Stimpson

"And, since congress might take up the "Fairness Doctrine", check out Dr. Wong's patient at 17 months...." LOL! It took me a second to get that. Anyway, outstanding results both. But what really stands out to ME in these logs, is the way Wong filled so much into existing hair. True for the Cooley case as well, albeit to a lesser extent (going by the 2 month photos anyway, and assuming not TOO much shock loss). I say this stands out to me not because of doctor skill per se, but simply because I personally still have some native hair towards the crown and also some transplanted hair up front, so being able to transplant a fairly large session comfortably into existing hair is a KEY point for me (I will be happy to shave to aid with this). Great examples of work by both Cooley and wong. Stimpson

Funny. I am down to the same 2 doctors for my choice. I go back and forth, and every time I think my mind is made up, I change it again. Basically, Cooley is a 6 hour drive, whereas Wong is WAY FAR AWAY.... But... The reason that I am leaning towards Wong is because they have provided such thorough documentation of success with the *type* of procedure that I want. No, I do not just mean a large procedure, as that is not guaranteed by anybody. What I mean, is simply that they go *back* on the head, and into a little bit of hair if need be. I have already had some prior work, so I have quite a bit of hair in the frontal area, plus I have some native hair lingering in the crown and just forward. Even if I do not address the crown, I would still like hair ALL THE WAY BACK TO the crown. I have high temple corners, and am fine with that. I just want the hair tied into the sides of my NW 5a/6 pattern, and BACK TO the crown, or maybe even a dusting in the crown. I would like the density to be tapered as you travel back, of course, but yet more uniform than is typically seen by most HT doctors, who have a tendency to weight too front heavy IMO. I have seen AMPLE photographic evidence where Dr. Wong does this REPEATEDLY. Cooley, while without doubt an *outstanding* HT doctor (my number 2 choice, well maybe 3 behind Hasson), simply does not provide documentation wherein they do these types of procedures regularly. The pictures I see from doctor Cooley are typically documenting the hairline/frontal third. H@W frequently document the ENTIRE HEAD, and thus they CLEARLY SHOW that they address my particular concerns regularly. I don't know if it's a genuine style difference, or just a documentation issue, but it's likely going to be my deciding factor for Wong. I will not let geography be the deciding factor. This is too important. - Stimpy

A LOT of us on this board know how you feel, because we too had bad HT experiences that casued us trauma in our lives. Unfortunately, I think it is an easier problem to correct by going FORWARD, because going backward is not really an option. That's what I mean when I say things like "I am a slave to the HT process". You can't really undo it. Just be DAMN sure that whatever corrective measures are taken are performed by a competent doctor, of which there are many, and they correct nightmare scenarios all the time. Best of luck - Stimpy

Botchedinatl - all I can say is that while Bosley performs the same TYPE of procedure, they did not do it NEARLY as well, or even of a really comparable quality, to the doc who did the repairs (Parsley). Parsley, btw, is NOT a paying member of the coalition (although he is *recomended* by this site). My Bosley work WAS early (1994), and by Bosley standards it was not as bad as some on here they have mangled, which is scary, because it was pretty damn bad!

I can STILL see a lot of the damn mini-grafts Bosley did for me, even after 3100 additional grafts from a good surgeon to attempt to camo them (1100 and 2000 grafts in 2 sessions nearly 10 years apart). This last 2000 graft cover-up procedure late last year *almost* buried them for good, but under the right conditions I can still see the little bastards. I don't think other people really notice them, it's just that my eyes are so trained in seeking them out. When you put 7-8 hairs in a singe graft, it just looks pluggy, period. That plus they put them in a bizarre stadium seating type pattern. Apparently it is going to take nearly a full canopy of hair like they do in Vancouver B.C. to cover the damn things once and for all. Maybe like Dewayne I can have the worst offending Bosley minis taken out. In summary, my entire HT plan is geared towards hiding the Bosley work. I guess that says it all.

Not to be a downer, but at a week or two you will probably have a hard time hiding things. You don't really have any hair to cover. You MIGHT be one of the lucky ones who recovers quickly, but you cannot count on this being the case. At two weeks I was still quite red, or maybe not red but a very deep pink. Sometimes it was very noticable, other times it wasn't too bad. It seems like it changed during the day. I would wake up in the morning and think "Oh, the redness is almost gone!". Then, later the same day, it would be back full force. Long story short, it was seriously a couple of months before I would have even *considered* going in public without a hat. In an office environment, there was simply no way I would have gone without a hat for a few months. In my office, I covered up the situation by just working weird hours, often overnights, worked a lot from home, etc. When I HAD to be there during the day, I wore a hat, which was thankfully accepted, although not smiled upon. I realize that my situation was gravy compared to most due to the flexibility and independent nature of my job. IMO the "down time" issues are perhaps the most complicated situation people face getting an HT. Sadly, required downtimes are not predictable and extremely individualistic, so people cannot really answer your question satisfactorily, but can only share their experiences. My personal opinion, with only a week or two, you are *really* pushing your luck. What is your situation specifically? Can you wear a hat at work? Can you be reclusive at work for a few weeks if need be? Would you just DIE if everybody found out about your HT, or would it just be a chuckle? Actually, in your case, they are probably going to know anyway eventually, because your appearance will be altered tremendously when the hair grows. Good luck - Stimpson

If it's just a little spot you are having filled in, and the strip taken is small, you can cut your as short as you want IMO. A small strip would not be detectable as an HT scar in particular, so who really cares. A lot of people have scars on their heads for a lot of different reasons. It is the long smiley face scars in particular that are the HT giveaway. If you don't have one of those you have no worries. - Stimpson

The economy won't even slow me down. My job is stable and my investments have nothing to do with the money that I will use for an HT. As long as I do not succeed a little too much, and end up having my earnings "spread around", I will be fine. I shudder to think what the doctors face as far as having their business earnings "spread around". This "spread the wealth" policy will seriously impact businesses, including HT businesses. One other thing about economic down times, and nobody ever mentions this, but economic downtimes tend to be a very good buying oppurtunity, whether talking about stocks or real estate or whatever. My opinion right now is BUY BUY BUY. If we become a socialist state, it will be nothing lost because we will all be peasants with nothing anyway (except for the liberal nobility). Oh, and botchedinatl - I understand exactly where you are coming from. I am one who probably would not have embarked on this road were it not for f***ing Bosley punks taking advantage of me at 22. A few more years and a little maturity and I probably would have just kept my hair trimmed very short. I'm happy now that HT results are so much better, and I love having hair. But make no mistake, I am also a slave to the HT process. I no longer have a choice. Again, I like the results I now have, and I look forward to having even more hair in about a year, but I do get sick of wondering what happens if I recede to a NW7, am I going to need another procedure when I'm 70, etc. It's a commitment, and once started there is no turning back. That is something 22 year olds, myself included, just have a hard time *really* understanding. - Stimson

All I can do is tell you that when I started finesteride/minox, I shed like MAD!! Front, temples, crown, the whole shebang! It was freaky!! But, all the hair came back after 3-4 months, and it looked better. I don't know if there was more hair or if it was just thicker or what. As for the crown/temple thing, that is where they tested it. I think finesteride is best at *regrowing* hair in the crown, if it is inclined to regrow hair for you at all. I think it is pretty good at holding and strengthening hair everywhere on the scalp though (again, if it is inclined to do so). My advice, stick with it. I know you have probably heard this, but the shedding is usually a good indicator. But, I too recall scurrying to the internet in search of info on drastic shedding, and I know it how alarming it is. I stuck with it, and it worked out well. If I were you I would stick with it. No sense quitting now, all you would get is the initial shed without even sticking it out to see if the drug works for you. JMO. - Stimpy

LOL! Don't even get me started on his *plethora* of issues!

If only this were true for me. I am the youngest of 3, with an older brother and also an older sister. I am pushing a NW6, and my brother has no detectable MPB at all. Stimpy

Better still! Stimpson

This is one of the main reasons why i am going to Dr. Wong in about a year for what I hope is my last surgery. He is not afraid to go BACK on the scalp, and into a little bit of hair. It seems like so many other doctors just focus on the frontal portion of the scalp. Plus, H@W do temple points so well, and they tend to get so many grafts. IMO these guys really are the masters. It's going to be pain in the ass getting back to D.C. all the way from Vancouver (I won't fly back because the staples will set off the metal detectors). I am going to do it, though. This is too important to settle for anything but the best, and a pain in the ass drive is not going to be a factor in the decision... Stimpy

oops... Sorry. I had my baldness types confused... Stimpson

I have heard that stress is a possible contributing factor to alopecia areata, which is NOT the same thing as MPB. Generally, alopecia areata is hair falling out, but not in any particular pattern. If your hair is thinning/receding in a typical MPB pattern, it is probably just MPB. I don't know whether hair that falls out due to stress comes back or not. Stimpson

youngsuccess - You are not alone. I too am a closeted non-Obama supporter at my place of work. I am right in the hornets nest in northern Virginia. I am taking election week off, because if Obama wins, it will be unbearable gloating, and if he loses, it will be unbearable hysterical accusing. I simply want no part of it, because the odds of being 'outed' will be very high (although unlike you I wouldn't face termination, only neverending irritation). btw - there are more of us than you might think. Just look for the ones who are silent when the crazy liberals make their obnoxious little wise-cracks. As for Biden's HT, well, I do credit him for not letting it stop him from public life. I had one little Bosley operation nowhere NEAR his disaster, and it kept me under a freaking hat for years. He apparently is not familiar with the concept of 'embarrasment', which I guess is evident from his political style too. Stimpson

If you want to hide it, all you can do is either drop off of the earth for a while, or wear a hat. If you do the hat, start wearing it BEFORE the transplant so that nobody is suspicious when you wear the hat AFTER the transplant. Blowdry - yes, friends tell spouses, who in turn tell friends, and so on... Again, if you do not want EVERYBODY to know, then don't tell ANYBODY!! Stimpson

It's probably a play on words. Something like by 'no touch' what they really mean is that they don't touch your butt or something like that. Stimpy

For my next and hopefully last strip procedure here in about a year, I am going to tell them to shave away!! Of course I plan on using Dr. Wong in Vancuover, so I believe it will be required anyway. The reason is that I want this last one to be as large a session as possible, as far back on my head as is feasible, and I already have a lot of hair on my scalp from previous operations plus some native thinning hair back towards the swirl. I want to create the absolute optimal environment, and I can easily hide under a hat for a few months while my hair grows back. Frankly, when you do a large session into existing hair, it seems like the ugly duckling phase is often brutal anyway. Might as well just shave it off IMO. Of course, for those who cannot hide under a hat, I know this is not always feasible. Issues like shaving, redness, etc. tend to be the HARDEST factor for most people in getting an HT. You can't really hide things if your head is shaved. Especially if only the TOP of your head is shaved. If you shave the back to match, the scar will be WAY visible. Recovery time and issues are huge, and sadly very unpredictable. I would not have really been comfortable without a hat after my previous operations for at least a couple of months (maybe more like three). I was NOT shaved. Things were MOSTLY okay after about a month, but not really comfortable for a few months. It is incorrect to assume that you can be back to work in a hatless environment in a couple of weeks without it being noticable, shaved or not. SOME people can. Most probably cannot. I guess for me, though, I just want to tip every single possible factor in my favor for getting good results. Everybody always says this, and i wonder sometimes if people who have not had an HT really appreciate the significance of this statement: You are STUCK with the results of your operation, and these results will be IMMEDIATELY on display for the rest of your life. Be careful. Bad HT results make baldness seem like a blissful dream. Stimpy

Thank you Dr. Lindsey. That is precisely what I meant when I said I could not even use the liquid. I dreaded applying the liquid. Between the irritation and the greasiness it ended up not being worth the trouble. The foam is no problem at all. Stimpy

To answer my own question, as well as Sparky's, according to H&W you should wait MINIMUM of 6 months after surgery before doing the exercises, but most prefer to wait a bit longer (9 months - 1 year). So Sparky should be fine doing them at six years post-op and I should be fine at one year. The scars are set and will not stretch further. Stimpy

Ceaser - It's tricky, because "going downhill right after making the switch" could be a minox induced shed phase, which *could* be indicative of good results to come from the foam. I tried the liquid about a year ago, and was quickly reminded why I stopped using it many years ago. I switched to the foam, and shed like crazy. But in fairness, I started finesteride about the same time, so I don't know exactly what caused the shedding. It might have been induced by the finesteride. Stimpy

Actually, the scabbing is one of the specific issues addressed in that article I posted above. They rudely yanked scabs off post HT, and before 5 days (IIRC), it *always* pulled the graft out with it. After 10 days, it NEVER pulled the graft out! So, if rudely yanking the scab from the HT itself after 10 days never pulls the graft out, it seems unlikely that pulling off a scab from an unrelated injury at 2 months would cause any damage whatsoever. A disclaimer, though, I guess if the injury was deep enough it *could* damage the follicles, whether transplanted or native. But the bottom line is that at 2 months, the transplanted hairs really *are* native. I know there is still scalp redness and all that, but the grafts themselves are long since secure. They are not even really grafts anymore, but just part of your head like the rest of your hair. Stimpy

Indeed, Rick, there would appear to be essentially no relation between alpecia areata, and alopecia androgenica (i.e. MPB). Alopecia areata is generally thought to be caused by stress or anxiety, although the causes are unknown. MPB of course is DHT choking off the hair according to genetic pre-programming. I think the entire argument for the liquid minox is that the propylene glycol causes follicle irritation, which opens the entrance and allows the minox to penetrate better. That is the gist of it from what I have found online and in patent apps and so forth. See US patent 5,972,345 which uses stinging nettle for the same purpose. Albeit, this may not be the intended purpose of the propylen glycol in rogaine, but I think john is saying this is an effect. Supposedly, however, the foam penetrates better. Does it *really*? I don't know. I know one thing though, and that is that irritatants are, well... irritating. Just my opinion - I'll take my chances with the foam. Seems to work okay for me. The liquid was not usable in my case. Truth be told, minox is not wildly acclaimed for growing hair anyway. It seems better at strengthening and holding what you have. Most of the tremendous results come from the minox/finersteride combo, and not just the minox alone. Stimpy

How big of a difference can doing scalp exercises make as far as increasing the donor available for a procedure? I know we are all different, but anybody have a ballpark average figure? Also, would it be acceptable to do these exercises *one* year after a previous surgery? Thanks - Stimpy