thanatopsis_awry

Yes. That's pretty much it. There was a video posted here some time back that showed the donor strip being removed. I think it's on youtube. The good news in the pictures you link to is that Bosley is using a single blade knife. When I had my HT done at L. I. Medical (Dr Hitzig, Dr Maleka, Dr Schwinning (Stay FAR away from any of them!!!!!) used a 3 blade knife for session sizes of 30 to 122 grafts. I'm sure I lost more follicles from disection and scarring in the donor area than were being transplanted. Hmm, thx, I'll try to find that clip -- I'm pretty interested in seeing what exactly goes on. And it never ceases to amaze how abhorrent the standards of surgery can be in the HT field!

Congrats on the decision! It's a great feeling to know you are on the cusp of a great, fruitful road!

Thx for the tips; I'm not ready to cross this bridge quite yet, but it's definitely something I want to explore as a possiblity and how it may or may not affect HT planning!

**image(s) contained within the link are graphic** http://www.bosleymedicalviolations.com/procedures.htm Is the strip excision procedure as highlighted in those two pictures the same as currently done by elite HT docs? If so, it doesn't overly concern me as all that really matters is what is looks like when closed up, how fast it heals, what it looks like after recovery, et. al. I was, however, struck by the images as it just wasn't something I had ever really imagined. Bottom line, it makes me appreciate the top docs even more and how vital it is to not get suckered into a surgical procedure with dangerous organizations that can royally *%$@ you up.

Ugh, I relate to the panic that sets in when hair loss really starts to become noticable, especially at such a young age (I'm in my 20's myself). I too wanted to beleive so badly in the amazing looking hair systems I saw being paraded around the net and on TV....in fact, I almost got suckered in by "Virtual Reality Hair" -- thank god I backed out at the last minute after doing some extensive research. flat out: they are NOT a panacea and not nearly the solution you think they are. Especially for someone as young as you, in school, getting into a hair system would present a whole new array of problems, not the least of which would be the very reasonable paranoia that goes along with always wondering if you are being detected....if the system is looking ok (because it WILL deterioriate)....can you take part in this activity and not damage (read: make obvious) the system. also, if you lead an active lifestyle (read: working out, sports, even if you just sweat a lot) there will be even more paranoia and potential problems. Not too mention the really obscene cost (this doesn't go so much for places like toplace and coolpiece, which, imo, are an elite, safe option if you ever do go that route). as it was pointed out, the money spent on these juiced up wigs can be put towards some truly marvelous procedures (e.g. an elite HT, or, in the future, hair multiplecation/cloning). i would: take some pictures and post them on a site such as this and get feedback; talk to your doctor about The Big Three (propecia, rogaine foam, nizoral); save up and know that you are living in a golden age of hair restoration where, when you become a viable candidate for a HT, you will get a devestatingly effective solutional path. w/e you do, don't get suckered into a contract before you are 100% sure you know what you are getting and how it will work.

Those legs are innnnnsaneeeeee! lol. I'm competetive in boxing/ma, and between all the sport-specific training I do its super tough to fit in good workouts dedicated more towards weight/mass...going to try this bicep workout as well, though, sounds sweet! Also, I seem to remember King Kamali (spelling? pro bodybuilder, fyi) telling me during high-school that if you want super beefy arms and size to focus most of your training on the triceps? Anyone have any opinions on this.

I've contemplated the usage of a partial crown piece as a potential weapon in my arsenal as well....could use what grafts I have to concentrate more aggressively on other regions and save the partial piece for where it really does work best -- the crown. Does anyone know how difficult it is to create and then apply a partial piece (to the crown) using toplace or coolpiece? I've read so many horror stories about the "professional salons" that hook you up w/ hair systems that I would rather go the root of like toplace or coolpiece, which I have heard nothing but rave things about....however, I imagine it could be pretty difficult to find, create, and apply properly...?

I think Max is seeking info on how important donor area is, and what people's donor areas have been like, and what kind of results they have been able to achieve; how many grafts (apporox)might he be able to harvest; what can be be achieved based off of various types of donor area....and the 1-10 scale is just a relative (prolly' too general) term in gauging how fruitful an HT can be w/ regard to donor viability. What I don't know is what factors make up the numerical rating. Jotronic is a "3" -- meaning his donor charachteristics are not obv amazing, yet he was able to harvest 8g's and look really good....does this mean he had lots of donor hair, but poor thickness; or poor quantity but great quality;and then via H&W's skill he was able to get amazing results despite a less than stellar donor area...?

Only you can be the judge, of course; but, if I were to do a competitive analysis of this site with others I don't think there would be much disagreement. Bottom line (from my experiences) -- you get the least B.S. here, as there is the highest quotient of valid information and even keeled temperment. It's also a rather "conservative" site; by that I mean it is very critical of unorthodox/unproven methods, very strict standards for who is/isn't an HT candidate, and a discriminating eye for doctors/procedures. Hair Loss Talk, e.g., (and other forums) have nuggets of solid information and perspective to be found; however, by and large they can be a bit like a zoo w/o cages and often bear greater resemblence to a soap opera or talk show than a hair loss community. Different forums for different folks.

Being a "good" candidate for a HT is only half the battle, unfortunatly; the other half is making sure you don't roll the dice with a suspect doctor, jeopardizing your time, money, and precious donar supply. Based off of the fact that lasers are being touted, as well as a 1200 graft session for a NW5+ (wow).....it already sounds like a criminal procedure that you should *seriously* hesitate and investigate. http://www.hairtransplantnetwork.com/Consult-a-Physicia...nsplant-surgeons.asp is a list of "recommended" HT practitioners. Of the "coalition doctors", I beleive they are all located in either the U.S., U.K., Canada, Belgium, and Brazil....while travelling is never ideal, it is often a necessary evil if you don't want to sacrifice expected quality and results.

What you are describing is a somewhat similar scenario to myself ~2years ago. I don't actually beleive there is a clear-cut answer for you; personally, if I was in your "exact" situation I would wait, as I wouldn't be *that* bothered by the hair loss and would find ways around it, and would wait at least a year+ on The Big Three and re-evaluate....but, I'm not you -- we all experience things differently and have a varying tolerance....and a tolerance for risk. Like most decisions, there will be +s and -s, both in the immediate future and the long-term future....you've begun educating yourself well, and have a solid idea now about why you might wanna hold off....for how long is really up to your m.o. on risk and how your hair loss progresses, which is out of your control. Think long n' hard on how badly your hair loss is affecting you; theoretically weigh what you will gain from a HT now against the road it will most likely lead you on and what that means to you. It's not a simple decision, and, imo, it really boils down to a personal decision -- but, whatever you choose, make sure you have educated yourself well and have thought rationally before you decide which road you want to travel!

Topher, none readily available right now, but I will have a bunch in the coming weeks which I'll be sure to PM to you w/! My hairline is actually quite strong, along with my sides/temples and back; bad diffuse pattern thinning, however. I've responded very well to the propecia/nizoral over the past 15months, thankfully, and am going to start up rogaine foam post-ht. I'm looking at two mega-session HTs over the next decade as well as a possible 3rd touchup....just in time for HM Best of luck, I think your taking your hair in a positive direction.

Being 22, I can understand the panic and dismay that sets in when you find yourself in the throws of hairloss. There is a glut of valid reasons for why you should not explore surgery at this point, and instead get on non-surgical treatment for ~12months and then re-assess. This would be the safe, conservative play and also the standard rule of thumb for how to proceed. Your hair loss is really at its genesis so its hard to say where you may be headed and how aggressive or non-aggressive your hair loss will be. *However* you clearly feel there is a major issue with your hair that needs to be addressed in a robust manner. This too is a reality. So maybe you are willing to roll the proverbial dice to ensure satisfaction with your hair in the present and near-future. Your hair really isn't that bad for a 26 year old, and it looks fairly strong and "youthfull", your now "mature" hairline aside. Regardless of whether you decide to get a HT now or a year from now or 10 years from now, the most important things to do, imo, are: get on The Big Three, consult w/ doctors Nelly mentioned and ask tons of questions and voice all your thoughts(Dr. Feller imo has a superb mind, and is also a FUE guru but you can't go wrong either way), give dermmatch or toppik a try, experiment with different hair styles/hair products, which, imo, may do wonders for you. I have a pretty bold attitude toward HTs, but given all the info you have provided, I would 100% say you should hold off, at least for the time being, and heed the various nuggets of advice given in this thread. **above all else, inform yourself from various angles and thoughts, and then make a rationale decision where you can live with the consequences**

I'm assuming you would have had a 3k or whatever FUT session; say, 6 months down the road you decide you want a "touch up", and FUE would make a lot of sense for this. Or, a doctor employs a 5k FUT, but doesn't think its best to do more in a single sesson. Because of the (lack of) invasiveness with FUE, how quickly can you hypoethitcally have a procedure done after a FUT.

Hottdamn! I think you are in for a seriously dramatic (and positive) change....nearly 3800 grafts in that area is going to be so nice. Congrats!

What did Dr. True recommend for you, surgically speaking?

I've seen it stated that ~12+ months is a standard time differential for FUT procedures; and, for FUE it is exponentially less (e.g. a few months, a few weeks, a few days...?). What about a FUT-FUE combo, the FUT coming first. This 1-2punch seems to be gaining some steam, and I'm curious what is a recommended time gap between the two. *if it makes a difference, assume in this case that the FUT is 2k+, and the FUE ~300-500*

I've seen it stated that ~12+ months is a standard time differential for FUT procedures; and, for FUE it is exponentially less (e.g. a few months, a few weeks, a few days...?). What about a FUT-FUE combo, the FUT coming first. This 1-2punch seems to be gaining some steam, and I'm curious what is a recommended time gap between the two. *if it makes a difference, assume in this case that the FUT is 2k+, and the FUE ~300-500*

This will be my only post in this thread, and hopefully it will spur "Grace" to actually step up to the plate and produce for once. I will keep this as impersonal as possible, though when someone goes into hysterics w/ psychotic threats, and bizarre insults at state univeristies it isn't always easy, sorry... **shudder** Where are the pictures, Grace? Most don't want to see your mug; we care about actual *results*, and the actual services that are being offered to prospective patients....do you still not understand this very simple, but singularly important point!? With all the supremely satisfied Bosley patients sworn to secrecy (and all those supremely screwed patients mere "aberrations") it'd be nice to finally see that Bosley is no longer a fecal-stain in hair restoration industry & that young, prospective patients can safely adopt their services...to be clear: IF GOING TO BOSLEY WASN'T THE EQUIVOLENT OF HAIR-RESTORATION-RUSSIAN-ROULETTE, AND IF SO MANY PEOPLE HAVEN'T RECEIVED SUB-STANDARD SURGERIES NO ONE WOULD BE AGAINST BOSLEY...THE BURDEN OF PROOF IS ON YOU TO ALTER THIS PERCEIVED TRUTH! STOP CARRYING ON WITH THIS UNTACTFUL, PASSIVE-AGGRESSIVE PERSONA AND ADDRESS THE CORE POINT! I would actually love to be wrong on this one, so I'm really hoping to see the super-adequate results that you may put up; it would be nice to know that there are certain Bosley clinics that can consistently produce results tantamount to, say, Coalition docs...until then, its all cheap talk from this Bosley laborer. Please, prove otherwise.

Heinous.

VN. Really adds more fullness, cool cosmetic change for sure.

Some (additonal) helpful perspective, perhaps: I'm early 20's as well, and while my thinning is rather pronounced in the frontal region it hasn't reached the scope or intensity of yours....however, after consulting w/ True&Dorin (who are oft noted for their conservative approach) I was recommended for ~1200 (and was told that the results would not be dramatic.) I'll reiterate what has been said: meet or e-consult with, I would say, multiple coalition docs....while it may not be "best" to receive some gargantuan megasession @ this first go around, 1300 seems way way to small....*especially* when you factor in the various discomforts and drawbacks that are inherent to getting the surgery -- make sure that when making such pivotal moves you are acting with absolute confidence.

FWIW, I *completely* empathize with you (10YO, Craven)....I'm barely into my 20s & my greatest fear is that I'll follow an emotional/psychological path similar to yours where the feelings you've mentioned will be omnipresent for year after year after year... I really feel that for some (i.e. when it afflicts someone with certain emotional and psychological predilictions), "hair loss" can be tantamount to a wretched, powerful illness....curse...disability even. If it wasn't for the hope of future HTs and concealers I'm positive I would have continued a wallowing descent into total social stagnation. Even as things stand, I'm precariously positioned -- the possibility that my hair loss will take sporadic, aggressive, punishing turns lurks...and that I'll be in a constant state of dissatisfaction, always trying to play catch up, loosing a half-step or so each way. Alas, we must just inform ourselves as much as possible, take action that gives us the best shot, and pray that another breakthrough occurs sooner than later.

Good stuff, mang. Doesn't look like you experienced "shockloss" badly either. Really looks like you've nipped this thing right in the bud!

Diamond, Really, really sorry that on top of dealing with MPB (at a young age, no less), that you must also cope with Bosley's questionable ethics, as well as surgical skill.... Really makes me ****** furious at Bosley and their shills.... At any rate, getting a consultation w/ True&Dorin should be an excellent move, setting yourself up on a solid path for the future. Best of luck, though I don't think you are even going to be needing any!