Will 1000 help

[Guest]

Hey guys,

I am new to this forum and had a question. I was wondering would 1000 grafts give me pretty good density, basically it it worth it? I was quoted 1000 from two well-known HT doctors. I am 21 and have been on propecia and rogaine since Sept 05. Thanks mucho! Also does being black help with a better density look? Not looking for replies like, "you are to young, ect.."

[Guest]

Hey guys,

I am new to this forum and had a question. I was wondering would 1000 grafts give me pretty good density, basically it it worth it? I was quoted 1000 from two well-known HT doctors. I am 21 and have been on propecia and rogaine since Sept 05. Thanks mucho! Also does being black help with a better density look? Not looking for replies like, "you are to young, ect.."

[John_in_NC]

First, you're too young, and too bad you don't want to hear it. You might regret the attitude 5-10 years down the road. Have you tried shaving? Many black men look great with a shaved head. If you get a scar, you will have to pretty much forget about shaving your head, especially since black people could end up with larger scars.

 

Second, it's hard to see what's missing from the picture. Try taking a few other ones with no flash and in different lightning. When I first saw it, I thought you had some sort of skin condition on the front.

 

Third, the benefits of "black" hair are probably negated by the lower density (a doctor might jump in and explain better.) Yes, black hair is thicker and curlier, but also black people have lower densities than whites.

 

Finally, an ethical doctor will probably not touch you at your age and for 1000 grafts, given that you may need many more to keep up--depending on family history. If you go to Dr. Armani you might end up with a great first few inches of the hairline, and nothing left to cover the rest. Be very careful, and think ahead. I know it's hard, but you will only make it worst if you rush to look good for a few years now.

 

Good luck,

[the B spot]

Darkman----- LMAO BTW

 

Well where do I begin--------

 

The answer to all of this is simple-- shave your head for about 6-8 more years.

 

Think about it... if you are losing hair at your age, logical progression will saddle you with a potentially completely bald male pattern at some point in life, right?

 

Even if you only lose the front half, you still need to find out how drastic your hairloss is, and what can be done about it.

 

Now, as a black man, a couple of things you need to know---- your hair is more coarse and the grafts tend to curl up under the skin making disection and re-implantation EXTREMELY difficult. Second, black people are more subsceptible to their scars kelioding or ridging. Discoloration of the skin is a possibility as well.

 

In addition, due to the larger nature of the grafts, incisions have to be larger, which can create a "cobblestoning" effect which is very noticeable.

 

So, while you aren't looking for things like your too young, etc... the fact that you have already noticed that response, means you should be bright enough to figure this out and reign yourself in a bit.

 

Now, I don't know who your "well-known" doctors are, and quite frankly, I could care less who they are.

 

Ethically, you don't operate on 21 year olds in the first stages of MPB, and second, you asking the question about being black and density means you need to really do some research and wise up quick.

 

Think about it before you do it..........

[Beefy]

I was 23 when I got my first procedure done. You can chance it like I did. Now I am 30 and have no problems in my crown area , I also been using rogaine for a long time.

[nikkop23]

well said, B_Spot. i second your response. 21 is _too young_, etc, etc.

[Robert_]

Well, while I am the last person to advocate surgery, I don't think that 21 is too young in every case.

 

However, in your case I think you would be much better served by shaving your head and applying minoxidil to the area twice a day for the next year or so. Yeah, I know it's not what you want to hear; you want hair. We all do. But what other forum posters and I am trying to do is make sure you look before you leap.

 

While there are thousands of possible complications for caucasion hair restoration surgery patients, there are a few more for darker skinned patients.

 

First, as B SPot pointed out, black patients are much more susceptible to keloid scarring. This requires an extra step of planning. Most physicians I have talked to about this say that they prefer to test the skin of the patient for keloid scarring before going forth with a full-blown procedure. This is done by transplanting just a few hairs into a small, relatively unnoticeable area. If keloid scars form, they will know the patient is not a candidate for surgery.

 

Additionally, black patient's hair has to be inserted in a different way than that of caucasions'. This isn't a detriment, though. Just make sure the physician you are considering is familiar with this method of placement by asking for references and to see pictures of as many black patients that they have operated on as possible.

 

I know that you know you can shave your head and pull it off, but I want to stress to you how much of an expense and long road you will be saving yourself if you go that route now, apply minoxidil (a growth stimulator) to the area twice a day, and stay on the Propecia. Do this for a year diligently (keyword: diligently) and assess where it gets you. After that, if you are still serious about trying a surgical option you can go forth in your research.

 

 

I'm only a couple of years older than you and I had every one tell me that I was too young too. So I know how you feel. It's not that we're shunning you, but if there are easier, less invasive methods that will possibly work, you want to utilize them first. In spite of what some make it look like, surgery is not the easiest way to go about this.

 

-Robert

[the B spot]

Beefy, in some instances it may be acceptable to operate on younger men.

 

I am not a fan of this as you are taking a risk of running out of donor.

IF you are talking a few reasonably placed grafts, 1000 to 1500 in 1 or 2 surgeries, then a HT on a young man might be acceptable, IN THE RIGHT CIRCUMSTANCES.

 

In this instance, it is blatantly obvious that this young man has no idea what is in store for him, the potential drawbacks associated with a HT at an early age, or the difficult physiological differences associated with his ethnicity and a HT.

 

Again, the BEST thing to do is hold off and think about it.

This is regardless of any Top Doc, etc...

 

Let me end with this: I firmly believe that younger men in their early to mid 20's find it difficult to understand the ramifications of "taking a chance" because the potential drawbacks may occur so far in the future. I just turned 30, and at 25 I remember wanting to have my hair back, regardless of cost, etc... Something made me hold off and I am glad I did.

It puts things into perspective.....

I am glad that your plan is working out for you Beefy! Happy Growing!!!!

[Guest]

Thanks guys for the responses. Well, I guess I'll just cut my balls off and get a HT . Just kidding. I knew it was going to me some remarks I would like to hear and some I wouldn't . I really just wanted to know if 1000 grafts would even give me a fuller look. The irony of it all is that when I started Pro and Ro last year, 5 months later I had a huge afro. But because of ignorance, I buzzed my hair and the front never grew back like it was. This summer I shaved my head and honestly EVERYONE that saw me had to hold their laugh in exept for my family of course. It is because I have this young baby face and big nose. I have to make my choice in less than a month so if any of you younger guys or black guys who went through it could please give your experience and input. Thanks!!!

[Robert_]

The reason that the hair never returned after you buzzed your hair is because those hairs were already in their telogen stage. Which means that they were bound to jump ship very soon anyway. You just hastened the process by buzzing them down.

 

Why do you only have less than a month? Who are the physicians you are consulting with? If you go toa well-renowned physician that turns you away, would you just "doctor shop" until you found one that would operate on you, no matter what the consequence?

 

Like I said before, I don't think that 21 is always too young. However, if you can posibly wait then do it. Believe me, I'm not telling you this to be mean. I'm telling you this because it's a huge decision that you really have to weight the pros and cons on. And no offense, but I am not so sure you even know what the full extent of those cons are.

 

Let us know who the physicians are that you are considering and let us hlep you make a decision on a physician that will definitely look out for your best interests no matter what.

 

-Robert

[Bill - Seemiller]

I agree with Robert and the others. I don't think 21 is always too young either, but from what I see in your case, I believe it's in your best interest to wait. There are some horror stories I've read from people who have started way too young, decided on dense packing the "thin" areas, only to lose a lot more hair in the future and not have enough donor hair to cover all the bald spots. Think very carefully before you act...that's my best advice. Try to remember that you are asking people on this forum and many of them have been around here for years...many of us know our stuff and are trying to help you. But if you are only looking for answers that you want to hear...then you'll ignore this advice anyway.

 

That being said, I do wish you luck in your quest. If you actually do want advice and help, please post again. There is no reason you have to decide anything in the next month...in fact, making a rash decision like that will most likely have extremely negative consequences. Perhaps you'll "luck out", but try to remember...we're only trying to help you make a decision that is best for you.

 

Bill

[hairbank]

Darkman,

 

I'm not sure I'd ever draw the line in the sand with respect to ages, but, in most cases, 21 is pretty young to have a HT. It's very difficult......really, it's impossible, to determine the extent of future loss. Meds may help you, they may not. This is the primary concern when considering a HT at your age.

 

One thing I will point out...........I've regretted many of the choices I made while under a time constraint. Is there a reason you can't put this off a while longer? I started with hairloss around 22-23 years of age and it was a gradual process. Before my first HT at age 38 I was around a NW 4. When I was 22-23, if HT's offered what they do today, I'm not sure what I'd do?? I supposed I'm gald it really wasn't something I considered until later in life when my hair loss pattern was easier to determine.

 

My advice to you would be to continue with the meds for a couple of years and see how it goes. It will give you more time to see how they work for you and possibly provide more insight as to the extent of future loss. If you're still wanting to do something pretty soon, I'd recommend you consult with a few of the docs who are members of the Coalition of Surgeons.

 

Either way.....best of luck to you .

[Beefy]

Loosing your hair does suk. When I took the plunge for the first time I had no one to help me out, there were no boards like this one where I could've went to for some information. Use the people on the board and listen to them they have been there and done that several times over. At 21 you take a chance I took one as well at 23, I am just thankfull that my hair loss has'nt gotten any worse, but who knows what will happen 10 years from now. I continue to take rogaine and hope it works, just remember no body but god can forecast someone's hairloss not even the best doc's.

[Guest]

Just want all you guys to know that I really appreciate all your comments. I guess alot of my decision on doing this at 21 is becaue of my insecurity. I was always insecure about myself. When I was younger I was insecure about my weight, then height. Finally when I reached 17 I was 6 feet and I great shape 175. It's like I finally excepted myself. And now this happens, taking away my confidence and self-esteem. I had an great internship with a great company away from home this summer and couldn't even enjoy my dream. Now I am about to graduate this spring to continue working and I know I need my confidence and self esteem back. I want to be able to enjoy my youth. Right now I would rather have my hair in my 20's and if I eventually have to, I would willingly wear a system like my dad has since he was 30. (he and my uncle are noorwood 5). They are the only ones with hairloss on both sides of my family. I guess maybe those of you who dont agree with this, please tell me what helped you get through your youth everday when the public stared, pointed, and laughed at your hairloss? When everyone you have known for years cant even have eye to eye contact during a conversation with you? Not many of you have had the extent of hairloss at 21 as I have, but it really feels like my life is a joke. Dr. Lehr and Dr. Cooley both recommended my pictures over the internet 1000 grafts. I am out of school from Dec. 11-Jan. 16. (that could possibly be my postop healing time before school starts back). Thanks again ALL u guys!!!

[Robert_]

I began losing my hair at 18. By the time I was 21 I was much worse than you. Muuuch worse.

 

Dr. Cooley performed both of my procedures. I trust his assessment because I have no doubt about his ethics. I know that he isn't quoting a number just to "get you in the chair." I have no doubt that if you went in for a face-to-face consultation that he and Ailene will offer you similar alternatives and not push surgery on you.

 

I know what its like to be young losing hair. It sucks. But there are other options. Have you been applying minoxidil to the hairline twice a day? While it won't perform miracles, it may help. I won't promise that it will regrow any hair but it may stave off future loss.

 

And maybe "bic"ing the area isn't for you. What about a very close buzz? You may be surprised at how well that camoflages a thinning area.

 

Oh, and trust me, you are the one that notices your hair loss 100 times as much as anyone else. Even if an acquaintence mentions it, odds are they have forgotten all about within 10 minutes. You carry it with you because, as it is with all of us, it's a sore subject for you.

 

If you really, really, really are going to go through with it, please go to Dr. Cooley for a face-to-face consultation. Dr. Blaine Lehr has a great reputation and I have no reason to believe that he would shoot you wrong, but I would put my trust into Dr. Cooley any day of the week.

 

We're here to help.

 

-Robert

[the B spot]

Let's see what helped me get through my 20's......

 

Lot's of really good looking women, a circle of friends that love me, a good job, and basically NO HAIR CARE!!!!!

That's right folks!!!!!! There is NOTHING like having a #1 shaved head.

 

I did it until I found Dr. Shapiro at age 28.

Trust me, it will be OK.

The nice part about all of this is that at least when you buzz down, you won't have a pasty white scalp, like us white guys do

 

Work out the Micheal Jordan look for a minute just to scope it out.

 

Peace

[Bill - Seemiller]

I started losing my hair when I was about 21 or 22. I first noticed thin hair on the back of my head...and I was in denial for awhile. I then tried Rogaine for a short time and it seemed to be working. I made the mistake of coming off of it thinking I didn't need it anymore and I lost any bit of growth I got and then some. I tried a number of gimics to try to regain lost hair but everything I tried simply wasn't working and I was losing ground.

 

Truth be told I was always a hat guy...even when I had a thick head of hair, I wore a hat since I was about 14 years old. Actually, I even grew my hair long and kept it hidden under a hat. I used to love surprising the ladies with my longer and healthy golden hair as I took off my hat and a thick head of hair fell down over my face. The girls LOVED running their fingers through my hair and playing with it. I felt very manly back in the day with a nice head of somewhat longer hair. So I was EXTREMELY upset when I started to losing it...probably similar to how you are feeling now. I wasn't the wisest back then...but it worked out in my favor that I waited to have an HT. If I had an HT back when I first started to lose hair, I'm sure I'd regret it...for a number of reasons. Back then, the technology wasn't like it is now in regards to HTs...not to mention I would have had unrealistic expectations.

 

You said it yourself...your dad has been wearing a hair system since he was 30 years old...you MIGHT be heading to a much more severe place of hairloss. Getting surgery now might not be the best plan.

 

Here's my advice plain and simple...keep up with Propecia...try Minoxodil, maybe a copper peptide spray like Folligen (optional...definately use Propecia and Minoxodil though), find a look that works for you in the meantime...wear a hat like I did, or shave to a 1 or 2 clip, or even "bic" it. Many bald men get a lot of women! I just happen to be one of those men that doesn't look good bald.

 

I hope we are helping you...we really are trying to look out for your best interest.

 

Bill

[PCC]

Darkman,

 

I could be the "poster boy" for early hairloss. Having started balding in high school during the "big hair and looks" obsessed 80's, I experienced all the feelings you are having now. I had my first HT at age 19 mainly due to a lack of support and acceptable choices back then. While I don't entirely regret it, I wouldn't wholeheartedly recommend it to others.

 

You have received very sound advice thusfar. Shaving/buzzing down one's head, a haircare regimen including meds, or even utilizing a hairsystem can all be valid precursors or alternatives to a HT. The surgical hair restoration industry will be here if and when you are ready.

 

You are among friends here.

 

Phil

[damo]

I personally think you are way to young.Who knows how much further hairloss there may be or may not.Would take Proscar or minoxidil in the meantime.

 

Damo

[Guest]

Hey guys, its been a minute. Thanks for all ur comments. I decided to not do a ht but stayed on treatments. Here is a update as of today. Visit: http://photobucket.com/albums/f67/prettyboyboo2000/

Now back in the summer i used alot of couvre and toppik (kept it in for weeks and didn't wash it out) and also overprocessed my hair with black dye to try to hide my scalp. I also started using Rogaine once a week. All this made me loose alot of hair down to the follicle within the last summer. I actually saw my hair fallin out when I brushed it, slept on the pillow, ect.. Now, even with alot of regrowth my scalp is still irritated and if i use wave grease, within a hour my hair will pop out including the follicle. Also applying Rogaine will pop out 1 or 2 follicles. This is not because a shed but I damaged my scalp. Is there any topical that can get my scalp back healthy?

[Bill - Seemiller]

darkman,

 

Glad to hear you are holding off on the HT and going to stick to the medicine. Did you say you were on Propecia? If not, I'd get on it ASAP. Minoxodil (Rogaine) can definitely irritate the scalp. Some use Nizoral shampoo, either in 1% or prescription 2% 2 or 3 days a week to help combat any itchiness. Some swear by it. Additionally, you may want to try the Rogaine foam, seems to be less of an irritant on the scalp from what I hear.

 

Also, you said you are using Rogaine once a week? It's not going to help you much if you don't use it at least once a day. Just so you know.

 

So I just looked at your pics...do you have anything in your hair for your most recent pics? Because basically, your hair looks perfect there without any loss.

 

Bill

[baldcasanova]

Originally posted by Bill:

darkman,

 

Glad to hear you are holding off on the HT and going to stick to the medicine. Did you say you were on Propecia? If not, I'd get on it ASAP. Minoxodil (Rogaine) can definitely irritate the scalp. Some use Nizoral shampoo, either in 1% or prescription 2% 2 or 3 days a week to help combat any itchiness. Some swear by it. Additionally, you may want to try the Rogaine foam, seems to be less of an irritant on the scalp from what I hear.

 

Also, you said you are using Rogaine once a week? It's not going to help you much if you don't use it at least once a day. Just so you know.

 

So I just looked at your pics...do you have anything in your hair for your most recent pics? Because basically, your hair looks perfect there without any loss.

 

Bill

 

i have used and use nizoral but it does dry your hair out. i wouldnt use too much of it. from the look of the pics in your photo album your hair has returned. Good for you. If you love having hair dont over process it. im a big toppik fan as well the stuff really helps. unfortunately in my case im just about down to only implanted hair on the top, which is only 3000 so its time to get 2000 or so more and then i'll look better.

 

best of luck to you.

 

one thing, remember rogaine is a forever thing. once you stop your regrown hair will fall out after 90 days or so. after 5 years on it, ive grown tired but whats a guy to do when you want to maintain your youthful vitality in the form of hair.

[Bill - Seemiller]

Baldcasanova,

 

I have had the same issue with Nizoral and so thus stopped using it. I like Nioxin shampoo and especially the contioner, BUT to those reading this, don't expect any shampoo to regrow hair. It's just nice shampoo. Good point about the Rogaine. It's also true with Finasteride...if you come off the medication, the MPB will continue, no question.

 

Bill

[Guest]

Dont think u guys understood what i was saying in my last post. From June 06-late August 06 I used couvre and toppik for weeks and didn't wash it out. And only on weekends (within this summer time period) i used Rogaine. I also over processed my scalp during this time period with dye. This is what took alot of my hair out including the follicle. Since September 06 I started back on Propecia daily, Rogaine foam daily, and nizoral and t-gel every other day. That is how I regrew alot of my hair that fell out from damaging it with chemicals and from the buzz cut. Now I need to know what type of topical could i use to get my scalp back in healthy condition because I still get irritation and can't use wave grease because it will take my hair out within hours? Doc Cooley said to try folligen and emu oil. What do u reccommend. I realize that I have grown alot of my hair back, but i just want my scalp to get back healthy. Thanks