am I just paranoid? Thanks '06/2500 w/Dr. Keene '07/1500 w/Dr. Keene My Hair Loss Weblog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member HairHope Posted July 28, 2006 Senior Member Share Posted July 28, 2006 Did you forget to add the glue? j/k IMO it should be fine, the attachment is under the skin, but ask your doc and report back here for the rest of us to learn Originally posted by Midiman:I'm ten days post-op with Dr. Keene (2500 at 25-30cm2). So far very little shockloss to grafts and surrounding hair. Also, I haven't had much in the way of itching or scabs. However, I have been using a fair amount of saline.. not sure why, maybe to relax the scalp a bit and aid its cleanliness? I'm wondering if there's such a thing as using "too much" saline after a procedure. My concern is that it may be hampering the graft's attachment to the scalp. Any concern in doing so or am I just paranoid? Thanks Dec. 2004 - 1938 Grafts via Strip Feb. 2009 - 1002 Grafts via FUE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Jotronic Posted July 28, 2006 Senior Member Share Posted July 28, 2006 Midiman, Unless you're using more saline than you are water from the shower (depending on Dr. recommendations you should be using it full bore) I seriously doubt you'll drown your soldiers. The Truth is in The Results Dr. Victor Hasson and Dr. Jerry Wong are members of the Coalition of Independent Hair Restoration Physicians Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Janna Posted July 28, 2006 Senior Member Share Posted July 28, 2006 At 10 days post-op saline is not needed anymore. If you still feel bumps (scabs) on the top of your head, you can gently massage your recipient area by shampooing in the following manner to ease them off completely: give your head a good soak under the shower to really hydrate the scabs, massage with shampoo, then give it another good soak. Patients are reluctant to massage for fear of losing grafts, but feel confident that the follicles are well adhered by now. It will look like you have dandruff for about a week. Patient Care Services & UK Patient Advisor for Shapiro Medical Dr. Ron Shapiro, Dr. Paul Shapiro and Dr. David Josephitis are members of the Coalition of Independent Hair Restoration Physicians. http://shapiromedical.com/info@shapiromedical.com http://shapiromedical.com/contact/request-a-consultation/janna@shapiromedical.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member HairHope Posted July 28, 2006 Senior Member Share Posted July 28, 2006 Thanks Janna , that is good advice. In your opinion, is saline in water spray all I need. Last time I used Grafcyte and to be honest stayed red longer than I expected. TY Originally posted by Janna:At 10 days post-op saline is not needed anymore. If you still feel bumps (scabs) on the top of your head, you can gently massage your recipient area by shampooing in the following manner to ease them off completely: give your head a good soak under the shower to really hydrate the scabs, massage with shampoo, then give it another good soak. Patients are reluctant to massage for fear of losing grafts, but feel confident that the follicals are well adhered by now. It will look like you have dandruff for about a week. Dec. 2004 - 1938 Grafts via Strip Feb. 2009 - 1002 Grafts via FUE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Janna Posted July 28, 2006 Senior Member Share Posted July 28, 2006 Approximately 7 years ago, we used to recommend only saline spray post-op. Then, we found that Graftcyte spray, more often than not, got rid of the redness sooner than saline. There's different factors that may explain why it took longer for you to rid the redness for your first procedure - maybe the incisions were a little bigger, you had a bigger session, or more up front where it's more visible. Either way the redness will subside fairly quickly. Patient Care Services & UK Patient Advisor for Shapiro Medical Dr. Ron Shapiro, Dr. Paul Shapiro and Dr. David Josephitis are members of the Coalition of Independent Hair Restoration Physicians. http://shapiromedical.com/info@shapiromedical.com http://shapiromedical.com/contact/request-a-consultation/janna@shapiromedical.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member HairHope Posted July 28, 2006 Senior Member Share Posted July 28, 2006 Thanks Janna, I think you hit the nail on the head, it might of been a function of the incision size (the doc just said he has recently gone to .9) and my decision to get back on rogaine (alcohol) sooner than I should of. My session was only 1938 grafts so it wasn't a megasession, however it was all up front. Thanks again. Originally posted by Janna:Approximately 7 years ago, we used to recommend only saline spray post-op. Then, we found that Graftcyte spray, more often than not, got rid of the redness sooner than saline. There's different factors that may explain why it took longer for you to rid the redness for your first procedure - maybe the incisions were a little bigger, you had a bigger session, or more up front where it's more visible. Either way the redness will subside fairly quickly. Dec. 2004 - 1938 Grafts via Strip Feb. 2009 - 1002 Grafts via FUE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member Midiman Posted July 28, 2006 Author Regular Member Share Posted July 28, 2006 Thanks everyone. I'll refrain from using saline now. Janna, quick question... Does Dr. Shapiro recommend short-trial Rogaine application to help speed growth of newly transplanted hair? I frankly had better results using Nioxin's "Follicle Booster" prior to the HT and would like to start its regimen soon if it's alright. Thanks... '06/2500 w/Dr. Keene '07/1500 w/Dr. Keene My Hair Loss Weblog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member tkerr22 Posted July 28, 2006 Senior Member Share Posted July 28, 2006 if you don't mind me asking, what did the nioxin follicle booster do for you? My Hair Loss Weblog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Janna Posted July 28, 2006 Senior Member Share Posted July 28, 2006 Dr. Shapiro does recommend using Rogaine two weeks after surgery to help jump start the growth of newly transplanted graft for two to three months. Grafts are going to grow regardless, so this is for people who are especially anxious for the hairs to grow. Ideally, he would prefer the patients keep using Rogaine indefinately in conjunction with Propecia. I'd like to hear more about your experience with the Nioxin booster. We don't have much feedback about it to start recommending it to our patients. Patient Care Services & UK Patient Advisor for Shapiro Medical Dr. Ron Shapiro, Dr. Paul Shapiro and Dr. David Josephitis are members of the Coalition of Independent Hair Restoration Physicians. http://shapiromedical.com/info@shapiromedical.com http://shapiromedical.com/contact/request-a-consultation/janna@shapiromedical.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member Midiman Posted July 29, 2006 Author Regular Member Share Posted July 29, 2006 Janna, thank you for the information... Concerning FB, I started a full-on Nioxin regimen about nine months ago after two hair stylists claimed their husbands were having success with it. Nioxin FB claims to "repair damage caused by free radicals, enhance nutritional uptake by energizing cellular scalp activity up to 200%, and protect against the phototoxic effects of sunlight thereby improving hair density and quality". It does indeed cause redness when applied to all areas of the scalp. Because I color out my grey, I noticed an immediate regrowth of new grey hair to my frontal zone... maybe 15-20 new hairs a day. Nothing to write home about... but a definite improvement. I'm not claiming it'll work for everyone, and this hair was possibly coming out of its telogen phase, but I definitely had more hair after nine months. (obviously not enough to deter a HT ) '06/2500 w/Dr. Keene '07/1500 w/Dr. Keene My Hair Loss Weblog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member tkerr22 Posted July 30, 2006 Senior Member Share Posted July 30, 2006 Janna, only thing I worry about using rogaine to jumpstart the new hairs is I don't want my existing hairs to get hooked on the rogaine and fall out when I stop using it. I don't want to take it consistently as it is a messy regimen that I don't wish to do for life. Is it ok to use for a month or two without worry of native hair getting hooked on it? and if it is, how often should u use it? once a day or twice? thanks My Hair Loss Weblog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member MrJobi Posted July 30, 2006 Senior Member Share Posted July 30, 2006 I agree with Tkerr I stayed away from Rogaine during my 2 HT's. No sense in starting something which may contribute to some marginal early growth. Unless the patient is going to stick with it, I wouldn't risk the consequence of "adding" loss when stopping. Good to have someone objective like Janna as a source of knowledge Cheers JOBI 1417 FUT - Dr. True 1476 FUT - Dr. True 2124 FUT - Dr. True 604 FUE - Dr. True My views are based on my personal experiences, research and objective observations. I am not a doctor. Total - 5621 FU's uncut! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member Midiman Posted July 30, 2006 Author Regular Member Share Posted July 30, 2006 Originally posted by tkerr22:Is it ok to use for a month or two without worry of native hair getting hooked on it? and if it is, how often should u use it? once a day or twice? Good question tkerr22... Briefly back to Nioxin FB. I decided to use some last night... big mistake! Stung like crazy! I'm thinking it'll be better to just let the grafts grow normally without additives. '06/2500 w/Dr. Keene '07/1500 w/Dr. Keene My Hair Loss Weblog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member worried Posted July 30, 2006 Regular Member Share Posted July 30, 2006 I was thinking of stopping rogaine on the hairline . I get zits on the forehead and it looks and feels slimy. I don't mind putting it on the crown and the cost is minimal. Costco sells rogaine 5% 3-60 ounce bottles for 19.99. I'm headed for my 4 month check up on 8-4 so I was going to asks the docs opinion.Also its easy to just put on the crown and not drip it all over the head. Also I don't know if it's fact or what about your other hair getting hooked on it like a drug addict and then needing it to grow or falling out. View My Hair Loss Weblog Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Janna Posted July 31, 2006 Senior Member Share Posted July 31, 2006 We have not had any patients report they lost native hairs due to usage and stoppage of Rogaine in the first two months. We recommend to our patients to use the 5% just once a day in the evening before bed for two months. Our thought on Rogaine is that it can only help. If a person does not see any benefit, then they can stop any time. I haven't heard of follicles becoming "addicted" to Rogaine. I will check with our Doctors to see if they have heard of this phenomenon. When Rogaine works, it works very well especially with Propecia. We recommend Rogaine usage only as an optional regimen as we realize this product seems to work on approx. 50% of patients. Dr. Shapiro feels the risks are minimal (time and cost) to see if you are among the lucky 50%. Patient Care Services & UK Patient Advisor for Shapiro Medical Dr. Ron Shapiro, Dr. Paul Shapiro and Dr. David Josephitis are members of the Coalition of Independent Hair Restoration Physicians. http://shapiromedical.com/info@shapiromedical.com http://shapiromedical.com/contact/request-a-consultation/janna@shapiromedical.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Janna Posted July 31, 2006 Senior Member Share Posted July 31, 2006 Worried, If you are seeing pimples at your hairline or in your grafted area, you may be experiencing folliculitis. It's nothing to be alarmed about. Be sure to report how many pimples you're getting and how long you've had them to your doctor when you have your follow-up visit. They will tell you how to treat it if they determine that's what it is. Did you have any grafts transplanted in the crown area? If it's the Rogaine, I'm wondering why you're only getting pimples in the hairline if you're applying Rogaine to your whole head. Patient Care Services & UK Patient Advisor for Shapiro Medical Dr. Ron Shapiro, Dr. Paul Shapiro and Dr. David Josephitis are members of the Coalition of Independent Hair Restoration Physicians. http://shapiromedical.com/info@shapiromedical.com http://shapiromedical.com/contact/request-a-consultation/janna@shapiromedical.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member tkerr22 Posted July 31, 2006 Senior Member Share Posted July 31, 2006 cool, so applying rogaine for a month or so will be ok on the existing hairs, and might speed up some growth? My Hair Loss Weblog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Janna Posted July 31, 2006 Senior Member Share Posted July 31, 2006 Yes, that's SMG's view on short term Rogaine use. Patient Care Services & UK Patient Advisor for Shapiro Medical Dr. Ron Shapiro, Dr. Paul Shapiro and Dr. David Josephitis are members of the Coalition of Independent Hair Restoration Physicians. http://shapiromedical.com/info@shapiromedical.com http://shapiromedical.com/contact/request-a-consultation/janna@shapiromedical.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member Midiman Posted July 31, 2006 Author Regular Member Share Posted July 31, 2006 Well maybe I'll reconsider Rogaine use? Janna, if I don't end up shedding a lot of the hair that Dr. Keene transplanted soon, what would be a fair amount of time to know whether or not the hair is going to remain in place and not fall out due to shockloss? Thanks for your contributions here! '06/2500 w/Dr. Keene '07/1500 w/Dr. Keene My Hair Loss Weblog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Janna Posted July 31, 2006 Senior Member Share Posted July 31, 2006 The shedding of the transplanted hairs start at approx. 2 two weeks post op to 2 1/2 months post op. Being on Rogaine and Propecia will help you retain a lot of your tranplanted hairs. At least that's the feedback we've been getting from our patients. I usually tell our patients to expect 70% loss of transplanted hairs. If you retain more, look at it as a bonus. The main thing is not to look in the mirror to count each hairs or compare if you've kept the density. That's putting extra unnecessary stress on yourself. Patient Care Services & UK Patient Advisor for Shapiro Medical Dr. Ron Shapiro, Dr. Paul Shapiro and Dr. David Josephitis are members of the Coalition of Independent Hair Restoration Physicians. http://shapiromedical.com/info@shapiromedical.com http://shapiromedical.com/contact/request-a-consultation/janna@shapiromedical.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member Midiman Posted July 31, 2006 Author Regular Member Share Posted July 31, 2006 Great... good info and advice! I'm at two weeks post-op tomorrow. I'll start a 3-month Rogaine regimen tonight (already on Proscar/1.25mg a day). Hopefully that, and the 25-30 cm2 procedure will help reduce the loss. Dr. Keene spoke very highly of Dr. Shapiro's staff when I "questioned and answered" her during the HT. I can easily see why now... thanks! '06/2500 w/Dr. Keene '07/1500 w/Dr. Keene My Hair Loss Weblog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senior Member Gorpy Posted July 31, 2006 Senior Member Share Posted July 31, 2006 Hi Midiman, Don't confuse normal shedding of the transplanted hairs with shock loss of pre-existing hair. It's normal for most of the transplanted hair to shed and start popping back out at about 3 months. Also, make sure you follow Dr. Keene's directions and slowly wean yourself off of the Rogain once the time comes. ____________ 2700 Total Grafts w/ Keene 9/28/05 663 one's = 663 1116 two's = 2232 721 three's = 2163 200 four's = 800 Hair Count = 5858 1000 Total Grafts w/Keene 2/08/07 Mostly combined FU's for 2600+ hairs My Photo Album See me at Dr. Keene's Gallery Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member Midiman Posted August 1, 2006 Author Regular Member Share Posted August 1, 2006 You're right Gorpy. I've started to notice some shockloss from my preexisting hair. Not too bad as of yet. And yes, I'll re-read my post-op Rogaine instructions carefully!... thanks. '06/2500 w/Dr. Keene '07/1500 w/Dr. Keene My Hair Loss Weblog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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