1966kph

Fue2014

I think that more and more people are starting to accept that techs can do extractions but some are not.

It was the same when fue first started appearing and now look were we are.

The difference with maral is that some people will say that a tech doing the incisions is a step to far.

Some people changed their minds about fue and the techs doing extraction also.

Its only through seeing constant good results from any given type of procedure that opinions change as happened with fue when it first appeared.

The fue v fut debate is still discussed or argued still.

We all have different opinions and mine is good techs are capable of achieving very good results.

Look at britboys results from what he's had and I would say at 9 months post op his results are very good and it is clear evidence that reenforces my point techs can do incisions to.

The answers to some questions are gained through images all I say is what answer do you see as to whether techs can do incisions also?

Have a good day

Who is the we in the below quote?

And to which dr are you referring to?

And how do you come this conclusion of were he is during the op?

Quote by blake)We don't feel comfortable recommending a clinic to a patient if we know the physician will be at a desk or in another facility performing different surgeries while an unknown non-physician is operating on the patient.) end quote

And yes I agree this is not the place to discuss this

So back on topic.

You say you like the presentatation and yes it is good so why is it they can do a presentation like this but asmed is incapable of presenting photos showing dry hair in pre op photos.

They have been asked to do this god knows how many times.

Please act on behalf of the community blake and ask them to present photos with the hair dry in pre op photographs.

Please will you do this for us blake?

Hello britboy I hope your healing up well.

Didn't you know techs cannot do the full ht or at least incisions and a lot of people think extractions to.At your starting point with maral to the results you have posted your only 9 months out after a 3600 graft fue and the results just prove the nay sayers wrong.

More than anything though I'm happy for YOU.

All the years of suffering is coming to a end for you after several ops with DOCTORS you finally get your results with a team of TECHNICIANS assembled by a dr that gets so much grief its off the scale.

Who were the docs who said you were a poor candidate for further ht's ?

You should go and post your photos on the thread dr Karadeniz started yesterday called ( urgent consumer advice ) regarding who should be doing ht.Your result at 9 months is better than any he has shown yet.

Have a good day and congrats

Hello blake.

You have made the comparison before but for me and this is in regard to fue not fut your comparisons are not good ones.

With respect you are fresh out of med school and have only resently come to the conclusion that fut is better than fue.A lot of the most respected fue drs on the planet have taken the decision to have techs do extractions why do you think they do this is?

Is it that they are being self serving in regard to monetary gain?

Have they got lazy and cannot be bothered with this arduous task?

Do you think that they have started caring less about the results and the patients?

Blake why not ask Erdoğan, Lorenzo and all the other drs that have techs doing extractions the above questions.

I think the answer you will get is that they believe the tech is as capable as they are in doing this crucial part of the op because of their training and experience,

Anything other than a answer similar to this will make it obvious they do not have the patients best interest at heart so which answer do you think your going to get? Will you believe the answer they give? Will you change your opinion based on the answer?

As a American dr blake are entering into the American ht industry were more and more people are wanting fue but because of the way the industry is regulated in the states the associated costs to the customers are so high its forcing them to go abroad as is clearly evident.

Dr karadeniz works as many others do within a ever declining niche market that they do all the extractions but who has the more patients going their way dr Karadeniz or drs Erdoğan, Lorenzo, maral,donagay ?

We will always have people going for both fut and fue just as we will have people going to dr Karadeniz or dr erdoğan.

Pup, ko or anyone else for that matter were would you go given the chance even if it were free? Would it be Lorenzo and have techs do the extractions or dr Karadeniz who will do all the extractions? You don't need to bother answering you and I know the answer and if its Lorenzo that makes your arguments a bit weaker does it not?

Very few people who have researched thoroughly would go to dr Karadeniz given the above scenario and its based purely on the results we have seen from both drs its that simple,We would not on the principle that we hold go to the place were we thought we were going to get a inferior result would we?

The US needs to relax its hands tieing restrictions if it is to have a fighting chance with the competion from abroad and Turkey needs to regulate the industry more stringently to protect people from the unethical practice's that litter its country.

Dr karadeniz needs to concentrate IMO on acheiveing better results to show case his talents than try and undermine his very successful peers within his own country as I said above its results we are looking for plain and simple.

Have a nice day

I read this statement after the 2014 ISHRS conference. It seems perfectly logical to me. I'm sure my motives will be questioned here, but I've never understood the argument behind taking the surgeon out of the surgery. If I was going to court, I would hire a lawyer, not a paralegal; if I were chartering a jet, I would hire a pilot to fly, not a flight attendant; If my loved ones were undergoing surgery, I would insist a surgeon performed the procedure, not a technician. In the end, it's just ethical and best for patients.

I suppose you could ask Erdoğan if he would put some nape hair in the hairline to help soften it and also express your concerns to him regarding hairlines.

Have a good day

Hello ready.

I know your gathering as much info as possible which is very wise but at the end of the day its your decision which must be based on your research of these two drs.

Do a check list.

Do three sections

List one dr Erdogans + points

List two dr Feriduni's + points.

List three list all that you are looking to achieve with the ht.

Then compare list one and two to list three to see which ticks the most boxes.

Its not as simple as this obviously but it may help a little.

One things for sure you've picked to excellent drs that in my opinion you can't go wrong with.

Do you require the soft hairline or the coverage and density most.

If its the hairline dr feriduni if its coverage and density its dr Erdogan.

Have a nice day

Yes all relevant in the USA .

So dr Karadeniz what do you suggest that the ishrs do to members who do not comply? Banish them from the ishrs ?

If so wave good bye to the top drs on the planet,Erdoğan, Lorenzo, Donagay ect ect I do not think you are going to reverse this growing trend dr Karadeniz but you carry on but I think your urinating in the wind.

You your self have undertaken ht procedure were these recommendations were not adhered to.

If the top drs deem it appropriate to operate this way I trust their judgement.Expertise. And many many years of experience over your rather limited experience in comparison ( no offence intended ) as I'm sure you agree experience counts for a lot ?

This is why the fue procedures in the US is dying a death compared to Europe and Turkey were people are flocking to.

If I remember rightly in a resent ishrs report about 60% of drs in the USA said they had convinced the patients to go for fut when they had their heart set on fue when they came in the door so make of that what you will.

If your on a crusade dr Karadeniz I think you would do better talking to your country's government to implement the laws of your land as many many people are having their lives ruined because of it.

Have a good day

Seeking Hair Restoration Surgery?

Be sure that a properly trained licensed physician* is responsible for your treatment.

 

 

The International Society of Hair Restoration Surgery (ISHRS) is concerned about the growing risk to patients of unlicensed technicians performing substantial aspects of hair restoration surgery. The use of unlicensed technicians to perform aspects of hair restoration surgery, which should only be performed by a properly trained and licensed physician*, places patients at risk of: (i) misdiagnosis; (ii) failure to diagnose hair disorders and related systemic diseases; and (iii) performance of unnecessary or ill advised surgery all of which jeopardizes patient safety and outcomes. There may also be a risk that unlicensed technicians may not be covered by malpractice insurance.

 

The ISHRS believes the following aspects of hair restoration surgery should only be performed by a licensed physician*:

Preoperative diagnostic evaluation and consultation

Surgery planning

Surgery execution including:

Donor hair harvesting

Hairline design

Recipient site creation

Management of other patient medical issues and possible adverse reactions

Post-operative care

To help insure patients have information needed to make informed decisions about who performs their hair restoration surgery, the ISHRS urges potential patients to ask the following questions as well as questions regarding costs, risks, and short and long-term benefits and planning:

 

Patients Should Ask These Questions:

Who will evaluate my hair loss and recommend a course of treatment? What is their education, training, licensure, and experience in treating hair loss?

 

Who will be involved in performing my surgery, what role will they play, and what is their education, training, licensure, and experience performing hair restoration surgery?

 

Will anyone not licensed by the state be making incisions or harvesting grafts during my surgery? If so, please identify this person, explain their specific role and why they are legally permitted to perform it.

 

Is everyone involved in my surgery covered by malpractice insurance?

 

Consumer Alert | International Society of Hair Restoration Surgery

I know hasson and Wong always asked that patients do scalp stretching exercises months prior to surgery.In my opinion this has helped them achieve the outstanding results their known for.

Have a good day

Your results are looking very good especially seen as how your only 9 months Brit you've gotta be happy considering were you started from with maral.

Results such as yours made me actually bite the bullet and commit to get a ht with maral.

One of the hardest decisions of my life not which clinic to choose but whether to bother.

You obviously needed repairs and I'm happy your finally getting the results you have been searching 20 years for you've suffered enough.

Maral does not need to be a recommended doctor here its results like yours that send people his way.

Congrats and I look forward to this next chapter.

So much for techs being incapable of giving good results!

Have a good day

Thats a good point ko and one that I suppose we need to ask and be told the truth about.

This is presuming that there is not any kind of qualification certificate that could be produced as way of proof.

Have a good day

How do you know which techs are "highly experienced" and which are only moderately so?

I think you should be more specific when categorising everywhere doing ht without a doc doing the work.

There are the places you describe dr Karadeniz were they are made up of vehicle technicians or theatre techs and so on.

But then there are places that have highly trained ht techs with vast experience doing the work.its a big difference in the likely outcome for the patients.

Look up what technician means. - someone with skill and artistry - the places you have high lighted that blight the lives of desperate people have neither of these qualities and even less compassion for another human being.

Only my opinion you don't need to insult me again by calling me a troll.

Have a nice day

Spanker I've seen your results you don't need anymore hair well not for a long while I hope.

Have a good day you hairy bugger.

What are your thoughts on total harvest. This has been heavily debated, but I stand by my belief that a person in my shoes, average density and super laxity can yield more grafts utilizing strip.

I think the US is somewhat handicapped because of the restrictions in regard to fue extractions.

If you take a look at a photo asmed just posted up in a presentation he must have at least 20 members of staff to keep going.

I asked the question on that thread how many patients they can deal with in a day but as yet its not been answered.

Erdoğans rates have climbed as has the number of patients and staff yet he only does the incisions and spends very little time with each individual patient.

Its a conveyer belt for patients and a clinic that fits the definition of a hair mill to a t but the standard of results is still very high.

Its a cost effective well oiled machine and a big business success story.

Have a good day

No its a quarter of a 5 milligram tablet.

We all react differently to meds but we don't know till we try them out.

If I were you I would get some 5mg generic finasteride tablets and take a quarter per day.

I would also be using minoxidil 5% 2x a day.

Take some photos now then at the end of each month and compare the results to see if they are working.

Have a nice day

I just had a quick look sone if them look like they had transplants haha but mist if them are on 1.25 mill a day what is 1.25? The whole pill.. Will a quarter a day even make a difference in 10-12 months or do you reckon it will just stablelize it

Hello wizz.

Yes just get a pipp cutter and cut the 5mg tablet into four and take a quarter a day.

If you experience any side effects just alter the dose level down to say a eighth of the tablet a day or take the quarter every other day.

Sorry I cannot give you the link to the thread as I'm doing this off my phone.

Just google Bernstein medical he has quite a lot of people he treats with meds and there's a gallery of photos to look at.

Hope this helps you out a little.

Have a nice day

If i do go on meds how do you suggest i take them to aviod sides cut it in four and take a quarter a day?

One doc might be booked up solid for months one might need your custom sooner.

So your not on meds? Sorry if I missed if you have already said.

If I were you I would get on the meds and see were they get you might be content with their results I have seen some very good results from meds.

Just luck back at the competition Mick from farjo did.

We had to guess how many grafts the person had and it turned out he was just on meds I think I guessed about 2700.

See what the meds give you, keep saving and researching and what will be will be.

Have a good day

Some very interesting thought provoking comments are any of you gonna throw in a answer to some of the other questions?

The one question I was really hoping some might answer was how much would you be prepared to pay and I should of posed it better but I meant in total to achieve the desired results not price per graft?

?10.000-?30.000-?100.000 anything?

Have a good day

Are we being over charged for hair transplantts?

How much have you spent thus far in the quest for more hair?

How much are you prepared to pay?

What do you think you should be paying?

Where would you be prepared to travel to in order to save money?

What do you think should happen within the industry to lower cost for the consumer?

Do you think drs are uncaring in demanding the price they do?

Do you think drs should drop prices if they indeed do have our best interest at heart?

Have a good day and I look forward to the forth coming responses to these questions

Why would you even think of a question like this?

Would you have one?

I know some people say they would kill to have hair but they don't really mean it.

I've heard the expression of stepping into dead mans shoes but this wearing someone elses scalp,Thats bizarre

I think your misunderstanding when we talk of the donor region its actually a region on ones own head.

Have a good evening.

Is a full scalp transplant from a deceased person possible?

Did you ever see anything even resembling this in your time at H&W Joe ?

Have a nice day

Cases like this are unpredictable. As SFGF said, his doctor claims to have seen zero indicators for this type of outcome. Playing devil's advocate, had he seen the issue I'm sure he would have taken measures to avoid such an outcome.

 

When patients are in consultation with doctors (or consultants of doctors) that perform FUT there should be a laxity test where the doctor or consultant literally pulls and/or pushes on the donor zone to see how much vertical movement there is. This is the only way to determine laxity. However, there are cases where the laxity is not what it may seem. The mastoid processes are the two areas at the back of the scalp where tension is normally higher. If you compare the skull to a square box the mastoid processes would be the rear two corners. It is this area where doctors will usually run into challenges with laxity and in RARE situations for even the most experienced FUT doctor these areas will be unusually tight and catch them off guard thereby requiring adjustments to allow for healing via secondary intention (as Blake referenced earlier).

 

This appears to be more serious because it looks like the entire length of the donor wound has been left open, or re-opened. I believe that if this were an issue isolated to one area of above average tension then that area would be the one to have release of tension by allowing the wound to re-open so I'm left a bit confused as to what really may or may not have happened. If this were one isolated area then the rest of the wound could heal as expected leaving a shorter length of the wound in need of eventual revision. In this case, the entire length of the wound will have to be revised which could indicate the tension was more severe over the entirety of the wound.

 

 

However, the donor scar most likely will not be as wide as the open wound we see in the photos as skin will fill in and the wound will become smaller before permanent scar tissue settles in. I suspect that once everything has healed the appearance will be much more acceptable (but still wider than anyone would wish for). Unfortunately it takes about six months to get to that point and even then it will be another two to four months before a revision should be attempted. It is just sad that

This is 7 months is that right Brit?

How much did it improve in the 2 months since these photos were taken?

Your at 9 months currently so I presume its still improving?

Good luck with your second round results with maral

13/12/14 updates

Well if you Google it.... 209,000 results come up. :confused: It is not how many anyways. You still have to buy malpractice insurance $$$$. I never have been in a auto accident but I've payed well over the price of a new car for policies in my lifetime.

We are indeed in the same boat I have two cars to insure but unfortunately for me my wife feels compelled to crash into anything and everything so insurance has always been expensive.

I f my wife says anything about my ht maybe I'll say I could of had one years ago if I hadn't had to spend lots of money on car insurance!

Apart from that she's a wonderful woman.

Have a good evening.

Caveat emptor had to look that one up but that would be a dream, What a gauntee that would be? You have your ht and if your happy say 18 months later you pay.

Have a good day

How many HT doctors are you aware of that have been successfully sued for malpractice in the United States? Can you name a single one? Also, there are practically no regulations on HT's in the United States, it is, and always has been, Caveat emptor.

And I appreciate your opinions squatch.

We are not all going to Agee all the time if we did we would all be going to one doc.

I appreciate all I have which is not much but I am just about tottaly content with my life having got more than I ever dreamt of with two wonderful kids and a brilliant wife.

Hopefully I will get a good results at a price I'm prepared to pay as to this point I never had a ht for one reason and its because I felt selfish.

I have had the money in the past but I would rather suffer myself rather than my family and I'm honestly glad I did its made me a lot better person I think.

We pay our money however much that maybe but none of us have a gaunteed good result so at that point we are all in the same boat.

I honestly dispair for the future that my children have to live in I honestly think that its a more selfish society were people chase money and others have to endure hardship for their actions.

I really like the Charlie Chaplin speech in the film the great dictator as I think in parts its almost phothetic and tried to steer us away from today 70 years later.

Live and let live is my motto.

Have a good day

Good luck on your HT. I wish the best. I'm glad you are choosing what fits yours needs. I think we would be all better without the bureaucracy in the medical field. If you ask most in America, the reason for high prices is government and the chance of being sued. I don't disagree with most of what you stated. Just giving an opinion.

Thats a very good way to look at it. We live we learn we make mistakes I know it must really suck but to think in the grand scheme of things its nothing compared to others suffering is a good philosophy to help you deal with this.

Very commendable train of thought which I applaud you for.

I hope things turn out as well as possible for you.

Have a nice day

Thanks for all the advice

 

I am going to give it a few more months and see what happens, if it doesn't improve so be it. Life is too short to worry about a few less follicles at the back of my head, people around the world are suffering from much worse. I'll consider it a lesson learnt

I have only ever seen this a time or two in my 10+ years of looking into ht but I'm sure its happened quite a lot hence the amount of corrective work some drs get.Umar must of seen some sights in his time!

Hasson and Wong to my knowledge have not produced any thing like this and they have done some massive strip cases

Skill level I think played a massive part in this resulting mess which was only compounded further with the lack of after care and sympathy shown by the dr.

Have a good day

While this is bad, I'm not sure that the doctor is all that much to blame. Accidents and unforeseen circumstances do happen, and it could be that this poor guy was in the 0.1%. Rather this is just a limitation of strip surgery, when you cut out a strip, there is always the risk that the tension may just be too much. Usually doctors check for laxity, I would hope the surgeon did that, and if so, it may be hard to fault him.