NARMAK

"Do NOT fear Finasteride!"

That's the plain and simple advice to my 18 year old self and also "Buy/Mine Bitcoin!!!, it reaches $65k!!!" lol. 

I think the fear mongering in 2008 put me off the medication but am grateful i still had enough hair to save with medication now and have a good shot with any HT even a decade plus later. 

Good luck on your journey and i agree with the above post. The "Gold Standard" of treatments pretty much remains unchanged but perhaps we can say Microneedling with a derma pen, oral Minoxodil and laser therapy data has improved for current regimens to be decided on. 

4 hours ago, SoSoz said:

I was consulting a hair surgeon and I told him im taking 1mg finasteride, he said that it's not enough and that I need to use supportive treatments such as laser therapy and special shampoos to stimulate the hair. How is that a thing? I thought that finasteride theraphy for long term is enough for maintenance of the hair.

As your response to Gatsby proved, this person you talked to is using an unscrupulous tactic to try extract more money from you on an upsell. Very scummy of them in some ways.

There is evidence that laser therapy that matches the clinically supported study can help your hair, but Finasteride is the heavy lifter by actually inhibiting DHT production as much as possible. All the rest are not going to give as much of an impact imo. 

If your hair loss doesn't slow enough, then a change to Dutasteride is possible but overall, the only two products imo that are proven to actually be effective are Finasteride and Minoxodil. Things like Microneedling are probably the 3rd best thing to add in your regimen as it's only necessary once a week at 1mm to 1.5mm abd you can then add in Nizoral with 2% ketoconazole too. The benefit of a laser cap at the quality required to what it costs is not going to be worth it imo. You're better off spending money on getting Vitamins you're lacking in your diet, drinking more water etc. 

Personally i understand the desire to keep your privacy and agree that if you wish to stay anonymous, then a unique username to the site and blurred face/cropped would be the way to go. 

I personally am okay with sharing my pictures with face cropped to help people get a realistic idea of progress and so on, but i have no desire to really show off anymore. Not because i necessarily have anything to hide, but because i don't need anonymous people identifying me either. 

If there's somebody in a specific context, i don't mind sharing my HT story and details, but most folks i think just want to get on with their lives anonymously and enjoy the results. 

A hair transplant can help you feel more confident depending on where you started off in terms of hair loss by making you look younger or even more like your age again. 

The issues of self confidence though being boosted by a HT sometimes might only work in tandem with other wholesale changes in your lifestyle such as getting in shape, finding your dream job and income. 

You definitely can find a boost overall, but i don't think anybody should go into a HT thinking it will be the magic bullet to change your life which you already highlighted but unfortunately some people do think like that and it needs to be countered. 

I personally feel a bit more confident with the framing of the temple points but there's much more in my eyes that i would work on that would probably have benefitted me in terms of confidence apart from just a hair transplant, but i would for sure say its a pretty big part of something i wanted to tick off and sooner rather than later because i think how it takes 12+ months for results and also, you could require a 2nd procedure for density and so whilst you get a hair transplant, you can use that time to work in tandem on getting in shape, fixing your style and even getting a better paying job. It will all come together to create a much better wholesale change than just a HT. 

1 hour ago, MazAB said:

Hi guys, sorry I'm a little late posting. It was officially 2 months last week. The pictures I've taken were from back on the 6th. I think the grafts are now starting to pop. I've definitely seen an improvement from even last week, but would prefer to post the shots that represent the correct timeline.

I, like @Zoomster, have had a good response from oral minoxidil. However, I was not as lucky as @Zoomster with the shedding part. Both native and transplanted areas were definitely affected. Even the sides and back of my head were affected. The good news is that I believe the worst of the shedding is behind me, and the oral minoxidil is making a noticeable difference with early growth. If I take macro shots of my scalp and zoom in, I can see newly forming grafts pop thru, so hopefully month 3 will have a decent visual improvement. I've realized that the high you get from seeing new growth never gets old, no matter how many procedures you've had!😁

Even at this stage entering the so called ugly duckling phase, the previous HT has just got such a solid foundation it doesn't make the shedding look egregious at alp and just a bit of natural looking thinning at best based on these shots. 

Plus, i think the early Oral Minoxodil shedding combined with the ugly duckling phase should mean everything rebounds in sync and really has a great look as you ramp up over the next months. 

Good luck Armen and i can definitely say the final journey seems on track for you to well and truly get the result you're happy with for life. 

42 minutes ago, wavypaint said:

My whole life my hairline has been extremely high up my forehead, making the upper third of my head look far out of proportion with the lower two thirds. It pretty much resembles the shape of a receding hairline which makes me look like a 50 year old if I have my hair up. This means I always have to style my hair in a way that covers my forehead. I’m getting pretty tired of it and now I am working full time I don’t really want to be in a position where I’m constantly worrying about my hair anymore. Having done some research, it appears there are two options, forehead reduction or hair transplant. However, since forehead reductions tend not to be appropriate for men, I am hoping a hair transplant could lower my hairline by about 1.5cm so that it balances my facial proportions better.

I am only 22 (soon turning 23) which I know is likely to be controversial in my decision, but having done much research and thought carefully about it, aside from my age I believe I am a good candidate for a transplant. I still have very thick hair all over including my donor area. I am a good respondent to finasteride, which I started taking at age 19 after feeling some minor thinning at my temples and didn’t want to take any chances. My hairline hasn’t changed since. I’ve uploaded some photos here to show my hairline currently (wet in photo), which is pretty much identical to the one I’ve had since I was a child. Obviously in my case, adding further medications such as minoxidil isn’t going to bring the hairline any further forward. I plan on taking finasteride indefinetly, and if my hairline were to eventually receed, I would move onto DUT to prevent further loss.

Based on my photos, how many grafts do you think would be required to provide sufficient density? I would want to match my current hair density as closely as possible whilst still being sensible as I obviously would want to keep grafts left over in case a future transplant was needed. Based on similar cases I’ve seen, is 2000-2500 grafts a good estimate?

The thing I’ve been struggling with the most is how to decide what clinic I should go with. Don’t think I can trust anywhere in Turkey to be reliable enough to consider. Also, I am based in the UK and It’s very difficult to determine what clinics are worthwhile here. Some of Dr Arshad’s results impressed me, but I have also found a number of cases where transplants from him have failed which makes me a bit apprehensive, and I am not really impressed by Dr Farjo. I am potentially open to the idea of travelling to Europe for one since I’ve seen good results from the clinics recommended on this forum, although the wait lists seem to be quite long. If I was hoping to get a transplant in late spring 2023 is it worth me enquiring now to get added to the waiting list? Even then how long could I expect to wait?

Also would any clinics outright reject me due to my age, or is it case dependent? Would the fact that my hair has been stabilised on finasteride be sufficient for them to consider me?

Would be grateful for any advice.

Having a higher hairline placement naturally can make you feel self conscious and i completely get that, but you're still only 22 and it's hard to see from wet hair pictures how things stand and whether there's going to be further hair loss, even with Finasteride but you smartly identified that it could help you stop or slow further loss. 

In your situation, i would personally stay on the Finasteride and start saving up for a great clinic and doctor for when you turn 25. This is the age the majority of places are willing to consider you and if you can show photos and evidence you haven't lost ground whilst on Finasteride, they'll be open to lowering your hairline enough. 

I have to warn you though. Hairline lowering with a hair transplant carries with it the risk of losing hair behind and playing a game of catch up and losing if your hair loss is aggressive and you run out of grafts for full coverage. 

Do yourself a favour, get like an eyebrow liner pen and scrunch your forehead muscles, draw the hairline design you want and take pictures. You can also maybe try scrunching your forehead and doing it on the editing freehand but up to you. 

Personally i think to get a full and proper density, you will be looking at approximately 2-2.5k grafts to lower it down to where i have a strong suspicion you probably want to end up at. 

2 hours ago, StillAlive said:

Bear in mind, finasteride does little to preserve the hairline or temples, it's mostly for keeping your crown and donor stable. The pics are taken in different light, so it's hard to judge. Looks about the same, so you may be retaining.

Just to clarify this. The original studies i believe only focused on the crown, but Finasteride and Dutasteride both work all over the scalp. 

OP you might be going through a combination of a shedding phase from medication like Finasteride and also telogen as part of your normal hair cycles. It sucks, but it can happen. Finasteride by itself is there mainly to slow or if possible halt hair loss and you are on the maximum dosage but if you truly do think you need something more, you can slowly increase the Dutasteride dosages but be prepared for the fact that doing this can actually make you go through another shedding period. 

Also, bear in mind, this process could last for about 3 months for a hair cycle on average. 

I would strongly urge you to consider adding Nizoral with 2% ketoconazole and maybe Microneedling with a derma pen once per week at 1mm to 1.5mm.

4 hours ago, Kamran said:

Thx guys, so first off, I did all the traveling pre-op, and this is also what I recommend to you, after the procedure it is hard to sleep for the first few nights, besides, it is better to keep the conditions relatively sterile, due to open wounds on the head, which can be difficult while traveling.

It's been 2 weeks post-op, so I would like to share some pictures with you, so you can help me evaluate the progress.

The redness is still very visible, but from what I've read it's normal for people with fair skin. Donor looks much better.

Shading hasn't started yet, but I know it's ahead of me, so I'm enjoying this "honeymoon"phase.

 

 

The fairer skin will make it more difficult for the redness to fade imo but it will eventually. Just be prepared though for it to persist for some months. Shedding will happen more as you get to the first month and beyond but usually by months 2 and 3, you will have shed the majority of the hair. 

The donor area looks solid so far. Bit red, little patchy probably because of lighting and the usual uneven hair growth in places but also doesn't seem to be affected by shock loss. 

Eugenix do seem to be in touch often via the first month or so, but i think as long as you are sticking to the post-op regime within the first 2 weeks, after that, you're fairly back to normal although i think i did wait closer to a month before the gym. 

Hi Kamran, 

Hope your post-op recovery goes well and the work looks solid so far and glad you managed to explore India. Definitely a braver choice post-op than what i would have done. 

Happy growing. 

7 hours ago, Yan bio said:

I'm thinking about buying one and using it "just in case" I see too much toppik close to hair-line. Anyone has an experience maybe?  thanks!

I just wanted to clarify the question. Do you mean using like a hair dryer to help distribute hair fibres/toppik? 

Personally i haven't used any hair fibres as of yet but from what i've seen online, they always seem to dry the hair first and a high quality hair dryer should become a staple of any male grooming routine for any haircut that's probably more than a shirt skin fade/crew cut thing. Any medium length or longer hair, even some shorter. A proper hair dryer can help establish good volume without drying the hair out. Look for something ionic. 

Once you have properly dried the hair, the hair fibres usually seem to be applied and i would say that hair spray is used to then "lock" the style. I think in order to properly direct the hair fibres, there's those applicator pumps you can pour it into as well. May help distribute it better but hair fibres, toppik etc. is all going to be challenging on the very frontal hairline when trying to create a natural look at least and take plenty of practice. 

1 hour ago, Bandit90 said:

Month 9 Update 

The front and mid-scalp seem to be making subtle improvements month after month, I’m noticing the hair is becoming slightly less wiry too. I have probably reached the peak now for the front and growth-wise I don’t think anymore will come, except for the side parting corridors and the area behind the temples, which had grafts implanted in sitting two. Crown-wise I’m on month 2 and very much in the ugly duckling phase, although I do notice that some of the beard hair implanted hasn’t shed and is growing. Also really pleased with the donor area, considering I have had 5,800 grafts taken from there this year.  

Looking solid at the front and a bit of time away for the crown but by months 6+, i think you'll be looking fantastic and we can properly see how amazing of a transformation this will be. The front is already mission accomplished it seems and with the extra temple point grafts and whatnot, i think it will be even more outstanding. 

21 minutes ago, ray35 said:

@NARMAKyeah I'd love to arrange the longer stay. Best I think I can manage is gonna be like 2 extra days post op. So I'll just have to be careful. I agree it would definitely be ideal resting up those 7 days before flying.

I personally couldn't stay that long either, but i wanted to allow at least 2 full days post-op to let the grafts anchor in before travelling. 

Ideally i would take off a week till the 1st head wash and then probably travel back and take a further week off or working remotely if possible to recover. 

2 hours ago, botchedguy95 said:

Funny thing is all of his examples actually use techs for the same parts of the surgery that eugenix does lol

Don't sweat it bro, you did your research well, and it is looking right on track In my opinion.. worst case depending on your own goals you might need a very tiny touch up.. and that is completely dependent on YOUR goals, because if I had this progress at 6 months personally I would be very very happy

1 hour ago, drawdownfx said:

yeah don't allow negative comments to hit you. It's still only 6 months, your donor isn't compromised and worst case scenario you do a touch up for the desired density. You got this bro @NARMAK

Thanks guys. I've tried to consistently reiterate that panicking isn't even a good idea. Everybody acts like 12 months is the final point for everybody but we can imo mature a bit later. 

I'm holding on for the final 12th month before i do give a final evaluation but yeah, i do think obviously some areas perhaps didn't feel like they filled out as much as i thought they would but i think there's genuinely areas maybe that have sprouted but the hair us thickening up and will take some time and a few cycles to mature and darken up. So hopefully over the next 2-3 months, i could see even further maturity coming and we have seen this plenty of times. 

I think it's just important to document it properly and let people understand a hair transplant isn't a magic cure or perfect solution. 

If you are going to have a flight that's not direct or its a slightly longer flight time, i would personally recommend staying 4-7 days post-op if possible to let the grafts anchor in and have a better survival chance should anything unfortunate occur like a bump on the head etc. And at 7 days some do the head wash. 

39 minutes ago, Bandit90 said:

Completely Agree. I did take finasteride when I was 19 for a week, then freaked out when I read about the horror stories and in the process convinced myself I was getting all sorts of side effects (In hindsight so silly of me). Interestingly, that was when I came across the HRN. When I got to 29 I resumed finasteride, but went in with a more mature mindset following the science, and unsurprisingly did not have any side effects. I do have sympathy for men who reject the drug out of fear because I know how it feels reading those horror stories and in your 20s let's be honest a healthy sex life is very high up the agenda for most, but then again I have even more sympathy for dudes who are high Norwood’s in their 20s because let me tell you that sucks too lol! I do think the best way to tackle finasteride if you are super anxious, is doing a titration phase over six months starting at 0.25mg EOD slowly building up to 1mg ED.  

That is my ten pence worth lol, as I don’t want to go off on a tangent with Finasteride side effects, given the rabbit-hole nature of the topic!

100% agree. 

It's the same reason i also never started and even though a lot of people would have looked at my hair and said it looks fine, it wasn't to me. So it affects everybody on the Norwood spectrum when it comes to hair loss but yeah, 100% can imagine more impact on a Norwood 4+ in your early to mid 20s etc. 

Honestly, really happy to have met you John and see this turnaround. We always like seeing fairytale endings, but it's nicer when it happens to us so really chuffed to see things fingers crossed ready to end that way for you.

45 minutes ago, Bandit90 said:

Haha, hair greed for sure! If there was ever an advert for getting on the meds sooner rather than later then this has to be it! Obviously, i'm absolutely over the moon with everything to date, and nice to know I still have something to look forward to when graft cloning becomes a reality!    

 

Well said. Definitely an amazing result and takes absolutely nothing away from it mentioning medication and starting sooner. I just think it shows an example for other people to learn from yours and others journey. 

Way too many times, guys feel too  scared of side effects to even try and save their hair and end up in a vicious cycle. I feel like at least somebody that gave it a go like Melvin and then had to stop due to sides is an acceptable example of doing it the right way. 

2 hours ago, gthomas21 said:

No offense taken, very new to it all! Do you have any recommendations? Most threads seem to lead back to Fuecapilar or Dr bicer in Turkey. 

Personally my recommendation isn't to restrict yourself to one geographical location like Turkey and only there. If you need to save up a bit more, do so and make sure you go to a proper clinic with doctor involvement with making recipient sites, proper oversight etc.

The forum has a recommended list but it's not exhaustive. You'll also find reviews from places not recommended on here if you search and somebody went there. 

I always tell people to research and try look at the most recent cases to find the best fit for your budget, hair type and hair transplant needs. 

This site can be a wealth of information but if you're having problems finding details after using search and other topics, always okay to ask questions. 

Hasson & Wong were the pioneers of making the absolutely best FUT results out there but Dr Hasson is now on record stating be believes FUE has got to a point where its as good as or better than FUT in their view and they only were willing to transition when it was considered good enough in their eyes. 

Firstly, i think FUT absolutely still has a place in terms of how it works and i think although people do worry about the linear scar, and this is probably the biggest sticking point for a lot of people because unlike FUE scars which are pretty set in point from extraction as a punch scar, the linear scar can and in some cases does stretch over time for some people. 

Now, just not to let FUE completely off the hook here, because it has its own issues, such as how on some people the FUE scars can heal with a brighter white pigmentation and stand out more. Mr Rolandas demonstrated this with his FUE procedure when he got a fade cut and its on YouTube to view. 

Also, one thing people who do get FUT can think about is how if you take all the punch scars FUE gives and FUT scar as a linear line, your FUT scar can actually cover a smaller area overall but FUE in maybe a fair few cases shows itself as being more visually better hidden with surrounding hair grown out enough to create that illusion it isn't. 

I would say it's significantly easier to then use scalp/beard hair to fill the donor in and also use SMP much easier to fill an FUT scar in. That said, the biggest minus is definitely the longer recovery time and the possibility of the scar stretching during and after that period of time. 

Honestly, hair clone grafts cannot get here fast enough to put this entire thing to rest and i guess by default both methods become extinct bar maybe FUE to cherry pick the initial grafts for cloning, neither plays a part on how implantation is done and we'll end up with the whole "Is Super Duper Diamond Dragon 9000 better than regular when making recipient zones?" type questions and a hyper focus on implanter pens etc. 

7 minutes ago, JoDimaggio22 said:

Thank you all for your responses. What is the half life of fin/Dut? I thought that you had to be off them for a year or so but if two months is plenty time just for conception and then once a positive is confirmed you can go back on it then that works. I’m okay losing hair loss ground during those two months if it means the child will be healthy I just wanted to know if having kids while on dutasteride is something that is most of the time if not all safe.

Half life of Finasteride i think is where it clears within a month. Dutasteride is slower but because its stronger. 

I would personally cease Dutasteride before trying to conceive as a precautionary measure and because it does generally help on that side. Even an ardent supporter of using Finasteride or Dutasteride to help slow/stop your hair loss, i will never ever tell somebody "Yeah, absolutely, you'll be fine(!)" but the pamphlet even tells you to keep things away. 

If you're on Oral Minoxodil, as mentioned above i do not think it has any correlation to conception so you could probably keep taking that but stop Finasteride/Dutasteride long enough for the half life to clear your system, give a buffer too and then try conceive and once that process is confirmed, then i guess you can feel confident to resume the medication. The amount of ground you would lose in those months shouldn't be dramatic imo that cannot be recovered or held off from further loss. 

5 hours ago, stephortless said:

I have my appointment booked for next month, and Dr. B has recommended ~1800 grafts. What do you guys think? I am 35 and been on 1mg fin/day for 10+ years.

After reading the responses in the Konior/greed thread, Gatsby's advice "Every time you have surgery (even with the best of the best) you are taking a risk that something can go wrong. Even if nothing goes wrong, you are taking the risk that for some reason, you just may not like the results and wish you had never had surgery in the first place" has got my wheels spinning a bit. 

I admire Dr. Bisanga's work and trust him and his team's skill. I guess I am just looking for age/hairline/situation reassurance. As you could surmise by me taking fin for over a decade, this has been on my mind for a long time.

I'm guessing you are just having hairline work done and closing the temporal corners down a bit. Knowing how Dr Bisanga generally remains conservative with his design, i think looking at the picture, roughly 1800 would be about right but do you have any pictures of the design? 

44 minutes ago, HelpfulFriend said:

Thanks Narmak, that makes sense, and it's what I sort of expected.

The middle part was actually not touched by the transplant, I didn't think it needed tending to when I booked it - but leading up to it, it seemed to thin.

Unfortunately, it looks like I might need another go around or to jump on dutasteride or something.

This is a hard game to win!

Personally i'm on Dutasteride. Went nuclear on the 5AR inhibition from the offset. I'd already allowed 10+ years of potential hair loss and wanted to recover maximum ground possible and retain what i had. Finding out the medication works beyond 12+ months and in fact 10+ years on responders motivated me too. I feel like i didn't really see the crown area but i feel like it did start to thin and i genuinely hope that Dutasteride helps me kick back hair there to be thicker but it could also be very much an emotional thing of it feeling thinner due to the way the crown area is and maybe even due to head shape etc. 

Unless you get a full professional trichoschopic check, then it does leave you a little unsure but in terms of frontal hairline, like mine for example, if you check my thread, you can see me expose it under harsher lighting and you can tell its something similar to what was posted and i'm not the only person who has shown this off either. Unfortunately i do think it's a limitation of hair transplants having to balance the scales of maximum survival and finite donor. However, once clone hair grafts are in the mix, i'm excited. I'm just going to set a 50 year clock on it. Maybe some great grand children might be able to use it lol. 

2 hours ago, Bandit90 said:

Been meaning to throw this light hearted post in. When I was there in October, I asked Dr Sethi in a non-norwood 7 world what would my hairline be. So got Dr Sethi to design it! Cant help but kick myself that I didn't start on finasteride much sooner in life 😂. 

Don't worry bud, the hair clones are coming in 5 years, and that is going to look smashing on you.

I honestly think it's genuinely amazing that you are able to rock that hair band and the density looks AMAZING! Dr P knocked it out of the park given that's a first pass too. I don't even know if you would need to worry about see through lol

1 hour ago, Gatsby said:

In all honesty @Bandit90 I think the  results of your design are not just incredible but most importantly of all ‘natural.’ The definition of a successful hair transplant(s). 🤩💯👌

I definitely think the impeccable execution John had definitely is the cherry on top for the naturalness. Dr P is 100% Elite and i can say i'm backing John just for the frontal restoration as worthy of a Hall of Fame. 

Heck though, if we could get our hands on those little miracle clone hair grafts, ooh. What i wouldn't give to see you head back for another run too Adrian when the sky is the limit

3 hours ago, BaldingEagle1 said:

Do you think dr das would be capable of that?

 

debating about going with her for crown this time 🧐🧐

I will be perfectly honest. I don't know and probably something you could ask her about in terms of her experience with it if you wanted to. 

The crown if completely gone needs much more skill and you need somebody who absolutely knows how to make the most of each graft for coverage. 

The temple points imo are probably on par with the crown in terms of complexity even if you can get away with using less grafts there than the crown for coverage due to the spiral shape of the crown. 

Anybody that thinks it requires less skill doesn't have a clue and is very much the type to end up at hair mills and not know what a natural hairline requires.