g4designs

I reached out to Dr. Pittella's office with the understanding that I'd be quoted the equivalent of Turkish pricing, just in South America rather than Europe. I was told I'll need 5500 grafts, which is nothing new. What surprised me was that they are charging 2USD/graft for a junior surgeon, 3USD/graft for a junior surgeon guided by Dr. Pittella, and 4USD/graft for Dr. Pittella himself. 

Talent aside, since I know he does great work (I'd not have contacted him otherwise)... these prices are INSANE. Did they raise rates with the new influx of patients? I was expecting to get a world-class surgery for 5 to 7k, since that wad the whole point of health-tourism. Am I missing something? 

I've been lurking on and off here and other forums for 10+ years. The idea of traveling to Turkey or other health-tourism hubs for a transplant has always been a big topic of discussion. What is the consensus on it nowadays? 

Are there any other places that are recommended for less expensive, high-quality treatment beyond Turkey? Are there any current guides I could read to learn more? I know there are some all-inclusive options as well; I'd love to hear experiences with this. 

A hair transplant is intimidating enough (all the questions like 'will it look good?' 'will they stay in?' 'will it get infected?'), but add traveling to a foreign country and all the safety implications of that and it easily becomes overwhelming. I'm VERY skeptical of everything I read outside this forum, since a solid 90% of the content is designed to scam or take advantage of desperate people, so any help you guys could provide would be amazing. 

Cheers! 

On 3/11/2021 at 6:18 PM, JohnAC71 said:

@g4designs how is your research going ? Looked back at your original questions and there was a lot to digest 😳

I heard back from all three of the clinics I reached out to! 

Dr. Konior responded to me personally, which surprised me. After reviewing my photos, he said I do have a moderately advanced frontal hairline recession and that I'll need at least 3,000 grafts. He really liked the photo I had photoshopped as a goal (though I understand I should lower my expectations). He said my donor area looks healthy and that strip harvesting is my best bet. He said his fee for a restoration like this would be about $25,000, which came as a shock. That's definitely higher than I had planned to pay (almost double), but it seems to be half of what @BLE123 figured it'd cost. I know he is genuinely one of the best in the world, so I would love to hear everyone's thoughts on how reasonable that is. 

His soonest availability is more than a year away, so I explained I still want to take a little more time and contact the other two doctors (Cooley and Shapiro). I asked Dr. Konior if he was familiar with them and he said they are both "exceptional surgeons and two of only a handful (he would) recommend". 

I just need to say, in the few emails I exchanged, Dr. Konior was an absolute pleasure to talk to. I cant even fathom how busy he must be, so it was incredible he took the time to respond.

As for Shapiro and Cooley, I originally thought they hadn't responded (part of the reason this update took so long), but just a warning -- their website form replies went directly to my spam folder. The auto-response I got from Shapiro included a PDF with pricing information. If I were to go with FUT (as Dr. Konior suggested), it is $5.50 per graft for first 2,000 grafts; $3 per graft over 2,000 grafts. That puts me at about $17,000 if I get 4,000 grafts. If I instead go with FUE, they ask $7 per graft. That puts me at $24,500 if I get 3,500 grafts. Avoiding the strip-scar isn't really worth $7500, honestly. My consultation is scheduled for May. These prices are a little higher than what @hybonix had mentioned, so hopefully there will be a little room for leniency.

I am still waiting for a confirmation from Ms. Russo at Dr. Cooley's office (as I responded 5 days late to her consultation arrangement), but hopefully I'll be scheduled for this June (the earliest time available).

I'm really looking forward to these appointments. Thank you guys again for all of the help so far. This community is incredible. 

@hybonixI missed your reply earlier, so I'm sorry I took so long to reply. Thank you so much for sharing your experience!

I definitely agree the photoshopped image is a very unrealistic goal - and honestly - that's far more density than I've ever had. I was more or less just messing around with the results of one of Dr. Cooley's patients who had a very similar hairline to mine going in. 

Congratulations on getting your HT! From what it sounds like, SMG is exactly the kind of place I'm looking for. I know at the end of the day doctors are in the business to put food on the table, but there's a difference between ones interested in closing a deal and ones looking to make a positive difference in their patients' lives.

I'll definitely shoot you a message and follow up once I gather my thoughts more. Out of curiosity, how old are you roughly? When did you start balding? Have you been on Finasteride for the two-year period? And finally, do you mind saying about how much everything cost so far? I'm guessing the exosome injections were an additional upcharge? 

1 minute ago, Melvin-Moderator said:

I have plenty more on IG, I have a series called Instagram live with surgeons. You’ll get some good insight. Yesterday I filmed a surgery, so you can actually see the process too.

That's phenomenal! I'll definitely take a look at everything on IG and YouTube! Thank you for all the time you put into this. It's really helpful for guys in my situation.

Do you know if there's a "master-list" somewhere with all the hair-restoration treatments (and their scientific validity), recommended doctors, trusted websites, forums, facebook groups, what to expect to pay and where, honest (not cherry-picked) results, etc? The deeper I research, the more bullshit I find. Like I said earlier, there's a lot of suspicious accounts on some places (like the HairTransplant subreddit) promoting sketchy treatments and even sketchier doctors. It is driving me crazy not knowing who is being paid by who, who is being silenced by who, and all the other issues that come along with things like this. 

And all the lies and false advertising aside, there's nothing but confirmation bias everywhere you look. Everyone wants to suggest their doctor, not because they're genuinely a good fit, but because they want to justify they spent $18k on "the best". I've also noticed places like Reddit's Tressless is VERY pro-medicinal treatment, which is fine, but I've seen users telling someone someone Fin/Min and a derma-needler is all they need to fix their Norwood 7. 

Rant aside, does that "master list" exist? If not, are there any resources that accomplish some of that? This forum and the HLC facebook group seem to be the most reliable so far.

4 minutes ago, Melvin-Moderator said:

Well, Dr. Konior is definitely one of the very best, his reputation is world renowned. I had an interview with him a few months ago, and he said any surgeon that tells you something like “exosome is a miracle treatment” run from their office. I suggest having a listen yourself.
 

We no longer mention the other doctor from Atlantas name here, for legal reasons. Suffice to say he’s very pro-FUE and anti-FUT. I suggest going to doctor who will give you impartial advice on which technique would best suit you. 

 

Check out Dr. Konior interview below.

https://www.instagram.com/tv/CItfBT8j7KO/?igshid=10rdtfsbcqylm

Guess you hit two birds with one stone with that first answer, haha! I'll continue the virtual appointment, but I have already been very skeptical of Doctor Anderson's clinic. A lot of subtle things set off red flags in my head.

As for the other doctor, I completely understand. It seems this is a very difficult subject to research unbiased information on. I'll go ahead and draw my conclusion from that and perhaps do some investigating on the internet archive.

I appreciate the interview. I'll watch that later tonight!

41 minutes ago, Melvin-Moderator said:

@Gatsby

Has some knowledge based on what he’s gone through in his own life. Being young and making a decision based off money is never a wise choice.

Now, are there good affordable clinics? Absolutely, but you need to research based on results and quality first and then weed clinics out based on budget. I’m not aware of the other two surgeons you mentioned, but Dr. Cooley is one of the best surgeons in the US. If he’s close to you, it’s a no-brainer. 
 

Check out his profile and look at some of the patient experiences/reviews. Those matter the most.

https://www.hairtransplantnetwork.com/physician/North-Carolina/Jerry-Cooley/4

 

39 minutes ago, Melvin-Moderator said:

Also, I’d throw in Dr. Shapiro in Minnesota. Check out @hybonixthread, you guys have similar hair characteristics and hair loss. 

Thank you for the response! I definitely would say Dr. Cooley is at the top of my list right now. 

I set up a virtual appointment with Dr. Cooley in NC, Dr. C in Atlanta, and Dr. Konior in Chicago, per the recommendations of people on here and the Hair Loss Conquerors Facebook group. 

I also had a phone call with Doctor Anderson's clinic in Atlanta. They were very pushy to get me some more information on Exosome Therapy, calling it the "miracle the hair restoration industry has been waiting for". Any thoughts on it? In quick research it seems very expensive for something that might or might not work. 

Oh, wow! This is a lot of information to take in. Thank you everyone who has taken the time to reply so far. I'll try to address and answer everything.

7 hours ago, Curious25 said:

Wow , how did you manage to draw up your goal ‘after picture’ ? It looks like a legitimate before and after from a top clinic ! 😂 

@Curious25 Haha -- I found a local clinic (Cooley Hair Center) with a patient I feel I'm very similar to. I just worked a little magic on the color and blending, then shaped it to match my natural peak.

6 hours ago, Gatsby said:

In short, forget Turkey and research. Put price last and quality that matches your hair loss characteristics for now and the future first. The hairline you have designed in twenty years from now is not an age appropriate one (for you to grow into). If you find the surgeon that ticks all of your boxes for the right reasons then you are better off to spend your time researching saving up for the right game plan for you over the lifespan. All the best!

6 hours ago, Egy said:

@g4designsI disagree with @Gatsby this time,(I usually agree with him, most of the time). in Turkey it is enough not to rely on the low-cost clinics or pseudo-clinics of which Istanbul is full, but not eliminated a priori.  In my opinion, the only clinics to consider in that place are HLC and Pekiner, forget the “all inclusive clinics”.

@Gatsby @Egy I appreciate the replies. Thus far, I've been avoiding the idea of going to Turkey (as appealing as it seems) because my friends and family are very uncomfortable with the idea of me going overseas for a surgery. Godforbid, if something were to go wrong, someone would have to book a last minute 14hr flight to come help me. The two main concerns I've heard are Turkey's proximity to the middle east (and civil unrest) and the lack of accountability. If I come back to the states and it turns out to be an absolute butcher job -- there's a lot less I can do than if it were in the states. 

It also really bothers me that there are so many sketchy users (with auto-generated names) on other forums and the HairTransplant subreddit constantly singing the praise of Turkey and India. It really seems like astroturf marketing. (not like people in this thread who are sharing actual opinions, its more the "I just had it done in Turkey, message me and I'll share the info" posts)

6 hours ago, Gatsby said:

I agree Egy. My point is not to get carried away with cost first (as Turkey has some of the cheapest options) but to focus on the quality of work and to find this out by research. If this happens to be a surgeon in Turkey then all the better. But this will only come from research. Not putting cost before results. 👍

I completely agree with this sentiment. When all is said and done, I'm looking to invest in my future. Whether that costs $7k, $12k, or $20k doesn't matter as long as I get results I am happy with. Do you have any recommendations for how to research based on the quality of work? I've been trying, but it doesn't help every clinic only posts their world-class results online. 

5 hours ago, Curious25 said:

Totally disagree with all of this. 
 

1) To disregard a whole nation based on the fact that there are cheap black market ‘hair mill’ clinics there, (as there are in every country), is short sighted and just frankly moronic. The competitive prices from these clinics aren’t down to the fact that they fall into the hair mill category, it’s a macro economic factor based upon comparative currency values, cost of living, average wages, rent, materials etc. I’m not suggesting the following surgeons are or aren’t suitable for OP’s case, but are you telling me HLC, Dr Bicer, Dr Kaan, and Dr Keser haven’t produced world class results on this forum over the years ? 

If I am able to convince the people in my support network to consider Turkey as a viable option, how do I approach this safely? I know nothing about the country and culture besides the fact that there aren't a ton of regulations and it is a leading health-tourism spot. What precautions and safety-nets are in place? How do I make sure I don't get screwed over? Is it a safe place to be? Are there any reputable services in the area that will help guide dumb foreigners through the process? The idea of being drugged-up on pain meds on the other side of the world sets off some red flags.

57 minutes ago, Raphael84 said:

@g4designs

Do you feel that your hair loss has stabilised with medication? You are still reasonably early in your "finasteride journey".

In a case such as yours, as a younger patient in your mid 20s, one important consideration will be progressive loss. As you have loss both in your frontal area, and a thinning crown, the concern is that over time as loss evolves, your crown loss will meet your frontal loss. In your photos, if you look at hair quality in your donor area, and compare that to the hair quality on top, your hair on top appears weaker and finer. Im not referring to density, but the quality of your hair.  In your mid 20s, if hair loss began at 18, you may have been experiencing loss for 7/8 years. Hair loss being progressive in nature, will continue past middle age, and so there is 35+ years ahead to consider and be conscious of.
How you may respond to medication will be an important factor in your long terms objectives.

@Raphael84 In the first few months, I've noticed a few week-long cycles of increased and decreased shedding, which I've heard is normal. I noticed my crown and center forehead thinning in the last year (especially with a shorter haircut), so it will be interesting to see if this continues or plateaus. 

I've had a fair amount of people suggest I continue on the finasteride and topical 5% minoxidil, then start using my Derminator 2 (which I bought, but have been afraid to try) for at least another 6 months. I'm starting to think this might be the right call. I'll schedule a consultation with some of my local doctors to get a few different opinions. 

In the meantime, I think I may consider the options available for hair-pieces. If I can get something completely undetectable that I can sleep and shower in, I'll be happy for now.

1 hour ago, Raphael84 said:

When designing the hairline, if the design is aesthetically pleasing is only one factor. Based on the photo and design that you have digitally edited, 3000 grafts would approximately restore your frontal third. Can your donor support further loss and provide a full restoration over subsequent surgeries as you age? This will depend on your donor density, follicular groupings and hair calibre, which also must have an influence on the most appropriate hairline design for you. No specific data is known and so all opinions currently are subjective
 

That's a really good point. Do you know if beard or other body hair would be viable substitutes as filler? I've noticed I have 3 different types/colors of hair on my body. My head is a medium thickness dark blonde with red undertones, my beard is thick and red, and my body hair (arms, legs) is a very thin lighter blonde-red. Do the follicles adapt to the location they are transplanted, or would there just be a mix of textures?

1 hour ago, Raphael84 said:

Whatever your decision may be, your choice in potential doctor must have your long term objectives as their priority, and plan any frontal restoration accordingly with a very specific and bespoke approach. You will lose more hair, and whilst there is no crystal ball regarding extent and rate of future loss, this must be taken into consideration and will be integral to your long term satisfaction. Whilst now your hairline is your priority, and quite rightly. You likely will not be satisfied in 10 years time with a great hairline but a larger balding crown. This is something that younger patients are often not able to relate to, and believe that as they hit their late 30´s, it really won't matter any more. In reality, that is rarely the case.

I really appreciate your insight on this. I really hope I'll find a doctor who will be on my team and help plan for the next decade or more. My ideal doctor is one who will be determined to give me the best results possible (and not just someone who sees me as 2% of the downpayment for their yacht). 

I've not considered the continued balding of my crown (even on fin/min). While I admittedly do fall into the category of younger patients who wrongfully "believe that as I hit my late 30´s, it really won't matter anymore", I would be interested in hearing what doctors have to say about the health and projected health of my donor areas and if I'd be a candidate for future surgeries as well.

Thank you again for everyone who responded. I will try my best to keep responding in this thread. 

This year I decided I am going to fully commit to a hair transplant. I've been on Finasteride for about 5 months now and 5% Minoxidil for a little over a year (previously on a Min/Fin compound). I'm in my mid-20s and have already met with a dermatologist and a local hair surgeon, both of whom have said I've been a good candidate for a while. I have a bunch of questions and I'd really appreciate any help you guys could provide. I'm not new to this journey, I've been fighting this since I was 18.

I attached some photos of where I'm at. I believe I'm a Norwood 3A. Does that sound right?

I'm willing to spend a decent chunk to fix this for good. I've already talked with my friends and family and they are very uncomfortable with me going to Turkey (which I respect), but I wouldn't mind traveling anywhere in North America (US or CAN) to get good results for a reasonable price. Ideally, I'm looking to spend $12,000 or less. I'm a young adult and would likely be taking a hefty loan from family for what I cant cover in cash, but this is important enough for me to justify it. Since Turkey is out of the picture, is this a reasonable budget for the amount of follicles I'd need? I would much rather get FUE than FUT, but I'd also be open to new technologies if there are other options. My dermatologist and the my local surgeon both said I have a good sized donor area on the back of my head and I have plenty of facial and upper body hair as well. I attached a photo of what I believe would be my donor area - it is very thick.

It seems what everyone suggests is to look at past results and find a doctor who is experienced with my hair type and Norwood stage. In my area (GA), I've seen good results from Cooley Hair Center (NC) and Dr. Rousso (AL). I've already met with Doctor Anderson in Atlanta, but he left a pretty rude first impression. He came off pretty condescending when I asked more about the scientific validity of the $1200 laser cap he was trying to sell me. Looking back, it could have just been that he though I was 'some kid' wasting his time and not a real client. Overall, I'm looking for a surgeon or a team who is willing to take care of me. I'm looking for someone who is willing to do whatever it takes to get me the best results -- someone that sees FUE almost as an artform, rather than just rushing to get me out so he can fit in his 3-o-clock appointment before a round of golf.

Are there any special or new technologies or techniques I should look out for? I've seen ARTAS iX and NeoGraft mentioned. Are there any other new technologies? I'd also consider getting SMP tattoos, if necessary. 

To put it simply, I'm looking to take back control of how I look. I'm sick of wearing hats because I don't like who I see in the mirror. I would like to bring my temples back to a reasonable level. I naturally had a high widow's peak, and hair loss brought it even farther back. The last photo attached is my goal. Is this unrealistic in my budget? Do I need to start shaking trees?

I've seen several places warning to turn around and walk out of anywhere charging per follicle. That being said, I don't have money to burn. I'm ready to commit to a hefty price-tag, but I need every dollar to count. Am I insane? Or is it possible clinics would be reasonable with pricing for a young-adult willing to spend a decent chunk of his life savings to regain control and confidence?

Finally, is now the right time for this? Or am I going to spend $15k only to see "magic pill finally approved by FDA" the next day? Has there been any progress on "the cure" that's been "5 years away" for the past 30+ years? Is there any promising science in the pipeline or delayed due to COVID that'll show up? 

I've done a fair bit of research so far, but any more help, thoughts, or opinions would be great. Thank you!